10 ms·

The case for flywheel storage in the Philippines

73 points by 1970-01-01 4y ago

fukawi2 4y ago
I got to tour the broadcast facility that transmits all the TV and Radio signals for Melbourne, AU. Part of their power infrastructure is a kinetic wheel - IIRC, 5 tons spinning constantly, that can put out 125kva for a few minutes - long enough for the backup generators to start up and take over. Damn impressive, and at least from a physics point of view, so simple too.
- bjornsing 4y ago
  You should see the flywheels at (the fusion energy research facility) JET. I haven’t, but they sound awe inspiring from the Wikipedia description. :)
- qbasic_forever 4y ago
  I toured a couple old (early 2000s era) data centers that had similar flywheel backup power systems. Apparently it was a giant pain in the ass in practice as they had to regularly test it was still working by flipping the whole DC over to it briefly, and it was quite a nerve-wracking "this cannot fail, we have no other backup" moment every time. The thing needed constant maintenance as it's a mechanical beast with heavy load on bearings and such that eventually fail. The whole thing was eventually scrapped and newer DCs are just pure battery backup (+diesel generator) as I understand.
  - gregoriol 4y ago
    Backup generators need maintenance and may fail to start too, switching to batteries may fail too, I don't see how one can really remove the "maintaining and testing systems" overall.
    - qbasic_forever 4y ago
      Yeah you can test those systems in isolation though. For the flywheel system it had to be tested under real production load, basically flipping the giant switch to take the whole DC off the grid power.
- timbit42 4y ago
  What is the name of the broadcast facility so I can search for this?
kerpotgh 4y ago
Doesn’t the average house use 30kwh per day. So you’d need one of these per 2-3 houses. At 5000 kg that doesn’t sound reasonable.
- nomel 4y ago
  I’ve read the article multiple times, just to be sure, and this seems to be correct. What are we missing? From the article: > The M32 system is a 5,000 kg, four-hour Kinetic Energy Storage System (KESS) flywheel technology. It can store 32 kWh of energy in a 2 ton steel rotor 32kWh of energy is 32kW for one hour, which is about the same energy as half a Model 3 battery. The allure must be the lack of degradation, giving good long term cost (chunks of steel are cheap). Could someone chime in?
  - einherjae 4y ago
    I think latency is where they truly shine, should be near instantaneously available, as opposed to generators or some batteries. So 32 kWh yes, but the hour part is more like a few minutes, at which point the Wattage can be a lot higher, and thus a decent bridging solution between grid and backup for somewhat large installations.
  - unwind 4y ago
    The article says that multiple wheels can be stacked in the same installation, to increase capacity.
    - nomel 4y ago
      Sure, but with something around one per 16 houses, that's a massive (tehe) installation.
- dmurray 4y ago
  The average American house has around 5000 kg of cars, so it doesn't seem that infeasible.
- dirkf 4y ago
0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
> The M32 system is a 5,000 kg, four-hour Kinetic Energy Storage System (KESS) flywheel technology. It can store 32 kWh of energy in a 2 ton steel rotor. Isn’t 32 kWh enough to power on the order of 2-3 homes?
- bertil 4y ago
  For a year and US home, 10 MWh yes. That’s also enough for a few seconds for 10k homes.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- dotancohen 4y ago
  For how long? One hour? Maybe American or European homes. When I'm not charging the Tesla my home rarely goes above 5 kW - only when I'm cooking with the electric oven and electric range. We don't use a television or very much heating or cooling. But I've seen homes that have a steady 10 kW load in the US - security systems, central AC, and way too many lights and televisions on were the big constant loads.
  - bonzini 4y ago
    What do you do with 5 kW if the oven and stove and car charger are off? I have 3.6 kW (16 A @ 230 V) for everything except cooking and heating (both of which are gas)... American energy use is really on another level.
    - dotancohen 4y ago
      The hot water heater might be on, that's I think 1800 W. We have a clothes washing machine and dishwasher as well, they both get up to 2kW each but only for a few minutes in the cycle. The built-in vacuum system I've never measured, but wouldn't surprise me if it's 1500 to 2000 W, though I don't even think it works right now. I suspect that the microwave oven is in the same power range - 1500 to 2000 W. There's a desktop computer that's sometimes on, it's probably good for 300 Watts with the LCD monitor. Add maybe a dozen light bulbs and phone chargers and a small fish tank pump and the refrigerator, it can get up above 5 kW at times and I sure above that if we're really running three or four appliances at once.
bertil 4y ago
