24 ms·

Paper map sales are booming

206 points by lxm 4y ago

bearmode 4y ago
I don't buy roadmaps, but I have a ton of orienteering maps for when I go hiking. I really love orienteering with a proper waterproof map & compass.
joshstrange 4y ago
> His customers, he added, aren’t just looking to maps for directions, but as inspiration for future trips or even as art worth hanging. I think that alone accounts for the vast majority of this increase. The article throws that in as a minor detail but I'd bet money it's the only reason. Of course you don't get as many clicks for "More people are buying maps as art". 2 of the 3 examples of maps they give at the end are exclusively art (raised maps and the coffee map).
- ghaff 4y ago
  Essentially retro-chic. Some may have also discovered some utility in being able to have a big picture view of a destination. However, I wouldn't impute too much utility to the explanation. I'd be pretty surprised if younger generations are suddenly discovering that it can be really useful to have a physical backup in case their phone battery dies.
  - tppiotrowski 4y ago
    I agree with the big picture utility. A good project would be a map where you can choose to display all Best Westerns, Shell gas stations, etc at state zoom level so you can visualize a day's worth of travel including food, gas and lodging destinations without needing to repeatedly search GMaps. (i.e. it looks like there's a Shell station in 15, 65 and 128 miles along our route...)
  - wingworks 4y ago
    This, and while no small device can easily replace a large physical map, but map developers aren't helping here either. I find more often then not, in map apps the 2nd you zoom out even a little, you start losing half the details. Even on a larger iPad. Especially the topo map apps, which also tend to forget most devices are HighDPI, so the topo image is also blurry. I just wish I could set the map level to it's best, then zoom out as far as I want without jumping to a worse level map.
  - bmicraft 4y ago
    My physical backup in case my phone dies is my other older phone with offline maps installed. I wonder why more people don't do the same.
- warner25 4y ago
  I love maps, and I'll admit that my wife and I have a bunch of map art hanging on our walls, one of each city or state where we've lived, but they're not like actual maps that you could fold up and take on a road trip. I hadn't thought of hanging up that sort of map. I'll also admit that I haven't bought a paper map to put in the glove box of my car in over a decade. I have printed Google Maps before a trip, though. This is coming from a career Army officer, so I'm quite used to looking at maps on the walls of operations centers, and doing serious map-and-compass navigation exercises.
  - kortilla 4y ago
    Where do you buy nice ones for the wall? I’ve wanted to do this but end up stumbling across random bespoke ones.
    - warner25 4y ago
      We've bought almost all of them through Etsy, and they are indeed "random bespoke" products. Some sellers are military spouses so they design prints of the places where we've lived (i.e. around Army bases, which wouldn't interest most other people). Last week we were looking at this one, and the seller appears to specialize in artistic maps: https://www.etsy.com/listing/346969594/fort-rucker-map-print-alabama-poster https://www.etsy.com/listing/346969594/fort-rucker-map-print...
- tristor 4y ago
  I only own one paper map, and it is specifically for art. I've traveled extensively and I wanted a way to track where I've been, so it's stapled to a pin-board, so I can put push-pins in after I visit somewhere. I've been primarily using a portable form of GPS for more than a decade, even before Google Maps.
- Finnucane 4y ago
  Down the street from my office is a store that sells maps as art. Old maps, new maps, and transit memorabilia. One of the advantages of a digital map is that it always up to date, but that also means it can never be a historical document, the way an old map can be. For myself I have a pile of bike maps, that I admit I don't use as much as I used to (partly because I have all my regular routes in my head now). The nice thing about those maps is that they marked elevation changes, and also the location of ice cream shops. You know, the essentials.
  - capekwasright 4y ago
    Ward Maps in Cambridge, MA?
    - Finnucane 4y ago
      yes.
- narag 4y ago
  I'm renting now, so I avoid putting things on the wall as much as possible. But I used to have a map to help build a mental map from repeatedly seeing it. Recently I've noticed that something similar happens to me with analogic watches.
- romwell 4y ago
  >The article throws that in as a minor detail but I'd bet money it's the only reason. For most people, perhaps. After working in Google Geo, I drove across the country and back (CA - NC - TX - CA) using the trusty Rand & McNally atlas and compass, and couldn't have been happier. No nagging voices telling me where to go. No countdown timers making me wary of taking a scenic detour. No feeling of going on rails. Yes to seeing things and being aware of my environment. Yes to understanding where I am at all times. Yes to exercising my brain and being in control of my lived experience. Yes to not becoming stupid [1][2][3][4]. But sure, maps are pretty too. [1] https://www.vocativ.com/418342/google-maps-gps-navigation/index.html https://www.vocativ.com/418342/google-maps-gps-navigation/in... [2] https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=5179471&page=1 https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=5179471&page=1 [3] https://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/a-sportsmans-life/gps-is-making-you-stupid/ https://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/a-sportsmans-life/gps-i... [4] https://www.thedrive.com/news/8686/study-using-gps-navigation-switches-off-brain-makes-you-stupid https://www.thedrive.com/news/8686/study-using-gps-navigatio...
- troymc 4y ago
  It's a plausible hypothesis. I'd like to see data.
- irrational 4y ago
  I love National Geographic maps of ancient places. They basically are maps as art.
- now__what 4y ago
  As a hiker I find paper maps absolutely essential and far easier to use than anything digital. Maybe it's because of that familiarity that I print or buy paper maps whenever I'm going on a trip more than a few hours' drive from home. I also rely heavily on printed maps and guidebooks for any extended travel and for trip planning, which are excruciating if you're relying solely on the internet. Can't say I've ever used a map for art.
  - nomel 4y ago
    > and far easier to use than anything digital. Paper maps are great for knowing where to go, but a little less great for knowing where you are. Off/deep trail hikers will have a stand-alone GPS, because climbing trees/hills to get your bearings ends up being a serious risk, with just a compass: https://gripped.com/gripped-outdoors/how-100-hikers-got-lost-and-how-they-survived/ https://gripped.com/gripped-outdoors/how-100-hikers-got-lost...
    - bearmode 4y ago
      Entirely depends on the environment you're hiking in tbh.
      - nomel 4y ago
        True. Maps only work if there’s uniquely, unambiguously, identifiable terrain, that’s well understood from looking at the, necessarily, topographical map.
  - mycall 4y ago
    My favorites are the waterproof versions.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
rob74 4y ago
https://archive.is/cVuOB https://archive.is/cVuOB
rr888 4y ago
Went hiking while relying on a phone app. Offline, it cached the map no problems, until a few hours in when the TTL must have been triggered then everything disappeared. Bought a real map soon after.
- ghaff 4y ago
  I won't say I'm religious about it--especially if somewhere familiar--but if I'm being doctrinaire, I'd argue you should always have a physical map and compass while hiking.
  - folli 4y ago
    ... and know how to use it ...
    - ghaff 4y ago
      Fair. As someone who grew up with physical maps, using them is pretty intuitive but I can see how it wouldn't be for everyone. And, of course, some aspects of topographic maps take some education. With respect to compass, I'm not sure how critical real orienteering is for most people. It's more about not being totally turned around and/or being able to make sure you hit some feature like a road.
      - purpleflame1257 4y ago
        Just being able to know which way is "north" is probably sufficient.
        jcranmer 4y ago
        There's a difference between geographic north and magnetic north that can get pretty significant (if you live in NE US, magnetic north about 10-20° west of north). If you're sailing the clipper route, for part of your journey, your magnetic compass now points as far as northwest rather than north.
stevesearer 4y ago
Even though I bring my phone with offline maps downloaded (Gaia GPS), I still like to bring a paper map of the area as well. In addition to having another option in case my phone breaks or dies, paper maps are nice to have so people can gather around and look together and build knowledge. When solo, paper maps are an easy thing to look at when sitting around the camp. Shout out to my local cartographer Bryan Conant who makes excellent maps of both the Dick Smith Wilderness and San Rafael Wilderness within the Los Padres National Forest.
- vidanay 4y ago
  This plus a Boy Scout level knowledge of orienteering (glorified triangulation with a $5 compass) can actually be useful in an emergency situation.
eschneider 4y ago
I definitely find paper maps are better (for me) for planning long trips and I always keep a set in the car for places I normally go. (Basically, the east coast of the US.) GPS is fantastic for last-mile directions/where exactly is that house sorta thing, but "best" route for me is rarely shortest path, and it's just easier to visualize on a big paper map.
- JKCalhoun 4y ago
  Agree. I prefer major interstates for road tripping — something Siri & Gigi (the name we came up with for Google Maps persona) don't always seem to get right. So in our road-tripping van, we keep a trucker's road atlas for the U.S.
moomoo11 4y ago
I’ve pretty much ditched Apple Maps and use the compass in my car and landmarks to navigate lol. It’s a lot of fun for me, using maps just ruins the fun of exploration.
- astrange 4y ago
  Maybe it's just me, but I thought the point of having a nav app open was to tell you about traffic/detours, not because you need directions.
  - moomoo11 4y ago
