4 ms·

Indeed, I've always thought there is a veritable bounty of great SciFi stories to put into film. The recent popularity of SciFi shows suggests to me that we wil

Indeed, I've always thought there is a veritable bounty of great SciFi stories to put into film. The recent popularity of SciFi shows suggests to me that we will start to see more works transferred to the big (or small) screen, though as always this seems to be a very hit or miss process. Personally, I'd love to see e.g. The Culture novels be made into a show, or series of films. There was talk of making a Consider Phlebas TV show some time back, though I don't think it went anywhere. Heinlein's "The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress" could also do well as a stand alone movie, though possibly with Heinlein you would need to tone down the polygamy themes. As to why PKD became such a cinematic mainstay I can't quite tell. I would think part of it would be to do with the fact that many of his stories were less about the "lasers and spaceships" part of SciFi, and more about the moral and human aspect, meaning costs could be saved on big budget set pieces ala Star Wars.

lazide 4y ago
I’m guessing because: Heinlein embeds too many weird sexual themes in non-trivial ways in his stories. Culture is too difficult to convey in a movie. The relationship of the AIs to the humans in particular is too subtle to come across well, and it’s too easy to make it into a giant party with occasional inexplicable violence.
- thaumasiotes 4y ago
  > Heinlein embeds too many weird sexual themes in non-trivial ways in his stories. Didn't seem to be a problem for A Song of Ice and Fire.
  - kadoban 4y ago
    It's only quite recent that something like GOT has been possible. And GOT is pretty tame, sexually, compared to what Heinlein stories got up to. Incest is a little spicy, but those are the villans so it's a bit more accepted, and the rest of GOT is mostly just a flash of tit or dick now and then, right? More titilating than conceptually boundary pushing. Heinlein had, off the top of my head: a main character forgiving and falling in love with her rapist, mother/son incest including protagonist, big ol' family incest (more complicated and varied than I can remember the details of) including "the good guys", a transexual protagonist (including many, many sexual descriptions), many varieties of open relationships, more forms of group marriage than I've ever heard anywhere else, and a sex cult (started by the protagonist). Most of those you could probably leave out of whatever story without too much trouble, but they're not exactly small parts of their respective stories either. Still, I'd think someone could make a really good movie/show out of at least: Friday, Double Star, The Moon is a Harsh Mistress, probably a few others.
- rsynnott 4y ago
  There's nothing _that_ weird in Moon is a Harsh Mistress, is there? Long time since I've read it, but I think some sort of polyamory was about as out-there as it got. If they can make a docudrama about FTX (and they will) they can make that :) Even some of the others... I mean, they made the Handmaid's Tale, and that's way more distressing than most of Heinlein's Weird Sex Stuff.
  - lazide 4y ago
    You might want to re-read the Moon is a harsh mistress, then look at what’s going on in large portions of society that aren’t the west coast bubble. Matriarchal, multi generational polyamory is going to be a bit weird for half+ of society, and it’s not easy to remove that without completely rewriting almost the entire book and it’s characters.
    - rsynnott 4y ago
      I mean, a bit weird, sure, but, again, they made Handmaid's Tale. And Game of Thrones. And two completely separate drama series about the Borgias! (I gather the HBO one _was_ bowdlerised a bit, but still.) If people can manage those, they can manage a bit of polyamory. Like, it might not be for everyone, but there have been many commercially successful TV dramas with more disturbing sexual content than Moon is a Harsh Mistress. (Now, some of his other stuff...)
      - lazide 4y ago
        Uh, I think you’re not getting my point. GoT style sexuality (including incest in royal families, widespread prostitution, etc.) used to be pretty normal. As in, literally up until a century ago. A handmaid’s tale (minus the massive infertility issues) is basically harem/sex slaves, which is still going on right now, and has been for most of human history near as I can tell. The writers know how to push buttons to make that titillating and ‘tehee oh my’ type controversial, which gets eyeballs, without bringing a banhammer down on themselves. Most heinlein (with moon as a harsh mistress being one of the mellowest!) is more in the alienates-too-many-mainstream-groups category. The large polygamy groups led today are all patriarchal, and would start lashing out at anything matriarchal. Matriarchal groups right now are pretty solidly anti-polygamy, etc. Star ship troopers might be in the wings for a remake though, with the authoritarian bent society seems to be taking lately, but I doubt the ‘free sex’ angle would play well with the ‘rah rah fascism’ angle. Those two groups currently aren’t as well aligned. And near as I can tell, it would be even harder for people to understand satire than last time, so good luck with that angle. And no one knows how to turn it into clicks/butts in seats reliably. So it doesn’t get the kind of attention from writers/producers/money folks. That’s all it is. PKD has a niche that does reliably put butts in seats, and doesn’t have the same baggage, so it does.
kcplate 4y ago
> As to why PKD became such a cinematic mainstay I can't quite tell. I would think part of it would be to do with the fact that many of his stories were less about the "lasers and spaceships" part of SciFi, and more about the moral and human aspect, meaning costs could be saved on big budget set pieces ala Star Wars. I have always felt that they always seem to skirt the edges of plausibility much more than other sci-fi. But I think you are right, the “tech” takes a backseat to the personal story.
ianburrell 4y ago
They should turn stories from Love, Death, Robots animated anthology into longer episodes. There were some stories that could do with longer treatment or dive more into the universe. With streaming service, they could have variable length, most being hour long with a few making to movie length.

