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I'm not a fan of plant-based meat, this is most likely because of my culture ( I'm Sardinian ), we do have many meat based dishes and many plant based dishes, a

I'm not a fan of plant-based meat, this is most likely because of my culture ( I'm Sardinian ), we do have many meat based dishes and many plant based dishes, and honestly I don't see the need to cook the meat based ones with processed food that tries to replicate the taste and consistency of meat. I believe that if you don't want to eat meat there's a world of recipes that do not involve meat and are made to elevate the delicate taste of veggies. I've grow up with eating whole foods, we cook everything from the base ingredients, sometimes we even make those base ingredients ( for example we have sheeps and cows and we make milk, and out of milk we make cheese ), personally for me pre-packaged food appears as the sub-optimal choice

georgyo 4y ago
Meat tastes really good. I think there are many people who want to eat less meat but really enjoy meat. I am one of those people.
- jononomo 4y ago
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  - Spivak 4y ago
    I know the new studies that walk back the "read meat is bad for your health" but I haven't heard anything about the environmental impact which puts beef at about 10x worse than chicken and 50x worse than tofu.
  - chollida1 4y ago
    > It tastes great, Agreed:) > it is the healthiest possible food, and it is the most environmentally friendly option. These two require a huge citation. I've never heard of meat being the most healthy food and I've only ever heard of how its one of the worst foods for the environment due to the huge amount of land and water it takes to grow. I've always grown up learning that greens(vegetables are the healthiest food you can eat). What citations would you put forward to show that meat isf the most environmentally friendly food you can eat and the healthiest food you can eat? I found this: https://www.onegreenplanet.org/environment/study-environmental-impact-meat-vs-veggies-staggering/#:~:text=The%20environmental%20impact%20of%20meat,the%20water%20impact%20of%20nuts https://www.onegreenplanet.org/environment/study-environment.... > The environmental impact of meat versus vegetables is staggering. A serving size of meat compared to a serving size of vegetables is linked to 20 times more greenhouse gas emissions. It also takes 100 times the amount of land as consuming vegetables. Unprocessed red meat has twice the water impact of nuts.
  - navierstokess 4y ago
    Some vegans believe that it is unethical to kill animals, and that they should have the same rights as us. Of course, they're wrong because animals aren't able to think. Others believe that meat is bad for the environment, however I don't know if that is correct as I haven't done any research on the topic.
    - evilduck 4y ago
      > Of course, they're wrong because animals aren't able to think. and you know this by what mechanism?
    - issa 4y ago
      I don't think I've ever heard anyone suggest that "animals aren't able to think" before. Could you please explain what you could possibly mean by that?
    - mythrwy 4y ago
      If not being able to think was justification for eating something, well, there's a coworker I have, but he'd probably taste bad.
    - Camus134 4y ago
      [dead]
    - slothtrop 4y ago
      Animals are mostly sentient. The degree of "consciousness" is debated. Sardines don't even have a cerebral cortex, which to me puts them on the level of insects - vegans might object, but they won't object to squashing flies and using insecticides. As for the environment, depends on the animal - this is usually about methane (from cows) and land encroachment (also, because of soybean crops or whatever).
      - reducesuffering 4y ago
        Vegans absolutely generally object to killing flies… Many won’t even steal the work of bees
  - unity1001 4y ago
    > it is the most environmentally friendly option Its not. You need 30 kg of grain or other edible product to make just 1 kg of meat. We are literally turning more food to less food. An unrelated statistic showed that if the world has increased its meat consumption just a little bit more, we would run out of food. The conversion rate is that bad. ... Context: https://www.worldanimalprotection.us/blogs/hidden-driver-fac https://www.worldanimalprotection.us/blogs/hidden-driver-fac... > It is estimated that livestock consume 70% of the grain grown in the US, and that half of the water consumed in the US is used to grow grain for cattle
    - base698 4y ago
      By protein content it's a bit better for beef. 1kg of corn has 32g protein. 1kg of beef has 260g of protein.
      - comte7092 4y ago
        The point was that you need 30 kg of corn to make 1 kg of beef. Therefore 32g * 30 = 960g of corn protein to create 260g of beef protein.
        bequanna 4y ago
        You’re missing the point. There is always some efficiency loss at every stage, but we’re turning something that is not ideal for human consumption (conventional field corn) to something that is very palatable.
        comte7092 4y ago
        No I get the point, your point misses the opportunity cost of the land that was used to raise animal feed, it could be used to grow any number of other crops for human consumption. That is unless you are of the belief that humans have an innate need to consume beef specifically.
    - nightski 4y ago
  - gpvos 4y ago
    1) Agree; 2) Fine, I'll give you that; 3) Spectacularly false.
  - TheRealNGenius 4y ago
