4 ms·

The technology already existed with the JVM, .Net, Flash, Silverlight, etc. It would just be a different runtime than the browser. Mobile app stores are that.

wahnfrieden 4y ago
iow proprietary fiefdoms
- rektide 4y ago
  And it's entirely unclear what any of these non-view-source minimal-user-agency alternatives has that's actually improved over what the web can do. There's no contentions about what about these alternatives would be an improvement, or to whom it would be an improvement. Most of these architectures could probably be recreated on the web, if we cared to, if we thought they provided sufficient advantage. Projects like swf2js are surprisingly competent at playing Flash. But it's... just not a better medium, for users, for extension builders, or for developers. It did have some good tooling for creatives at least, but there are plenty of really good modern web tools with similar capabilities, they're just not as popular, not as important anymore, I'd argue because Flash was actually a pretty crude & raw interface builder that lacked much of the refinement, navigability, control, & capabilities we now take for granted.
  - goatlover 4y ago
    What do you have in mind that beats Flash as an SVG animation development platform?
  - dmitriid 4y ago
    > It did have some good tooling for creatives at least, but there are plenty of really good modern web tools with similar capabilities There really aren't. Because the web can't even do animations properly. And Flash had a faster vector rendering model than SVG. > I'd argue because Flash was actually a pretty crude & raw interface builder that lacked much of the refinement, navigability, control, & capabilities we now take for granted. Ah yes, the refinement, navigability, control and capabilities of... what exactly do we take for granted? Where are these amazing tools that replaced flash and can be used for creatives, games, interactions...
still_grokking 4y ago
Even Flash was much more sane for application development than HTML / JS. But as always, the cheapest "solution" won.
- jakelazaroff 4y ago
  Let’s say you’re blind. How do you use a Flash application with a screen reader?
  - wmf 4y ago
    It was apparently possible, although 15 years late. http://maccessibility.net/2010/03/24/adobe-announces-flash-and-flex-accessibility-for-mac http://maccessibility.net/2010/03/24/adobe-announces-flash-a...
  - still_grokking 4y ago
    https://help.adobe.com/en_US/FlashPlatform/reference/actionscript/3/flash/accessibility/package-detail.html https://help.adobe.com/en_US/FlashPlatform/reference/actions... https://web.archive.org/web/20170617075857/http://www.adobe.com/accessibility/products/flash.html https://web.archive.org/web/20170617075857/http://www.adobe....
  - pjmlp 4y ago
    We are getting there again with WebGL and WASM.

wahnfrieden 4y ago

iow proprietary fiefdoms

rektide 4y ago
And it's entirely unclear what any of these non-view-source minimal-user-agency alternatives has that's actually improved over what the web can do. There's no contentions about what about these alternatives would be an improvement, or to whom it would be an improvement. Most of these architectures could probably be recreated on the web, if we cared to, if we thought they provided sufficient advantage. Projects like swf2js are surprisingly competent at playing Flash. But it's... just not a better medium, for users, for extension builders, or for developers. It did have some good tooling for creatives at least, but there are plenty of really good modern web tools with similar capabilities, they're just not as popular, not as important anymore, I'd argue because Flash was actually a pretty crude & raw interface builder that lacked much of the refinement, navigability, control, & capabilities we now take for granted.
- goatlover 4y ago
  What do you have in mind that beats Flash as an SVG animation development platform?
- dmitriid 4y ago
  > It did have some good tooling for creatives at least, but there are plenty of really good modern web tools with similar capabilities There really aren't. Because the web can't even do animations properly. And Flash had a faster vector rendering model than SVG. > I'd argue because Flash was actually a pretty crude & raw interface builder that lacked much of the refinement, navigability, control, & capabilities we now take for granted. Ah yes, the refinement, navigability, control and capabilities of... what exactly do we take for granted? Where are these amazing tools that replaced flash and can be used for creatives, games, interactions...

still_grokking 4y ago

Even Flash was much more sane for application development than HTML / JS. But as always, the cheapest "solution" won.

jakelazaroff 4y ago
Let’s say you’re blind. How do you use a Flash application with a screen reader?
- wmf 4y ago
  It was apparently possible, although 15 years late. http://maccessibility.net/2010/03/24/adobe-announces-flash-and-flex-accessibility-for-mac http://maccessibility.net/2010/03/24/adobe-announces-flash-a...
- still_grokking 4y ago
  https://help.adobe.com/en_US/FlashPlatform/reference/actionscript/3/flash/accessibility/package-detail.html https://help.adobe.com/en_US/FlashPlatform/reference/actions... https://web.archive.org/web/20170617075857/http://www.adobe.com/accessibility/products/flash.html https://web.archive.org/web/20170617075857/http://www.adobe....
- pjmlp 4y ago
  We are getting there again with WebGL and WASM.