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Ejaculation frequency and prostate cancer (2022)
- throwawaytemp29 4y agoPhew
- altdataseller 4y agoDont show this to the nofap community
- rideontime 4y agoI disagree; as a vulnerable community, they should know the truth.
- Espressosaurus 4y agoThey're worried about their precious bodily fluids. I don't expect contrary information to penetrate their bubble.
- loeg 4y ago[flagged]
- mouse_ 4y agoIt's a fetish.
- lucb1e 4y agoI only ever heard cult used in the sense of an organised group that is lead to believe harmful and untrue things, but checking the dictionary, it can also just be "great devotion to [e.g., an] idea" (merriam webster) which could be said of nearly any subreddit. In what way do you mean it? Besides the correlation in this study, is there anything particularly harmful in the same way that a more stereotypical cult (KKK is the first that comes to mind, probably a relatively extreme example but I don't know that many) is typically considered harmful?
- maximus-decimus 4y agoPeople in the nofap community claim that abstaining from masturbation gives them "super powers". From Google, a cult is "a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object." They venerate non-masturbation as if it were a deity able to grant them divine powers if they worship it enough. Or at least that's how it sounds like when you hear them talk about it.
- lucb1e 4y agoThat's not at all the impression I got. Never masturbating ever might be seen as good by some there, but for most it's a temporary means to an end than the end goal. Helping get past porn addictions (by stopping cold turkey for a while), improving the relationship with your partner (by reducing or stopping to masturbate and see how that affects it), and being supportive of whatever people's goals are is what the community seemed like to me (but that's admittedly going off years-old memories). Hence I'm quite confused by all the outright hate here.
- SXX 4y agoHate to weird niche communities is pretty much like hate to Linkedin: because it full of cringe, poor quality marketing and just pure BS. Even if you registered on there you won't be using it 99% of time until you need to find a new job. Or unless Linkedin is part of your actual job because you're HR / sales person. It's great that it might help someone, but it doesn't mean we all should accept everything this community produce is something good and normal.
- _yb2s 4y agoThey only believe it gives them “super powers” in the same way getting free from a heroin addiction would feel like gaining super powers. Normal health feels super when you previously lacked it.
- girvo 4y ago> in the same way getting free from a heroin addiction would feel like gaining super powers As someone who has done exactly that and is involved heavily in recovery communities, no one would describe sobriety as "gaining super powers", and I'm sick of people conflating porn addiction and heroin addiction as if they have anything in common. They really do not, and anyone who does has obviously never experienced opioid dependence. "But but but dopamine pathways" -- if you don't understand the difference in orders of magnitude between exogenous chemicals that directly operate on those pathways, and that which your body and brain can create on their own, I don't know what to tell you.
- Loveaway 4y ago[flagged]
- dang 4y agoYikes! Please don't break the site guidelines like this, regardless of how wrong other people are or you feel they are. We ban accounts that do this. You may not owe (non-)masturbators better, but you owe this community (much) better if you're participating in it. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- girvo 4y agoMost of that community appears to be based on woo and bad analysis of science/biology, so I imagine they'd likely dismiss this study out of hand regardless. But also, we shouldn't forget this: > The studies from the United States and Australia do little to answer these critical questions — but they do open a new avenue for research This isn't a fully understood area of research yet.