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- danjoredd 4y ago
  Agreed. My family has a long history of cardiovascular problems so I am trying to cut down on red meat myself to possibly extend my life...but dangit I want some chicken fried steak and cheeseburgers. I might use impossible burgers to satiate my cravings in a heart-healthy way, but it just isn't the same.
  - maury91 4y ago
    Chicken is not red meat, and also it's an healthy meat ( not sure if in USA chickens are pumped with weird stuff that makes them unhealthy ), you can make a light version of schnitzel by using chicken breast ( mostly protein, low fat ), some healthy oil like EVO oil to shallow fry it, and you should be good ( also if you are worried about cholesterol you can avoid eggs and use other ingredients like oil to make the breadcrumbs/panko/flour/semola stick to the meat ) PS: I'm not a doctor, to my knowledge this is a healthy dish but if you have any health issue I recommend first talking with someone with a specialisation to know how much is healthy and much you can eat of it
    - User23 4y ago
      You can trim, slice, and hammer pork tenderloin as another way to get a fairly low fat schnitzel. Regarding cholesterol, the link between dietary cholesterol and blood cholesterol isn’t very strong. As far as I know unless someone is following specific medical advice from their own provider eggs do not need to be restricted.
      - maury91 4y ago
        Yes, that is true, if your body is healthy the two type of cholesterol ( LDL and HDL ) contained in foods should balance each other and you will not have cholesterol problems. Some people can have medical conditions and can eat maximum ~3 eggs/week. I can't know if OP is one of those people, this is why I suggested a way to avoid cholesterol rich ingredients. Edit: replaced "have cholesterol rich ingredients" with "avoid ..."
      - idiotsecant 4y ago
- stronglikedan 4y ago
  Me too, and I believe OP is just saying that it's better to substitute your nutrition with other non-meat whole foods, instead of substituting it with heavily processed fake meat. And I agree.
- slothtrop 4y ago
  I eat less (almost no red meat), but that is as far as I'll go. Taste is one thing, but also the high quality proteins and nutrition, plus I don't see the problem in killing animals in and of itself. I can't replicate this calorie-per-calorie strictly with veg without supplementation, nor do I feel as good. That approach doesn't seem "green" or financially viable for everyone, notwithstanding that some people do better on vegan diets than others. As far as I can tell, modest consumption is best for optimal health, by virtue that replacing them with.
- TheRealNGenius 4y ago
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- HWR_14 4y ago
  Meat tastes really good. That does not imply that plant-based pseudo-meat tastes better than plant-based recipes designed to use, not hide, the plant flavors.
  - japaneseminisub 4y ago
    It's so strange isn't it, there are so many vegetarian dishes that are delicious. I've never understood the need to use a replacement that's worse across the board. I wonder if it's a cultural thing, like "I want a steak"
    - DangitBobby 4y ago
      If you become a vegetarian in the US, you will come to appreciate that almost no mains offered in any "American" restaurant are without meat. If you go to a popular American restaurant that your friends picked, you are lucky to have 1 non-salad non-side option. For whatever reason, our culture has decided that if it doesn't have meat, it barely qualifies as a meal. As a result, high quality vegetarian food must be aquired by seeking out ethnic food, seeking out veg friendly places, or learning to cook.
- JimBlackwood 4y ago
  But then in your effort to eat less meat, would you replace it with plant-based alternatives? Personally, I cook without any alternatives and just make proper dishes with no meat. Then, once in a while, I’ll get some better locally sourced meat and make a great meat based dish.
  - somehnguy 4y ago
    > But then in your effort to eat less meat, would you replace it with plant-based alternatives? Yes, 100%. I like meat, and meat based dishes. I’ve never had a vegetable based dish that compares to even something similar but containing meat. I feel like when meat alternatives are discussed this option of just making vegetable based dishes always comes up. And I think most people agree with me here - meat makes them better across the board. If it didn’t this market wouldn’t exist and people buy much less meat. As I’m unwilling to switch completely to vegetable based dishes, meat alternatives are the next best option.
- sixstringtheory 4y ago
  As someone who enjoys meat well enough… I realized a while ago that meat itself doesn’t have that great of a flavor, it can be downright bland. The flavor comes from the seasonings and spices they are typically prepared with. Which are either: a) salt or b) something that came from a plant.
  - DuckFeathers 4y ago
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ido 4y ago
I see this a lot here in Germany (I'm an immigrant) - people buying vegan sausage, vegan ham, etc. I prefer to just eat "normal" vegetarian food (I don't even like real ham!) but meat is so central to traditional German cuisine and people here want the kind of (what they consider) staple food that they're willing to eat fake meat.
saiya-jin 4y ago