    I think that's just you (and me maybe) haha. Most people are awful at navigating. I have a fairly photographic memory and once I read a street name once or twice I'm never forgetting it.
philip1209 4y ago
Some of the most fun I've had while traveling is exploring a city without a phone. Just write down your home address and destination address on a card, and if you need a mulligan - a taxi can take you to either. Related: this reminds me of the "paper phone" concept from Google: https://experiments.withgoogle.com/paper-phone https://experiments.withgoogle.com/paper-phone
- TurkishPoptart 4y ago
  I love this idea! Looks like Google either didn't launch it or shitcanned it after a year.
  - dwringer 4y ago
    I went through a roller coaster of emotions reading this thread and clicking through all the way to the github repo, where it slowly dawned on me that this was not just layers of satire.
kypro 4y ago
Something I find really fun when traveling in the car with kids is to give them a paper map and ask them to plan a route a for us to get to our destination. Then when you're driving ask them to follow along and give the directions. Obviously they can't be too young and they're not going to be perfect, but if you have a child around 7-13 they'll probably find this quite fun. Being able to use a map is one of those skills which admittedly isn't all that useful today, but I still think it's fun to plan out your own routes and decide the kinds of roads you'd like to take and the places you'd like to pass on your way from A to B. Plus, there are so many times my phone has died or my GPS has randomly stopped working and I'm glad I have my paper map with me just in case.
- macintux 4y ago
  I navigated a cross-country road trip when I was 14. Absolutely a great way to learn about maps, traveling, time estimation.
- eldaisfish 4y ago
  an interesting thought experiment is to ponder just how many skills are being lost due to technology. I know how to read a map and how to find rough compass bearings but i was never in a situation where i needed either skill. Could i manage without GPS - probably but i’m not confident. If GPS died tomorrow because of a solar flare, would the younger generations manage?
  - zikduruqe 4y ago
    https://www.gislounge.com/spatial-orientation-and-the-brain-the-effects-of-map-reading-and-navigation/ https://www.gislounge.com/spatial-orientation-and-the-brain-... Studies have shown that people just cannot read maps anymore due to dependence on GPS apps in their daily lives.
    - culopatin 4y ago
      But doesn’t mean they won’t learn the next thing if it’s gone.
adamwong246 4y ago
I will go out of my way to use _anything_ that is not a screen. I stare at screens, all day, ever day. Every moment not gazing into a hyper-bright magic rectangle is a relief.
- nicbou 4y ago
  I'd like to read about your approach. This is something I am considering too, but screens are a good medium for a lot of what I do.
  - adamwong246 4y ago
    Well, me too. Hard to write software with pen and paper. But it resolves to "use tech for work and only work". I go online to get my job done but it's all work, no pleasure. I've ridden my phone of any app which can eat my attention. It goes without saying that social media apps got trashed but also news apps, even the default google news app. My phone is more like an old-school Nokia than a modern magic rectangle and if they made a decent e-ink phone, I'd seriously consider it. I will watch _some_ tv or film, but only in the living room, on the dedicated television, never on a laptop or tablet. Lastly, zero video games at all. Edit, well, almost zero. Factorio is a hard habit to break but I have been clean now for several months.)
    - nicbou 4y ago
      This is similar to something I wrote about recently: https://nicolasbouliane.com/blog/silence https://nicolasbouliane.com/blog/silence My goals were different, but my approach was very similar. However I did not replace screens with analogue equivalents.
pm215 4y ago
I buy paper Ordnance Survey maps because they come with a scratch-off code to get the map in their digital app. You can also pay an annual subscription of about 50 quid to get coverage of the whole UK, but for my usage, which is limited to fairly small geographic areas, I prefer to pay the 8 or 9 quid each for the paper maps covering the areas I care about, which then gets me access to that map forever, rather than having an ongoing annual expense. And it's nice to have the paper map to be able to look at a larger area at once.
- globular-toast 4y ago
  You can access OS maps on Bing maps. Both Landranger and Explorer. I used to use streetmap.co.uk for this purpose but recently discovered Bing has them too. Useful for areas where I don't want to buy the map yet.
- jjgreen 4y ago
  The OS do fabulous work, and not just of the UK: https://shop.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/the-moon-50th-anniversary-edition-map/ https://shop.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/the-moon-50th-anniversary-...
mvexel 4y ago
Part of this resurgence can undoubtedly be explained by the ready availability of high quality open geospatial data sources like OpenStreetMap. The United States has always had a lot of open geospatial data available, but it's patchy, can be hard to find, and is of wildly varying quality. In Europe, open (geospatial) data has become the norm, but that wasn't the case even 10 years ago. And in spite of harmonization efforts, it can still be hard to cobble together map data that is consistent across countries from government sources.
- courgette 4y ago
  I live between France and the US. France has https://www.geoportail.gouv.fr/ https://www.geoportail.gouv.fr/ and IGN topographic map of every square centimeter of the country. The US has... google map and you can also find some decent topographic map online. It's just way harder to find the paper version. ( must have in my book for hiking and such ) That article actually provide great resources to buy good topographic map of the US. It's been a struggle and a frustration for me.
ttcbj 4y ago
They aren't mentioned in the article, but Butler Motorcycle Maps fit with the theme. You can currently access the same data via an app called Rever (which is great for actually driving a route you have already planned), but the physical maps give a better overview, and more accessible editorial content, than the app does: https://butlermaps.com/ https://butlermaps.com/ They are more useful for deciding where you want to go in the first place. As developers, I think it is really interesting to think about why this is true/possible. (I also find it true that PDF brochures for automobiles are a better way to understand the different trims than the car's website). All the filtering/searching/data analysis features of software seem so powerful, but sometimes committing to a single, static format for presenting information yields a more comprehensible result.
kzrdude 4y ago
Just to note, all the hiking maps I get now are made in tyvek, not really in paper. It's a newer material, it doesn't wear as much (but still some) in the folds, it is water resistant and so on. It's a more usable map as a result. It does feel slightly waxy to touch.
- sowbug 4y ago
  Do you know whether there is such a thing as laser-printable paper that you can write on with dry-erase markers and still erase? I like annotating certain documents while I'm traveling, and I wish I could wipe them clean at the start of each trip. I currently laminate the things I reuse most (checklists), or just print a new copy each time.
  - mdmglr 4y ago
    Laminate the paper and use Expo Vis-A-Vis Wet-Erase Markers. Use to be popular in K12 classrooms before everything became chromebooks.
kimbernator 4y ago
This is a little tangential, but last year me and my girlfriend went to Greece for the first time. A few days after we purchased the tickets, a book came in the mail. She had ordered a tourism guide for Greece that had some recommendations about what to see, where to eat, where to stay, etc. My first reaction was along the lines of "why would we do this when we have the entire internet? Each section is written by only one person recommending what they liked, how can I rely on that?" Well, it turns out that avoiding the chaotic whirlwind of dubiously-funded and low-quality clickbait articles that come up on google when you search "things to do in _____" makes the planning process much easier. Even if the book missed a few places we would have enjoyed, it was a pleasure to read this person's insight on the areas we were in and the places they thought were worth seeing. It came with useful maps of every location we were in and gave fairly accurate pricing estimates for each activity. The simplicity of seeing a couple sentences about why you should take the time to see a historic site or scenic view, or eat at some little hole in the wall restaurant and taking them at face value makes the entire travel process so much easier and more fun. Googling around and seeing conversations about what to do on Reddit will make me second-guess every choice and wonder if I'm truly maximizing my trip, which is guaranteed to make the trip worse, regardless of what I end up seeing. Consuming data and services from the internet has become very transactional: Every article about tourism is either selling a ton of ad space or is sponsoring the recommendations, both of which make it more annoying to get data that way. It's hard to tell what the writer's financial motivations are. The same is true for google maps: some things are promoted because they paid for it, not because they are better. Books, paper maps, and other "analog" formats are written by people that want to sell the book. It's not impossible that they are getting kickbacks for their recommendations, but in this age where informational books are gasping for air, they really do need to do a good job for people to keep buying them. edit: I might as well plug the guide we used - as of this comment it's the newest version but it looks like there will be a new one in 06/23: https://www.amazon.com/Lonely-Planet-Greece-Travel-Guide/dp/1788688287 https://www.amazon.com/Lonely-Planet-Greece-Travel-Guide/dp/...
- space_fountain 4y ago
  Not really disagreeing, but I’d like to plug Wikivoyage which has also (for me), been very helpful
dljsjr 4y ago
