25 ms·

It's easier and faster to pirate an e-book, than it is to buy it

• theCrowing 4y ago
  Get a library card and check out libby.
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• zeckalpha 4y ago
  This sounds like a Spendesk problem, not an ebook problem.
  • adamparsons 4y ago
    Sounds like kindle is pretty broken
  • don-code 4y ago
    While I don't agree it's a Spendesk problem, it's definitely a hard position to take that Spendesk shouldn't fix it themselves. When a large (I'd guess, at minimum, double digit) percentage of your virtual card traffic goes through Amazon specifically, having your product trigger Amazon's fraud detection system, however broken it is, isn't a great look, and borders on being a bug. At the end of the day, the customer doesn't really care whether what Spendesk does is perfectly reasonable - they only care if it works. We have some other examples of this in software: * There was an article here on HN a couple of days ago, regarding how Windows 95 detected SimCity and treated memory allocations differently if it was running. (https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/10/windows-95-went-the-extra-mile-to-ensure-compatibility-of-simcity-other-games/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/10/windows-95-went-the-...) * Excel still treats 1900 as a leap year, which it was not, for greater compatibility with Lotus 1-2-3. https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/office/troubleshoot/excel/wrongly-assumes-1900-is-leap-year https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/office/troubleshoot/excel/... * The Linux kernel has an extremely strict policy of not breaking userland - to the point of keeping buggy behavior in place (I can't find a reference for this one, but I believe it one notorious case involved PulseAudio and one of Linus's earlier "moments").
  • failbuffer 4y ago
    Except for the part where Amazon (software) agents break into your home and steal your books.
  • Finnucane 4y ago
    I work in ebook production, and Amazon, Spendesk, and even drm are not part of the epub standard. Those are imposed externalities best avoided if you can.
• breck 4y ago
  100%. It's time we start spreading the word that (c)opyright laws are evil and need to go. #LiberateIdeas The good news is: public domain products are strictly superior: https://breckyunits.com/how-the-public-domain-can-win.html https://breckyunits.com/how-the-public-domain-can-win.html Amendment to abolish copyright: https://breckyunits.com/the-intellectual-freedom-amendment.html https://breckyunits.com/the-intellectual-freedom-amendment.h...
  • fallingknife 4y ago
    So if you write a book, and sell it for $20, and I make a copy of your book and sell it for $10, you are ok with this?
    • breck 4y ago
      That question and more answered here: https://breckyunits.com/an-unpopular-phrase.html https://breckyunits.com/an-unpopular-phrase.html
      • Vaslo 4y ago
        Or you could just answer the question here as it was asked instead of getting hits for your site.
        • breck 4y ago
          > instead of getting hits for your site. Here you go, get the full site without hitting my web server: `git clone https://github.com/breck7/breckyunits.com https://github.com/breck7/breckyunits.com` > just answer the question >> So if you write a book, and sell it for $20, and I make a copy of your book and sell it for $10, you are ok with this? If I make a hammer, and sell it for $20, and the person I sell it to uses it to make more hammers that he sells for $10, are you okay with this? Your question shows a shallowness of thinking. What is a book? Did you come up with 100% of the words in the book? If not, are you tracking down and compensating all the people who invented the words you used (or their ancestors?). What about the letters? Let's talk about the machinery you used to print the book. Are you providing a "royalty" to the printing press manufacturer? The problem with me wasting my time is that your question is so basic and shows such lack of thought that I can't distinguish whether you are being genuine or are a paid shill by the (c)opywrong regime out there muddying the waters. And yes, there are a tremendous amount of paid shills out there spreading false and dishonest information about (c)opywrongs.
• adamparsons 4y ago
  So you’re telling me you can give Amazon money for their closed book system, give them more money and they can just decide to take away “””your””” books you’ve bought over the years? Can’t wait for the apologist to appear and explain why this is just totally fine
  • wahnfrieden 4y ago
    information and art should be free, and authors and artists should be entitled to decent living
    • swarnie 4y ago
      Those two statements can't be reconciled in any viable society.
      • wahnfrieden 4y ago
        sounds like hardened political rhetoric to say simply that it's not viable. even ahistorical if you look at recent eg wengrow and graeber research. where's your intellectual curiosity for possible alternatives to status quo? but sure, enjoy your current "viable society"
      • jfengel 4y ago
        It should work with a universal basic income. Everyone has enough to eat and a place to live. Then you price your efforts based on not needing a subsistence. It would make it easier to dismiss the notion of intellectual property, since you no longer need to artificially limit copying so that creators could survive. They'll probably want some kind of job to afford art supplies, but it's an option rather than a mandate. This is oversimplified, of course, but it doesn't seem fundamentally impossible.
        • patentatt 4y ago
          The limited monopoly isn't just for survival though, it's supposed to be an incentive.
• ganarajpr 4y ago
  THIS. This is especially true for old (and new?) academic books / works. If its really popular book, old academic books are available to buy at exorbitant prices ($100-$1000+) or alternatively you can just get it free as a pirated pdf. Guess what most people will prefer!