When I was backpacking around India and Nepal for 6 months altogether, I just stopped eating meat - their chicken pieces were always just bones with tiny bits of meat here and there, mutton was worse than chewing gum and that was it for the meat, food safety notwithstanding. Now enter a wonderful universe of vegetable curries and masalas where every household has their own twist on recipes and it all tastes so much differently. I couldn't care less if there was no meat, the spice mixture, thick sauces and ingredients meant I felt very satiated and didn't miss meat at all. Its all just in our minds. Recently I was explaining to my friend how I eat often cold salads for lunch and in the mountains its more likely some sandwich, probably already half-frozen in the backpack. And I don't care, it tastes great after some physical effort and gives body all it needs and some more. For him, you can't have lunch if its not warm and there is no big piece of meat on plate in some form. Also some people equate spices with just chili, meaning for them that any spiced food must burn your anus for whole next week and leave permanent scars on lower back. Which is a shame, there is whole universe of intense tastes unavailable to traditional western cuisine that doesn't burn your tongue a bit (or it still can while not using any chili at all).
- lawkwok 4y ago
  Often what we want is some familiar texture and substantial mouthfeel of meat. Just adding tiny slices of meat to remind you it’s there or substituting it with “meatier” veggies like mushrooms or cabbage can do the trick.
- riffraff 4y ago
  > there is whole universe of intense tastes unavailable to traditional western cuisine that doesn't burn your tongue a bit FWIW, I agree with everything you said, but I'd like to point out there's a ton of spices used in western cuisine too. For example, in my hometown (central Italy) we use a lot of wild fennel pollen, which goes on basically everything. In Hungary fennel seeds, marjoram, paprika and turmeric are in practically every kitchen. Star anise, nutmeg, saffron, mace, clove etc.. have been used in western cuisine for centuries too, and are used in very traditional western dishes (french onion soup, bechamel sauce, risotto alla milanese etc) Western cuisine certainly uses less spices than the indian subcontinent, but I would not say the spices were unavailable to western cuisine.
Swizec 4y ago
Fake meat feels similar to my Slovenian eyes. There's a whole world of recipes that just don't include meat and are delicious. It wasn't until I moved to the USA that I even realized those are "vegetarian" ... to me they're just regular foods and recipes. Lots of cottage cheese hearty meals with high protein content. It helps that traditional (100+ years ago) Slovenian culture was that you rarely eat meat because meat is expensive. Ye olden folks typically ate meat only on Sundays, I think. Maybe bacon fat to season the food on other days. Sometimes I talk to my vegetarian friends and ask "If you want to be vegetarian, why don't you just eat natively vegetarian dishes? Why the fake meat?". So far no satisfying answer.
- issa 4y ago
  Fake meat is generally aimed more at meat eaters than people who are already vegetarian or vegan. If you already like tofu and seitan, you probably aren't trading those in for the new products.
  - Swizec 4y ago
    I know a lot of vegetarians who have been such for decades and half their diet is veggie sausages, burgers, and similar. Not even the new fake meats, the previous generation.
- lukeschlather 4y ago
  Vegetarian/veganism is not a fashion choice, it's a moral one. It's like asking why a Muslim prepares a dish that's traditionally prepared with pork but instead substitutes lamb. I'm not sure what more explanation you require.
  - Swizec 4y ago
    To quote a funny meme: If my mother had wheels she would've been a bicycle! You can't just replace ingredients. Make a lamb dish if lamb is what you want!
    - 4y ago
unity1001 4y ago
> I'm not a fan of plant-based meat, this is most likely because of my culture ( I'm Sardinian ) Many of the well-known plant based meat companies make their foods for American consumers. That food taste is not similar to what we are accustomed to in the Mediterranean. You can give a try to Heura's mediterranean items. Its an European company and it knows the Mediterrnanean cuisine well: https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/bocados-mediterraneos https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/bocados-mediterraneos https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/albondigas-originales https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/albondigas-originales https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/bocados-especiados https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/bocados-especiados https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/picada-troceada https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/picada-troceada
anonu 4y ago
I second this sentiment. General advice is to avoid things in boxes and bags: aka highly processed foods. The ingredients list on the beyond meat website looks like this: Water, pea protein*, expeller-pressed canola oil, refined coconut oil, rice protein, natural flavors, dried yeast, cocoa butter, methylcellulose, and less than 1% of potato starch, salt, potassium chloride, beet juice color, apple extract, pomegranate concentrate, sunflower lecithin, vinegar, lemon juice concentrate, vitamins and minerals What are you really eating?
- hardwaregeek 4y ago
  Huh that’s actually not too many unfamiliar ingredients. Pea protein, methyl cellulose and potassium chloride. Sure those could be harmful but that’s not exactly the same as a Twinkie
- edgyquant 4y ago
  I don’t see anything glaringly bad here
- kortex 4y ago