Anybody remember Triptiks from AAA? You'd go to a AAA office or call them on the phone, tell them where you were going, and in return you'd get a printed spiral top-bound pad with your trip broken down in to multiple legs, the roads/routes pre-highlighted, gas stops and prices estimated in, a list of sites for stopping off at, etc. All human curated and human annotated (the roads on your route were literally gone over by a person with a Highlighter). I'm sure it was all pulled from some sort of centralized/normalized/standardized data source but the human touch was definitely there. They were awesome. When we were growing up most big family trips were in the car because gas and hotels were just so much more affordable than flying an entire family anywhere. I got to be the "navigator" on so many trips by helping family members read the Triptiks. Apparently AAA still offers these, but they're generated digitally now via their app, and you can print them off if you want. But something about those human-built Triptiks were really really special.
- chordalkeyboard 4y ago
  AAA will also print them themselves and mail them to members upon request.
- mxuribe 4y ago
  I had always heard of this - and so highly regarded for years(!) - but never used myself.
- kulahan 4y ago
  Travel is such an personal thing - it's people in an environment at least somewhat foreign to them. Trusting someone to plan it is a pretty intimate thing, and companies don't do intimate things very well anymore. Too many people, too few companies. I'd pay good money for more personal experiences from companies, especially when it comes to something like this, but it's not easy. The wife and I were looking for a honeymoon package, but neither "beach" nor "romantic European getaway" were on our list. Roughly 90% of travel companies were out of ideas after that. It's literally their JOB to plan trips and they can't deviate from a template. It's pain incarnate.
  - 4y ago
DrThunder 4y ago
I love looking at paper maps for my wilderness backpacking/camping trips. I really like seeing where the trail leads and what camping spots I can use. It just makes it feel like a big adventure. Additionally, having a weather proof map for wilderness trips is invaluable. I'd never rely on a digital device to provide what could be a life saving tool.
- troymc 4y ago
  Wilderness backpacking/camping trips are a great use case for (laminated) paper maps. You really need a good map, and you don't want to be dependent on an electronic device that has many failure modes (e.g. running out of power, getting wet, getting dropped into a canyon, getting smashed...).
gumby 4y ago
There are a lot of things you can learn from a paper map that you can't by looking through a small window into "map space". The paper map has all sorts of affordances the digital maps don't, and vice versa.
calme_toi 4y ago
I will try this in my next holiday. It is really exhausting to read those online reviews/guides and try to find some places to eat/visit. So next time I will buy maps with recommendations and follow them. If it's not good, I will buy a new map locally. That's it. No more reading reviews on every top rated restaurants nearby and trying to guess if they are fake!
reducesuffering 4y ago
Paper maps can have pitfalls to their usage. The family of James Kim ended up lost in the Oregon wilderness because they took an ill-advised route based on using their paper map. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Kim https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Kim
- fsckboy 4y ago
  and navigation software has driven people into lakes or snowy mountain passes. both systems need to be updated with better and current information, and yes, internet connected is easier to update, but is also now receiving spam.
ben7799 4y ago
I'm totally hooked on digital navigation but one thing I've noticed is it takes me longer to learn an area to the point I know my way around if I use digital navigation. There are times digital navigation is a million times better. I remember getting lost in the boroughs of NYC a few years before smartphones hit the world. It was very difficult to have the right paper maps in your car for a place like NYC. But in more rural travel it didn't really matter.
smm11 4y ago
We were on a road trip back to Midwestern City 1 from Midwestern City 2, with the grandparents driving. Every 50 miles or so I'd flick the rear door ashtray closed, and we'd immediately screech to a stop on the side of the interstate/freeway, as 'we have a blowout.'
gwbas1c 4y ago
I generally use paper backups for tickets. I used to print out directions when I had my first GPS, but now I usually have enough redundancy that I don't feel like I need a paper map. I should point out that my printed directions saved me a few times with my first GPS. It was really bad, it would get confused and make me take off ramps and then get right back on; or it would make me drive in circles. One time it tried to send me 100 miles up a dirt road. (I turned around and relied on printed directions.)
- ghaff 4y ago
  Especially traveling internationally, I try to have a paper backup of important information. I can imagine arriving in a city having lost my phone and having no idea of where I was staying.
xyzelement 4y ago
I am sure excited to teach my kids (current age, 2.5 years, and 4 months, so there's a bit of time) to use a map. I must have my old road atlas somewhere. As an engineer and product manager (and just in general) I constantly think about, metaphorically, where I want to get to and how to reasonably get there. We literally call this "the roadmap" - it's the ability to visualize a viable path. I love Google maps (I've relied for it on 6 continents for driving, transit, and walking, it's amazing) but it basically does the "how" for you and I want my kids to be able to do that. So if we're ever doing a roadtrip, I dunno, from NYC to Miami, I want my kids to be part of the planning - how many miles can we do a day? What are the natural destinations along the way? Basically, I think mapping and trip planning is a very natural example of breaking down the problem into sub-problems that are both meaningful in their own way and add up to the whole. It's also interesting to trouble-shoot this kind of stuff. If Google Maps suggests to us a route that is very different than what we mapped out - why? What is it optimizing for vs what are we optimizing for? I am excited to teach my kids to think this way.
freitzkriesler 4y ago
I thought I was the Luddite, I have a leather bound north America map in my 300D for when the mobile phone networks get shutdown by solar flares.
- quirk 4y ago
  Gotta have an atlas for when SHTF!
Eumenes 4y ago
If you're an outdoors person in maine, you pretty much need one of these: https://www.amazon.com/Maine-Atlas-Gazetteer-Delorme/dp/089933282X https://www.amazon.com/Maine-Atlas-Gazetteer-Delorme/dp/0899... Google maps is often wrong with roads/atv/snowmobiel trails, and its also very useful for finding boat launches
cassepipe 4y ago
I personnally am a fan of physical 3d maps. They are rigid and not for travel, and they're made out of plastic but there's nothing like it to understand a region.
pmontra 4y ago
If I go hiking in the mountains I'd bring with me a paper map just in case something happens to my phone or I run out of battery. A power bank backups only the battery, not a cracked or lost phone. Never lost a paper map though.
- KMag 4y ago
  On a side note, hiking is incredibly popular in Hong Kong (mountain sides too steep to practically build residences right in the middle of one of the most densely populated places on Earth). However, Google maps is comically bad for hiking in Hong Kong. For years, the Mt. Butler HF radio station was marked as "gas station". (It's the only gas station I've seen with barbed wire locked gate and signs warning of guard dogs.) They've since fixed the HF radio station. However, last I checked, hiking from the North Point MTR to Stanley, Google maps will still try and route you over some overgrown paths, and up the side of a rock quarry where you need to scramble up with the help of some tied together odds and ends of rope someone has helpfully fastened to a small tree. Any sane human would have routed up Siu Ma Shan and along the back side of the quarry over to Park View.
  - kccqzy 4y ago
    Do people actually try to use Google Maps for hiking? It never occurred to me to even try. I always go to the authority maintaining the hiking trails (NPS, or some state or county agency) and download PDF maps.
    - KMag 4y ago
      Sample size 1: I have tried from time to time. Google seems to have Hong Kong trail maps in its data set, just poor quality as to which trails are passable.
Zigurd 4y ago
I have seen maps of Boston since forever, but it was not until using Google Maps to navigate that I realized some parts of Boston I assumed were not well connected are in fact conveniently driveable. I suspect this boom is like describing cassette sales as "booming." Supposedly sales doubled in 2021.
college_physics 4y ago
Fact number one: with the connected supercomputer, gps, camera, audio recorder etc in our hands travel gets upgraded (at least in principle) not one but several levels, from the mundane and practical to the sublime Fact number two: the tangible, tactile reality, longevity, versatility, privacy, artistic beauty of a well made map or travel guide cannot be replicated, certainly not by the crappy websites that have come to dominate this space Conclusion. We have two legs. Walking and hiking is better if we use them both :-)
deleted 4y ago
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jurassic 4y ago
Maps are an art form. There will always be a market for beautiful maps as art objects.
redtriumph 4y ago
While the article points out alternatives people use in modern era, I always had a pull towards paper maps. My father had a collection of atlas of India and its different cities. I spent lot of time parsing through them, even though I haven't been to upper half of country yet. On recent vacation, while we were trying doing street shopping, I came across Lewis-Clark map [original size] and then I thought I might as well use maps as wall art. I ended up buying following two classic replicas. a. Hindoostan map of 1827: http://www.davidrumsey.com/maps4000.html http://www.davidrumsey.com/maps4000.html b. Western North America of 1846: https://digitalcommons.csumb.edu/hornbeck_mex_1/7/ https://digitalcommons.csumb.edu/hornbeck_mex_1/7/ Next lookout: Hydrological map of North America.
maptime 4y ago
