8 ms·

Just a couple of hours ago I was kicking off a build that would take about 20 minutes. It's a slow sprint so I went and put the laundry in the dryer and then ha

• Breza 4y ago
  I feel the exact same way, I run a data science team from my basement. At 4:30, I walk to my daughter's daycare and we play together in the time that I used to spend commuting. I never want to go back to an office.
• kylehotchkiss 4y ago
  sounds like you need to run your build on a m2 max!
• ttul 4y ago
  How about a $10K pay cut?
  • lsaferite 4y ago
    You could easily spend 10k on commuting. That's only about $40/day. Between fuel, maint, tolls, and maybe food, you can easily bust $40/day in the Bay Area. That's not even considering the _time_ spent commuting.
    • lotsofpulp 4y ago
      And the morbidity/mortality risk. Driving is the most risky thing most Americans do.
      • soiler 4y ago
        I already hated cars, but since I began WFH I've become really averse to driving unnecessarily. Getting killed by a car is one of the absolute stupidest ways to go. My dad smoked all his life and still made it past 60; my brain could hit pavement tonight if I run out of milk. And the worst part is that it wouldn't have to be my fault at all, and it wouldn't even require somebody to do something extraordinarily reckless. Driving too fast through my neighborhood is typical, because it happens to offer the shortest path from A to B for many people, and the road is wide thanks to bike lanes that I have never seen bikes in (because: cars drive too fast). I'll cut myself off here before this becomes an overly long screed.
        • ryandrake 4y ago
          My car conveniently started having reliability problems about the same time I started working remotely. We're not talking "oops need an oil change today" but "car won't start for weeks on end and is in the shop more than it's on the road". When I had to commute to the office, this would have been a pants-on-fire career-ending emergency, but now it's just a minor inconvenience. I might just sell the damn lemon and get a bicycle for those rare times I need to go anywhere. Would not have had that option with my previous 50 mile (each way) commute.
      • lamontcg 4y ago
        I so rarely see this pointed out in the WFH threads, but it is one of the biggest ones to me. I don't want to get killed by some idiot driver for the sake of the company I'm working for.
  • barbazoo 4y ago
    Absolute numbers are kind of meaningless but I for sure would take a 10% lower pay at a company that did 100% WFH. Thow in another couple percentage points for a 4 day work week. I feel for all the folks that work at a place that implemented a hybrid model because I don't see that working ever if some people are in the office and some are permanently remote. I bet collaboration and feeling of togetherness suffers. When everyone's remote, you have to adjust your processes and ceremonies to account for that.
    • DiggyJohnson 4y ago
      I can’t imagine a firm offering “a couple” of percentage points of comp for 20% less paid hours. Would you take a 20% pay cut for 4 day/32 hour workweek? Just curious about your mindset on this. I would love to find myself at a spot where I’m working 4 days a week, but not interested in doing 10 hour days. By the way, I do understand that most people, including myself, would probably have a greater fraction of productive hours of work working 4/32 than 5/40. Not sure if many employees would recognize that though.
      • throwaway09223 4y ago
        "Would you take a 20% pay cut for 4 day/32 hour workweek?" I would take an 80% pay cut for a 1 day/8 hr workweek in a heartbeat (the industry is remarkably inflexible and I ended up having to do a 100% paycut for 0 workdays and I'm happy with that too).
      • barbazoo 4y ago
        Yeah you're obviously right, 20% would be more of a starting point for a negotiation. I'm still thinking about it but right now I feel like with WFH and PTO I get enough time with my family that I don't need a full day yet. If that changes, I'm planning on taking a day a week off to spend with my kid before he's at school age, I'll do it. 20% less comp (in reality it'll be less due to tax brackets)for 50% more time is a no-brainer for me.
      • kens 4y ago
        I took a 20% pay cut for a 4 day/32 hour work week a few years ago and it was great. One additional day off is much more free time than you'd think. It's 50% more days off compared to the weekend. I'd recommend it to anyone whose circumstances permit it.
  • ok_dad 4y ago
    I'm saving money that would normally be used for office space; if anything I expect a pay raise. A cut would cause me to seek other opportunities.
  • makeitdouble 4y ago
    Depends on how much 10k represents to you, many have explicitely chosen to be paid less to get a better life balance.
  • meindnoch 4y ago
    No thanks. How about a 10k pay raise you would otherwise spend on office space?
  • deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  • bdcravens 4y ago
    If you spend an hour in traffic each direction, that $10k is about $20/hour, before you start talking about costs like wear and tear, gas, parking, etc.