  There's only one thing on that list which isn't food/seasoning/salt: methylcellulose. However, it is derived from plant cellulose, and is basically a semi-synthetic equivalent of pectin, a natural product (or other dietary fibers). Methylcellulose is better than pectin because it's just easier to get standard properties. There's nothing harmful about it and the body treats it exactly the same as pectin - it passes straight through like other dietary fiber.
- Dylan16807 4y ago
  > General advice is to avoid things in boxes and bags: aka highly processed foods. What kind of rule is this? Half of the barely-processed foods I buy are in boxes and bags. Rice, potatoes, frozen vegetables... Fresh meat is also wrapped for sanitary reasons. Do you count plain cheese as highly processed because that has plastic on it too. Let alone how normal it is to add things like starch and salt and juices.
uhtred 4y ago
Do we have to keep having this conversation? Lots of people, like myself, choose to not eat meat because we care about animal welfare. It's not because we don't like eating meat. Therefore food that tastes and feels like meat but didn't require killing an animal makes sense.
- purephase 4y ago
  Yeah, this is the issue that most people seem to miss. It's not the flavour that is the issue, which is why products that attempt to replicate it are successful with vegans/vegetarians. What we find abhorrent is that a living, sentient being had to be raised and slaughtered in mostly inhumane conditions, in a supply chain that is evil to humans and animals alike. Removing that element from my diet is the goal, not the flavour. I don't understand why this is so hard for some people to understand.
  - uhtred 4y ago
    Sometimes it seems so predictable that someone will say it that I think they are being deliberately ignorant and trolling.
  - barbazoo 4y ago
    Some people just don't care about the same things. And some people also don't have the creativity, joy or whatever to cook a vegetarian meal. People are just different and for some, biting into a burger or eating a piece of chicken gives them some kind of joy. Maybe they even associate some kind of lifestyle, identity with that. I think there is no point arguing these principles over and over. People are different.
  - pvaldes 4y ago
    > What we find abhorrent is that a living, sentient being had to be raised and slaughtered in mostly inhumane conditions, in a supply chain that is evil to humans and animals alike. Looks like a phobia and probably should be treated as one.
nicbou 4y ago
I second this. I cut meat by cooking better vegetarian recipes, not by finding better meat substitutes. Asia has no shortage of excellent dishes, as does Italy. I'll take a good pasta dish over a fake sausage made of mystery ingredients any day. Tomatoes are nearly fungible, but meat substitutes are not. Potatoes are cheap but meat substitutes are not. Carrots are easy to find anywhere but meat substitutes are not.
- namlem 4y ago
  Seitan is very cheap and easy to make at home, and can be quite tasty.
dayvid 4y ago
It's a good option for eating out as a vegetarian/vegan. At least in the US, most vegetarian/vegan restaurant dishes are an afterthought or non-existent unless it's a vegan restaurant. I don't complain about it, but I've come to not enjoy going to restaurants as a result of this. It's also not bad for people who want to transition from eating meat to being more plant-based and it's another option in general.
- bastardoperator 4y ago
  I'd argue most of the vegetarian/vegan food is going to be cooked alongside meat, especially burgers. You're not getting a special griddle when it comes to prep. The closest I've seen is cooking the vegetarian food earlier and putting it in a steamer, but who wants anything that was prepared 6 hours ago let alone steamed?. I guess I just don't understand the whole concept. I went to vegan expo thing way back in the day at UCLA and nearly every vendor was pretty much "our fake meat" which was odd because I assumed they didn't like meat, yet clearly do. Very confusing.
  - someNameIG 4y ago
    Veganism is an ethical position, not a diet. It to reduce the harm to animals we cause as much as feasible and possible. A veggie burger cooked need to a beef one doesn't harm any animal nor does it add demand for animal products. Ethically there's nothing really wrong with it. Same with the last, I'm vegan because I can live fine while lowering the harm I do to animals, but meat and dairy products do taste good.
- ricardobayes 4y ago
  You'd be pleasantly surprised in Europe, just checked LA on happycow and shows 828 vegan-friendly options to dine, whilst looking at Vienna, a comparatively very small city showed 818 options.
AussieWog93 4y ago
100% agreed. Never understood why vegan evangelists would try to convert me with some God awful meat-free sausage rather than a fresh falafel with tahini.
- DangitBobby 4y ago
  I think a lot of people either eat out or buy and heat up frozen ready-to-eat meals or meal parts (chicken tenders, fries, bag of vegetables, bag of stir fry mix) because they lack either the time or inclination to prep foods themselves. These are the maybe-could-be vegetarians that meat alternatives really appeal to.
now__what 4y ago
It depends on the dish. With burgers, for example, I much prefer an Impossible Burger patty to any meat-based burger for the flavor alone. I also love vegetable-based dishes, but I seek out Impossible meat in addition to those. I also enjoy mostly non-prepackaged, unprocessed food, but it doesn't have to be all or nothing. You can enjoy both.

