8 ms·

This is far worse than Airbnb. As annoying as the cleaning fees are, they are disclosed before you obligate yourself. A 20% fee only disclosed after you’ve alr

This is far worse than Airbnb. As annoying as the cleaning fees are, they are disclosed before you obligate yourself. A 20% fee only disclosed after you’ve already ordered and eaten is just fraud.

benatkin 4y ago
Not to mention that you can search for AirBnbs that have lower cleaning fees.
- hadlock 4y ago
  Once they started including cleaning fees on the regular, often for as much as a single night's stay, I've largely curtailed my use of the service, and have gone back to hotels. Very occasionally, like for an out of state wedding, especially out in the country where hotel options are limited, we'll still at least glance at airbnb type services. I used to really like airbnb but instead of undercutting hotels on price they're often significantly higher, along with significant risk of an unpredictable or even bad experience. Staying at a chain hotel virtually guarantees no unexpected issues and no unexpected charges or drama. The last experience I had with airbnb (two years ago) the host grilled me on why I wanted a last minute booking (pandemic staycation baby-moon). Was not thrilled with the experience. When you book with a hotel all they ask you is for your ID and if you want a king or two queen beds.
  - benatkin 4y ago
    A single night's stay is actually a great use of a cleaning fee, because the cost of cleaning can't be spread between multiple nights.
alistairSH 4y ago
This. The other industries mentioned might tack on fees at check-out time, but the service/product hasn't yet been consumed, so the consumer can back out. This isn't true with dining out, where you see a price list, order, eat, and then get a bill at the end. You can no longer opt to eat elsewhere. You either make a scene or pay the undisclosed fees. Restaurants should at least put a notice on the menu in a highly visible location, but even that isn't going to be foolproof. Really, this practice should be banned everywhere. As a consumer, I largely don't give a shit what expenses a vendor has; I only care about the final price. I can see an argument for disclosing regulatory fees, because as a resident/citizen, I can at least lobby politicians to change those fees. But, even that's a bit of a crap argument.
- jbirer 4y ago
  A little assertiveness can go a long way. "I was not made aware of this fee, so I am only paying X" and walking away should work.
  - tempestn 4y ago
    You can only do that if paying cash. And if you do, what will effectively happen is that the money you intend to leave as tip will go toward the fee instead.
    - chamwislothe2nd 4y ago
      Unfortunately for everyone involved, the waiter is complicit in the fraud and no longer deserves a tip.
      - jzb 4y ago
        Yes, because as we all know, service staff have enormous power and dictate restaurant policy. This is why they're so highly paid and aren't abused at all by customers, for example. /s
        adamc 4y ago
        Their only power is to leave. I don't like sticking them either, but it's true that they are complicit.
        LadyCailin 4y ago
        Or unionizing.
        drdec 4y ago
        The server could have made sure they were aware of the policy before they ordered. Seems like the best way to make sure you get a tip to me.
tommoor 4y ago
I'm not defending the restaurant as I hate this as much as the next person but I'm sure the fee was mentioned on the menu - probably in small print and this was omitted for the sake of a good story.
- happymellon 4y ago
  That is defending the restaurant. If it was tiny fine print then it was intended to be missed.
- bradleyjg 4y ago
  If you’re going to reprint the menu to add that, just bump the prices 20% and be an honest business.
benj111 4y ago
Just don't pay the fee. Or call the manager over and ask why they arent paying their staff properly. Companies only pull this stuff because they get away with it. Don't make it worth their while.
- adamc 4y ago
  Unfortunately, for many people that ruins their night out. It is often more practical to pay it and never return.
  - autoexec 4y ago
    The good news is that if everyone does that it'll still not be worth it to continue their deceptive practice, the bad news is that not everyone will stop going to the restaurant and the owner who sees the number of customers decline might be thick enough to assume it's for some other reason. I wouldn't make a scene, or let it ruin my night, but I'd make it clear that the hidden charge lost them my business.
  - benj111 4y ago
    Surely the night is already ruined by restaurants pulling this shit?
idopmstuff 4y ago
The problem with AirBnb cleaning fees is that they don't disclose what's included in them. If you're going to charge me $500, fine, but it's not great when I show up and find out that you expect me to wash and remake the beds, power wash the deck, get rid of that wasp nest that's been there for a month and also assemble some Ikea furniture. These days I ask for a list of cleaning requirements before I book.
- adrr 4y ago
  Airbnb should set standards. Some places make me do absolutely nothing like a hotel room. And some places make you wash the linens, dishes and sweep/vacuum the floors while paying $300+ for a cleaning fee. Probably why I now prefer hotels because i know what i am getting.
  - idopmstuff 4y ago
    Honestly, I'm fine with hosts charging whatever they want and asking guests to do whatever they want, as long as it's properly disclosed. If I show up and the house rules/cleaning requirements are more onerous than what's disclosed, I ought to be able to notify AirBnb and just get my cleaning fee refunded or somethin else slightly punitive to keep hosts honest.
- spacemadness 4y ago
  I don’t think I’ve ever been asked to do laundry, but if I would have I’d refuse on principle since I’m paying an exorbitant cleaning fee already.
- kriskrunch 4y ago
  This and several horrendous check-ins we experienced on our most recent trip to Europe made us go back to booking exclusively with hotels.
- 0x457 4y ago
  If I get charged $500 for cleaning and I find a speck of dust, anything foreign (hair, eyelash) on bedsheets or streak marks on any gloss surface - I'm doing a charge-back as soon as I check out.
lxgr 4y ago
It's still annoying, since they don't show up when you search on the map, as far as I remember. Mostly due to this, I've given up on Airbnb in favor of traditional hotel booking sites (specifically the one with a capital B). Many private apartments are also listed on them these days, and I value not having to play stupid pricing games more than the slightly higher availability on Airbnb. When changing the country to Europe (or currency to EUR?), listings even include taxes and local fees, allowing a true apples to apples comparison between offers.
- bradleyjg 4y ago
  I agree it’s annoying, it’s just not as bad as changing you 20% after you leave for an unannounced “Fair Wage and Wellness” fee. The restaurant is straight out stealing.