Traditional paper maps or charts are not booming at all. The biggest producer of physical nautical charts has had to withdraw from the market as they have become unprofitable. The increased availability of good open geospatial data along with amazing free open source tooling has made making beautiful maps easier than ever. Tools like QGIS and blender are world class Maybe contentious but is it really a map if it's hung on a wall for artistic merit? At what point is it considered art?
- panza 4y ago
  I'd really like a breakdown on what these maps are actually used for. They could just be wall art, perhaps a (growing?) niche of custom guide books, maybe a renewed interest in exploring offroad/outback etc. Or maybe just more people are acknowledging that a fallback paper map in the glove box is a good idea.
- wmeredith 4y ago
  "Suits are Back" Map sales aren't booming any more than point-and-shoot camera sales. I would bet a month's salary that this is a submarine article: http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html
gregsadetsky 4y ago
No affiliation — an amazingly niche, caring paper map is this one of places to photograph in Iceland: https://international-photographer.com/en/product/map-iceland-v5/ https://international-photographer.com/en/product/map-icelan... (This is the 5th version of the map!) The author only makes maps of Iceland and the Faroe Islands. They’re beautiful, annotated with camping and natural spring sites, and the photographic spots are unique and cover a wide range of terrain / vistas. I car-camped the entire island and would refer to it to find my next stop. I wish the author made maps of more locations but I also understand that this is a work of dedication and patience.
annoyingnoob 4y ago
Thomas Guide used to make the best street maps ever. I did deliveries pre-Internet, the Thomas Guide was invaluable.
courgette 4y ago
When I enter a new state, a buy a road map of that state. Then I store it under a seat of my van. Phone battery die, cell signal can be weak. And I can scribble on the map. It's just a better tool.
ThinkBeat 4y ago
In the city I live in, construction, random political initiatives, broken down infrastructure, temporary closures and on make paper maps entirely useless. I used to have a decent map in my head from getting around but that is impossible now. I do wish Google Maps / Wayze / TomTOm etc updated the maps faster.
controlch 4y ago
We recently had to define the boundaries of polygons that designate the various sectors of a city. We found that hand drawing them on a paper map was far more convenient than doing the same on a screen. This of course involves the initial design of the polygons and not the subsequent transformation to their respective coordinates, which inevitably had to be done using a map software.
- crtified 4y ago
  In my experience, most land planning is done (or at least, starts) with a pencil on paper, even today. Technicians then take over the work of making it a detailed digital reality. The computer is wonderful in so many ways, but it does not yet (in common usage) replicate the direct physical connection, the casual efficiency and universal understanding of the real world pencil-on-paper tool.
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reader_x 4y ago
A cartography professor of mine once advised me to take another career path because cartography was dying; he added, “Google Maps has terrible maps- but no one seems to care.” It heartens me to see in HN comments that some are noticing. A pet peeve of mine is when water bodies go unlabeled. An old-fashioned paper map like the kind inserted in National Geographic mags when I was wee included a breathtaking amount of information, but that requires careful design so element labels don’t overlap etc.
- brightlancer 4y ago
  At least in the US, folks seem extremely sensitive to direct prices and are consequently penny-wise and pound-foolish (not in a Vimes's Boots way), where they could've spent an extra 5% or 10% on a better product or service and been happier for it, perhaps even saving more in short-term indirect costs. Even against a "free" product or service, spending $30 or $50 might save multiples in time -- but IME folks are really bad at pricing indirect costs.
- walnutclosefarm 4y ago
  Google and most other digital maps are indeed terrible maps. They are fine for a certain kind of navigation task, and great for looking up where the Starbucks nearest your current location is located, but for most other map uses, and certainly for actually getting a picture in your head of where you are or want to go, and how that relates to other things that you know or may want to know, or for thinking about an itinerary or even route that might be other than the shortest or fastest, they are terrible.
  - nicbou 4y ago
    OsmAnd is a good option for this. I use it where Google Maps fails, namely layering multiple things, and going hiking. If something is missing, you can slowly improve the map yourself. I've contributed hundreds of places to OSM in more distant places.
- maxerickson 4y ago
  It's still very much in the early stages, but https://zelonewolf.github.io/openstreetmap-americana/ https://zelonewolf.github.io/openstreetmap-americana/ is a project to build a rendering system that handles details better. It's using OpenStreetMap data in the OpenMapTiles schema, but giving lots of feedback to OMT when something won't work. (There's some attempt to make things look nice, but the focis is still on capabilities)
ChuckMcM 4y ago
When we were home schooling our kids we got a map of the US from Imus Geographics [1] and it made it really easy to see the places that were being talked about in history and their relative position to other places. The map in general has a wealth of details and over the years we have often used it when planning camping trips around the west. [1] https://www.imusgeographics.com/ https://www.imusgeographics.com/
insane_dreamer 4y ago
I love maps. I have a map of the Pacific Crest Trail (which I got at REI) on the wall of my living room - it's beautiful to look at (still need to frame it but it's on the list!), informative (cleverly shows elevation along the trail in a column on the left), and leads to interesting conversations with guests. We also have metal "night" city maps (from displate.com) of cities my wife and I have lived in, which make wall decorations (i.e, arranged in a pattern of 8) .
rascul 4y ago
Many states in the US offer free road maps, generally available at welcome centers when you cross a state line on an interstate. Also many states, counties, and municipalities offer free or low cost paper maps. I pick up paper maps whenever I can, and some are hanging on my walls.
midasuni 4y ago
Read a great book over summer based on a mystery of various maps - especially an old 1930s gas station map from a time of adventure that I guess doesn’t exist any more. The Cartographers, by Peng Shepherd. https://www.washingtonpost.com/books/2022/03/24/cartographers-peng-shepherd-book-review/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/books/2022/03/24/cartographer...
WalterBright 4y ago
What I miss from paper maps is the size. You can spread them out on a table. Good luck with your phone. I got tired of using Waze, as I found that when I arrived I had little idea of how I got there. I had no notion of which direction I went, or where the destination was. Now I look at a map on my computer before I go, and sketch out the route on a piece of paper. Then, I tape the paper to the steering wheel and follow it. I know, I know, I'm out of step. But at least I am spatially oriented with this method.
syngrog66 4y ago
with a paper map I cannot count on learning every road's name that I need to know, or learning it fast. with Google Maps the last few years it can be a real battle. And at the worst time UX-wise: while I'm driving and need to make a turn or lane decision in the next few minutes. Also this reminds me to add something to my Prepper's stash: recent accurate paper maps for everywhere I might care about. Just In Case.
dogman144 4y ago
paper map and compass navigation opens the world up. very cool skill to have. if one is capable in the outdoors, land navigation opens up so many cool areas to explore. easy enough to do safely and leave no trace.
mmahemoff 4y ago
This has been a recurring pattern with other forms of media, e.g. vinyl records, typewriters, Atari cartridges. An uptick many years after the technology became obsolete, which generates intriguing headlines. More recently, it's been happening with digital cameras from the early 2000s. Of course, it follows a long period of decline, so it's like a stock price that's dropped from $100 to $1. Should it suddenly increase 30%, it will attract attention, but it's still down 98.7%. There's usually a gap of a decade or more because it can't be retro-chic until its replacement has saturated the market. The last of the laggards keep a baseline demand for the old thing, while the hipsters come in and increase its demand for a while. Then they get bored and the laggard market keeps declining, so the market falls back down again.
sukilot 4y ago
[dead]
freetime2 4y ago
Antique maps are pretty fun, too. It's always interesting to compare your neighborhood now to the way it was hundreds of years ago. And original prints can be pretty collectable, too.
sizzzzlerz 4y ago
I'm a small scale collector of historic and antique maps with a collection of about 20 maps. The earliest map I own is from the 17th century which I treasure because it shows California as an island. Most of them are of the United States, primarily the west. I find just looking at these maps immensely satisfying in a way digital maps can never be. I consider them works of art.
wilg 4y ago
I love headline writing. Headline: "Forget google maps!!!!" Article: "This [map] shows all the rivers in the U.S., with each color representing a different river basin." I ain't navigating by color coded river basins, fellas!
nicbou 4y ago
I like paper maps because you can write on them. Every hostel will tear a map off a pile and draw directions on them for their guests. I have an iPad and a Pencil. There just isn't any app that lets me plan the same way with digital maps, circling things and writing.
tee_0 4y ago
I’ve been a google maps user for ten years and I tried Apple Maps recently and it’s way, way better. Google maps has always had a million little problems that annoy the shit out of me. It will take you down a road that is totally inappropriate, one lane and hasn’t been maintained for decades.