georgyo 4y ago

Meat tastes really good. I think there are many people who want to eat less meat but really enjoy meat. I am one of those people.

jononomo 4y ago
[flagged]
- Spivak 4y ago
  I know the new studies that walk back the "read meat is bad for your health" but I haven't heard anything about the environmental impact which puts beef at about 10x worse than chicken and 50x worse than tofu.
- chollida1 4y ago
  > It tastes great, Agreed:) > it is the healthiest possible food, and it is the most environmentally friendly option. These two require a huge citation. I've never heard of meat being the most healthy food and I've only ever heard of how its one of the worst foods for the environment due to the huge amount of land and water it takes to grow. I've always grown up learning that greens(vegetables are the healthiest food you can eat). What citations would you put forward to show that meat isf the most environmentally friendly food you can eat and the healthiest food you can eat? I found this: https://www.onegreenplanet.org/environment/study-environmental-impact-meat-vs-veggies-staggering/#:~:text=The%20environmental%20impact%20of%20meat,the%20water%20impact%20of%20nuts https://www.onegreenplanet.org/environment/study-environment.... > The environmental impact of meat versus vegetables is staggering. A serving size of meat compared to a serving size of vegetables is linked to 20 times more greenhouse gas emissions. It also takes 100 times the amount of land as consuming vegetables. Unprocessed red meat has twice the water impact of nuts.
- navierstokess 4y ago
  Some vegans believe that it is unethical to kill animals, and that they should have the same rights as us. Of course, they're wrong because animals aren't able to think. Others believe that meat is bad for the environment, however I don't know if that is correct as I haven't done any research on the topic.
  - evilduck 4y ago
    > Of course, they're wrong because animals aren't able to think. and you know this by what mechanism?
  - issa 4y ago
    I don't think I've ever heard anyone suggest that "animals aren't able to think" before. Could you please explain what you could possibly mean by that?
  - mythrwy 4y ago
    If not being able to think was justification for eating something, well, there's a coworker I have, but he'd probably taste bad.
  - Camus134 4y ago
    [dead]
  - slothtrop 4y ago
    Animals are mostly sentient. The degree of "consciousness" is debated. Sardines don't even have a cerebral cortex, which to me puts them on the level of insects - vegans might object, but they won't object to squashing flies and using insecticides. As for the environment, depends on the animal - this is usually about methane (from cows) and land encroachment (also, because of soybean crops or whatever).
    - reducesuffering 4y ago
      Vegans absolutely generally object to killing flies… Many won’t even steal the work of bees
- unity1001 4y ago
  > it is the most environmentally friendly option Its not. You need 30 kg of grain or other edible product to make just 1 kg of meat. We are literally turning more food to less food. An unrelated statistic showed that if the world has increased its meat consumption just a little bit more, we would run out of food. The conversion rate is that bad. ... Context: https://www.worldanimalprotection.us/blogs/hidden-driver-fac https://www.worldanimalprotection.us/blogs/hidden-driver-fac... > It is estimated that livestock consume 70% of the grain grown in the US, and that half of the water consumed in the US is used to grow grain for cattle
  - base698 4y ago
    By protein content it's a bit better for beef. 1kg of corn has 32g protein. 1kg of beef has 260g of protein.
    - comte7092 4y ago
      The point was that you need 30 kg of corn to make 1 kg of beef. Therefore 32g * 30 = 960g of corn protein to create 260g of beef protein.
      - bequanna 4y ago
        You’re missing the point. There is always some efficiency loss at every stage, but we’re turning something that is not ideal for human consumption (conventional field corn) to something that is very palatable.
        comte7092 4y ago
        No I get the point, your point misses the opportunity cost of the land that was used to raise animal feed, it could be used to grow any number of other crops for human consumption. That is unless you are of the belief that humans have an innate need to consume beef specifically.
  - nightski 4y ago
- gpvos 4y ago
  1) Agree; 2) Fine, I'll give you that; 3) Spectacularly false.
- TheRealNGenius 4y ago
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danjoredd 4y ago
