4 ms·

I can see the usage being between parent and kid more than producing best sellers. Or a way to give a kid a cheap but special gift.

the_af 4y ago
Yes, but that's precisely the usage I find upsetting!
- dwringer 4y ago
  I can see your point but I'm not sure it's that straightforward. Let's say you simply took a hat with your kid's favorite characters from tv/movies/books/whatever on slips of paper, drew some, then did the same for plots, then made up a story to tell your kid. At some level, sure, it's not the same as coming up with a story on your own - there's not going to be anything meaningful in why you selected those particular elements of the story - but that merely constrains those choices to free you up to be creative with other aspects of the story. I think there's still room for someone who wants to be creative to use the tools to provide the same experience you're describing. It's not like one has to give the raw output to one's child. And I think such raw outputs will be generally bland, missing something relative to those with a human touch. However, giving bland and meaningless entertainment to children wouldn't really be something new, and I still see a fair concern in there. I suppose this is already part of what articles on "Kids' YouTube" are talking about.[0] [0]https://www.avclub.com/take-a-trip-to-the-automated-hellscape-of-youtube-video-1820196139 https://www.avclub.com/take-a-trip-to-the-automated-hellscap...
- sanp 4y ago
  perhaps the core idea of the story can still come from you but ChatGPT can help flesh out the details in write it in a compelling manner.
  - nemo44x 4y ago
    That's how I see it. IT could still involve a lot of novel thought and work to get the AI to generate text you want. You nudge it in whatever direction you want it to go.
    - the_af 4y ago
      What actual problem about writing would this solve? This is like coming up with a plot idea and having some hired writer write it. This already existed before computers. So you're essentially using GPT as a ghostwriter, only (unlike human ghostwriters) it has no way to come with something innovative, it just regurgitates whatever it's already in its data in some way or another. "But," I can guess you'll object, "human (ghost)writers are already writing derivative crap, what's the difference?". Exactly. We already know how to hire humans to write derivative crap, and the truly good stuff is out of the question for GPT. So what is this solving? But what about children's bedtime stories? Well, there are tons of really good bedtime stories, lovingly crafted by good authors. Do we need automated ones written by ChatGPT?
      - corysama 4y ago
        Do we need another song about love? Do we need another library for formatting text? Do we need another bedtime story? No, we probably don’t. Won’t and shouldn’t stop people from making more :)
        the_af 4y ago
        Excellent point. The world doesn't need another love song [1]. But the human composing it might need it, as a form of expression, even if the result is garbage or trite. Humans enjoy creating stuff, even if nobody wants that stuff. Writers write, or their minds will explode. The creation process is its own goal. This is not the case for ChatGPT; a LLM has no motivations. [1] https://youtu.be/jJHbJukQi8k?t=42 https://youtu.be/jJHbJukQi8k?t=42
        nemo44x 4y ago
        Go ahead and create, no technology is stopping anyone from doing that. But I don't see why you can't create while using a technology like ChatGPT. Coming up with the proper prompts, rewriting some of its output, using its output as an input, etc. There's a lot of things you can do to combine your own novel thoughts with the text generated by a machine. That's a way to create things that has never really been possible. Imagine being an OK writer and now you potentially have an editor. Imagine asking it to come up with a few ideas regarding something you're working on and you can use one as inspiration. There's just unlimited ways people will work with and integrate these new tools that you or I can't even possibly dream up. As for asking if we need more bedtime stories - why not? Maybe it would be cool if me and my kid could use some experience we had together to create a story that features him and his friends in the mold of a classic story.

the_af 4y ago

Yes, but that's precisely the usage I find upsetting!

dwringer 4y ago
I can see your point but I'm not sure it's that straightforward. Let's say you simply took a hat with your kid's favorite characters from tv/movies/books/whatever on slips of paper, drew some, then did the same for plots, then made up a story to tell your kid. At some level, sure, it's not the same as coming up with a story on your own - there's not going to be anything meaningful in why you selected those particular elements of the story - but that merely constrains those choices to free you up to be creative with other aspects of the story. I think there's still room for someone who wants to be creative to use the tools to provide the same experience you're describing. It's not like one has to give the raw output to one's child. And I think such raw outputs will be generally bland, missing something relative to those with a human touch. However, giving bland and meaningless entertainment to children wouldn't really be something new, and I still see a fair concern in there. I suppose this is already part of what articles on "Kids' YouTube" are talking about.[0] [0]https://www.avclub.com/take-a-trip-to-the-automated-hellscape-of-youtube-video-1820196139 https://www.avclub.com/take-a-trip-to-the-automated-hellscap...
sanp 4y ago
perhaps the core idea of the story can still come from you but ChatGPT can help flesh out the details in write it in a compelling manner.
- nemo44x 4y ago
  That's how I see it. IT could still involve a lot of novel thought and work to get the AI to generate text you want. You nudge it in whatever direction you want it to go.
  - the_af 4y ago
    What actual problem about writing would this solve? This is like coming up with a plot idea and having some hired writer write it. This already existed before computers. So you're essentially using GPT as a ghostwriter, only (unlike human ghostwriters) it has no way to come with something innovative, it just regurgitates whatever it's already in its data in some way or another. "But," I can guess you'll object, "human (ghost)writers are already writing derivative crap, what's the difference?". Exactly. We already know how to hire humans to write derivative crap, and the truly good stuff is out of the question for GPT. So what is this solving? But what about children's bedtime stories? Well, there are tons of really good bedtime stories, lovingly crafted by good authors. Do we need automated ones written by ChatGPT?
    - corysama 4y ago
      Do we need another song about love? Do we need another library for formatting text? Do we need another bedtime story? No, we probably don’t. Won’t and shouldn’t stop people from making more :)
      - the_af 4y ago
        Excellent point. The world doesn't need another love song [1]. But the human composing it might need it, as a form of expression, even if the result is garbage or trite. Humans enjoy creating stuff, even if nobody wants that stuff. Writers write, or their minds will explode. The creation process is its own goal. This is not the case for ChatGPT; a LLM has no motivations. [1] https://youtu.be/jJHbJukQi8k?t=42 https://youtu.be/jJHbJukQi8k?t=42
        nemo44x 4y ago
        Go ahead and create, no technology is stopping anyone from doing that. But I don't see why you can't create while using a technology like ChatGPT. Coming up with the proper prompts, rewriting some of its output, using its output as an input, etc. There's a lot of things you can do to combine your own novel thoughts with the text generated by a machine. That's a way to create things that has never really been possible. Imagine being an OK writer and now you potentially have an editor. Imagine asking it to come up with a few ideas regarding something you're working on and you can use one as inspiration. There's just unlimited ways people will work with and integrate these new tools that you or I can't even possibly dream up. As for asking if we need more bedtime stories - why not? Maybe it would be cool if me and my kid could use some experience we had together to create a story that features him and his friends in the mold of a classic story.