206 points by lxm 4y ago

I don't buy roadmaps, but I have a ton of orienteering maps for when I go hiking. I really love orienteering with a proper waterproof map & compass.

joshstrange 4y ago

> His customers, he added, aren’t just looking to maps for directions, but as inspiration for future trips or even as art worth hanging. I think that alone accounts for the vast majority of this increase. The article throws that in as a minor detail but I'd bet money it's the only reason. Of course you don't get as many clicks for "More people are buying maps as art". 2 of the 3 examples of maps they give at the end are exclusively art (raised maps and the coffee map).

ghaff 4y ago
Essentially retro-chic. Some may have also discovered some utility in being able to have a big picture view of a destination. However, I wouldn't impute too much utility to the explanation. I'd be pretty surprised if younger generations are suddenly discovering that it can be really useful to have a physical backup in case their phone battery dies.
- tppiotrowski 4y ago
  I agree with the big picture utility. A good project would be a map where you can choose to display all Best Westerns, Shell gas stations, etc at state zoom level so you can visualize a day's worth of travel including food, gas and lodging destinations without needing to repeatedly search GMaps. (i.e. it looks like there's a Shell station in 15, 65 and 128 miles along our route...)
- wingworks 4y ago
  This, and while no small device can easily replace a large physical map, but map developers aren't helping here either. I find more often then not, in map apps the 2nd you zoom out even a little, you start losing half the details. Even on a larger iPad. Especially the topo map apps, which also tend to forget most devices are HighDPI, so the topo image is also blurry. I just wish I could set the map level to it's best, then zoom out as far as I want without jumping to a worse level map.
- bmicraft 4y ago
  My physical backup in case my phone dies is my other older phone with offline maps installed. I wonder why more people don't do the same.
warner25 4y ago
I love maps, and I'll admit that my wife and I have a bunch of map art hanging on our walls, one of each city or state where we've lived, but they're not like actual maps that you could fold up and take on a road trip. I hadn't thought of hanging up that sort of map. I'll also admit that I haven't bought a paper map to put in the glove box of my car in over a decade. I have printed Google Maps before a trip, though. This is coming from a career Army officer, so I'm quite used to looking at maps on the walls of operations centers, and doing serious map-and-compass navigation exercises.
- kortilla 4y ago
  Where do you buy nice ones for the wall? I’ve wanted to do this but end up stumbling across random bespoke ones.
  - warner25 4y ago
    We've bought almost all of them through Etsy, and they are indeed "random bespoke" products. Some sellers are military spouses so they design prints of the places where we've lived (i.e. around Army bases, which wouldn't interest most other people). Last week we were looking at this one, and the seller appears to specialize in artistic maps: https://www.etsy.com/listing/346969594/fort-rucker-map-print-alabama-poster https://www.etsy.com/listing/346969594/fort-rucker-map-print...
tristor 4y ago
I only own one paper map, and it is specifically for art. I've traveled extensively and I wanted a way to track where I've been, so it's stapled to a pin-board, so I can put push-pins in after I visit somewhere. I've been primarily using a portable form of GPS for more than a decade, even before Google Maps.
Finnucane 4y ago
Down the street from my office is a store that sells maps as art. Old maps, new maps, and transit memorabilia. One of the advantages of a digital map is that it always up to date, but that also means it can never be a historical document, the way an old map can be. For myself I have a pile of bike maps, that I admit I don't use as much as I used to (partly because I have all my regular routes in my head now). The nice thing about those maps is that they marked elevation changes, and also the location of ice cream shops. You know, the essentials.
- capekwasright 4y ago
  Ward Maps in Cambridge, MA?
  - Finnucane 4y ago
    yes.
narag 4y ago
I'm renting now, so I avoid putting things on the wall as much as possible. But I used to have a map to help build a mental map from repeatedly seeing it. Recently I've noticed that something similar happens to me with analogic watches.
romwell 4y ago
>The article throws that in as a minor detail but I'd bet money it's the only reason. For most people, perhaps. After working in Google Geo, I drove across the country and back (CA - NC - TX - CA) using the trusty Rand & McNally atlas and compass, and couldn't have been happier. No nagging voices telling me where to go. No countdown timers making me wary of taking a scenic detour. No feeling of going on rails. Yes to seeing things and being aware of my environment. Yes to understanding where I am at all times. Yes to exercising my brain and being in control of my lived experience. Yes to not becoming stupid [1][2][3][4]. But sure, maps are pretty too. [1] https://www.vocativ.com/418342/google-maps-gps-navigation/index.html https://www.vocativ.com/418342/google-maps-gps-navigation/in... [2] https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=5179471&page=1 https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=5179471&page=1 [3] https://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/a-sportsmans-life/gps-is-making-you-stupid/ https://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/a-sportsmans-life/gps-i... [4] https://www.thedrive.com/news/8686/study-using-gps-navigation-switches-off-brain-makes-you-stupid https://www.thedrive.com/news/8686/study-using-gps-navigatio...
troymc 4y ago
It's a plausible hypothesis. I'd like to see data.
irrational 4y ago
I love National Geographic maps of ancient places. They basically are maps as art.
now__what 4y ago
As a hiker I find paper maps absolutely essential and far easier to use than anything digital. Maybe it's because of that familiarity that I print or buy paper maps whenever I'm going on a trip more than a few hours' drive from home. I also rely heavily on printed maps and guidebooks for any extended travel and for trip planning, which are excruciating if you're relying solely on the internet. Can't say I've ever used a map for art.
- nomel 4y ago
  > and far easier to use than anything digital. Paper maps are great for knowing where to go, but a little less great for knowing where you are. Off/deep trail hikers will have a stand-alone GPS, because climbing trees/hills to get your bearings ends up being a serious risk, with just a compass: https://gripped.com/gripped-outdoors/how-100-hikers-got-lost-and-how-they-survived/ https://gripped.com/gripped-outdoors/how-100-hikers-got-lost...
  - bearmode 4y ago
    Entirely depends on the environment you're hiking in tbh.
    - nomel 4y ago
      True. Maps only work if there’s uniquely, unambiguously, identifiable terrain, that’s well understood from looking at the, necessarily, topographical map.
- mycall 4y ago
  My favorites are the waterproof versions.
deleted 4y ago
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rob74 4y ago

https://archive.is/cVuOB https://archive.is/cVuOB

rr888 4y ago

Went hiking while relying on a phone app. Offline, it cached the map no problems, until a few hours in when the TTL must have been triggered then everything disappeared. Bought a real map soon after.

ghaff 4y ago
I won't say I'm religious about it--especially if somewhere familiar--but if I'm being doctrinaire, I'd argue you should always have a physical map and compass while hiking.
- folli 4y ago
  ... and know how to use it ...
  - ghaff 4y ago
    Fair. As someone who grew up with physical maps, using them is pretty intuitive but I can see how it wouldn't be for everyone. And, of course, some aspects of topographic maps take some education. With respect to compass, I'm not sure how critical real orienteering is for most people. It's more about not being totally turned around and/or being able to make sure you hit some feature like a road.
    - purpleflame1257 4y ago
      Just being able to know which way is "north" is probably sufficient.
      - jcranmer 4y ago
        There's a difference between geographic north and magnetic north that can get pretty significant (if you live in NE US, magnetic north about 10-20° west of north). If you're sailing the clipper route, for part of your journey, your magnetic compass now points as far as northwest rather than north.

stevesearer 4y ago

Even though I bring my phone with offline maps downloaded (Gaia GPS), I still like to bring a paper map of the area as well. In addition to having another option in case my phone breaks or dies, paper maps are nice to have so people can gather around and look together and build knowledge. When solo, paper maps are an easy thing to look at when sitting around the camp. Shout out to my local cartographer Bryan Conant who makes excellent maps of both the Dick Smith Wilderness and San Rafael Wilderness within the Los Padres National Forest.

vidanay 4y ago
This plus a Boy Scout level knowledge of orienteering (glorified triangulation with a $5 compass) can actually be useful in an emergency situation.

eschneider 4y ago

I definitely find paper maps are better (for me) for planning long trips and I always keep a set in the car for places I normally go. (Basically, the east coast of the US.) GPS is fantastic for last-mile directions/where exactly is that house sorta thing, but "best" route for me is rarely shortest path, and it's just easier to visualize on a big paper map.

