4 ms·

And you're defending the antics of a childish billionaire and blaming the damage on the people he hurt. That's on you.

warinukraine 4y ago
I'm defending the right to own property, which is something really fundamental to the way we organize our society. ... and when you say "the people that were hurt"... If you leave your wallet on the street, it might be stolen and you might be hurt. I'm not blaming the victim; someone stealing your wallet is wrong even though you left it on the street. It's not your fault, I'm not blaming you, I blame the thief for the theft. On the other hand there's something that you could've done that would've avoided it - don't leave your wallet on the street.
- Ensorceled 4y ago
  > I'm defending the right to own property, which is something really fundamental to the way we organize our society. No one is trying to "steal" twitter in this thread, we are saying he used his "property rights" to unnecessarily hurt others. You're the one who is saying this is just peachy keen and "that's on you". You're defending the harm.
  - xupybd 4y ago
    I feel for this guy. He worked on a product for 16 years. A lot goes into that and it becomes part of your identity. Then right at a time close to the loss of his mother it gets shutdown, with no warning. I'd be devastated. That said Elon is not doing this to anyone. He is not attacking anyone. He simply made a business decision. This happens all the time. Companies let suppliers go for financial reasons, they let staff go for similar reasons. People invest their lives into helping these businesses only to find they were let go for a few dollars. It sucks and it's can be super painful. Businesses mostly exist to make money and people should avoid investing their identity and loyalty into businesses as they probably won't reciprocate.
    - arrrg 4y ago
      This to me reads like an argument that we should nuke capitalism. (Which I’m not sure is a good ideas, even.) I mean, you are presenting something as inevitable, I just don’t understand why.
      - xupybd 4y ago
        No I love capitalism. It's just that we need to see business as business. You make relationships with people and put your trust and faith in people not in businesses. They're entities that can be bought and sold and exist purely to make a profit. They have their place and offer huge value to society but they are not people.
    - vajrabum 4y ago
      Just business doesn't usually lead to massive losses in an advertising revenue at an advertising business to the point Twitter is giving away ads. I'm not sure what it is but it's not just business. https://mashable.com/article/twitter-free-ads-to-advertisers-elon-musk https://mashable.com/article/twitter-free-ads-to-advertisers...
      - xupybd 4y ago
        Sure it does. Plenty of people purchase business and make choices that cause businesses to fail.
- aktenlage 4y ago
  Nah, you are defending something that is based on the right to own property (and do whatever you like with it), but may nevertheless be shitty behavior. Just because something is legal and the legal basis is important (in your opinion), doesn't necessarily mean it is ok behavior. E.g., being rude isn't forbidden, the freedom of speech is important, so is the right to express your personality. But lecturing the affected person about these rights may not be the best reaction when they have been insulted by someone. I think the main point to discuss is not the rights, but whether the owner of a company should act more responsible, even if he is within his rights. And that's also the point of the OP.
- Spooky23 4y ago
  Why? Turds like Musk don’t need defense from anything other than their own ego. Taking a poorly run site that had such a great influence in society and somehow running it even worse so that it loses its influence and revenue capability is breathtaking. It’s a lesson on how the modern hands off approach to corporate governance puts society at risk and is a lesson for limiting the rights of property owners.
- dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
  You seem to be suffering from Reductive Personality Disorder. Just because Musk has the power to do things like this doesn't absolve him from the absolute shittiness of his behaviour. He doesn't get a free ride because he's the owner, quite the opposite. People who wield power should act responsibly with it. Musk hasn't heard of the concept because he's so self absorbed and insecure he has no room for any sort of basic human empathy. Obnoxious people
pessimizer 4y ago
If you're referring to Twitter closing their API again, this tone is a bit hysterical.
nradov 4y ago
There hasn't been any damage. No one has been hurt. Calm down and stop being overly dramatic. Twitter is not a real place, it's just a social network. Anyone who doesn't like it is free to use other communication tools, or even build their own. And I'm not defending Elon Musk here. I don't care about him one way or another. This isn't an issue that rational, educated people should get agitated about.
- simonw 4y ago
  "Twitter is not a real place, it's just a social network" The idea that what happens on the internet is unimportant compared to what happens "in real life" hadn't made sense for over a decade now. The internet is real life.
  - cirgue 4y ago
    This is so utterly wrong it hurts. The internet is real life the same way that evening news is real life. It’s a self-referential funhouse mirror that’s useful exactly for understanding what people who post on the internet think, and “people who post on the internet” is a tiny, profoundly idiosyncratic group. Conflating their opinions with “real life” is a powerful solvent for rationality, empathy, and mental health.
    - simonw 4y ago
      Depending on demographics, including stage of life, many people talk to their real life friends online more than than they do in person.
- Spooky23 4y ago
  Twitter is how a failed game show host and real estate promoter became the president of the United States. It matters.
- Ensorceled 4y ago
  > There hasn't been any damage. No one has been hurt. Calm down and stop being overly dramatic. We are literally talking about a posting from the CEO of a company that has been essentially shutdown by this change. Other companies have also been placed in this predicament. People will probably lose jobs, at least, and these companies may go bankrupt.