Most of those announcements should explain more specifically which level of the storage curve their cover: * flywheels are great for sub-second up to a few minutes of correction and adjustments, as they can have enormous output and don’t suffer from degradation from usage; capacity is expensive, so using them for more than a few minutes isn’t economical; they spin down quite fast, depleting in the course of days or weeks, depending on the quality of the barring. * batteries (notably LFP) offer great potential for longer periods, up to a few hours: capacity is cheaper, and their output is good, but expensive to scale with power electronics; they don’t really deplete after a few months, so great to smooth out daily and weather pattern. * gravity (notably pumped hydro) is cheap for even more capacity but has limited opportunities, and it’s not nearly as fast to trigger as the other, so it’s better used to store capacity over one week. Evaporation is a problem, but cheaply fixable. They overlap a lot, so having systems work together, or only one isn’t impossible — but having that structure and quasi-ranking in mind really helps understand what is being discussed.
- chongli 4y ago
  gravity (notably pumped hydro) is cheap for even more capacity but has limited opportunities, and it’s not nearly as fast to trigger as the other, so it’s better used to store capacity over one week. Evaporation is a problem, but cheaply fixable. I wonder whatever happened to the earth piston idea I saw floated a bunch of years ago. It involved cutting a cylindrical piston in the earth and drilling beneath it at an angle. You then pump water down into the space beneath the piston, causing it to lift. To extract the stored energy you simply let the pressure provided by the piston force the water back out through a turbine. The main trick to getting it all to work is with the surfaces. You want the piston to be able to slide up and down smoothly without water infiltrating the earth or going around the side of the bore, so the whole thing needs to be sealed and smooth like an engine cylinder. The other trick is for your pumps, valves, and turbines to be able to operate reliably with huge water pressures. I haven’t heard about the idea in years so I have no idea how it went, though I would guess it didn’t pan out for some reason.
  - unilynx 4y ago
    It sounds like quite an engineering challenge and a lot of ground to excavate to store a significant amount of water. Geothermic energy and CO2 storage sound a lot more useful if you’re going to dig that much
mongol 4y ago
What are the failure modes of a large flywheel? Can it somehow fall off and break out, spinning like crazy and maiming people around?
- shrubble 4y ago
  Yes if it gets out of balance or somehow gets loose, you don't want to be within 1000 feet of it...
- meindnoch 4y ago
  “ SAN DIEGO – An 11,000 pound metal flywheel caused an explosion this summer that injured four people at the warehouse of a Poway technology firm, state officials said this week. The blast occurred June 10 at Quantum Energy Storage at 13350 Gregg St. The California Division of Occupational Safety and Health (Cal/OSHA) announced Wednesday it had fined Quantum $58,025 for 16 health and safety violations after determining the explosion was caused by an “out-of-control” 11,000 pound, seven-foot diameter metal flywheel. One worker suffered a broken ankle and three others had abrasions caused by flying debris. None of the injuries were life-threatening.” https://www.10news.com/news/11k-pound-flywheel-caused-poway-explosion https://www.10news.com/news/11k-pound-flywheel-caused-poway-...
- bjornsing 4y ago
  Yea it can. So I was a bit surprised the OP only discussed the risk of chemical fire (which is of course very low, since there are no chemicals).
moloch-hai 4y ago
Flywheels never seem to work out for storing more than a few seconds' power. The pictures here do not show them mounted underground or surrounded by earthen berms, which seems foolishly hazardous. The Philippines could store power much more economically by suspending weights from cable reels on a ship, lowering them to the sea floor to extract power. The key to economical operation is to share a big motor-generator and winch, protected from weather, along a single shaft with a long line of reels and weights coupled via clutches. This is akin to the similar scheme using a mineshaft, but is much more economically viable. Using separate weights, the winch can usefully be of much lower capacity than the mineshaft needs, so available off-the-shelf. The seabed is in many places deeper than common disused mineshafts, and there is plenty of it.
- closewith 4y ago
  > The key to economical operation is to share a big motor-generator and winch, protected from weather, along a single shaft with a long line of reels and weights coupled via clutches. With respect, placing machinery at sea and protecting it from weather are antithetical.
  - moloch-hai 4y ago
    Tell that to cruise-line passengers and offshore wind-turbine operators. The key is keeping parts necessarily exposed to weather simple and sturdy, and the touchy electro-mechanical stuff well housed. A physical shaft between them safely moves power in or out. We see the same dichotomy play out in wave-energy extraction systems, where wave action pumps air through a turbine. The air could easily be conducted via a culvert to a turbine onshore, safely indoors, and shared. But somehow people building those seem never think of it.