Agreed. My family has a long history of cardiovascular problems so I am trying to cut down on red meat myself to possibly extend my life...but dangit I want some chicken fried steak and cheeseburgers. I might use impossible burgers to satiate my cravings in a heart-healthy way, but it just isn't the same.
- maury91 4y ago
  Chicken is not red meat, and also it's an healthy meat ( not sure if in USA chickens are pumped with weird stuff that makes them unhealthy ), you can make a light version of schnitzel by using chicken breast ( mostly protein, low fat ), some healthy oil like EVO oil to shallow fry it, and you should be good ( also if you are worried about cholesterol you can avoid eggs and use other ingredients like oil to make the breadcrumbs/panko/flour/semola stick to the meat ) PS: I'm not a doctor, to my knowledge this is a healthy dish but if you have any health issue I recommend first talking with someone with a specialisation to know how much is healthy and much you can eat of it
  - User23 4y ago
    You can trim, slice, and hammer pork tenderloin as another way to get a fairly low fat schnitzel. Regarding cholesterol, the link between dietary cholesterol and blood cholesterol isn’t very strong. As far as I know unless someone is following specific medical advice from their own provider eggs do not need to be restricted.
    - maury91 4y ago
      Yes, that is true, if your body is healthy the two type of cholesterol ( LDL and HDL ) contained in foods should balance each other and you will not have cholesterol problems. Some people can have medical conditions and can eat maximum ~3 eggs/week. I can't know if OP is one of those people, this is why I suggested a way to avoid cholesterol rich ingredients. Edit: replaced "have cholesterol rich ingredients" with "avoid ..."
    - idiotsecant 4y ago
stronglikedan 4y ago
Me too, and I believe OP is just saying that it's better to substitute your nutrition with other non-meat whole foods, instead of substituting it with heavily processed fake meat. And I agree.
slothtrop 4y ago
I eat less (almost no red meat), but that is as far as I'll go. Taste is one thing, but also the high quality proteins and nutrition, plus I don't see the problem in killing animals in and of itself. I can't replicate this calorie-per-calorie strictly with veg without supplementation, nor do I feel as good. That approach doesn't seem "green" or financially viable for everyone, notwithstanding that some people do better on vegan diets than others. As far as I can tell, modest consumption is best for optimal health, by virtue that replacing them with.
TheRealNGenius 4y ago
[dead]
HWR_14 4y ago
Meat tastes really good. That does not imply that plant-based pseudo-meat tastes better than plant-based recipes designed to use, not hide, the plant flavors.
- japaneseminisub 4y ago
  It's so strange isn't it, there are so many vegetarian dishes that are delicious. I've never understood the need to use a replacement that's worse across the board. I wonder if it's a cultural thing, like "I want a steak"
  - DangitBobby 4y ago
    If you become a vegetarian in the US, you will come to appreciate that almost no mains offered in any "American" restaurant are without meat. If you go to a popular American restaurant that your friends picked, you are lucky to have 1 non-salad non-side option. For whatever reason, our culture has decided that if it doesn't have meat, it barely qualifies as a meal. As a result, high quality vegetarian food must be aquired by seeking out ethnic food, seeking out veg friendly places, or learning to cook.
JimBlackwood 4y ago
But then in your effort to eat less meat, would you replace it with plant-based alternatives? Personally, I cook without any alternatives and just make proper dishes with no meat. Then, once in a while, I’ll get some better locally sourced meat and make a great meat based dish.
- somehnguy 4y ago
  > But then in your effort to eat less meat, would you replace it with plant-based alternatives? Yes, 100%. I like meat, and meat based dishes. I’ve never had a vegetable based dish that compares to even something similar but containing meat. I feel like when meat alternatives are discussed this option of just making vegetable based dishes always comes up. And I think most people agree with me here - meat makes them better across the board. If it didn’t this market wouldn’t exist and people buy much less meat. As I’m unwilling to switch completely to vegetable based dishes, meat alternatives are the next best option.
sixstringtheory 4y ago
As someone who enjoys meat well enough… I realized a while ago that meat itself doesn’t have that great of a flavor, it can be downright bland. The flavor comes from the seasonings and spices they are typically prepared with. Which are either: a) salt or b) something that came from a plant.
- DuckFeathers 4y ago
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ido 4y ago

