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I guess that means we should expect AppKit and SwiftUI to never improve.

by LudwigNagasena 4y ago

lapcat 4y ago
AppKit has been going downhill for years.
- StewardMcOy 4y ago
  I don't know why this is being downvoted. The situation is more complex than this simple comment, but the sentiment is correct. The reality is that AppKit has had its ups and downs recently. There are obviously people in Apple trying to do their best to patch things up, and there have been some nice improvements because of their efforts, but some really bad bugs have been introduced, only to sit unfixed for years. It's gotten to the point where I dread the yearly OS updates, not because I dread having to update my code, but because I worry what has broken. In my experience, if you don't get your bugs filed within the first week after WWDC, they'll never get fixed, and even if you do, it's a toss-up. But testing your existing code isn't always enough. If you're writing new code to take advantage of some of the new OS features, you can be a month into the beta cycle before you find a bug, and by that point, its too late.
  - plorkyeran 4y ago
    The worst part is that new things are often completely broken or outright missing in beta 1, and then by the time you can actually test them in beta 3 it's too late to report bugs and have any real hope of them getting fixed.
- Klonoar 4y ago
  Uhhh, not sure I agree. You could argue it’s stagnant, maybe - but it’s just as good as it’s always been.
  - lapcat 4y ago
    > You could argue it’s stagnant, maybe Quite the opposite. I would argue that macOS (the artist formerly known as Mac OS X) is quickly being transformed into iOS. Big Sur was a massive change in this respect, and the transformation continues in Ventura.
    - solarkraft 4y ago
      iOS has a super solid UI, so that would be great. Instead Control Center takes 2 seconds to show up and without any animation. UI wise at best it's some paint. The port of Stage Manager is horrendous as well. Freedom wise I find it just about still tolerable. You can still run non-blessed binaries after some hoops and access a good amount of APIs.

I guess that means we should expect AppKit and SwiftUI to never improve.

lapcat 4y ago

AppKit has been going downhill for years.

StewardMcOy 4y ago
I don't know why this is being downvoted. The situation is more complex than this simple comment, but the sentiment is correct. The reality is that AppKit has had its ups and downs recently. There are obviously people in Apple trying to do their best to patch things up, and there have been some nice improvements because of their efforts, but some really bad bugs have been introduced, only to sit unfixed for years. It's gotten to the point where I dread the yearly OS updates, not because I dread having to update my code, but because I worry what has broken. In my experience, if you don't get your bugs filed within the first week after WWDC, they'll never get fixed, and even if you do, it's a toss-up. But testing your existing code isn't always enough. If you're writing new code to take advantage of some of the new OS features, you can be a month into the beta cycle before you find a bug, and by that point, its too late.
- plorkyeran 4y ago
  The worst part is that new things are often completely broken or outright missing in beta 1, and then by the time you can actually test them in beta 3 it's too late to report bugs and have any real hope of them getting fixed.
Klonoar 4y ago
Uhhh, not sure I agree. You could argue it’s stagnant, maybe - but it’s just as good as it’s always been.
- lapcat 4y ago
  > You could argue it’s stagnant, maybe Quite the opposite. I would argue that macOS (the artist formerly known as Mac OS X) is quickly being transformed into iOS. Big Sur was a massive change in this respect, and the transformation continues in Ventura.
  - solarkraft 4y ago
    iOS has a super solid UI, so that would be great. Instead Control Center takes 2 seconds to show up and without any animation. UI wise at best it's some paint. The port of Stage Manager is horrendous as well. Freedom wise I find it just about still tolerable. You can still run non-blessed binaries after some hoops and access a good amount of APIs.