  • rootusrootus 4y ago
    You can buy old academic e-books for exorbitant prices? Are you not perhaps thinking of physical copies of out-of-print books?
• hasbot 4y ago
  For the average person, it isn't. For the average person with a Kindle, buying a book from Amazon is a very smooth process. My 83 year-old mother does it easily. I pirate e-books and it's kind of a pain in the ass to get the book, convert it to MOBI format, and then transfer it to my Kindle.
  • torben-friis 4y ago
    kindle handles epub books just fine (not sure how recent that is). They also provide an email address where, if you send an email with some epubs attached, they make them magically appear on your kindle. I was pleasantly surprised by this last week, since I got a kindle and I thought it was going to be a hassle, but nope.
    • preetamjinka 4y ago
      This is what I do with my base model Kindle. I have its email address saved as a contact so it is super easy to send it ePubs (or PDFs!) from my phone.
      • bombolo 4y ago
        I'm sure you're aware that amazon can discontinue this at any moment. My ebook reader just reads an sd card or I can use a usb cable to transfer files. That's harder to remotely kill.
        • preetamjinka 4y ago
          I'm aware. If they discontinue it then I'll just stick to Kindle books. That's all I'm expecting from this device anyway. For everything else I have an iPad Pro.
        • SalimoS 4y ago
          You can use usb cable to transfer to kindle too
        • deleted 4y ago
• gfosco 4y ago
  1. You bought the books fast/easy on Amazon... That is incredibly suspicious activity though, buying everything with different cards... You can get this fixed by dealing with Amazon support. 2. You bought them pretty fast/easy here too... Without knowing if you can transfer that format to your device. The title is misleading and inaccurate.
  • jtode 4y ago
    Ehhh... OP is riffing on a theme that's been playing a long time. Back around mid aughts, it was pretty easy to pirate movies. Doesn't really matter how but it wasn't hard (still isn't actually, but that's beside my point). At the time I was still avidly collecting physical media, and I observed at some point, as did many others, that it became an absurd choice of getting an xvid, double clicking, and there's the movie, vs. load the DVD, sit through previews which, even if skippable, just no. And then the warnings of course, which again, sometimes skipping or fast forwarding would be disabled again. So your reward for playing by the rules was wasted time looking at or skipping - forever - the marketing for whatever garbage they had coming out that season. I understand that not everyone wants to embrace the Cory Doctorow professional model, but I sure don't mind giving him my money.
    • yamtaddle 4y ago
      The goofiest part was how, often, one of the unskippable things making paid media worse was an anti-piracy notice! The only people to be pestered with them were those who'd paid for the thing—pirates never saw that crap.
      • Schroedingersat 4y ago
        Don't forget that the unskippable piracy notice had uncredited unlicensed music.
• thrdbndndn 4y ago
  To your story: it sounds more like a problem with Spendesk though. And if your goal is to "give it back to some of the authors", attempt no.2 already achieved that. To ebook and DRM in general: yeah they suck. But that's kinda like a dead horse at this point. To the convenience: I don't find buy an ebook on Kindle any hard if your goal is just to read it. And after graduating from uni years ago, I have no idea where to get pirate ebooks, so that's definitely harder for me. I'd assume same goes to the majority of people.
• Mistletoe 4y ago
  Well luckily most people in society don’t decide what to do based on how easy or fast it is. Stealing a car is also easier than working to make $40,000. I suggest a library.
• bnj 4y ago
  You mention that removing the DRM isn’t exactly legal— is this something that right to repair would address? Are there places where DRM circumvention is legal? I had thought that at least in some jurisdictions breaking the DRM on things you’d bought yourself was a protected activity, but I confess I know next to nothing about where things stand.
  • jagged-chisel 4y ago
    In the US, the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) made it illegal to bypass DRM[1]. It also set up the ability to get exceptions by presenting at the copyright office. And the exceptions expire after three years and must be argued again. The practical side of this is that no one is coming after you individually for removing DRM from your own files. They will target the tools people use, or especially online services that are available. 1 - The DRM just has to exist on the file, there’s no need for it to be strong or require massive effort to undo.
• rootusrootus 4y ago
  Sounds like a niche case. For average people who buy one book at a time, Amazon's purchase process is single-click. All of the Kindle books I've gotten in recent memory have been DRM-free. I'm having trouble feeling any outrage here, I think most retailers would have flagged your account if you used a bunch of different credit cards, one for each item you bought.
  • jacquesm 4y ago
    Average people like me, who visit a bookstore once in six months or so tend to stock up on books. Never had a bookstore bar me from entering because I bought too many books. On the contrary, they asked me if they could help out by delivering them to my house for free...
    • SalimoS 4y ago
      To be completely fair if you use a new card for every book it will rise some eyebrows
      • nimih 4y ago
        Yeah, the human being behind the counter will probably ask "why the hell are you ringing up each book on a new credit card," to which the OP would presumably answer "I'm buying books for work and this is how they make me do expense reports," and both would continue to go about their day. Perhaps part of the OP's point is that the efficiency gains of Amazon over B&M retailers (from the POV of the company owners and investors, at least) come at a very real cost to the customer experience.