JKCalhoun 4y ago
Agree. I prefer major interstates for road tripping — something Siri & Gigi (the name we came up with for Google Maps persona) don't always seem to get right. So in our road-tripping van, we keep a trucker's road atlas for the U.S.

moomoo11 4y ago

I’ve pretty much ditched Apple Maps and use the compass in my car and landmarks to navigate lol. It’s a lot of fun for me, using maps just ruins the fun of exploration.

astrange 4y ago
Maybe it's just me, but I thought the point of having a nav app open was to tell you about traffic/detours, not because you need directions.
- moomoo11 4y ago
  I think that's just you (and me maybe) haha. Most people are awful at navigating. I have a fairly photographic memory and once I read a street name once or twice I'm never forgetting it.

philip1209 4y ago

Some of the most fun I've had while traveling is exploring a city without a phone. Just write down your home address and destination address on a card, and if you need a mulligan - a taxi can take you to either. Related: this reminds me of the "paper phone" concept from Google: https://experiments.withgoogle.com/paper-phone https://experiments.withgoogle.com/paper-phone

TurkishPoptart 4y ago
I love this idea! Looks like Google either didn't launch it or shitcanned it after a year.
- dwringer 4y ago
  I went through a roller coaster of emotions reading this thread and clicking through all the way to the github repo, where it slowly dawned on me that this was not just layers of satire.

kypro 4y ago

Something I find really fun when traveling in the car with kids is to give them a paper map and ask them to plan a route a for us to get to our destination. Then when you're driving ask them to follow along and give the directions. Obviously they can't be too young and they're not going to be perfect, but if you have a child around 7-13 they'll probably find this quite fun. Being able to use a map is one of those skills which admittedly isn't all that useful today, but I still think it's fun to plan out your own routes and decide the kinds of roads you'd like to take and the places you'd like to pass on your way from A to B. Plus, there are so many times my phone has died or my GPS has randomly stopped working and I'm glad I have my paper map with me just in case.

macintux 4y ago
I navigated a cross-country road trip when I was 14. Absolutely a great way to learn about maps, traveling, time estimation.
eldaisfish 4y ago
an interesting thought experiment is to ponder just how many skills are being lost due to technology. I know how to read a map and how to find rough compass bearings but i was never in a situation where i needed either skill. Could i manage without GPS - probably but i’m not confident. If GPS died tomorrow because of a solar flare, would the younger generations manage?
- zikduruqe 4y ago
  https://www.gislounge.com/spatial-orientation-and-the-brain-the-effects-of-map-reading-and-navigation/ https://www.gislounge.com/spatial-orientation-and-the-brain-... Studies have shown that people just cannot read maps anymore due to dependence on GPS apps in their daily lives.
  - culopatin 4y ago
    But doesn’t mean they won’t learn the next thing if it’s gone.

adamwong246 4y ago

I will go out of my way to use _anything_ that is not a screen. I stare at screens, all day, ever day. Every moment not gazing into a hyper-bright magic rectangle is a relief.

nicbou 4y ago
I'd like to read about your approach. This is something I am considering too, but screens are a good medium for a lot of what I do.
- adamwong246 4y ago
  Well, me too. Hard to write software with pen and paper. But it resolves to "use tech for work and only work". I go online to get my job done but it's all work, no pleasure. I've ridden my phone of any app which can eat my attention. It goes without saying that social media apps got trashed but also news apps, even the default google news app. My phone is more like an old-school Nokia than a modern magic rectangle and if they made a decent e-ink phone, I'd seriously consider it. I will watch _some_ tv or film, but only in the living room, on the dedicated television, never on a laptop or tablet. Lastly, zero video games at all. Edit, well, almost zero. Factorio is a hard habit to break but I have been clean now for several months.)
  - nicbou 4y ago
    This is similar to something I wrote about recently: https://nicolasbouliane.com/blog/silence https://nicolasbouliane.com/blog/silence My goals were different, but my approach was very similar. However I did not replace screens with analogue equivalents.

pm215 4y ago

I buy paper Ordnance Survey maps because they come with a scratch-off code to get the map in their digital app. You can also pay an annual subscription of about 50 quid to get coverage of the whole UK, but for my usage, which is limited to fairly small geographic areas, I prefer to pay the 8 or 9 quid each for the paper maps covering the areas I care about, which then gets me access to that map forever, rather than having an ongoing annual expense. And it's nice to have the paper map to be able to look at a larger area at once.

globular-toast 4y ago
You can access OS maps on Bing maps. Both Landranger and Explorer. I used to use streetmap.co.uk for this purpose but recently discovered Bing has them too. Useful for areas where I don't want to buy the map yet.
jjgreen 4y ago
The OS do fabulous work, and not just of the UK: https://shop.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/the-moon-50th-anniversary-edition-map/ https://shop.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/the-moon-50th-anniversary-...

mvexel 4y ago

Part of this resurgence can undoubtedly be explained by the ready availability of high quality open geospatial data sources like OpenStreetMap. The United States has always had a lot of open geospatial data available, but it's patchy, can be hard to find, and is of wildly varying quality. In Europe, open (geospatial) data has become the norm, but that wasn't the case even 10 years ago. And in spite of harmonization efforts, it can still be hard to cobble together map data that is consistent across countries from government sources.

courgette 4y ago
I live between France and the US. France has https://www.geoportail.gouv.fr/ https://www.geoportail.gouv.fr/ and IGN topographic map of every square centimeter of the country. The US has... google map and you can also find some decent topographic map online. It's just way harder to find the paper version. ( must have in my book for hiking and such ) That article actually provide great resources to buy good topographic map of the US. It's been a struggle and a frustration for me.

ttcbj 4y ago

They aren't mentioned in the article, but Butler Motorcycle Maps fit with the theme. You can currently access the same data via an app called Rever (which is great for actually driving a route you have already planned), but the physical maps give a better overview, and more accessible editorial content, than the app does: https://butlermaps.com/ https://butlermaps.com/ They are more useful for deciding where you want to go in the first place. As developers, I think it is really interesting to think about why this is true/possible. (I also find it true that PDF brochures for automobiles are a better way to understand the different trims than the car's website). All the filtering/searching/data analysis features of software seem so powerful, but sometimes committing to a single, static format for presenting information yields a more comprehensible result.

kzrdude 4y ago

Just to note, all the hiking maps I get now are made in tyvek, not really in paper. It's a newer material, it doesn't wear as much (but still some) in the folds, it is water resistant and so on. It's a more usable map as a result. It does feel slightly waxy to touch.

sowbug 4y ago
Do you know whether there is such a thing as laser-printable paper that you can write on with dry-erase markers and still erase? I like annotating certain documents while I'm traveling, and I wish I could wipe them clean at the start of each trip. I currently laminate the things I reuse most (checklists), or just print a new copy each time.
- mdmglr 4y ago
  Laminate the paper and use Expo Vis-A-Vis Wet-Erase Markers. Use to be popular in K12 classrooms before everything became chromebooks.

kimbernator 4y ago

This is a little tangential, but last year me and my girlfriend went to Greece for the first time. A few days after we purchased the tickets, a book came in the mail. She had ordered a tourism guide for Greece that had some recommendations about what to see, where to eat, where to stay, etc. My first reaction was along the lines of "why would we do this when we have the entire internet? Each section is written by only one person recommending what they liked, how can I rely on that?" Well, it turns out that avoiding the chaotic whirlwind of dubiously-funded and low-quality clickbait articles that come up on google when you search "things to do in _____" makes the planning process much easier. Even if the book missed a few places we would have enjoyed, it was a pleasure to read this person's insight on the areas we were in and the places they thought were worth seeing. It came with useful maps of every location we were in and gave fairly accurate pricing estimates for each activity. The simplicity of seeing a couple sentences about why you should take the time to see a historic site or scenic view, or eat at some little hole in the wall restaurant and taking them at face value makes the entire travel process so much easier and more fun. Googling around and seeing conversations about what to do on Reddit will make me second-guess every choice and wonder if I'm truly maximizing my trip, which is guaranteed to make the trip worse, regardless of what I end up seeing. Consuming data and services from the internet has become very transactional: Every article about tourism is either selling a ton of ad space or is sponsoring the recommendations, both of which make it more annoying to get data that way. It's hard to tell what the writer's financial motivations are. The same is true for google maps: some things are promoted because they paid for it, not because they are better. Books, paper maps, and other "analog" formats are written by people that want to sell the book. It's not impossible that they are getting kickbacks for their recommendations, but in this age where informational books are gasping for air, they really do need to do a good job for people to keep buying them. edit: I might as well plug the guide we used - as of this comment it's the newest version but it looks like there will be a new one in 06/23: https://www.amazon.com/Lonely-Planet-Greece-Travel-Guide/dp/1788688287 https://www.amazon.com/Lonely-Planet-Greece-Travel-Guide/dp/...

