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How is this deceptive? Anyone who has ever charged a phone is probably familiar with the concept that a higher wattage charger provides faster charging speeds -

by giobox 4y ago

How is this deceptive? Anyone who has ever charged a phone is probably familiar with the concept that a higher wattage charger provides faster charging speeds - electric cars are no different. Higher power chargers charge faster is not some secret. The car simply states the fastest DC connection it supports - 350kw. It works with any charger up to this wattage, just like my laptop charges from any USB-C source up to 100w - was I missold my laptop too because if I use a 50w charger it only charges at 50w? EVs must charge from a huge range of different wattage chargers - I regularly switch between 7kw, 11kw, 50kw and 250 depending on the spec of the power source. The power you get is determined entirely by the DC plug you use (and to some degree state of charge, but lets not complicate this further...) - the car has no bearing on this beyond supporting up to 350kw in this example. The car can't magically make a 50kw charger output 350kw, as nice as this might be.

jefftk 4y ago
The specs say: [1] DC Fast Charge Time (10-80% @ 350 kW via Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment) Level 3 Charger: Approx. 18 min. and Drive Battery Energy: 77.4 kWh The battery is 77.4 kWh. This implies the battery is charging at 180kW. If it were taking in the full 350kW and losing 170kW as heat that would be one (inefficient and dangerous) thing, but it doesn't sound like it actually draws 350kW? For comparison, they say 73min for charging at 50kW, which implies the battery is charging at 45kW. If we figure that same 10% loss, then to charge at 180kW it's probably drawing 200kW from the charger. [1] https://www.kia.com/us/en/ev6/specs https://www.kia.com/us/en/ev6/specs [2] 70% * 77.4 kWh * (60min / 1h) / 18 min = 181 kW
- giobox 4y ago
  As battery charges its pretty common to taper the charge rate to improve health of the battery. To my knowledge, no EV today will sit at 350kw for the full 10 to 80 percent even if it can draw this. You still get faster charge times as the full draw can usually happen at close to empty, but charge rate will taper as battery fills. 181kw average is still pretty great - there are many EVs on sale that still max draw at 50 (looking at you VW...).
  - jefftk 4y ago
    If the peak current draw were 350kW then I'd agree the specs were fine. I'd thought they were advertising a 10% to 80% charge because that's the period over which they can charge at max speed? Looking now, it seems like they start tapering at 50%, and it's peak draw is 235kW? https://www.arenaev.com/kia_ev6_crowned_the_best_charging_ev_in_the_latest_p3_charge_index-news-495.php https://www.arenaev.com/kia_ev6_crowned_the_best_charging_ev... (I agree this is very good, but it's still wrong to quote 350kW if they never draw this much.)
freejazz 4y ago
"Anyone who has ever charged a phone is probably familiar with the concept that a higher wattage" I assure you that my mother has no idea what a watt is.

by giobox 4y ago

jefftk 4y ago

The specs say: [1] DC Fast Charge Time (10-80% @ 350 kW via Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment) Level 3 Charger: Approx. 18 min. and Drive Battery Energy: 77.4 kWh The battery is 77.4 kWh. This implies the battery is charging at 180kW. If it were taking in the full 350kW and losing 170kW as heat that would be one (inefficient and dangerous) thing, but it doesn't sound like it actually draws 350kW? For comparison, they say 73min for charging at 50kW, which implies the battery is charging at 45kW. If we figure that same 10% loss, then to charge at 180kW it's probably drawing 200kW from the charger. [1] https://www.kia.com/us/en/ev6/specs https://www.kia.com/us/en/ev6/specs [2] 70% * 77.4 kWh * (60min / 1h) / 18 min = 181 kW

giobox 4y ago
As battery charges its pretty common to taper the charge rate to improve health of the battery. To my knowledge, no EV today will sit at 350kw for the full 10 to 80 percent even if it can draw this. You still get faster charge times as the full draw can usually happen at close to empty, but charge rate will taper as battery fills. 181kw average is still pretty great - there are many EVs on sale that still max draw at 50 (looking at you VW...).
- jefftk 4y ago
  If the peak current draw were 350kW then I'd agree the specs were fine. I'd thought they were advertising a 10% to 80% charge because that's the period over which they can charge at max speed? Looking now, it seems like they start tapering at 50%, and it's peak draw is 235kW? https://www.arenaev.com/kia_ev6_crowned_the_best_charging_ev_in_the_latest_p3_charge_index-news-495.php https://www.arenaev.com/kia_ev6_crowned_the_best_charging_ev... (I agree this is very good, but it's still wrong to quote 350kW if they never draw this much.)

freejazz 4y ago

"Anyone who has ever charged a phone is probably familiar with the concept that a higher wattage" I assure you that my mother has no idea what a watt is.