This is far worse than Airbnb. As annoying as the cleaning fees are, they are disclosed before you obligate yourself. A 20% fee only disclosed after you’ve already ordered and eaten is just fraud.

benatkin 4y ago

Not to mention that you can search for AirBnbs that have lower cleaning fees.

hadlock 4y ago
Once they started including cleaning fees on the regular, often for as much as a single night's stay, I've largely curtailed my use of the service, and have gone back to hotels. Very occasionally, like for an out of state wedding, especially out in the country where hotel options are limited, we'll still at least glance at airbnb type services. I used to really like airbnb but instead of undercutting hotels on price they're often significantly higher, along with significant risk of an unpredictable or even bad experience. Staying at a chain hotel virtually guarantees no unexpected issues and no unexpected charges or drama. The last experience I had with airbnb (two years ago) the host grilled me on why I wanted a last minute booking (pandemic staycation baby-moon). Was not thrilled with the experience. When you book with a hotel all they ask you is for your ID and if you want a king or two queen beds.
- benatkin 4y ago
  A single night's stay is actually a great use of a cleaning fee, because the cost of cleaning can't be spread between multiple nights.

alistairSH 4y ago

This. The other industries mentioned might tack on fees at check-out time, but the service/product hasn't yet been consumed, so the consumer can back out. This isn't true with dining out, where you see a price list, order, eat, and then get a bill at the end. You can no longer opt to eat elsewhere. You either make a scene or pay the undisclosed fees. Restaurants should at least put a notice on the menu in a highly visible location, but even that isn't going to be foolproof. Really, this practice should be banned everywhere. As a consumer, I largely don't give a shit what expenses a vendor has; I only care about the final price. I can see an argument for disclosing regulatory fees, because as a resident/citizen, I can at least lobby politicians to change those fees. But, even that's a bit of a crap argument.