space_fountain 4y ago
Not really disagreeing, but I’d like to plug Wikivoyage which has also (for me), been very helpful

dljsjr 4y ago

Anybody remember Triptiks from AAA? You'd go to a AAA office or call them on the phone, tell them where you were going, and in return you'd get a printed spiral top-bound pad with your trip broken down in to multiple legs, the roads/routes pre-highlighted, gas stops and prices estimated in, a list of sites for stopping off at, etc. All human curated and human annotated (the roads on your route were literally gone over by a person with a Highlighter). I'm sure it was all pulled from some sort of centralized/normalized/standardized data source but the human touch was definitely there. They were awesome. When we were growing up most big family trips were in the car because gas and hotels were just so much more affordable than flying an entire family anywhere. I got to be the "navigator" on so many trips by helping family members read the Triptiks. Apparently AAA still offers these, but they're generated digitally now via their app, and you can print them off if you want. But something about those human-built Triptiks were really really special.

chordalkeyboard 4y ago
AAA will also print them themselves and mail them to members upon request.
mxuribe 4y ago
I had always heard of this - and so highly regarded for years(!) - but never used myself.
kulahan 4y ago
Travel is such an personal thing - it's people in an environment at least somewhat foreign to them. Trusting someone to plan it is a pretty intimate thing, and companies don't do intimate things very well anymore. Too many people, too few companies. I'd pay good money for more personal experiences from companies, especially when it comes to something like this, but it's not easy. The wife and I were looking for a honeymoon package, but neither "beach" nor "romantic European getaway" were on our list. Roughly 90% of travel companies were out of ideas after that. It's literally their JOB to plan trips and they can't deviate from a template. It's pain incarnate.
- 4y ago

DrThunder 4y ago

I love looking at paper maps for my wilderness backpacking/camping trips. I really like seeing where the trail leads and what camping spots I can use. It just makes it feel like a big adventure. Additionally, having a weather proof map for wilderness trips is invaluable. I'd never rely on a digital device to provide what could be a life saving tool.

troymc 4y ago
Wilderness backpacking/camping trips are a great use case for (laminated) paper maps. You really need a good map, and you don't want to be dependent on an electronic device that has many failure modes (e.g. running out of power, getting wet, getting dropped into a canyon, getting smashed...).

gumby 4y ago

There are a lot of things you can learn from a paper map that you can't by looking through a small window into "map space". The paper map has all sorts of affordances the digital maps don't, and vice versa.

calme_toi 4y ago

I will try this in my next holiday. It is really exhausting to read those online reviews/guides and try to find some places to eat/visit. So next time I will buy maps with recommendations and follow them. If it's not good, I will buy a new map locally. That's it. No more reading reviews on every top rated restaurants nearby and trying to guess if they are fake!

reducesuffering 4y ago

Paper maps can have pitfalls to their usage. The family of James Kim ended up lost in the Oregon wilderness because they took an ill-advised route based on using their paper map. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Kim https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Kim

fsckboy 4y ago
and navigation software has driven people into lakes or snowy mountain passes. both systems need to be updated with better and current information, and yes, internet connected is easier to update, but is also now receiving spam.

ben7799 4y ago

I'm totally hooked on digital navigation but one thing I've noticed is it takes me longer to learn an area to the point I know my way around if I use digital navigation. There are times digital navigation is a million times better. I remember getting lost in the boroughs of NYC a few years before smartphones hit the world. It was very difficult to have the right paper maps in your car for a place like NYC. But in more rural travel it didn't really matter.

smm11 4y ago

We were on a road trip back to Midwestern City 1 from Midwestern City 2, with the grandparents driving. Every 50 miles or so I'd flick the rear door ashtray closed, and we'd immediately screech to a stop on the side of the interstate/freeway, as 'we have a blowout.'

gwbas1c 4y ago

I generally use paper backups for tickets. I used to print out directions when I had my first GPS, but now I usually have enough redundancy that I don't feel like I need a paper map. I should point out that my printed directions saved me a few times with my first GPS. It was really bad, it would get confused and make me take off ramps and then get right back on; or it would make me drive in circles. One time it tried to send me 100 miles up a dirt road. (I turned around and relied on printed directions.)

ghaff 4y ago
Especially traveling internationally, I try to have a paper backup of important information. I can imagine arriving in a city having lost my phone and having no idea of where I was staying.

xyzelement 4y ago

I am sure excited to teach my kids (current age, 2.5 years, and 4 months, so there's a bit of time) to use a map. I must have my old road atlas somewhere. As an engineer and product manager (and just in general) I constantly think about, metaphorically, where I want to get to and how to reasonably get there. We literally call this "the roadmap" - it's the ability to visualize a viable path. I love Google maps (I've relied for it on 6 continents for driving, transit, and walking, it's amazing) but it basically does the "how" for you and I want my kids to be able to do that. So if we're ever doing a roadtrip, I dunno, from NYC to Miami, I want my kids to be part of the planning - how many miles can we do a day? What are the natural destinations along the way? Basically, I think mapping and trip planning is a very natural example of breaking down the problem into sub-problems that are both meaningful in their own way and add up to the whole. It's also interesting to trouble-shoot this kind of stuff. If Google Maps suggests to us a route that is very different than what we mapped out - why? What is it optimizing for vs what are we optimizing for? I am excited to teach my kids to think this way.

freitzkriesler 4y ago

I thought I was the Luddite, I have a leather bound north America map in my 300D for when the mobile phone networks get shutdown by solar flares.

quirk 4y ago
Gotta have an atlas for when SHTF!

Eumenes 4y ago

If you're an outdoors person in maine, you pretty much need one of these: https://www.amazon.com/Maine-Atlas-Gazetteer-Delorme/dp/089933282X https://www.amazon.com/Maine-Atlas-Gazetteer-Delorme/dp/0899... Google maps is often wrong with roads/atv/snowmobiel trails, and its also very useful for finding boat launches

cassepipe 4y ago

I personnally am a fan of physical 3d maps. They are rigid and not for travel, and they're made out of plastic but there's nothing like it to understand a region.

pmontra 4y ago

If I go hiking in the mountains I'd bring with me a paper map just in case something happens to my phone or I run out of battery. A power bank backups only the battery, not a cracked or lost phone. Never lost a paper map though.

KMag 4y ago
On a side note, hiking is incredibly popular in Hong Kong (mountain sides too steep to practically build residences right in the middle of one of the most densely populated places on Earth). However, Google maps is comically bad for hiking in Hong Kong. For years, the Mt. Butler HF radio station was marked as "gas station". (It's the only gas station I've seen with barbed wire locked gate and signs warning of guard dogs.) They've since fixed the HF radio station. However, last I checked, hiking from the North Point MTR to Stanley, Google maps will still try and route you over some overgrown paths, and up the side of a rock quarry where you need to scramble up with the help of some tied together odds and ends of rope someone has helpfully fastened to a small tree. Any sane human would have routed up Siu Ma Shan and along the back side of the quarry over to Park View.
- kccqzy 4y ago
  Do people actually try to use Google Maps for hiking? It never occurred to me to even try. I always go to the authority maintaining the hiking trails (NPS, or some state or county agency) and download PDF maps.
  - KMag 4y ago
    Sample size 1: I have tried from time to time. Google seems to have Hong Kong trail maps in its data set, just poor quality as to which trails are passable.

Zigurd 4y ago

I have seen maps of Boston since forever, but it was not until using Google Maps to navigate that I realized some parts of Boston I assumed were not well connected are in fact conveniently driveable. I suspect this boom is like describing cassette sales as "booming." Supposedly sales doubled in 2021.

college_physics 4y ago

Fact number one: with the connected supercomputer, gps, camera, audio recorder etc in our hands travel gets upgraded (at least in principle) not one but several levels, from the mundane and practical to the sublime Fact number two: the tangible, tactile reality, longevity, versatility, privacy, artistic beauty of a well made map or travel guide cannot be replicated, certainly not by the crappy websites that have come to dominate this space Conclusion. We have two legs. Walking and hiking is better if we use them both :-)

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jurassic 4y ago

Maps are an art form. There will always be a market for beautiful maps as art objects.

redtriumph 4y ago

While the article points out alternatives people use in modern era, I always had a pull towards paper maps. My father had a collection of atlas of India and its different cities. I spent lot of time parsing through them, even though I haven't been to upper half of country yet. On recent vacation, while we were trying doing street shopping, I came across Lewis-Clark map [original size] and then I thought I might as well use maps as wall art. I ended up buying following two classic replicas. a. Hindoostan map of 1827: http://www.davidrumsey.com/maps4000.html http://www.davidrumsey.com/maps4000.html b. Western North America of 1846: https://digitalcommons.csumb.edu/hornbeck_mex_1/7/ https://digitalcommons.csumb.edu/hornbeck_mex_1/7/ Next lookout: Hydrological map of North America.