        • rootusrootus 4y ago
          When I was younger, in my teens and early 20s, carding was a thing. Good old stolen credit cards used in person at retail. This was in the late 80s, before the Internet became A Thing. If you had walked into a store and started swiping multiple cards, they'd most likely have called the cops.
• christophilus 4y ago
  What I ended up doing was buying my books wherever they were cheapest (e.g. a used bookstore or the kindle shop or whatever) and then pirating a non-DRM e-pub version so that I didn’t have any hassle and could read as I pleased. That way, my conscience was clear (subjectively). Then, the FBI or someone took down z-library. So, I’m not sure what my next move will be.
  • unixbotnuke 4y ago
    Here is an alternative: http://libgen.is/ http://libgen.is/
    • fnord77 4y ago
      I'm amazed this hasn't gotten taken down. it's been around for years and years
  • andai 4y ago
    z-lib is still up on Tor. Check wikipedia for the links. You do need to login with an email though which sucks.
  • torben-friis 4y ago
    Authors aren't benefited by second hand sales. Have you considered libby? Nowadays libraries around the world provide you with an account that gives you access to their catalogue for free.
    • cube00 4y ago
      For my library at least there are very few modern technical books in their Libby subscription.
    • mehlmao 4y ago
      Libby and similar services are designed to bleed libraries dry. Libraries are prohibited from buying a normal / retail eBook license, and have to buy a special library license. These licenses are more expensive and expire after they are checked out a few times. I'll check out a physical book from the library, grab an epub, and delete it when I return the book.
• petodo 4y ago
  Just pirate the book and send money to author directly. In the end they are getting peanuts from book price. https://forum.mobilism.org/viewforum.php?f=106 https://forum.mobilism.org/viewforum.php?f=106
  • drakonka 4y ago
    If the book is self-published and priced over 99c, the author will be getting 70% royalties from a Kindle purchase.
• jordanmorgan10 4y ago
  Stuff like this hurts to read. I don't have any DRM stuff for my ebooks so people can avoid any hassles, but at the same time it totally sucks when I come across is being pirated.
• smcl 4y ago
  > for each of the purchase I created a new virtual card and bought them Well there's your problem. Look Amazon is a shady company and I completely understand not wanting to hand over any more money to Bezos. But one account making N orders on N different cards in quick succession is going to trigger any rudimentary anti-fraud protection
  • _Algernon_ 4y ago
    Which wouldn't have been an issue if you could have paid for all the books at once... It's still a stupidly designed system by Amazon.
    • School-Cotton 4y ago
      It also wouldn’t be an issue if you just didn’t create a new card for every transaction. I feel like I’m missing context on why anyone would do that.
      • _Algernon_ 4y ago
        It's clearly stated in the OP: >My company uses Spendesk for managing funds, so for each of the purchase I created a new virtual card and bought them. Presumably Spendesk doesn't allow using the same virtual card multiple times?
      • Zuiii 4y ago
        one card == one transaction
• airesearcher 4y ago
  Ok yes all true. But if authors cannot make a living then what? What if the content was sourcecode for your non-open-source software - would you still feel the same way? In order for ideas to be free there has to be some new way to compensate authors for their hard work. Voluntary donations don’t work well enough. Perhaps the solution is an “idea tax” that everyone pays a small amount into every year - and the proceeds are distributed pro rata to authors based on the relative proportions of their content in all downloads? You can’t just liberate all content and not also find a way to compensate people who work to make the content as their paying jobs. That isn’t sustainable. There is a missing idea in your plan. I think it can be solved somehow - but might require an equally radical and blanket solution on the economic side.
  • mschild 4y ago
    The idea is to provide a system that "Just Works". I know what OP is talking about. Managing ebooks is a pain in the ass. I want to buy books directly from the author and put them on my reading device, but I barely ever have the option to. Often the only source for ebooks is Amazon, which I dont really want to buy from for several reasons. There are other stores, but often their ebooks are locked to their specific devices, essentially locking you in to whatever platform you pick. God forbid the one you picked doesnt have a particular book you want to read. I end up buying a paper copy, because I dont have to deal with yet another shitty ebook that may or may not work.
  • BlackFly 4y ago
    The idea isn't missing, you just didn't see it. He (and I as well), want to be able to easily buy non DRM'ed epubs so we can transfer them from one reader to another, sometimes offline. After getting increasingly aggravated by Amazon over the years, I transfered my files out of Amazon into Calibre and onto my Kobo. I am not at all interested in connecting Amazon to my Kobo. I explicitly do not want Amazon to know I bought a Kobo, they can of course see I am not buying any more books from them. [I buy them from multiple competitors these days.] It was solved already in the distant past. It is called first sale doctrine. You sell me a copy. That copy is mine, we no longer need to speak to one another unless I want to buy something else from you. "Oh, but what if you copy it and give out many copies?" So you're assuming I'm a criminal and using that to justify ruining the perfectly good relationship we had before? If I'm treated like a criminal anyways and get a better experience by actually being a criminal--well it is better to be a criminal and treated like one than an honest person treated like a criminal.