  • wyager 4y ago
    For most of the people on this site that is probably not very significant in percentage terms, and even in absolute terms is probably easily outweighed by the cost savings associated with WFH.
  • wil421 4y ago
    You can change jobs, become a virtual worker at new company, and increase your salary. I did this at the end of 2021 and made a 45% increase. Screw a pay cut the company should be increasing my salary so they can reduce spending on office space. Except they likely get tax benefits on a lease so that’s not happening.
  • downrightmike 4y ago
    Then you just do $20k worth of work less.
  • wetpaws 4y ago
    Why not $10K pay increase?
    • A4ET8a8uTh0 4y ago
      I think management somehow think they are getting less ( and I am not convinced that is the case ) and want to price "it" accordingly. What is missing from the story is what they are getting less of. I want to say I am participating in less gossip, less pointless meetings and less ass-kissing rituals. To me, personally, this counts as a major win. What I certainly do not generate is more 'spontaneous collaboration" that various executives are quick to trot out, but.. I never have beforehand either.
  • cwkoss 4y ago
    Offices cost businesses more than wfh. Petty tyrant bosses will try this, but the rest of the market will continue valuing those workers the same. We should theoretically expect WFH compensation to asymptotically approach getting paid (prorated per head cost of office space) more.
• loteck 4y ago
  What if it becomes clear across the industry that remote workers are first in line for convenience layoffs? Beyond reduced pay and benefit scenarios, I'm curious if reduced job security will be a price workers are willng to pay for WFH.
  • sonotathrowaway 4y ago
    Then employers smart enough to prioritize wfh will gain a competitive advantage in attracting and retaining talent
  • Johnny555 4y ago
    What if it becomes clear that remote workers are the last to go since they have less overhead in office space and other office amenities that companies offer to entice them to come to the office (on site gym, snacks, lunch, etc). Amazon just got rid of a 29 acre property that they paid $123m for, why wouldn’t other companies recognize savings from remote workers?
    • timr 4y ago
      > What if it becomes clear that remote workers are the last to go since they have less overhead in office space and other office amenities that companies offer to entice them to come to the office (on site gym, snacks, lunch, etc). The lavish amenities of big tech were put there for a reason -- to get people to work more. Maybe secondarily for retention. If you think that companies are going to look at declining productivity and think "hm, that's an acceptable tradeoff, since I'm paying less for office space!", then I'll take that bet.
      • nkozyra 4y ago
        > declining productivity Isn't this begging the question? I've never been as productive in an office as WFH. I know that's not everyone but I also know I'm not the only one.
        • timr 4y ago
• yieldcrv 4y ago
  Thats pretty cool, I can see it being annoying for those that don’t have a partner and don’t have any structured environments to meet more people I’m not saying hit on coworkers, having coworkers increases the entropy of activities after work and their additional social circles. but yes, also hitting on coworkers happens without incident too
• guardiantesla 4y ago
  This sounds good if family relationships are priority. I think networking and building professional relationships are often improved over in-person interactions. As we get more isolated in remote work, are there any diminishing returns which often not talked about? Any idea, how are these concerns for folks who are in or want to work for startups? How are WFH folks networking in bayarea?
  • eddsh1994 4y ago
    I signed up to go to Hacker Dojo in Mountain View to get out the house, my employer pays for me to use WeWork whenever I want, and most importantly the bar (I found any freelance work I've wanted to pick up by having a beer and someone there asking for help for their startup from time to time).
    • ShamelessC 4y ago
      WeWork is still a thing?
      • ShamelessC 4y ago
        This was a legitimate question. We don't all live in the Bay area and my understanding was that the business model failed.
        • eddsh1994 4y ago
          Yeah it’s still a thing! There’s 5 in SF and one in most cities down to San Jose
          • ShamelessC 4y ago
            So quite reduced from their initial operations though, correct? Why is that notion apparently so threatening? I remember people here proudly loathing the distracting music and making (apt) comparisons to existing co-working spaces, shared offices, coffee shops and public libraries (in order of increasing affordability). I never used one, but the idea that it's a household name is just tone deaf. Most people probably know it best from the Hulu series about it's demise.
• elforce002 4y ago
  Congrats! I hope your employer doesn't make you return to the office anytime soon.
• fmajid 4y ago
  WFH for a programmer can be far more productive because you don't have the interruptions of random colleagues. If you have kids at home, however, it might be just as bad. I think at some point there is going to be a surge in working-from-the-WeWork-closest-to-home for people who can't afford a dedicated home office.