- shagie 4y agoHow a New Meme Exposes the Far-Right Roots of #NoNutNovember - https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/coomer-meme-no-nut-november-nofap-908676/ https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/coomer... > Yet it would be naive to ignore that there’s significant overlap between the general ideology behind NoFap — and, to a degree, No Nut November — and that of the far right, which has increasingly coopted the principles of masturbation abstinence. Because the challenge is associated with abstaining from porn, some people associated with the movement have taken the extra step of harassing adult performers on social media, giving it an additional layer of troubling implications. “In the past [No Nut November] has always been like, ‘Oh, look at this ridiculous thing some people are participating in,'” says adult performer and director Casey Calvert. “This year, people [in the industry] are talking about, ‘Oh, actually this is connected to the far right and maybe we shouldn’t just be saying hahaha, No Nut November.'” Was UK Mass Murderer Radicalized in Anti-Porn Groups? - https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/women-who-stray/202108/was-uk-mass-murderer-radicalized-in-anti-porn-groups https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/women-who-stray/2021... > Like the incel groups, online discussions of ways to stop masturbating or cease watching pornography have also been identified as groups filled with hatred towards women, homophobia, antisemitism, and threats of violence. In 2019, I appeared on The Daily Show, describing how these groups radicalize young men by teaching them to fear masturbation. > Since that appearance, I've regularly received threats, death threats, and intimidating emails, including troubling messages from Gavin McInnes, founder of The Proud Boys. Recent research examining the discussions in these anti-porn and anti-masturbation groups has repeatedly documented that they thrive on the rejection of science and embrace extremely conservative, highly religious themes. These groups promote abstinence from pornography and masturbation as ways for men to become more masculine and successfully attract mates. As you might imagine, there is a significant overlap between the incel and these anti-porn/anti-masturbation groups. That episode is https://www.cc.com/video/bgws7v/the-daily-show-with-trevor-noah-why-is-the-alt-right-so-angry https://www.cc.com/video/bgws7v/the-daily-show-with-trevor-n...
- SnowHill9902 4y agoThere’s no problem with nofap if you get enough little kittens.
- threadweaver34 4y agoThe one point they have is that internet porn can be a problem for some people, but there's a difference between having to use your imagination and abstaining entirely.
- prmoustache 4y agoDo they really exist? And if so do they actually apply a nofap policy?
- sph 4y agoWhen I'm in the mood of reading a bunch of smug nerds pontificating and preaching, I click on any popsci or diet-related article on HN. Never fails to entertain. Nofap like many things has been turned into a brand, and even politicised to the point some idiots attack it saying it's far right ideology. On the other hand there are teenagers with serious porn-related issues that think nofap will turn them into superhumans. But the smug nerd on the internet doesn't stop to consider the nofap movement that's become a caricature of its former self, still is a major indicator of the emotional and physical problems porn is causing to many men and women. It's an epidemic. Go crank all you want because a popsci article said so, but if you haven't seen how widespread and destructive porn addiction is, this must be your first day on the Internet. I already imagine the retort "well, just don't watch porn then." Because only idiots and weak-willed people get addicted. Sorry, I'm in a cranky mood because I've struggled with porn addiction myself, I have had someone confess they suffer from it just a few hours ago, and I'm bitter how what was a porn addiction support group like nofap managed to turn itself into a joke—and they have themselves to blame, yet porn still is something people laugh about for internet karma. /rant
- EGreg 4y ago“Sorry, I’m in a cranky mood” Made me look up the word cranky and found “crankshaft” - a shaft driven by a crank that turns reciprocating motion into rotating motion. Legit. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reciprocating_motion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reciprocating_motion
- TheFreim 4y ago[dead]
- Moissanite 4y ago[flagged]
- metadat 4y agoThe quote at the end confuses me: > In 1807 William Wordsworth wrote, "The child is father of the man." With respect to prostate cancer, though, sexual activity in adolescence may be a predictor of risk in adulthood. Wouldn't adolescent sexual activity be the form-determining-factor (aka "father") of the prostate cancer risk statistical profile in adulthood? How is this different from the last sentence being analogous to the quote? Thanks in advance for humoring me.
- danuker 4y ago> Compared to men who reported 4–7 ejaculations per month across their lifetimes, men who ejaculated 21 or more times a month enjoyed a 31% lower risk of prostate cancer.
- rippercushions 4y agoThose are rookie numbers. You gotta pump up those numbers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CES1OIkFhg4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CES1OIkFhg4
- Gigachad 4y agoI’m probs a coomer because I’d average 80/ month.
- grugagag 4y agoAre you a teenager??
- LiquidPolymer 4y agoI'm 58 - Based upon this article, it appears I'm going to love, I mean live forever!
- grugagag 4y agoIn my early 40s and have become a lot lazier/more lame than you in this department. It’s a need that needs to be fulfilled and it does but, it doesnt occupy my mind like when I was a teenager or in my early 20s and in a way i’m grateful for it. It seems I may be on the hook for prostate issues. A grandparent and uncle had prostate cancer so it’s up there in my history.