• jayp1418 4y ago
  I always buy physical book.
  • superkuh 4y ago
    It's expensive to turn physical books into something my text to speech program can read. Typically about $25-35 to ship off the book to a scanning/OCR company and get back an epub.
• mgkimsal 4y ago
  > Amazon doesn't have a shopping card for kindle books I don't know what this means. What is a 'shopping card for kindle books'? EDIT: OK - thanks all. Likely a typo of 'cart', unless the OP explains further. That was an initial thought, but the next line mentions 'so for each of the purchase I created a new virtual card and bought them'... so wasn't sure what the 'card' connection was.
  • kcartlidge 4y ago
    Probably means shopping cart. I'm a Kobo user so haven't bought Kindle books in many years, but IIRC you can only click to buy a single book at a time, rather than add them into a cart for a bulk buy.
  • miniwark 4y ago
    Probably a typo, i think than OP mean "shopping carT". It's how my brain have auto-correct it.
  • cannolicannon 4y ago
    I think it's a typo, probably should read "cart." For whatever reason, Amazon doesn't seem to have a way to place Kindle books in your shopping cart and do a single, large purchase. Rather you find the book you want and buy using their 1-click purchase option then go find the next book and purchase with 1-click.
  • lalopalota 4y ago
    most likely a typo. i assume they meant shopping cart, as in they couldn't purchase multiple books in one transaction.
• BigGreenTurtle 4y ago
  I don't think that's true for most people, but for me the difference isn't large enough to matter. It probably takes most people 1 or 2 minutes to click the one click buy button on Amazon and download a book. I can get a book from Z-Library on telegram, upload it to Dropbox, and have it downloaded to my Kobo in 3-4 minutes -- not a big deal on book reading time scales.
• herbstein 4y ago
  Personally, I've bought quite a few (non-fiction) books eBooks.com, all of which can be downloaded as DRM-free PDF and EPUB files. Not their whole catalog is available in DRM-free editions, but enough to satisfy my needs are.
• rpigab 4y ago
  If buying and consuming DRM-protected media was easy and fast, then it would mean that DRM is not working as intended. Because then it would be easy and fast to copy the file, and even if it'll always be possible to pirate one way or another, they'll try to block it anyway and these restrictions will impact paying customers 99% of the time. No matter what happens, the ones who pay will be the ones who pay. Why do you think Netflix is restricting offline viewing? It would be so convenient to download first and watch it during travel when Internet connection is impossible or too expensive, but no, that's why I don't have Netflix anymore (it's been a while). I've heard they've allowed it since, but I'm not getting Netflix again.
  • cypress66 4y ago
    It's easier and a much better experience to buy games on steam than to pirate them. And you can play them offline too. The exception is maybe Denuvo, but steam warns you on the purchase page if it uses Denuvo.
    • ta8645 4y ago
      I'd prefer to have the option to give or sell the used games away after playing them. You can't give a Steam game to a friend after you've played it, and you can't pass your entire game collection on to your heirs when you die. But you don't own anything, and you're happy -- which apparently is meant to be the new normal.
• binarymax 4y ago
  If you’re looking for software dev books, check out Manning. They are amazing and their ebooks are PDF without DRM. https://www.manning.com/ https://www.manning.com/
• stalfosknight 4y ago
  eBooks on Apple Books is a pretty seamless experience.
• Veuxdo 4y ago
  Well, it's easier to shoplift something than buy it, too. No need to wait in line to check out. No need to have a credit card or get cash from an ATM, either.
  • ykonstant 4y ago
    What?? No, it isn't!
• _Algernon_ 4y ago
  I'm getting happier with my decision to embrace piracy again by the minute. This isn't just true for books. Streaming film/TV is essentially cable TV at this point: you either pay out your arse for all streaming services or you have to constantly micromanage different subscriptions. Even if you are happy with the former, there is no way to centrally browse everything so you need 7 different apps. Not to mention series being removed from streaming platforms because of profit: https://techcrunch.com/2022/12/13/westworld-removed-from-hbo-max https://techcrunch.com/2022/12/13/westworld-removed-from-hbo... You can't even rely on being able to access the media you want in the future if you do it legally. It's insane.
  • majkinetor 4y ago
    In the meantime: 1. Rarbg or rutracker to dwn anything in minutes 2. mpv to watch anything in minutes with subtitles and bunch of flexible options that propriatery or FOSS tools like plex can only dream to have 3. enjoy life without commercials ever and hord stuff if you want it and pay for things after the fact For books replace 1. with libgen and 2. with calibre reader. Yes, its 100x easier. Games could be in some cases easier to buy, especially since you realy must test those for viruses and other malcious stuff, not something you should be concerned with multimedia.
