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CostCo sells several brands, but in particular Sony, that they have arranged to ensure that these TVs are fully functional when you decline the T&Cs and never c

CostCo sells several brands, but in particular Sony, that they have arranged to ensure that these TVs are fully functional when you decline the T&Cs and never connect it to the Internet. It is the only reason I currently own a "smart" TV, is because I could be reasonable certain that this was controllable. Otherwise, I'd probably only use projectors right now because these are still commonly purchaseable at consumer pricing without "smart" features that are unskippable.

kmbfjr 4y ago
They’re not fully functional in the case of Sony. Without internet there is no guide data for off-air TV even though it is not only part of the ATSC stream, Sony is decoding it. I know this because the pop up menu for the channel line has the name and time of the program being watched. That had to come off air if the internet is disabled. Declining everything and setting up the TV as “basic” still has the underlying Google TV OS reaching out to the Play store, Android update, plus something in the Google IP block in China. Yes, China. And three net blocks from Microsoft. Carefully selecting and permitting only the AWS Cloudfront net block will restore guide data, but it will cause the Google TV OS to howl loudly about no internet access. Allowing it to hit www.google.com shuts most of it up, but I will be poking at the OS to find out what needs to be shut off. Developer mode is available. Sony is not using anything to report what the user is watching, network traffic is non-existent when viewing something on HDMI inputs. This was not a cheap TV, Sony promised they would honor my requests not to be monetized, but my need for their guide data suggests otherwise (PSIP is not entirely broken, just slow). That doesn’t matter, Google is there to pick up the slack on the over the shoulder browsing. It will be relegated to HDMI use only, just like the Samsung it replaced.
- tristor 4y ago
  I was unaware of this, as I haven't had "TV" service in more than a decade. In basic mode, connected to HDMI, it allows for all display features. Good information, and a good thing for folks to consider if they intend to actually use TV directly.
- mikewarot 4y ago
  >Declining everything and setting up the TV as “basic” still has the underlying Google TV OS reaching out How? If you don't give it access to your WiFi, how does it make an IP connection?
  - KirillPanov 4y ago
    > If you don't give it access to your WiFi, how does it make an IP connection? 5G.
    - gaadd33 4y ago
      TV's have 5g modems and activated sim cards in them? Has anyone taken one apart and tested if the sim card could be used elsewhere? Seems like a great target for people who want free internet access.
pessimizer 4y ago
> CostCo sells several brands, but in particular Sony, that they have arranged to ensure that these TVs are fully functional when you decline the T&Cs and never connect it to the Internet. Do you have a reference for this? I guarantee that it would be interesting for people.
- squarefoot 4y ago
  > I guarantee that it would be interesting for people. I second that. Will need a new TV soon and before buying a much more expensive signage display I would consider a SmartTV that would work as "dumb" screen without complaining, or worse, forcing me to connect it to the Internet.
- tristor 4y ago
  I had seen it on Hacker News in the past, and so I ended up buying a Sony A80CJ 65". The CJ vs the J is that the CJ is the CostCo model. It has three differences, as far as I am aware: 1. CostCo models have 3-year manufacturer warranty instead of 1 year. (mine bundled coverage through AllState to make it 5 years warranty total) 2. CostCo models have a physical switch for the built-in microphone (used for Google Assistant, Alexa, and tuning audio for the built-in speakers) to turn it off. Mine is turned off and left off out of the box. [2] 3. In the fine print on superscript 2 in the spec sheet[1]: "Use of TV without connecting to a Google account allows only basic TV features and certain apps." So #3 there, basically means if you don't accept the T&Cs and connect the TV to the Internet it acts like a dumb display with just support for HDMI, etc inputs. I am using mine with an Xbox Series X connected to it and that's how I watch Netflix, as an example, or play games with Game Pass. The TV itself has never had an Internet connection, and all /display/ features work perfectly fine, it just doesn't do anything "smart" in basic mode. In basic mode it basically reverts to a dumb TV. It also doesn't nag you after you make a choice. This differs from the non-CostCo models, which in some instances /force/ you to connect to the Internet and accept the T&Cs within some time frame in order to be useable. As far as I am aware, CostCo has agreements with most manufacturers to produce CostCo specific SKUs and always enforces points #2 and #3 for these TVs. It's the primary reason I bought my TV through CostCo. [1]: https://mobilecontent.costco.com/live/resource/img/static-us-pdf/9865080-847_Spec_Sheet.pdf https://mobilecontent.costco.com/live/resource/img/static-us... [2]: https://www.avsforum.com/threads/what-is-the-difference-between-sony-a80j-vs-a80cj.3221611/ https://www.avsforum.com/threads/what-is-the-difference-betw...
zmk5 4y ago
I'm very interested in this too. Is there information on their website that specifies which Sony televisions allow this?
mvexel 4y ago
The 55" LG I purchased at Costco for less than $400 a couple of years ago works great and I've never connected it to the internet. [edit] looked it up, it's this one: https://www.lg.com/us/tvs/lg-55UM7300AUE-4k-uhd-tv https://www.lg.com/us/tvs/lg-55UM7300AUE-4k-uhd-tv Of course, who knows if they've since updated the OS and make it impossible to use without establishing a network connection..
- joombaga 4y ago
  I have a C1 from a few years ago and a C2 from a few months ago, and they both work perfectly offline.
  - tw98521358 4y ago
    C1 owner never internet
    - entropicgravity 4y ago
      I too have a LG C1 55" from Costco but it did have a few nag screens to connect to the internet during setup. I ignored those and eventually an image appeared on HDMI 1 but the process wasn't really clear. That's my recollection.