    - willyt 4y ago
      Convert semi submersible oil rigs, which are designed for deep water, to grid storage?
      - 4y ago
concordDance 4y ago
If people want to get educated on energy storage technologies and what use cases work for them then here's a good resource: https://www.pnnl.gov/sites/default/files/media/file/Final%20-%20ESGC%20Cost%20Performance%20Report%2012-11-2020.pdf https://www.pnnl.gov/sites/default/files/media/file/Final%20... If you prefer web to PDF: https://www.pnnl.gov/ESGC-cost-performance https://www.pnnl.gov/ESGC-cost-performance And if you just want a quick 2 table summary (INCLUDING flywheels!) look at pages 8 and 8 of this: https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/2019/07/f65/Storage%20Cost%20and%20Performance%20Characterization%20Report_Final.pdf https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/2019/07/f65/Stora...
idontwantthis 4y ago
Does anyone know what the bearings are like on these? Do they last 20 years or need to be replaced and they don’t count that?
- pg_bot 4y ago
  I've been doing some research on flywheel storage systems like this one. Most use magnetic bearings to reduce friction. They should last more than 20 years with permanent magnets.
pg_bot 4y ago
I've been taking a look at materials for creating a flywheel energy storage system and for the life of me I can't understand why people don't use basalt fibers as the material for the flywheel. It has similar properties to carbon fiber but is cheaper and heavier. Since the energy storage scales exponentially with speed but linearly with weight, it should make sense to optimize for materials with a high tensile strength. Basalt fiber is pretty easy to manufacture and there are tons of it all over the world.
- moloch-hai 4y ago
  Right, there is no advantage in maximizing rotational velocity. Flywheels are the best when you need to store only a few seconds' worth of power, and may need to store or retrieve it at a very high rate. Still, spinning spare "Starship" cans on the ends of a girder might be a good way to store solar energy on the moon, during the long night. Maybe the girder is made from basalt fiber.
- nelgaard 4y ago
  Energy storage does not scale exponentially with speed. Kinetic energy increases quadratically with the angular velocity.
throwawaaarrgh 4y ago
Talk to datacenters with flywheels. There's plenty of problems that make them mostly useless.
rootsudo 4y ago
All these comments about the tech but not the political stability and outlook of the country. Philippines has always been adapting new technology, but suffers failures on general governance that prevents them from really changing the country. Has there been recent success that solved the energy issue within the country? (I really don't know.) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bataan_Nuclear_Power_Plant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bataan_Nuclear_Power_Plant - Didn't work, built by a fault line, fully constructed, never powered the country. Much more political fallout - fun read. You can get tours of the place if you call the right number, which always changes and there is no voicemail or whatsapp/viber/facebook option available. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_the_Philippines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_the_Philippines Currently all deployments provides 1.6% of energy within the Philippines, but was built and foretasted to provide much more - https://www.doe.gov.ph/sites/default/files/pdf/energy_statistics/2021_power_statistics_01_summary.pdf https://www.doe.gov.ph/sites/default/files/pdf/energy_statis... (from wikipedia) There are also much more studies and reports that contain fully documented news articles and government press releases, that overestimated capacity during bid/build and actual provided energy. This is another example - https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3907028 https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3907028. I have nothing against the Philippines, nor am I filipino, but it is interesting to see a country continually promise, promote and market solutions that are somewhat forgotten when they come into fruition. Nonetheless, it will be interesting to see what happens with this solution. Some background information on the Philippines - it is the most expensive country in South East Asia, for electricity cost - https://ieefa.org/resources/philippine-energy-transition-building-robust-power-market https://ieefa.org/resources/philippine-energy-transition-bui... And I also find it quite humorous that the beer company, san miguel corp controls 30% energy transmission https://www.sanmiguel.com.ph/page/power-energy https://www.sanmiguel.com.ph/page/power-energy and continues to build coal power plants, which are mostly dependent on coal exports from China. I'm interested, because it seems like a comedy sketch when you put it all together. I'm not saying any other country is perfect, flawless with execution or never has problems but when I look at Philippines performance for South East Asia - they always appear dead last, by a huge margin - while Indonesia and Thailand seem to have proper governance and expands infrastructure services and more to help their population.

