12 ms·

German Bundestag Passes Whistleblower Protection Act

220 points by donutloop 4y ago

sschueller 4y ago
"However, the original responsibility for following up and remedying the identified violation remains with the respective company." I don't see how this works if it is usually companies that are corrupt to the top that have stuff that the public should know. Just look at Boeing, there were countless internal issues raised about the corner cutting and it was just ignored over and over. Won't this also allow a company to internally fix the issues and then sweep it under the rug?
- fsw 4y ago
  I don't think that's very clear in the article. The law allows companies to provide incentives for internal reports but the employee/reporter is the one who can chose to do an internal and an external report. > Personen, die beabsichtigen, Informationen über einen Verstoß zu melden, können wählen, ob sie sich an eine interne Meldestelle (§ 12) oder eine externe Meldestelle (§§ 19 bis 24) wenden. Wenn einem intern gemeldeten Verstoß nicht abgeholfen wurde, bleibt es der hinweisgebenden Person unbenommen, sich an eine externe Meldestelle zu wenden. DeepL translation: > Persons intending to report information about a violation may choose whether to contact an internal reporting office (Section 12) or an external reporting office (Sections 19 to 24). If an internally reported violation has not been remedied, the whistleblower is free to contact an external reporting office.
  - sschueller 4y ago
    Thanks, the article made it sound like you have to use internal channels but the line "können wählen, ob sie sich an eine interne Meldestelle (§ 12) oder eine externe Meldestelle (§§ 19 bis 24) wenden." indicates you can do either internal or external report.
LatteLazy 4y ago
Welcome as this is, I think the US is way ahead of most countries because it guarantees whistleblowers a share of the resulting fines etc.
- yieldcrv 4y ago
  I only know of this in securities violations and maybe one aspect of the medical field? Can you elaborate most? Most employees and stakeholders are just lucky if they aren't ostracized from their field forever.
  - Nasrudith 4y ago
    All I can contribute is that there is also a tax evasion/tax fraud bounty with the IRS.
  - KirillPanov 4y ago
    Securities fraud and tax fraud. I think it only applies to those two limited areas.
- hutzlibu 4y ago
  This is news to me, are there famous examples? Otherwise I am not sure, if money is the solution to everything, as it could create incentive to create problems or make them worse, only to eventually receive a bigger part of the fines.
  - djcannabiz 4y ago
    I know there is a program in the SEC that gives whistleblowers a cut of the fines https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-151 https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-151 one example: https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-211 https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-211
  - barbazoo 4y ago
    Good point!!!
  - 4y ago
berry_sortoro 4y ago
[dead]
lizardactivist 4y ago
Idea: extend the act to provide full protection for US Americans who expose espionage, sabotage (and possibly worse things) carried out in EU countries.
- colonwqbang 4y ago
  I don't follow. Why would an EU country punish a US citizen for reporting espionage/sabotage directed against the EU country? Or do you mean something else?
  - dividedbyzero 4y ago
    They would need guaranteed non-extradition and possibly a lot of protection so they don't get abducted by the US, but that sort of legislation would never sail under the current German government.
    - zirgs 4y ago
      It's only possible to extradite people if they did something that's a crime in both countries.
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - dividedbyzero 4y ago
        Treason is a crime in Germany, too, and whether the result is politically opportune for Germany couldn't officially play a role in front of a Oberlandesgericht court when ruling on an extradition request by the US. Disclosure of spy activities certainly would be a crime if committed in Germany against Germany, so extradition for such a whistleblower would have to be stopped at the political level, which is possible, but that's not something I would want to depend on. The US could exert a lot of very painful pressure on a German government, and as the Snowden affair shows, broad public support is far from given. Might be easier to weather the scandal from giving in than the consequences of sticking to principles.
POPOSYS 4y ago
Why not go to the original source, this is what the internet was made for! https://www.bundestag.de/dokumente/textarchiv/2022/kw50-de-hinweisgeber-926806 https://www.bundestag.de/dokumente/textarchiv/2022/kw50-de-h... Hope you can help yourself with translate services.
graderjs 4y ago
Honestly sort of depressing how everything follows US policy: NDAA contained whistleblower-protection language--and we have to be proud of it. Couldn't other "western liberal democracies" just initiate their own policy initiatives--sounds like I'm denigrating US--I'm not--but couldn't other countries initiate their own first, why have to wait and play second fiddle? Always like this. US passes some law, then you see, like the dominoes fall elsewhere--depressing as it gives the impression they were too scared to pass before US...ugh. Progress controlled from one source is not diverse enough to succeed. We need more :)
- Darge 4y ago
  Can you provide more examples of the EU following US? I think there are plenty of examples of the opposite: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brussels_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brussels_effect
  - graderjs 4y ago
    It's a feeling built up over years, from a gestalt experience... I wasn't keeping notes. I don't know...some places I might look to research that further are: copyright law / DMCA, encryption law and export regulation, COVID policies, country / company blacklists, crypto law -- but without finding all the little moments in my past where I saw such and such a news happen in USA, then later on such and such similar legislation / policy happen in EU, in East Asian democracies, in Indo Pacific...I couldn't provide you who is exactly on that list for sure. Just a feeling it's there tho. I'm sure it seems probably not very convincing to you...that's OK, you have your own experience and memory. This is mine. Thanks for the link. Interesting. Cross-pollination maybe? :) Have a good one!

