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"Intrinsic value?" What if I invent a new banana plant that can grow in cold weather. It's so successful that there is a banana glut. All the banana republics f

"Intrinsic value?" What if I invent a new banana plant that can grow in cold weather. It's so successful that there is a banana glut. All the banana republics face bankruptcy because it costs more to ship the darn things than for me to go out back and pick a fresh bunch off my own personal banana tree? This may seem like a silly example, but think of how the invention of the tractor affected the draft horse industry. There is no such thing as intrinsic value. There is only the value the marketplace assigns to it. The Soviets spent decades trying to quantify it -- that is, to figure out how much to pay the janitor compared to the factory manager -- but ultimately gave up.

Volpe 15y ago
Oh I see what you did there... so because the soviets tried and failed (with stalinism that is). We should just assume that "free markets" are the best solution despite the obvious exploitation that occur due to the 'profit motive'? You wouldn't accept a political system that gave more votes to a select minority, so why so keen on an economic system that does that? (substitute votes, for money)
- Dylan16807 15y ago
  Selected how? The house/senate split in the us gives more vote to people in less populated areas and it's generally considered an okay idea.
  - Volpe 15y ago
    my point exactly, yet in a free market economy the rich have a lot more money to 'vote' than the poor. Wealth is inherited (for no valid reason). Poor families stay poor, rich stay rich. In our political metaphor, it is the same as totalitarianism, the powerful stay powerful through use of force, and weak stay weak. Why do the same people advocate polar opposites regarding politics and economy?
- drumdance 15y ago
  Free markets are the least bad option so far. You tried to make the same point about intrinsic value the Marx, Engels and their followers have been making for the last 150 years. Rhetoric only gets you so far. It's easy to seize the moral high ground when you don't have to actually implement. It's like me saying "there needs to be a better search engine than Google" and getting mad if someone suggests I build one. And as another commenter posted earlier, the US Senate prioritizes votes from low-population states. And "money" is just a store of value. Ultimately it has to be backed by a marketplace that accepts its value.

Volpe 15y ago

Oh I see what you did there... so because the soviets tried and failed (with stalinism that is). We should just assume that "free markets" are the best solution despite the obvious exploitation that occur due to the 'profit motive'? You wouldn't accept a political system that gave more votes to a select minority, so why so keen on an economic system that does that? (substitute votes, for money)

Dylan16807 15y ago
Selected how? The house/senate split in the us gives more vote to people in less populated areas and it's generally considered an okay idea.
- Volpe 15y ago
  my point exactly, yet in a free market economy the rich have a lot more money to 'vote' than the poor. Wealth is inherited (for no valid reason). Poor families stay poor, rich stay rich. In our political metaphor, it is the same as totalitarianism, the powerful stay powerful through use of force, and weak stay weak. Why do the same people advocate polar opposites regarding politics and economy?
drumdance 15y ago
Free markets are the least bad option so far. You tried to make the same point about intrinsic value the Marx, Engels and their followers have been making for the last 150 years. Rhetoric only gets you so far. It's easy to seize the moral high ground when you don't have to actually implement. It's like me saying "there needs to be a better search engine than Google" and getting mad if someone suggests I build one. And as another commenter posted earlier, the US Senate prioritizes votes from low-population states. And "money" is just a store of value. Ultimately it has to be backed by a marketplace that accepts its value.