lazide 4y ago

I’m guessing because: Heinlein embeds too many weird sexual themes in non-trivial ways in his stories. Culture is too difficult to convey in a movie. The relationship of the AIs to the humans in particular is too subtle to come across well, and it’s too easy to make it into a giant party with occasional inexplicable violence.

thaumasiotes 4y ago
> Heinlein embeds too many weird sexual themes in non-trivial ways in his stories. Didn't seem to be a problem for A Song of Ice and Fire.
- kadoban 4y ago
  It's only quite recent that something like GOT has been possible. And GOT is pretty tame, sexually, compared to what Heinlein stories got up to. Incest is a little spicy, but those are the villans so it's a bit more accepted, and the rest of GOT is mostly just a flash of tit or dick now and then, right? More titilating than conceptually boundary pushing. Heinlein had, off the top of my head: a main character forgiving and falling in love with her rapist, mother/son incest including protagonist, big ol' family incest (more complicated and varied than I can remember the details of) including "the good guys", a transexual protagonist (including many, many sexual descriptions), many varieties of open relationships, more forms of group marriage than I've ever heard anywhere else, and a sex cult (started by the protagonist). Most of those you could probably leave out of whatever story without too much trouble, but they're not exactly small parts of their respective stories either. Still, I'd think someone could make a really good movie/show out of at least: Friday, Double Star, The Moon is a Harsh Mistress, probably a few others.
rsynnott 4y ago
There's nothing _that_ weird in Moon is a Harsh Mistress, is there? Long time since I've read it, but I think some sort of polyamory was about as out-there as it got. If they can make a docudrama about FTX (and they will) they can make that :) Even some of the others... I mean, they made the Handmaid's Tale, and that's way more distressing than most of Heinlein's Weird Sex Stuff.
- lazide 4y ago
  You might want to re-read the Moon is a harsh mistress, then look at what’s going on in large portions of society that aren’t the west coast bubble. Matriarchal, multi generational polyamory is going to be a bit weird for half+ of society, and it’s not easy to remove that without completely rewriting almost the entire book and it’s characters.
  - rsynnott 4y ago
    I mean, a bit weird, sure, but, again, they made Handmaid's Tale. And Game of Thrones. And two completely separate drama series about the Borgias! (I gather the HBO one _was_ bowdlerised a bit, but still.) If people can manage those, they can manage a bit of polyamory. Like, it might not be for everyone, but there have been many commercially successful TV dramas with more disturbing sexual content than Moon is a Harsh Mistress. (Now, some of his other stuff...)
    - lazide 4y ago
      Uh, I think you’re not getting my point. GoT style sexuality (including incest in royal families, widespread prostitution, etc.) used to be pretty normal. As in, literally up until a century ago. A handmaid’s tale (minus the massive infertility issues) is basically harem/sex slaves, which is still going on right now, and has been for most of human history near as I can tell. The writers know how to push buttons to make that titillating and ‘tehee oh my’ type controversial, which gets eyeballs, without bringing a banhammer down on themselves. Most heinlein (with moon as a harsh mistress being one of the mellowest!) is more in the alienates-too-many-mainstream-groups category. The large polygamy groups led today are all patriarchal, and would start lashing out at anything matriarchal. Matriarchal groups right now are pretty solidly anti-polygamy, etc. Star ship troopers might be in the wings for a remake though, with the authoritarian bent society seems to be taking lately, but I doubt the ‘free sex’ angle would play well with the ‘rah rah fascism’ angle. Those two groups currently aren’t as well aligned. And near as I can tell, it would be even harder for people to understand satire than last time, so good luck with that angle. And no one knows how to turn it into clicks/butts in seats reliably. So it doesn’t get the kind of attention from writers/producers/money folks. That’s all it is. PKD has a niche that does reliably put butts in seats, and doesn’t have the same baggage, so it does.

kcplate 4y ago

> As to why PKD became such a cinematic mainstay I can't quite tell. I would think part of it would be to do with the fact that many of his stories were less about the "lasers and spaceships" part of SciFi, and more about the moral and human aspect, meaning costs could be saved on big budget set pieces ala Star Wars. I have always felt that they always seem to skirt the edges of plausibility much more than other sci-fi. But I think you are right, the “tech” takes a backseat to the personal story.

ianburrell 4y ago

They should turn stories from Love, Death, Robots animated anthology into longer episodes. There were some stories that could do with longer treatment or dive more into the universe. With streaming service, they could have variable length, most being hour long with a few making to movie length.