kmbfjr 4y ago

They’re not fully functional in the case of Sony. Without internet there is no guide data for off-air TV even though it is not only part of the ATSC stream, Sony is decoding it. I know this because the pop up menu for the channel line has the name and time of the program being watched. That had to come off air if the internet is disabled. Declining everything and setting up the TV as “basic” still has the underlying Google TV OS reaching out to the Play store, Android update, plus something in the Google IP block in China. Yes, China. And three net blocks from Microsoft. Carefully selecting and permitting only the AWS Cloudfront net block will restore guide data, but it will cause the Google TV OS to howl loudly about no internet access. Allowing it to hit www.google.com shuts most of it up, but I will be poking at the OS to find out what needs to be shut off. Developer mode is available. Sony is not using anything to report what the user is watching, network traffic is non-existent when viewing something on HDMI inputs. This was not a cheap TV, Sony promised they would honor my requests not to be monetized, but my need for their guide data suggests otherwise (PSIP is not entirely broken, just slow). That doesn’t matter, Google is there to pick up the slack on the over the shoulder browsing. It will be relegated to HDMI use only, just like the Samsung it replaced.

tristor 4y ago
I was unaware of this, as I haven't had "TV" service in more than a decade. In basic mode, connected to HDMI, it allows for all display features. Good information, and a good thing for folks to consider if they intend to actually use TV directly.
mikewarot 4y ago
>Declining everything and setting up the TV as “basic” still has the underlying Google TV OS reaching out How? If you don't give it access to your WiFi, how does it make an IP connection?
- KirillPanov 4y ago
  > If you don't give it access to your WiFi, how does it make an IP connection? 5G.
  - gaadd33 4y ago
    TV's have 5g modems and activated sim cards in them? Has anyone taken one apart and tested if the sim card could be used elsewhere? Seems like a great target for people who want free internet access.

pessimizer 4y ago

> CostCo sells several brands, but in particular Sony, that they have arranged to ensure that these TVs are fully functional when you decline the T&Cs and never connect it to the Internet. Do you have a reference for this? I guarantee that it would be interesting for people.

squarefoot 4y ago
> I guarantee that it would be interesting for people. I second that. Will need a new TV soon and before buying a much more expensive signage display I would consider a SmartTV that would work as "dumb" screen without complaining, or worse, forcing me to connect it to the Internet.
tristor 4y ago
I had seen it on Hacker News in the past, and so I ended up buying a Sony A80CJ 65". The CJ vs the J is that the CJ is the CostCo model. It has three differences, as far as I am aware: 1. CostCo models have 3-year manufacturer warranty instead of 1 year. (mine bundled coverage through AllState to make it 5 years warranty total) 2. CostCo models have a physical switch for the built-in microphone (used for Google Assistant, Alexa, and tuning audio for the built-in speakers) to turn it off. Mine is turned off and left off out of the box. [2] 3. In the fine print on superscript 2 in the spec sheet[1]: "Use of TV without connecting to a Google account allows only basic TV features and certain apps." So #3 there, basically means if you don't accept the T&Cs and connect the TV to the Internet it acts like a dumb display with just support for HDMI, etc inputs. I am using mine with an Xbox Series X connected to it and that's how I watch Netflix, as an example, or play games with Game Pass. The TV itself has never had an Internet connection, and all /display/ features work perfectly fine, it just doesn't do anything "smart" in basic mode. In basic mode it basically reverts to a dumb TV. It also doesn't nag you after you make a choice. This differs from the non-CostCo models, which in some instances /force/ you to connect to the Internet and accept the T&Cs within some time frame in order to be useable. As far as I am aware, CostCo has agreements with most manufacturers to produce CostCo specific SKUs and always enforces points #2 and #3 for these TVs. It's the primary reason I bought my TV through CostCo. [1]: https://mobilecontent.costco.com/live/resource/img/static-us-pdf/9865080-847_Spec_Sheet.pdf https://mobilecontent.costco.com/live/resource/img/static-us... [2]: https://www.avsforum.com/threads/what-is-the-difference-between-sony-a80j-vs-a80cj.3221611/ https://www.avsforum.com/threads/what-is-the-difference-betw...

zmk5 4y ago

I'm very interested in this too. Is there information on their website that specifies which Sony televisions allow this?

mvexel 4y ago

The 55" LG I purchased at Costco for less than $400 a couple of years ago works great and I've never connected it to the internet. [edit] looked it up, it's this one: https://www.lg.com/us/tvs/lg-55UM7300AUE-4k-uhd-tv https://www.lg.com/us/tvs/lg-55UM7300AUE-4k-uhd-tv Of course, who knows if they've since updated the OS and make it impossible to use without establishing a network connection..

joombaga 4y ago
I have a C1 from a few years ago and a C2 from a few months ago, and they both work perfectly offline.
- tw98521358 4y ago
  C1 owner never internet
  - entropicgravity 4y ago
    I too have a LG C1 55" from Costco but it did have a few nag screens to connect to the internet during setup. I ignored those and eventually an image appeared on HDMI 1 but the process wasn't really clear. That's my recollection.