I see this a lot here in Germany (I'm an immigrant) - people buying vegan sausage, vegan ham, etc. I prefer to just eat "normal" vegetarian food (I don't even like real ham!) but meat is so central to traditional German cuisine and people here want the kind of (what they consider) staple food that they're willing to eat fake meat.

saiya-jin 4y ago

When I was backpacking around India and Nepal for 6 months altogether, I just stopped eating meat - their chicken pieces were always just bones with tiny bits of meat here and there, mutton was worse than chewing gum and that was it for the meat, food safety notwithstanding. Now enter a wonderful universe of vegetable curries and masalas where every household has their own twist on recipes and it all tastes so much differently. I couldn't care less if there was no meat, the spice mixture, thick sauces and ingredients meant I felt very satiated and didn't miss meat at all. Its all just in our minds. Recently I was explaining to my friend how I eat often cold salads for lunch and in the mountains its more likely some sandwich, probably already half-frozen in the backpack. And I don't care, it tastes great after some physical effort and gives body all it needs and some more. For him, you can't have lunch if its not warm and there is no big piece of meat on plate in some form. Also some people equate spices with just chili, meaning for them that any spiced food must burn your anus for whole next week and leave permanent scars on lower back. Which is a shame, there is whole universe of intense tastes unavailable to traditional western cuisine that doesn't burn your tongue a bit (or it still can while not using any chili at all).

lawkwok 4y ago
Often what we want is some familiar texture and substantial mouthfeel of meat. Just adding tiny slices of meat to remind you it’s there or substituting it with “meatier” veggies like mushrooms or cabbage can do the trick.
riffraff 4y ago
> there is whole universe of intense tastes unavailable to traditional western cuisine that doesn't burn your tongue a bit FWIW, I agree with everything you said, but I'd like to point out there's a ton of spices used in western cuisine too. For example, in my hometown (central Italy) we use a lot of wild fennel pollen, which goes on basically everything. In Hungary fennel seeds, marjoram, paprika and turmeric are in practically every kitchen. Star anise, nutmeg, saffron, mace, clove etc.. have been used in western cuisine for centuries too, and are used in very traditional western dishes (french onion soup, bechamel sauce, risotto alla milanese etc) Western cuisine certainly uses less spices than the indian subcontinent, but I would not say the spices were unavailable to western cuisine.

Swizec 4y ago

Fake meat feels similar to my Slovenian eyes. There's a whole world of recipes that just don't include meat and are delicious. It wasn't until I moved to the USA that I even realized those are "vegetarian" ... to me they're just regular foods and recipes. Lots of cottage cheese hearty meals with high protein content. It helps that traditional (100+ years ago) Slovenian culture was that you rarely eat meat because meat is expensive. Ye olden folks typically ate meat only on Sundays, I think. Maybe bacon fat to season the food on other days. Sometimes I talk to my vegetarian friends and ask "If you want to be vegetarian, why don't you just eat natively vegetarian dishes? Why the fake meat?". So far no satisfying answer.

issa 4y ago
Fake meat is generally aimed more at meat eaters than people who are already vegetarian or vegan. If you already like tofu and seitan, you probably aren't trading those in for the new products.
- Swizec 4y ago
  I know a lot of vegetarians who have been such for decades and half their diet is veggie sausages, burgers, and similar. Not even the new fake meats, the previous generation.
lukeschlather 4y ago
Vegetarian/veganism is not a fashion choice, it's a moral one. It's like asking why a Muslim prepares a dish that's traditionally prepared with pork but instead substitutes lamb. I'm not sure what more explanation you require.
- Swizec 4y ago
  To quote a funny meme: If my mother had wheels she would've been a bicycle! You can't just replace ingredients. Make a lamb dish if lamb is what you want!
  - 4y ago

unity1001 4y ago

> I'm not a fan of plant-based meat, this is most likely because of my culture ( I'm Sardinian ) Many of the well-known plant based meat companies make their foods for American consumers. That food taste is not similar to what we are accustomed to in the Mediterranean. You can give a try to Heura's mediterranean items. Its an European company and it knows the Mediterrnanean cuisine well: https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/bocados-mediterraneos https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/bocados-mediterraneos https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/albondigas-originales https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/albondigas-originales https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/bocados-especiados https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/bocados-especiados https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/picada-troceada https://heurafoods.com/es/productos/picada-troceada

anonu 4y ago

I second this sentiment. General advice is to avoid things in boxes and bags: aka highly processed foods. The ingredients list on the beyond meat website looks like this: Water, pea protein*, expeller-pressed canola oil, refined coconut oil, rice protein, natural flavors, dried yeast, cocoa butter, methylcellulose, and less than 1% of potato starch, salt, potassium chloride, beet juice color, apple extract, pomegranate concentrate, sunflower lecithin, vinegar, lemon juice concentrate, vitamins and minerals What are you really eating?