- bradyd 4y agoErnest Borgnine's secret to a long life: https://youtu.be/hk1T9XC3XPc https://youtu.be/hk1T9XC3XPc
- version_five 4y agoI wonder what things correlate with more frequent ejaculation in early adulthood? Having a girlfriend, being a "player"? Having a living situation that's amenable to regular self pleasure (posts are automatically dead if you use the m-word). Having more free time?
- b212 4y agoI’d assume being in a long term relationship actually lowers your frequency ;)
- dahfizz 4y agoCopium single people tell themselves
- cycomanic 4y agoYou're wrong. This was some time ago but I recall seeing a study that a 60 year old married woman has more sex on average than a single man in his 20s.
- hattmall 4y agoBut definitely not a single woman, that wants to have more.
- hdctambien 4y agoA 60 year old woman (well, a 65+ yo) doesn't spend 8+ hours a day at work or have kids at home.
- jefftk 4y agoBut the study was about ejaculation, not intercourse. Single men in their 20s might have little of the latter, but lots of the former.
- toast0 4y agoAccess to privacy?
- 4y ago
- antirez 4y agoSo YouPorn is a medical device now. Seriously: those are not the sole studies showing those evidences. There are older with the same results. Religion and movements that prevent masturbation are disturbing from the point of view of the sexual development of teenagers.
- MuffinFlavored 4y ago> So YouPorn is a medical device now. I thought I've read the opposite that porn should be avoided because it's just like the rest of social media (a hinderance overall). Bad from an "over stimulation" perspective. aka the whole "nofap" movement https://www.reddit.com/r/NoFap/ https://www.reddit.com/r/NoFap/ has 1,100,000+ members
- ravi-delia 4y agoI mean I can find a million people believing a lot of things. If you want to avoid both social media and prostate cancer, the species has been making do with imagination for quite a few millennia.
- MuffinFlavored 4y agoTo me it's more about what the current "narrative" is being pushed/what is a popular "mindset/viewpoint" in society. A lot of TikTok users write comments like "stay strong bros" referring to "keep scrolling past this trending submission on the timeline" do not let these young women in skimpy clothing make you succumb to your goals of avoiding the pitfalls that come with being "addicted" to the stimulation of the porn itself and the "pleasure" of masturbating"
- narag 4y agoSo some behaviour is bad and social media is bad and you join a social media forum with one million... ahem, members to talk about it. It doesn't seem like a good plan. Edit, to clarify: traditional suppport groups must be helpful for serious addiction, but an online forum with a lot of traffic? It seems crazy. If you have a problem with doing something pasively and anonymously online, go outside and chat with people in the flesh. You need to do something that helps you forget the damn thing, not revolving around it more.
- nimbius 4y agoHacker news: check out this amazing stablediffusion library in rust! Also Hacker news: you should be crankin' it more.
- goodpoint 4y ago[dead]
- yazzku 4y agoRust evangelists surely need to crank it more. Make sure to wrap it in unsafe{}, boys.
- WesolyKubeczek 4y agoWhy not both? There are multiple ways to have joy.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- thepasswordis 4y agoLot of people seem to be combining the two actually.
- robocat 4y agoSo many opportunities for correlation not causation. One obvious correlation could be testosterone: higher testosterone leading to less prostate cancer. Of course higher testosterone has multiple causes. I knew a girlfriend of a guy taking roids, both in their twenties: she said he was insatiable in her opinion (I think she limited access to three times a day, because he just wanted more).
- Yorch 4y agoWhen someone has prostate cancer, the first thing they do is give them hormones to suppress testosterone.
- graeme 4y agoThere is a difference between treating prostate cancer and preventing it. Both of the following are true: * Androgen suppression treats prostate cancer * Low testosterone is associated with developing prostate cancer This paper suggests there is a saturation model at work. Zero T does prevent prostate cancer, but above a certain very low level the risk does not grow. https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=testosterone+and+prostate+cancer&oq=testosterone+and+pros#d=gs_qabs&t=1675038089555&u=%23p%3D1FX8h9vHSVcJ https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=test...