maptime 4y ago

Traditional paper maps or charts are not booming at all. The biggest producer of physical nautical charts has had to withdraw from the market as they have become unprofitable. The increased availability of good open geospatial data along with amazing free open source tooling has made making beautiful maps easier than ever. Tools like QGIS and blender are world class Maybe contentious but is it really a map if it's hung on a wall for artistic merit? At what point is it considered art?

panza 4y ago
I'd really like a breakdown on what these maps are actually used for. They could just be wall art, perhaps a (growing?) niche of custom guide books, maybe a renewed interest in exploring offroad/outback etc. Or maybe just more people are acknowledging that a fallback paper map in the glove box is a good idea.
wmeredith 4y ago
"Suits are Back" Map sales aren't booming any more than point-and-shoot camera sales. I would bet a month's salary that this is a submarine article: http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html

gregsadetsky 4y ago

No affiliation — an amazingly niche, caring paper map is this one of places to photograph in Iceland: https://international-photographer.com/en/product/map-iceland-v5/ https://international-photographer.com/en/product/map-icelan... (This is the 5th version of the map!) The author only makes maps of Iceland and the Faroe Islands. They’re beautiful, annotated with camping and natural spring sites, and the photographic spots are unique and cover a wide range of terrain / vistas. I car-camped the entire island and would refer to it to find my next stop. I wish the author made maps of more locations but I also understand that this is a work of dedication and patience.

annoyingnoob 4y ago

Thomas Guide used to make the best street maps ever. I did deliveries pre-Internet, the Thomas Guide was invaluable.

courgette 4y ago

When I enter a new state, a buy a road map of that state. Then I store it under a seat of my van. Phone battery die, cell signal can be weak. And I can scribble on the map. It's just a better tool.

ThinkBeat 4y ago

In the city I live in, construction, random political initiatives, broken down infrastructure, temporary closures and on make paper maps entirely useless. I used to have a decent map in my head from getting around but that is impossible now. I do wish Google Maps / Wayze / TomTOm etc updated the maps faster.

controlch 4y ago

We recently had to define the boundaries of polygons that designate the various sectors of a city. We found that hand drawing them on a paper map was far more convenient than doing the same on a screen. This of course involves the initial design of the polygons and not the subsequent transformation to their respective coordinates, which inevitably had to be done using a map software.

crtified 4y ago
In my experience, most land planning is done (or at least, starts) with a pencil on paper, even today. Technicians then take over the work of making it a detailed digital reality. The computer is wonderful in so many ways, but it does not yet (in common usage) replicate the direct physical connection, the casual efficiency and universal understanding of the real world pencil-on-paper tool.

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reader_x 4y ago

A cartography professor of mine once advised me to take another career path because cartography was dying; he added, “Google Maps has terrible maps- but no one seems to care.” It heartens me to see in HN comments that some are noticing. A pet peeve of mine is when water bodies go unlabeled. An old-fashioned paper map like the kind inserted in National Geographic mags when I was wee included a breathtaking amount of information, but that requires careful design so element labels don’t overlap etc.

brightlancer 4y ago
At least in the US, folks seem extremely sensitive to direct prices and are consequently penny-wise and pound-foolish (not in a Vimes's Boots way), where they could've spent an extra 5% or 10% on a better product or service and been happier for it, perhaps even saving more in short-term indirect costs. Even against a "free" product or service, spending $30 or $50 might save multiples in time -- but IME folks are really bad at pricing indirect costs.
walnutclosefarm 4y ago
Google and most other digital maps are indeed terrible maps. They are fine for a certain kind of navigation task, and great for looking up where the Starbucks nearest your current location is located, but for most other map uses, and certainly for actually getting a picture in your head of where you are or want to go, and how that relates to other things that you know or may want to know, or for thinking about an itinerary or even route that might be other than the shortest or fastest, they are terrible.
- nicbou 4y ago
  OsmAnd is a good option for this. I use it where Google Maps fails, namely layering multiple things, and going hiking. If something is missing, you can slowly improve the map yourself. I've contributed hundreds of places to OSM in more distant places.
maxerickson 4y ago
It's still very much in the early stages, but https://zelonewolf.github.io/openstreetmap-americana/ https://zelonewolf.github.io/openstreetmap-americana/ is a project to build a rendering system that handles details better. It's using OpenStreetMap data in the OpenMapTiles schema, but giving lots of feedback to OMT when something won't work. (There's some attempt to make things look nice, but the focis is still on capabilities)

ChuckMcM 4y ago

When we were home schooling our kids we got a map of the US from Imus Geographics [1] and it made it really easy to see the places that were being talked about in history and their relative position to other places. The map in general has a wealth of details and over the years we have often used it when planning camping trips around the west. [1] https://www.imusgeographics.com/ https://www.imusgeographics.com/

insane_dreamer 4y ago

I love maps. I have a map of the Pacific Crest Trail (which I got at REI) on the wall of my living room - it's beautiful to look at (still need to frame it but it's on the list!), informative (cleverly shows elevation along the trail in a column on the left), and leads to interesting conversations with guests. We also have metal "night" city maps (from displate.com) of cities my wife and I have lived in, which make wall decorations (i.e, arranged in a pattern of 8) .

rascul 4y ago

Many states in the US offer free road maps, generally available at welcome centers when you cross a state line on an interstate. Also many states, counties, and municipalities offer free or low cost paper maps. I pick up paper maps whenever I can, and some are hanging on my walls.

midasuni 4y ago

Read a great book over summer based on a mystery of various maps - especially an old 1930s gas station map from a time of adventure that I guess doesn’t exist any more. The Cartographers, by Peng Shepherd. https://www.washingtonpost.com/books/2022/03/24/cartographers-peng-shepherd-book-review/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/books/2022/03/24/cartographer...

WalterBright 4y ago

What I miss from paper maps is the size. You can spread them out on a table. Good luck with your phone. I got tired of using Waze, as I found that when I arrived I had little idea of how I got there. I had no notion of which direction I went, or where the destination was. Now I look at a map on my computer before I go, and sketch out the route on a piece of paper. Then, I tape the paper to the steering wheel and follow it. I know, I know, I'm out of step. But at least I am spatially oriented with this method.

syngrog66 4y ago

with a paper map I cannot count on learning every road's name that I need to know, or learning it fast. with Google Maps the last few years it can be a real battle. And at the worst time UX-wise: while I'm driving and need to make a turn or lane decision in the next few minutes. Also this reminds me to add something to my Prepper's stash: recent accurate paper maps for everywhere I might care about. Just In Case.

dogman144 4y ago

paper map and compass navigation opens the world up. very cool skill to have. if one is capable in the outdoors, land navigation opens up so many cool areas to explore. easy enough to do safely and leave no trace.

mmahemoff 4y ago

This has been a recurring pattern with other forms of media, e.g. vinyl records, typewriters, Atari cartridges. An uptick many years after the technology became obsolete, which generates intriguing headlines. More recently, it's been happening with digital cameras from the early 2000s. Of course, it follows a long period of decline, so it's like a stock price that's dropped from $100 to $1. Should it suddenly increase 30%, it will attract attention, but it's still down 98.7%. There's usually a gap of a decade or more because it can't be retro-chic until its replacement has saturated the market. The last of the laggards keep a baseline demand for the old thing, while the hipsters come in and increase its demand for a while. Then they get bored and the laggard market keeps declining, so the market falls back down again.

sukilot 4y ago

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freetime2 4y ago

Antique maps are pretty fun, too. It's always interesting to compare your neighborhood now to the way it was hundreds of years ago. And original prints can be pretty collectable, too.

sizzzzlerz 4y ago

I'm a small scale collector of historic and antique maps with a collection of about 20 maps. The earliest map I own is from the 17th century which I treasure because it shows California as an island. Most of them are of the United States, primarily the west. I find just looking at these maps immensely satisfying in a way digital maps can never be. I consider them works of art.

wilg 4y ago

I love headline writing. Headline: "Forget google maps!!!!" Article: "This [map] shows all the rivers in the U.S., with each color representing a different river basin." I ain't navigating by color coded river basins, fellas!

nicbou 4y ago

I like paper maps because you can write on them. Every hostel will tear a map off a pile and draw directions on them for their guests. I have an iPad and a Pencil. There just isn't any app that lets me plan the same way with digital maps, circling things and writing.

tee_0 4y ago

I’ve been a google maps user for ten years and I tried Apple Maps recently and it’s way, way better. Google maps has always had a million little problems that annoy the shit out of me. It will take you down a road that is totally inappropriate, one lane and hasn’t been maintained for decades.