I'm defending the right to own property, which is something really fundamental to the way we organize our society. ... and when you say "the people that were hurt"... If you leave your wallet on the street, it might be stolen and you might be hurt. I'm not blaming the victim; someone stealing your wallet is wrong even though you left it on the street. It's not your fault, I'm not blaming you, I blame the thief for the theft. On the other hand there's something that you could've done that would've avoided it - don't leave your wallet on the street.

Ensorceled 4y ago
> I'm defending the right to own property, which is something really fundamental to the way we organize our society. No one is trying to "steal" twitter in this thread, we are saying he used his "property rights" to unnecessarily hurt others. You're the one who is saying this is just peachy keen and "that's on you". You're defending the harm.
- xupybd 4y ago
  I feel for this guy. He worked on a product for 16 years. A lot goes into that and it becomes part of your identity. Then right at a time close to the loss of his mother it gets shutdown, with no warning. I'd be devastated. That said Elon is not doing this to anyone. He is not attacking anyone. He simply made a business decision. This happens all the time. Companies let suppliers go for financial reasons, they let staff go for similar reasons. People invest their lives into helping these businesses only to find they were let go for a few dollars. It sucks and it's can be super painful. Businesses mostly exist to make money and people should avoid investing their identity and loyalty into businesses as they probably won't reciprocate.
  - arrrg 4y ago
    This to me reads like an argument that we should nuke capitalism. (Which I’m not sure is a good ideas, even.) I mean, you are presenting something as inevitable, I just don’t understand why.
    - xupybd 4y ago
      No I love capitalism. It's just that we need to see business as business. You make relationships with people and put your trust and faith in people not in businesses. They're entities that can be bought and sold and exist purely to make a profit. They have their place and offer huge value to society but they are not people.
  - vajrabum 4y ago
    Just business doesn't usually lead to massive losses in an advertising revenue at an advertising business to the point Twitter is giving away ads. I'm not sure what it is but it's not just business. https://mashable.com/article/twitter-free-ads-to-advertisers-elon-musk https://mashable.com/article/twitter-free-ads-to-advertisers...
    - xupybd 4y ago
      Sure it does. Plenty of people purchase business and make choices that cause businesses to fail.
aktenlage 4y ago
Nah, you are defending something that is based on the right to own property (and do whatever you like with it), but may nevertheless be shitty behavior. Just because something is legal and the legal basis is important (in your opinion), doesn't necessarily mean it is ok behavior. E.g., being rude isn't forbidden, the freedom of speech is important, so is the right to express your personality. But lecturing the affected person about these rights may not be the best reaction when they have been insulted by someone. I think the main point to discuss is not the rights, but whether the owner of a company should act more responsible, even if he is within his rights. And that's also the point of the OP.
Spooky23 4y ago
Why? Turds like Musk don’t need defense from anything other than their own ego. Taking a poorly run site that had such a great influence in society and somehow running it even worse so that it loses its influence and revenue capability is breathtaking. It’s a lesson on how the modern hands off approach to corporate governance puts society at risk and is a lesson for limiting the rights of property owners.
dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
You seem to be suffering from Reductive Personality Disorder. Just because Musk has the power to do things like this doesn't absolve him from the absolute shittiness of his behaviour. He doesn't get a free ride because he's the owner, quite the opposite. People who wield power should act responsibly with it. Musk hasn't heard of the concept because he's so self absorbed and insecure he has no room for any sort of basic human empathy. Obnoxious people

pessimizer 4y ago

If you're referring to Twitter closing their API again, this tone is a bit hysterical.

nradov 4y ago

There hasn't been any damage. No one has been hurt. Calm down and stop being overly dramatic. Twitter is not a real place, it's just a social network. Anyone who doesn't like it is free to use other communication tools, or even build their own. And I'm not defending Elon Musk here. I don't care about him one way or another. This isn't an issue that rational, educated people should get agitated about.

simonw 4y ago
"Twitter is not a real place, it's just a social network" The idea that what happens on the internet is unimportant compared to what happens "in real life" hadn't made sense for over a decade now. The internet is real life.
- cirgue 4y ago
  This is so utterly wrong it hurts. The internet is real life the same way that evening news is real life. It’s a self-referential funhouse mirror that’s useful exactly for understanding what people who post on the internet think, and “people who post on the internet” is a tiny, profoundly idiosyncratic group. Conflating their opinions with “real life” is a powerful solvent for rationality, empathy, and mental health.
  - simonw 4y ago
    Depending on demographics, including stage of life, many people talk to their real life friends online more than than they do in person.
Spooky23 4y ago
Twitter is how a failed game show host and real estate promoter became the president of the United States. It matters.
Ensorceled 4y ago
> There hasn't been any damage. No one has been hurt. Calm down and stop being overly dramatic. We are literally talking about a posting from the CEO of a company that has been essentially shutdown by this change. Other companies have also been placed in this predicament. People will probably lose jobs, at least, and these companies may go bankrupt.