- twawaaay 4y agoIt is truly tiring to see all these "linked" articles. It might be interesting but without some more research it is useless and just messes up with 99.9% of population who will read it and wrongly assume sexual activity prevents cancer. I am currently on a big spree trying to fix my diet and sift true information from all those wrong inferences. Turns out, almost everything I have been told and red is a lie based on wrong inferences. Lifetime of avoiding fat... exactly opposite of what I should have been doing...
- ponector 4y agoWhat are your current diet assumptions? From what I heard, the best way to stay healthy is to follow mediterranean and DASH diets.
- triyambakam 4y agoTime to go beat cancer? Sorry, the jokes are too easy.
- mrleinad 4y agoPornhub has done more for public healthcare than the average politician.
- SXX 4y agoAlso for public satefy.
- steve_adams_86 4y agoSomeone could make the case that porn has actually devalued intimacy to a substantial number of men (for example) and harmed many people’s well being as a result.
- mjklin 4y agoI doubt the evidence will stand up…
- fxde 4y agoWe do not do it because it is easy. We do it because it's hard.
- unity1001 4y ago"Slapping the sergeant" also comes to mind...
- BuckyBeaver 4y agoSo I glad I invested in my long-term health early. And often.
- quickthrower2 4y agoAlso for a bit of correlation circlejerk: On average, men who walk 5km a day are less likely to die in a road accident.
- pluc 4y agoPeople who drink 1.7 glass of water in the shade on Tuesdays are 53% more likely to win travel-related sweepstakes in odd-numbered years (this expands to 66% for carbonated water)
- pessimizer 4y agoIs that actually true, or is it only true of drivers? I'm pretty sure that of people who don't drive, the ones who walk fewer than 5km a day are going to be involved in fewer road accidents than the ones who walk more.
- owl57 4y agoI haven't got any data whatsoever, but probably most people who walk more than 5km a day live in places with relatively pedestrian-friendly roads and driving habits.
- quickthrower2 4y agoYeah that was my joke/point. Walking alot means you are more likely to be doing that walking instead of using a car on average. City dwelling being the main scenario and I am sure there are other scenarios. By specifying car accidents (and not just accidents) I biased it further
- codegeek 4y agoTL;Dr: "The scientists found no evidence that frequent ejaculations mark an increased risk of prostate cancer. In fact, the reverse was true: High ejaculation frequency was linked to a decreased risk"
- version_five 4y agoI want to point out that it's long been HN filter policy to "kill" posts that use a word beginning with m for self stimulation they is very relevant to this discussion. If you turn on showdead you'll see a few dead posts by people that aren't otherwise shadowbanned, because they used that word. Seems like a good argument against censorship, especially as it relates to normal activity.
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- ggm 4y agoPragmatically if it stops a spam burden, I don't much care. Beaver college sports and The UK town of Scunthorpe are well used to this kind of regex filter, and neither have ceased to exist online. I don't think this is a good argument against censorship at all.
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- OnlineGladiator 4y ago> Pragmatically if it stops a spam burden, I don't much care. I doubt there are people/bots spamming about jerking off on HN. It makes me wonder why this rule was implemented.
- idiotsecant 4y agoThere are porn bots in the comments section of my personal website that like 5 people have ever read. HN is a big website, I'm sure spam is a major problem.
- adenozine 4y agoFirst good news about this topic for a lot of you, it seems.
- hunglee2 4y agolow frequency ejaculators might be in poor overall health in any case and perhaps more at risk for prostate cancer. How would we test for this? A sample group might need to 'up the tempo' for a period and test again for the therapeutic effect
- Hatrix 4y agoIs this why Musk installed bedrooms at Twitter?
- giantg2 4y agoIs there any correlation to ejaculated frequency and other issues, such as enlarged prostate?
- loeg 4y agoThe former decreases with age and the latter increases with age, so they're almost certainly reverse-correlated. Is that meaningful? Probably not.
- raydiatian 4y agoThis discovery is nuts.