jbirer 4y ago
A little assertiveness can go a long way. "I was not made aware of this fee, so I am only paying X" and walking away should work.
- tempestn 4y ago
  You can only do that if paying cash. And if you do, what will effectively happen is that the money you intend to leave as tip will go toward the fee instead.
  - chamwislothe2nd 4y ago
    Unfortunately for everyone involved, the waiter is complicit in the fraud and no longer deserves a tip.
    - jzb 4y ago
      Yes, because as we all know, service staff have enormous power and dictate restaurant policy. This is why they're so highly paid and aren't abused at all by customers, for example. /s
      - adamc 4y ago
        Their only power is to leave. I don't like sticking them either, but it's true that they are complicit.
        LadyCailin 4y ago
        Or unionizing.
      - drdec 4y ago
        The server could have made sure they were aware of the policy before they ordered. Seems like the best way to make sure you get a tip to me.

tommoor 4y ago

I'm not defending the restaurant as I hate this as much as the next person but I'm sure the fee was mentioned on the menu - probably in small print and this was omitted for the sake of a good story.

happymellon 4y ago
That is defending the restaurant. If it was tiny fine print then it was intended to be missed.
bradleyjg 4y ago
If you’re going to reprint the menu to add that, just bump the prices 20% and be an honest business.

benj111 4y ago

Just don't pay the fee. Or call the manager over and ask why they arent paying their staff properly. Companies only pull this stuff because they get away with it. Don't make it worth their while.

adamc 4y ago
Unfortunately, for many people that ruins their night out. It is often more practical to pay it and never return.
- autoexec 4y ago
  The good news is that if everyone does that it'll still not be worth it to continue their deceptive practice, the bad news is that not everyone will stop going to the restaurant and the owner who sees the number of customers decline might be thick enough to assume it's for some other reason. I wouldn't make a scene, or let it ruin my night, but I'd make it clear that the hidden charge lost them my business.
- benj111 4y ago
  Surely the night is already ruined by restaurants pulling this shit?

idopmstuff 4y ago

The problem with AirBnb cleaning fees is that they don't disclose what's included in them. If you're going to charge me $500, fine, but it's not great when I show up and find out that you expect me to wash and remake the beds, power wash the deck, get rid of that wasp nest that's been there for a month and also assemble some Ikea furniture. These days I ask for a list of cleaning requirements before I book.

adrr 4y ago
Airbnb should set standards. Some places make me do absolutely nothing like a hotel room. And some places make you wash the linens, dishes and sweep/vacuum the floors while paying $300+ for a cleaning fee. Probably why I now prefer hotels because i know what i am getting.
- idopmstuff 4y ago
  Honestly, I'm fine with hosts charging whatever they want and asking guests to do whatever they want, as long as it's properly disclosed. If I show up and the house rules/cleaning requirements are more onerous than what's disclosed, I ought to be able to notify AirBnb and just get my cleaning fee refunded or somethin else slightly punitive to keep hosts honest.
spacemadness 4y ago
I don’t think I’ve ever been asked to do laundry, but if I would have I’d refuse on principle since I’m paying an exorbitant cleaning fee already.
kriskrunch 4y ago
This and several horrendous check-ins we experienced on our most recent trip to Europe made us go back to booking exclusively with hotels.
0x457 4y ago
If I get charged $500 for cleaning and I find a speck of dust, anything foreign (hair, eyelash) on bedsheets or streak marks on any gloss surface - I'm doing a charge-back as soon as I check out.

lxgr 4y ago

It's still annoying, since they don't show up when you search on the map, as far as I remember. Mostly due to this, I've given up on Airbnb in favor of traditional hotel booking sites (specifically the one with a capital B). Many private apartments are also listed on them these days, and I value not having to play stupid pricing games more than the slightly higher availability on Airbnb. When changing the country to Europe (or currency to EUR?), listings even include taxes and local fees, allowing a true apples to apples comparison between offers.

bradleyjg 4y ago
I agree it’s annoying, it’s just not as bad as changing you 20% after you leave for an unannounced “Fair Wage and Wellness” fee. The restaurant is straight out stealing.