    • _Algernon_ 4y ago
      Since I game on Linux, Steam provides enough value since most games with Proton are one-click install. Don't use other stores though.
      • the_af 4y ago
        Steam+Proton is magical these days, I have no problem supporting creators and buying their games. With Steam, GOG and Humble Bundle, it's never been easier to game on Linux. It feels like paradise. In a way, gaming is in much better shape (re: convenience) than streaming TV shows these days. Yes, DRM for online play can be problematic for Proton -- but fuck those games!
      • 4y ago
• latexr 4y ago
  The Oatmeal has a relevant comic, but for a TV show: https://www.theoatmeal.com/comics/game_of_thrones https://www.theoatmeal.com/comics/game_of_thrones
  • anhncommenter25 4y ago
    This comic is no longer relevant; you can see every Game of Thrones episode in existence by visiting hbo.com, and following a very straightforward streaming sign-up process. The price of admission is cheaper than all the legal options the character tried in the comic. I guess The Oatmeal author forgot to update their decade-old comic to reflect the current state of things. They did manage to add an update to the bottom of the website though, which says "Please don't steal." This either contradicts the message in the comic or piracy only matters when it happens to Matthew Inman specifically.
• iammjm 4y ago
  I have the same feeling with streaming movies - it is often easier to watch them illegally then to pay for them and watch them legally. But I also suspect I can’t be the only one in this situation, so I assume the problem has go be global and thus a global solution will be found as there is money to be made there. Until then I will pay for what is available and pirate what is not, without feeling bad about it.
• dtx1 4y ago
  As a long time Pirate of everything, I have found that Gabe Newell was right. > "We think there is a fundamental misconception about piracy. Piracy is almost always a service problem and not a pricing problem," he said. "If a pirate offers a product anywhere in the world, 24 x 7, purchasable from the convenience of your personal computer, and the legal provider says the product is region-locked, will come to your country 3 months after the US release, and can only be purchased at a brick and mortar store, then the pirate's service is more valuable." As soon as a Store offers a better Solution than pirating it, I tend to buy it. Steam being a Prime example. Took ages to build the trust that when I buy something on Steam, it's safe and mine. Whatever the EULA says, at the end of the day, my Steam Stuff feels safe. Add to that the Linux Compatibility (I'd rather pay for a game and have steam deal with compatibility than do it on my own with a pirated copy). Same with Spotify. I can't be bothered to maintain my own music library and music piracy is dead these days anyway. As long as Spotify has all the music I'm happy to pay them to deal with keeping everything up-to-date and well sorted. The moment they fuck up and I can't find the music I want it's either to another provider with a better library or back to piracy. Movies and TV Shows are still broken. Especially here in Germany. Now given the Production Cost I'd arguably accept a little less variety per Service but for me it's more like each Provider has 1-5 things I'm interested in and none has enough to justify buying into them. So Piracy it is. And let's not even talk about the atrocious Quality of the streams we get. Banding everywhere, obvious compression artifacts and annoying DRM Ridden interfaces making it hard to deal with them on Linux. Try watching a Nolan Movie on Netflix on Desktop Linux and fix the horrible Audio Mix via Post Processing. Just Nope. Same is trivial with a pirated Copy (that incidentally also looks better because a 50GB Blue Ray Rip just has more Bits than a Netflix Stream). I haven't even bothered with books so far...
  • leobg 4y ago
    Didn’t Steve Jobs say something like that to the music industry when starting iTunes? “If people can’t easily buy things, they will steal them.”
• cm2187 4y ago
  Same with buying digital music. On Amazon's website you can tell it is a legacy business. Songs now appear in the same messy search result than other physical items (so you can't try quickly several results to find the correct version). You need to open the page of each song to get a chance to get a hear a sample. If you click anything on that page you get a modal for trying amazon music unlimited, and this modal will reappear again and aagin on every click. With such a UX I presume the number of mp3 sales on amazon must be near zero.
  • LanceH 4y ago
    The music is beyond frustrating and I can only assume this is deliberate. On my phone, if I search for music that I own and have downloaded, it still returns results from the store/streaming and not the specific song/artist I asked for. I'm looking for something else to manage mp3's again, preferably with an easy way to backup storage -- and it shouldn't be a monthly service.
• superkuh 4y ago
  It's not just Amazon. Kobo has gone Adobe corrupted too and now instead of epub downloads, or even just the basic consideration of telling you what format the book is in you first have to pay for the book then you get to find out weather you're getting actual text or just some shell of a drm file pointing to adobe's servers (.acsm). I've had to sit through a couple 30 minute chat holds with Kobo in order to get refunds recently due to their lack of proper labeling. When there is no option to buy the actual text of a book I will try pirating and it is almost always simpler and faster. If pirating fails too then I have to find an old paperback to buy and send off to a scanner/OCR company.