73 points by 1970-01-01 4y ago

I got to tour the broadcast facility that transmits all the TV and Radio signals for Melbourne, AU. Part of their power infrastructure is a kinetic wheel - IIRC, 5 tons spinning constantly, that can put out 125kva for a few minutes - long enough for the backup generators to start up and take over. Damn impressive, and at least from a physics point of view, so simple too.

bjornsing 4y ago
You should see the flywheels at (the fusion energy research facility) JET. I haven’t, but they sound awe inspiring from the Wikipedia description. :)
qbasic_forever 4y ago
I toured a couple old (early 2000s era) data centers that had similar flywheel backup power systems. Apparently it was a giant pain in the ass in practice as they had to regularly test it was still working by flipping the whole DC over to it briefly, and it was quite a nerve-wracking "this cannot fail, we have no other backup" moment every time. The thing needed constant maintenance as it's a mechanical beast with heavy load on bearings and such that eventually fail. The whole thing was eventually scrapped and newer DCs are just pure battery backup (+diesel generator) as I understand.
- gregoriol 4y ago
  Backup generators need maintenance and may fail to start too, switching to batteries may fail too, I don't see how one can really remove the "maintaining and testing systems" overall.
  - qbasic_forever 4y ago
    Yeah you can test those systems in isolation though. For the flywheel system it had to be tested under real production load, basically flipping the giant switch to take the whole DC off the grid power.
timbit42 4y ago
What is the name of the broadcast facility so I can search for this?

kerpotgh 4y ago

Doesn’t the average house use 30kwh per day. So you’d need one of these per 2-3 houses. At 5000 kg that doesn’t sound reasonable.

nomel 4y ago
I’ve read the article multiple times, just to be sure, and this seems to be correct. What are we missing? From the article: > The M32 system is a 5,000 kg, four-hour Kinetic Energy Storage System (KESS) flywheel technology. It can store 32 kWh of energy in a 2 ton steel rotor 32kWh of energy is 32kW for one hour, which is about the same energy as half a Model 3 battery. The allure must be the lack of degradation, giving good long term cost (chunks of steel are cheap). Could someone chime in?
- einherjae 4y ago
  I think latency is where they truly shine, should be near instantaneously available, as opposed to generators or some batteries. So 32 kWh yes, but the hour part is more like a few minutes, at which point the Wattage can be a lot higher, and thus a decent bridging solution between grid and backup for somewhat large installations.
- unwind 4y ago
  The article says that multiple wheels can be stacked in the same installation, to increase capacity.
  - nomel 4y ago
    Sure, but with something around one per 16 houses, that's a massive (tehe) installation.
dmurray 4y ago
The average American house has around 5000 kg of cars, so it doesn't seem that infeasible.
dirkf 4y ago

0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago

> The M32 system is a 5,000 kg, four-hour Kinetic Energy Storage System (KESS) flywheel technology. It can store 32 kWh of energy in a 2 ton steel rotor. Isn’t 32 kWh enough to power on the order of 2-3 homes?

bertil 4y ago
For a year and US home, 10 MWh yes. That’s also enough for a few seconds for 10k homes.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
dotancohen 4y ago
For how long? One hour? Maybe American or European homes. When I'm not charging the Tesla my home rarely goes above 5 kW - only when I'm cooking with the electric oven and electric range. We don't use a television or very much heating or cooling. But I've seen homes that have a steady 10 kW load in the US - security systems, central AC, and way too many lights and televisions on were the big constant loads.
- bonzini 4y ago
  What do you do with 5 kW if the oven and stove and car charger are off? I have 3.6 kW (16 A @ 230 V) for everything except cooking and heating (both of which are gas)... American energy use is really on another level.
  - dotancohen 4y ago
    The hot water heater might be on, that's I think 1800 W. We have a clothes washing machine and dishwasher as well, they both get up to 2kW each but only for a few minutes in the cycle. The built-in vacuum system I've never measured, but wouldn't surprise me if it's 1500 to 2000 W, though I don't even think it works right now. I suspect that the microwave oven is in the same power range - 1500 to 2000 W. There's a desktop computer that's sometimes on, it's probably good for 300 Watts with the LCD monitor. Add maybe a dozen light bulbs and phone chargers and a small fish tank pump and the refrigerator, it can get up above 5 kW at times and I sure above that if we're really running three or four appliances at once.