- svnt 4y agoWhy not provide the relationship between variables in the title itself? Less frequent ejaculation correlates with higher rates of prostate cancer People will still click through
- Awelton 4y ago[flagged]
- thepasswordis 4y agoAlso seems possible that married men, who are at a lower risk for almost every negative health outcome there is, are also at a lower risk for prostate cancer due to what is outlined in the paper. Married men seem more likely to have frequent (ahem) both due to literally living with their partner, as well as having a lower likelihood of depression, higher testosterone (the higher test generally would lead to the marriage) etc.
- angarg12 4y agoAre you married? My anecdotal evidence points in the opposite direction.
- thepasswordis 4y agoYes I am married.
- nfw2 4y agoI would actually expect most married men to have less frequent ejaculations. I'm not married myself, but my impression is that most couples don't keep up a daily sexual routine for several decades, and finding time and space to self-stimulate is awkward if your live-in partner is not in the mood. One thing I actually prefer (ironically) about the single life is that the schedule of your sexual release, which has a big influence on mood, energy, and sleep, is totally under your control.
- pessimizer 4y ago> finding time and space to self-stimulate is awkward I still believe that the main reason for the iPad's success (ahead of letting it babysit your kids) was married men taking it into the bathroom to masturbate.
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- TheFreim 4y agoThe evidence is extremely varied, and in my opinion unreliable for making serious claims. Commonly cited by those repeating these claims, which as others have pointed out is rife with issues pertaining to causality, is the 2004 study "Ejaculation Frequency and Subsequent Risk of Prostate Cancer" published in the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA). Here is a section summarizing what came before: > Previous investigations on reported ejaculation frequencies or sexual intercourse and prostate cancer are limited to studies of retrospective design and results are mixed. Nine studies observed a statistically significant or non-significant positive association; 3 studies reported no association; 7 studies found a statistically significant or non-significant inverse relationship; and 1 study found a U-shaped relationship. Conclusions that come from the aforementioned article, as well as many/most/all others that I have encountered, are mixed and, as others have noted, have issues with determining causes.
- danielvaughn 4y agoMy wife and I have been trying for a kid for a while, and though I’m healthy, over the past 9 months I’ve gone down a rabbit hole on the professional literature around men’s health. I don’t know how it compares to anything else, but the variance of the data is what struck me the most. That, and the low-resolution around a lot of the studies that have been run. I get that science is hard, but I would expect a LOT more detail from publications than what is typically offered.
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- thepasswordis 4y agoHey man good luck! I know some people who have tried and tried before it finally all clicked. One person I can think of now has 4 kids! It can be tough. I'm sure you don't need any advice. Kids are the best, most meaningful thing you will ever do. Its worth it to keep trying.
- birthcontrol 4y ago
- cryptonector 4y agoStrong correlation vs. causation vibes here. It could well be that ejaculation helps prevent prostate cancer, but it could just as well be that men who are by nature more likely to get prostate cancer also need less frequent ejaculation and that ejaculation has nothing to do with causing the cancer.
- ynab4 4y agoConsoom more p0rn!!! Give your money to OnlyFans!!1! Trust the soyence!!!
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- l8rlump 4y agoReminds me of something I think Frank Zappa said. Something like there are two things that you can never have too much of: sex and vegetables.
- nikolay 4y ago[flagged]
- bobobob420 4y agoTim Ferris is a conman who will say anything to sell his worthless books and supplements. I wouldn't take anything he says seriously
- nikolay 4y agoAnd how is he benefiting from particularly saying that? What he says is based on studies and talks with experts in the field. You may not like many things he says, but this doesn't automatically make them wrong.
- bobobob420 4y agoIts like the people who write all sorts of software engineering processes and procedures books. If you look at them their entire career is writing and selling books. They don’t actually have any industry experience. Tim ferris sells you the idea you can become a superhuman so he can make money on supplements and books. He doesn’t and hasn’t done anything of merit in the first place. Hes like a salesman of adhd. One of his books is ‘the 4 hour work week’. Just absolute garbage.
- nikolay 4y agoJoe Cohen of SelfHacked.com also talked about this and even shared TMI on his hacks to absorb back the "losses."
- stan_kirdey 4y ago"High ejaculation frequency was linked to a decreased risk" tldr
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