• the__alchemist 4y ago
  Tangential: I've had good luck over the years with this flow: -Buy on Amazon (using a single card!) - Install an old version of Kindle for PC (might be able to find an installer online); download/open the book in it - install a Calibre de-drm plugin. - Open the Kindle file downloaded to a home subdirectory in Calibre. - Convert to epub in Calibre, using one of the big HD formats etc so it won't downscale images - save the epub somewhere you can back up, and also transfer it to your reader. Yikes ... I guess I wouldn't recommend this as an easy solution!
  • kingaillas 4y ago
    This was my flow, except instead of PC I was using Mac. But then, that Mac died and I hadn't also happened to save the proper old version of Kindle for PC. And I migrated to a linux desktop instead of replacing the Mac. I'm a bit uneasy about grabbing some version downloaded from a random website, even if I ran that in a VM I still have to present my Amazon account info. So my replacement flow would include "get a macos vm running, install an old version of Kindle for Mac (known good since it's my copy) in the VM" and then do everything in the VM and transfer the converted epub out. I keep hoping the de-drm plugin will be updated to understand how to de-drm the newer Kindle format. :)
• syvolt 4y ago
  I wish more people knew about fraud protection and how not to trigger it. If you want to pay in an unusual way, ask support if it's allowed or causes issues. If you just try and imitate the average customer you will almost always be on the happy path, but ordering multiple books with multiple cards in a short period... I think that would trigger any decent fraud protection and not just at Amazon scale.
  • beebeepka 4y ago
    This would have been somewhat funny piece of sarcasm but I fear you are being serious. Next step: force customers to submit to a full cavity search upon payment
  • ryanbrunner 4y ago
    For most services (I'd assume even Amazon) they likely wouldn't be able to tell you what would trip their fraud detection. Most of the time fraud detection happens at the payment processor or issuing bank level, and even if it is detected directly by the service, usually the support department doesn't have much access to the fraud department, and fraud departments are usually very protective around details of how they detect fraud.
  • yamtaddle 4y ago
    To be fair, it seems like their only option was to look like someone running stolen credit card numbers, due to how two systems outside their control worked—the work payment system that issued one card number per transaction; Amazon not letting you buy more than one ebook at a time.
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• kraig911 4y ago
  Funny enough while I agree with your points I think you're being a little facetious given the premise. If someone came into my store and bought a different item with different credit cards for multiple transactions I'd be suspicious too. Fraud is super hard to fight back.
  • leoff 4y ago
    I also understand this, I just wish Amazon had a shopping cart so I could use my single use card only one time.
• anhncommenter25 4y ago
  I recommend buying actual books from local bookstores (bookshop.org can middleman) and then giving them away to a local library when you're finished with them. Piracy is for children.
  • bambax 4y ago
    Do you mean paper books? They are incredibly impractical: bulky, heavy, unsearchable... I wrote a historical novel last year that I self-published on Amazon, on paper as well as Kindle. To my surprise, 80% of my sales are paper. It's in French, and the French are notoriously conservative, but still... I don't care one way or the other what other people do, but for me the only time I buy paper books is if there is no electronic version, or the ebook is priced something like €15 and it's possible to find a used copy for 50 cents.
    • anhncommenter25 4y ago
      I don't think either are _incredibly_ impractical. They're both impractical in different ways to different people. The downsides of e-books are dealing with digital files, the many technological shortcomings of e-ink screens, and the e-book reader itself is a high-value item that attracts unwanted attention. I understand some of those are hand-waived away on a Hacker Forum full of technologists, but they describe the uncanny valley of e-book reading for many book readers. Your novel's statistics don't surprise me!
    • kstrauser 4y ago
      I'm reading "Infinite Jest" on my still-new Kobo, and after the 50th time using the built-in dictionary to figure out what I'm seeing, this is my new favorite thing in the world.
  • themadturk 4y ago
    Many of the physical books I want to read are too large to hold comfortably, and have typefaces too small for me to read easily. Neither of these are problems I have with ebooks.
  • thefurdrake 4y ago
• beebeepka 4y ago
  Same with music, movies, and TV shows. Valve realized, and monetized, this years ago: "pirates are underserved customers".
• mhb 4y ago
  I know, right? It's the same with small appliances. It's such a hassle to take an item to a cashier and check out instead of just leaving with the merchandise.
• r_hoods_ghost 4y ago
  I'm sorry but this sounds like a pebkac. You created a new virtual card for each purchase rather than just create a single card, load it up with £50 and use that. Why? Making multiple purchases on multiple cards in a short period of time is absolutely classic fraudulent behaviour. Of course your account got suspended. You can probably get it easily un suspended by contacting customer support.
  • charles_f 4y ago
    It's just the (not great) way Spenddesk works.
    • nulbyte 4y ago
      Looks like you can create cards for online subscriptions with Spendesk. Presumably you could set a reasonable monthly amount or something. If not, sounds like the product is poorly thought out. Every other solution for virtual cards I've seen has something akin to a reusable card for a specific vendor.