bertil 4y ago

Most of those announcements should explain more specifically which level of the storage curve their cover: * flywheels are great for sub-second up to a few minutes of correction and adjustments, as they can have enormous output and don’t suffer from degradation from usage; capacity is expensive, so using them for more than a few minutes isn’t economical; they spin down quite fast, depleting in the course of days or weeks, depending on the quality of the barring. * batteries (notably LFP) offer great potential for longer periods, up to a few hours: capacity is cheaper, and their output is good, but expensive to scale with power electronics; they don’t really deplete after a few months, so great to smooth out daily and weather pattern. * gravity (notably pumped hydro) is cheap for even more capacity but has limited opportunities, and it’s not nearly as fast to trigger as the other, so it’s better used to store capacity over one week. Evaporation is a problem, but cheaply fixable. They overlap a lot, so having systems work together, or only one isn’t impossible — but having that structure and quasi-ranking in mind really helps understand what is being discussed.

chongli 4y ago
gravity (notably pumped hydro) is cheap for even more capacity but has limited opportunities, and it’s not nearly as fast to trigger as the other, so it’s better used to store capacity over one week. Evaporation is a problem, but cheaply fixable. I wonder whatever happened to the earth piston idea I saw floated a bunch of years ago. It involved cutting a cylindrical piston in the earth and drilling beneath it at an angle. You then pump water down into the space beneath the piston, causing it to lift. To extract the stored energy you simply let the pressure provided by the piston force the water back out through a turbine. The main trick to getting it all to work is with the surfaces. You want the piston to be able to slide up and down smoothly without water infiltrating the earth or going around the side of the bore, so the whole thing needs to be sealed and smooth like an engine cylinder. The other trick is for your pumps, valves, and turbines to be able to operate reliably with huge water pressures. I haven’t heard about the idea in years so I have no idea how it went, though I would guess it didn’t pan out for some reason.
- unilynx 4y ago
  It sounds like quite an engineering challenge and a lot of ground to excavate to store a significant amount of water. Geothermic energy and CO2 storage sound a lot more useful if you’re going to dig that much

mongol 4y ago

What are the failure modes of a large flywheel? Can it somehow fall off and break out, spinning like crazy and maiming people around?

shrubble 4y ago
Yes if it gets out of balance or somehow gets loose, you don't want to be within 1000 feet of it...
meindnoch 4y ago
“ SAN DIEGO – An 11,000 pound metal flywheel caused an explosion this summer that injured four people at the warehouse of a Poway technology firm, state officials said this week. The blast occurred June 10 at Quantum Energy Storage at 13350 Gregg St. The California Division of Occupational Safety and Health (Cal/OSHA) announced Wednesday it had fined Quantum $58,025 for 16 health and safety violations after determining the explosion was caused by an “out-of-control” 11,000 pound, seven-foot diameter metal flywheel. One worker suffered a broken ankle and three others had abrasions caused by flying debris. None of the injuries were life-threatening.” https://www.10news.com/news/11k-pound-flywheel-caused-poway-explosion https://www.10news.com/news/11k-pound-flywheel-caused-poway-...
bjornsing 4y ago
Yea it can. So I was a bit surprised the OP only discussed the risk of chemical fire (which is of course very low, since there are no chemicals).

moloch-hai 4y ago

Flywheels never seem to work out for storing more than a few seconds' power. The pictures here do not show them mounted underground or surrounded by earthen berms, which seems foolishly hazardous. The Philippines could store power much more economically by suspending weights from cable reels on a ship, lowering them to the sea floor to extract power. The key to economical operation is to share a big motor-generator and winch, protected from weather, along a single shaft with a long line of reels and weights coupled via clutches. This is akin to the similar scheme using a mineshaft, but is much more economically viable. Using separate weights, the winch can usefully be of much lower capacity than the mineshaft needs, so available off-the-shelf. The seabed is in many places deeper than common disused mineshafts, and there is plenty of it.