hardwaregeek 4y ago
Huh that’s actually not too many unfamiliar ingredients. Pea protein, methyl cellulose and potassium chloride. Sure those could be harmful but that’s not exactly the same as a Twinkie
edgyquant 4y ago
I don’t see anything glaringly bad here
kortex 4y ago
There's only one thing on that list which isn't food/seasoning/salt: methylcellulose. However, it is derived from plant cellulose, and is basically a semi-synthetic equivalent of pectin, a natural product (or other dietary fibers). Methylcellulose is better than pectin because it's just easier to get standard properties. There's nothing harmful about it and the body treats it exactly the same as pectin - it passes straight through like other dietary fiber.
Dylan16807 4y ago
> General advice is to avoid things in boxes and bags: aka highly processed foods. What kind of rule is this? Half of the barely-processed foods I buy are in boxes and bags. Rice, potatoes, frozen vegetables... Fresh meat is also wrapped for sanitary reasons. Do you count plain cheese as highly processed because that has plastic on it too. Let alone how normal it is to add things like starch and salt and juices.

uhtred 4y ago

Do we have to keep having this conversation? Lots of people, like myself, choose to not eat meat because we care about animal welfare. It's not because we don't like eating meat. Therefore food that tastes and feels like meat but didn't require killing an animal makes sense.

purephase 4y ago
Yeah, this is the issue that most people seem to miss. It's not the flavour that is the issue, which is why products that attempt to replicate it are successful with vegans/vegetarians. What we find abhorrent is that a living, sentient being had to be raised and slaughtered in mostly inhumane conditions, in a supply chain that is evil to humans and animals alike. Removing that element from my diet is the goal, not the flavour. I don't understand why this is so hard for some people to understand.
- uhtred 4y ago
  Sometimes it seems so predictable that someone will say it that I think they are being deliberately ignorant and trolling.
- barbazoo 4y ago
  Some people just don't care about the same things. And some people also don't have the creativity, joy or whatever to cook a vegetarian meal. People are just different and for some, biting into a burger or eating a piece of chicken gives them some kind of joy. Maybe they even associate some kind of lifestyle, identity with that. I think there is no point arguing these principles over and over. People are different.
- pvaldes 4y ago
  > What we find abhorrent is that a living, sentient being had to be raised and slaughtered in mostly inhumane conditions, in a supply chain that is evil to humans and animals alike. Looks like a phobia and probably should be treated as one.

nicbou 4y ago

I second this. I cut meat by cooking better vegetarian recipes, not by finding better meat substitutes. Asia has no shortage of excellent dishes, as does Italy. I'll take a good pasta dish over a fake sausage made of mystery ingredients any day. Tomatoes are nearly fungible, but meat substitutes are not. Potatoes are cheap but meat substitutes are not. Carrots are easy to find anywhere but meat substitutes are not.

namlem 4y ago
Seitan is very cheap and easy to make at home, and can be quite tasty.

dayvid 4y ago

It's a good option for eating out as a vegetarian/vegan. At least in the US, most vegetarian/vegan restaurant dishes are an afterthought or non-existent unless it's a vegan restaurant. I don't complain about it, but I've come to not enjoy going to restaurants as a result of this. It's also not bad for people who want to transition from eating meat to being more plant-based and it's another option in general.

bastardoperator 4y ago
I'd argue most of the vegetarian/vegan food is going to be cooked alongside meat, especially burgers. You're not getting a special griddle when it comes to prep. The closest I've seen is cooking the vegetarian food earlier and putting it in a steamer, but who wants anything that was prepared 6 hours ago let alone steamed?. I guess I just don't understand the whole concept. I went to vegan expo thing way back in the day at UCLA and nearly every vendor was pretty much "our fake meat" which was odd because I assumed they didn't like meat, yet clearly do. Very confusing.
- someNameIG 4y ago
  Veganism is an ethical position, not a diet. It to reduce the harm to animals we cause as much as feasible and possible. A veggie burger cooked need to a beef one doesn't harm any animal nor does it add demand for animal products. Ethically there's nothing really wrong with it. Same with the last, I'm vegan because I can live fine while lowering the harm I do to animals, but meat and dairy products do taste good.
ricardobayes 4y ago
You'd be pleasantly surprised in Europe, just checked LA on happycow and shows 828 vegan-friendly options to dine, whilst looking at Vienna, a comparatively very small city showed 818 options.

AussieWog93 4y ago

100% agreed. Never understood why vegan evangelists would try to convert me with some God awful meat-free sausage rather than a fresh falafel with tahini.

DangitBobby 4y ago
I think a lot of people either eat out or buy and heat up frozen ready-to-eat meals or meal parts (chicken tenders, fries, bag of vegetables, bag of stir fry mix) because they lack either the time or inclination to prep foods themselves. These are the maybe-could-be vegetarians that meat alternatives really appeal to.

now__what 4y ago

It depends on the dish. With burgers, for example, I much prefer an Impossible Burger patty to any meat-based burger for the flavor alone. I also love vegetable-based dishes, but I seek out Impossible meat in addition to those. I also enjoy mostly non-prepackaged, unprocessed food, but it doesn't have to be all or nothing. You can enjoy both.