• alecco 4y ago
  For audiobooks it's even worse. Some are practically impossible to purchase outside of US. I guess it has to do with arcane distribution rights. Authors should always have a donation page for people who are forced to pirate their work.
• markx2 4y ago
  Steam. It was the case - and may still be - that during a sale if you bought a game, then another, then another that your account would be flagged and purchases blocked, effectively ending your sale. The only way around was to credit your account before the sale and spend through Steam's Wallet. The 'own' thing is the same for Steam. I go to my Steam Library and it shows games I 'own', but in reality I own none of them. I simply have a licence to play, a licence which can be revoked by Steam or the Developer or the Publisher or the Online Retail Store where I bought it and at any time they choose. GOG. Itch.io. I own games that I purchase games there.
  • tmtvl 4y ago
    Er, if GOG decides to ban you, you'll lose all your stuff on there as well. As for being DRM-free, Steam's DRM is opt-in for developers and there are lists of DRM-free games on Steam (for example: https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_games_on_Steam https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_g...).
    • bentley 4y ago
      > Er, if GOG decides to ban you, you'll lose all your stuff on there as well. Whenever I get a game on GOG, I download and keep a local copy of the DRM‐free installer. If my account got banned, I would lose nothing except access to future updates. > Steam's DRM is opt-in for developers and there are lists of DRM-free games on Steam It’s nice that some Steam games lack runtime DRM, but as far as I’m aware every Steam game uses DRM at install time.
• hwc 4y ago
  I wish we could just buy DRM-free physical copies of ebooks, music, and movies on SDCard-sized ROM cartridges.
• gruez 4y ago
  > so for each of the purchase I created a new virtual card and bought them. After a few minutes my Amazon account is blocked for suspicious activity, and ALL my kindle library is wiped, and the funds are returned to my company. I understand generating a virtual card for a per company basis, but what's the point of generating a card for every book you're buying? Besides the added hassle for little benefit, surely you can understand why such behavior might be considered "suspicious"?
  • tux1968 4y ago
    Guessing that the virtual cards are only able to be used for a single purchase. And because there is no shopping cart on Kindle allowing books to be bought together, multiple cards were required for the individual purchases.
    • zitterbewegung 4y ago
      From what I have used my virtual card for my Apple Card that seems correct. Virtual cards really should be generated once per purchase because if you aren't doing this its going to trigger a fraud detection system for the payment processor.
    • leoff 4y ago
      Yes, this is correct.
  • sidlls 4y ago
    Why would it be considered suspicious?
    • patch_collector 4y ago
      Could be a person testing out stolen cards with a low-value purchase, to verify that the cards are legitimate. They then can use them elsewhere for much larger purchases.
    • lkbm 4y ago
      Usually when someone uses lots of different cards to make purchases on a website, they're testing stolen cards. 2-3 cards is fine, but if you have over ~5 cards in a day, it's over 90% chance that they're stolen. You simply don't run an ecommerce platform of any size without a system to automatically flag and block those transactions. I haven't checked the logs, but I guarantee there have been people/bots trying to do card testing on our site in the past 24 hours. It's pretty nearly a non-stop barrage, so you have to auto-detect and auto-block.
• jijji 4y ago
  when i look for an ebook, i usually just do a google search for: "book name" intitle:"index of" "parent directory" pdf
• signaru 4y ago
  The irony when you supposedly pay for convenience.
• ojagodzinski 4y ago
  In Poland there is no DRM on ebooks. Nobody uses Amazon, there is plenty of e-bookstores that sell them in all 3 formats (PDF, mobi, epub) and You can just download them od send via email form bookstore to device. examples: - https://virtualo.pl/ebooki/ https://virtualo.pl/ebooki/ - https://ebookpoint.pl/kategorie/ebooki https://ebookpoint.pl/kategorie/ebooki
• hcks 4y ago
  It’s now time to grow up and stop being outraged at people wanting to be paid for their work.
  • cloakedcode 4y ago
    What? Did you read the article? I think it is you that is outraged. You came in a little hot.
• bambax 4y ago
  > Amazon doesn't have a shopping card for kindle books I think you mean shopping cart? And yes it's astonishing that on Amazon today you can't add a Kindle book to a regular shopping cart (or any cart), or even save it for later! Which is something I would want to do often. I don't understand the reasoning (or the technical difficulty). It's just bad service.
• dorianmariefr 4y ago
  Just Google "[Book name] filetype:pdf"
• mark_l_watson 4y ago
  That is strange that Amazon does not let you “shopping cart” Kindle books since they support batch buying audio books on Audible. Some people here mentioned that Kindle books can be taken away, like 1984 was. I try to split eBook purchases between Kindle, Apple Books, and Google Play Books. Google Play Books have the advantage that they are almost always shareable with family members. Also, I write in the Leanpub.com platform and I also buy a fair number of other people’s leanpub books. You get 3 formats without DRM: Kindle, ePub, and PDF. Authors also get 80% royalties.