closewith 4y ago
> The key to economical operation is to share a big motor-generator and winch, protected from weather, along a single shaft with a long line of reels and weights coupled via clutches. With respect, placing machinery at sea and protecting it from weather are antithetical.
- moloch-hai 4y ago
  Tell that to cruise-line passengers and offshore wind-turbine operators. The key is keeping parts necessarily exposed to weather simple and sturdy, and the touchy electro-mechanical stuff well housed. A physical shaft between them safely moves power in or out. We see the same dichotomy play out in wave-energy extraction systems, where wave action pumps air through a turbine. The air could easily be conducted via a culvert to a turbine onshore, safely indoors, and shared. But somehow people building those seem never think of it.
  - willyt 4y ago
    Convert semi submersible oil rigs, which are designed for deep water, to grid storage?
    - 4y ago

concordDance 4y ago

If people want to get educated on energy storage technologies and what use cases work for them then here's a good resource: https://www.pnnl.gov/sites/default/files/media/file/Final%20-%20ESGC%20Cost%20Performance%20Report%2012-11-2020.pdf https://www.pnnl.gov/sites/default/files/media/file/Final%20... If you prefer web to PDF: https://www.pnnl.gov/ESGC-cost-performance https://www.pnnl.gov/ESGC-cost-performance And if you just want a quick 2 table summary (INCLUDING flywheels!) look at pages 8 and 8 of this: https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/2019/07/f65/Storage%20Cost%20and%20Performance%20Characterization%20Report_Final.pdf https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/2019/07/f65/Stora...

idontwantthis 4y ago

Does anyone know what the bearings are like on these? Do they last 20 years or need to be replaced and they don’t count that?

pg_bot 4y ago
I've been doing some research on flywheel storage systems like this one. Most use magnetic bearings to reduce friction. They should last more than 20 years with permanent magnets.

pg_bot 4y ago

I've been taking a look at materials for creating a flywheel energy storage system and for the life of me I can't understand why people don't use basalt fibers as the material for the flywheel. It has similar properties to carbon fiber but is cheaper and heavier. Since the energy storage scales exponentially with speed but linearly with weight, it should make sense to optimize for materials with a high tensile strength. Basalt fiber is pretty easy to manufacture and there are tons of it all over the world.

moloch-hai 4y ago
Right, there is no advantage in maximizing rotational velocity. Flywheels are the best when you need to store only a few seconds' worth of power, and may need to store or retrieve it at a very high rate. Still, spinning spare "Starship" cans on the ends of a girder might be a good way to store solar energy on the moon, during the long night. Maybe the girder is made from basalt fiber.
nelgaard 4y ago
Energy storage does not scale exponentially with speed. Kinetic energy increases quadratically with the angular velocity.

throwawaaarrgh 4y ago

Talk to datacenters with flywheels. There's plenty of problems that make them mostly useless.

rootsudo 4y ago

All these comments about the tech but not the political stability and outlook of the country. Philippines has always been adapting new technology, but suffers failures on general governance that prevents them from really changing the country. Has there been recent success that solved the energy issue within the country? (I really don't know.) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bataan_Nuclear_Power_Plant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bataan_Nuclear_Power_Plant - Didn't work, built by a fault line, fully constructed, never powered the country. Much more political fallout - fun read. You can get tours of the place if you call the right number, which always changes and there is no voicemail or whatsapp/viber/facebook option available. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_the_Philippines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_the_Philippines Currently all deployments provides 1.6% of energy within the Philippines, but was built and foretasted to provide much more - https://www.doe.gov.ph/sites/default/files/pdf/energy_statistics/2021_power_statistics_01_summary.pdf https://www.doe.gov.ph/sites/default/files/pdf/energy_statis... (from wikipedia) There are also much more studies and reports that contain fully documented news articles and government press releases, that overestimated capacity during bid/build and actual provided energy. This is another example - https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3907028 https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3907028. I have nothing against the Philippines, nor am I filipino, but it is interesting to see a country continually promise, promote and market solutions that are somewhat forgotten when they come into fruition. Nonetheless, it will be interesting to see what happens with this solution. Some background information on the Philippines - it is the most expensive country in South East Asia, for electricity cost - https://ieefa.org/resources/philippine-energy-transition-building-robust-power-market https://ieefa.org/resources/philippine-energy-transition-bui... And I also find it quite humorous that the beer company, san miguel corp controls 30% energy transmission https://www.sanmiguel.com.ph/page/power-energy https://www.sanmiguel.com.ph/page/power-energy and continues to build coal power plants, which are mostly dependent on coal exports from China. I'm interested, because it seems like a comedy sketch when you put it all together. I'm not saying any other country is perfect, flawless with execution or never has problems but when I look at Philippines performance for South East Asia - they always appear dead last, by a huge margin - while Indonesia and Thailand seem to have proper governance and expands infrastructure services and more to help their population.