220 points by donutloop 4y ago

"However, the original responsibility for following up and remedying the identified violation remains with the respective company." I don't see how this works if it is usually companies that are corrupt to the top that have stuff that the public should know. Just look at Boeing, there were countless internal issues raised about the corner cutting and it was just ignored over and over. Won't this also allow a company to internally fix the issues and then sweep it under the rug?

fsw 4y ago
I don't think that's very clear in the article. The law allows companies to provide incentives for internal reports but the employee/reporter is the one who can chose to do an internal and an external report. > Personen, die beabsichtigen, Informationen über einen Verstoß zu melden, können wählen, ob sie sich an eine interne Meldestelle (§ 12) oder eine externe Meldestelle (§§ 19 bis 24) wenden. Wenn einem intern gemeldeten Verstoß nicht abgeholfen wurde, bleibt es der hinweisgebenden Person unbenommen, sich an eine externe Meldestelle zu wenden. DeepL translation: > Persons intending to report information about a violation may choose whether to contact an internal reporting office (Section 12) or an external reporting office (Sections 19 to 24). If an internally reported violation has not been remedied, the whistleblower is free to contact an external reporting office.
- sschueller 4y ago
  Thanks, the article made it sound like you have to use internal channels but the line "können wählen, ob sie sich an eine interne Meldestelle (§ 12) oder eine externe Meldestelle (§§ 19 bis 24) wenden." indicates you can do either internal or external report.

LatteLazy 4y ago

Welcome as this is, I think the US is way ahead of most countries because it guarantees whistleblowers a share of the resulting fines etc.

yieldcrv 4y ago
I only know of this in securities violations and maybe one aspect of the medical field? Can you elaborate most? Most employees and stakeholders are just lucky if they aren't ostracized from their field forever.
- Nasrudith 4y ago
  All I can contribute is that there is also a tax evasion/tax fraud bounty with the IRS.
- KirillPanov 4y ago
  Securities fraud and tax fraud. I think it only applies to those two limited areas.
hutzlibu 4y ago
This is news to me, are there famous examples? Otherwise I am not sure, if money is the solution to everything, as it could create incentive to create problems or make them worse, only to eventually receive a bigger part of the fines.
- djcannabiz 4y ago
  I know there is a program in the SEC that gives whistleblowers a cut of the fines https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-151 https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-151 one example: https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-211 https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2022-211
- barbazoo 4y ago
  Good point!!!
- 4y ago

berry_sortoro 4y ago

[dead]

lizardactivist 4y ago

Idea: extend the act to provide full protection for US Americans who expose espionage, sabotage (and possibly worse things) carried out in EU countries.

colonwqbang 4y ago
I don't follow. Why would an EU country punish a US citizen for reporting espionage/sabotage directed against the EU country? Or do you mean something else?
- dividedbyzero 4y ago
  They would need guaranteed non-extradition and possibly a lot of protection so they don't get abducted by the US, but that sort of legislation would never sail under the current German government.
  - zirgs 4y ago
    It's only possible to extradite people if they did something that's a crime in both countries.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - dividedbyzero 4y ago
      Treason is a crime in Germany, too, and whether the result is politically opportune for Germany couldn't officially play a role in front of a Oberlandesgericht court when ruling on an extradition request by the US. Disclosure of spy activities certainly would be a crime if committed in Germany against Germany, so extradition for such a whistleblower would have to be stopped at the political level, which is possible, but that's not something I would want to depend on. The US could exert a lot of very painful pressure on a German government, and as the Snowden affair shows, broad public support is far from given. Might be easier to weather the scandal from giving in than the consequences of sticking to principles.

POPOSYS 4y ago

Why not go to the original source, this is what the internet was made for! https://www.bundestag.de/dokumente/textarchiv/2022/kw50-de-hinweisgeber-926806 https://www.bundestag.de/dokumente/textarchiv/2022/kw50-de-h... Hope you can help yourself with translate services.

graderjs 4y ago

Honestly sort of depressing how everything follows US policy: NDAA contained whistleblower-protection language--and we have to be proud of it. Couldn't other "western liberal democracies" just initiate their own policy initiatives--sounds like I'm denigrating US--I'm not--but couldn't other countries initiate their own first, why have to wait and play second fiddle? Always like this. US passes some law, then you see, like the dominoes fall elsewhere--depressing as it gives the impression they were too scared to pass before US...ugh. Progress controlled from one source is not diverse enough to succeed. We need more :)

Darge 4y ago
Can you provide more examples of the EU following US? I think there are plenty of examples of the opposite: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brussels_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brussels_effect
- graderjs 4y ago
  It's a feeling built up over years, from a gestalt experience... I wasn't keeping notes. I don't know...some places I might look to research that further are: copyright law / DMCA, encryption law and export regulation, COVID policies, country / company blacklists, crypto law -- but without finding all the little moments in my past where I saw such and such a news happen in USA, then later on such and such similar legislation / policy happen in EU, in East Asian democracies, in Indo Pacific...I couldn't provide you who is exactly on that list for sure. Just a feeling it's there tho. I'm sure it seems probably not very convincing to you...that's OK, you have your own experience and memory. This is mine. Thanks for the link. Interesting. Cross-pollination maybe? :) Have a good one!