• tiffanyh 4y ago
  > for each of the purchase I created a new virtual card and bought them. After a few minutes my Amazon account is blocked for suspicious activity This seems totally acceptable from Amazon perspective. Someone who in an extremely short amount of time, keeps buying new products with a different credit card per purchase. How does this not appear to be activity a fraudster would do?
• helloworld11 4y ago
  It's simple: hear or read about a book you like, visit Libgen, search for it under fiction or non-fiction, (more often than not) find it listed and available, click to download. The entire process literally takes seconds and unless your literary tastes are deeply esoteric or specialized (and sometimes even then you'll be fine) you can get nearly any book you like notably faster than if you had paid for it to be locked into Amazon's shitty kindle platform.
• wslh 4y ago
  Not only books... movies and other content. It is a shame that you cannot pay and watch almost any movie online. And this is worst when you look to movie translated to other languages.
• vxNsr 4y ago
  The Amazon issue is kinda a unique issue you created by generating a bunch of cc numbers and adding them all to your amazon account. That’s kinda what fraudsters do who buy cc info in bulk. Did you try contacting amazon support and explaining the issue?
• SanjayMehta 4y ago
  Kindle Unlimited + real books for reference. Also British Council and the ACM have excellent ebook facilities.
• helloworld11 4y ago
  >Funnily enough, it's possible to remove this DRM protection, but it's also not something completely legal, and makes me question why did I decide to legally buy the e-books in the first place. Did you seriously stop yourself from saving your books, that you'd bought, from erasure by these shitty systems because of some silly DRM laws that are to begin with grossly unfair in this context? Please, next time, strip that garbage and be done with it. Regardless of some silly regulations, consider it a basic assertion of concrete and very fair, paid-for ownership. Or just pirate them.
• deleted 4y ago
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• Mystery-Machine 4y ago
  I really don't understand why people buy Kindle. I bought Kobo reader in 2015. It still works perfectly and receives software updates. Transferring books or PDFs is as easy as plugging the device into my computer.
  • phil294 4y ago
    I really don't understand why people buy Kobo. I bought a Pocketbook from 2007. It still works perfectly and does not need software updates (nor does it have internet). Transferring books or PDFs is as easy as plugging the device into my computer.
    • sleepycatgirl 4y ago
      Both are very much fine :D
  • TulliusCicero 4y ago
    I use the Kindle store because it has the content I want and it's dead simple to use. Kobo doesn't have the Kindle Unlimited books that I like reading.
  • idoubtit 4y ago
    I also own a Kobo reader, and I'm especially delighted with the unofficial KOReader software. I've installed it aside the official Kobo software which I don't use anymore. http://koreader.rocks http://koreader.rocks I believe it is suitable for power users that want more control on their reader (gestures, shortcuts, navigation, override text presentation...). I prefer to organize the ebooks in a hierarchy of directories while ignoring completely the categories, and this is the way KOReader works.
  • themadturk 4y ago
    Some of us bought (or were gifted) Kindles when they were brand new, and pretty much the only game in town...my sister handed down her Kindle 1 to me she moved to a Kindle DX. A few years ago I bought a Likebook Mars (an e-ink tablet) and sent it back a few days later, because the Android-based reader software (Kindle reading app and others) was awful compared to the Kindle itself, and even the iOS version of the Kindle software.
• Aissen 4y ago
  Everyone saying it's your fault for not knowing about fraud detection and using multiple cards: I disagree. The issue here is simply that amazon has no cart for ebooks. Period. And that they did not reach out about the transactions before taking action (or even after blocking, who knows… they could have reversed the block). Using Spendesk means generating a new card for each transaction. Having a single transaction to load "credit", and then use up that credit means more accounting work and simply adds friction, which is the original point of the post.
• D13Fd 4y ago
  > My company uses Spendesk for managing funds, so for each of the purchase I created a new virtual card and bought them. After a few minutes my Amazon account is blocked for suspicious activity You're surprised that Amazon would suspend your account for using a different virtual credit card for each purchase?
  • dpkirchner 4y ago
    I sure am -- it would be sufficient for them to suspend the ability to make more purchases until the account is manually reviewed. There's absolutely no need to suspend the account entirely.
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• IncRnd 4y ago
  I'm not defending Amazon, but I thought everyone already knew that Amazon owns the books and the "purchaser of the license" doesn't. Honestly, though, it's a little suspicious to an automated system for someone to create a new card for each book getting purchased. There is a lot of fraud involved with those cards. Try purchasing a google play card online from Walmart to see what I mean. Recall that Kindle is Amazon's app or device. Kindle uses Amazon's DRM, and Kindle doesn't allow copying of the digital books out of the Amazon ecosystem. The truth is that you don't purchase a Kindle book. You purchase a license to read a Kindle ebook. That ebook gets updated on your device, which might remove your favorite passages. Also, when an author wants, your ebook can even be completely removed. At one point I went into the web inteface to Manage Digital Items and selected several thousand ebooks to download onto my desktop device. Then, after they all downloaded to that device, I created local digital copies as backups of those ebooks, using Calibre. Did you contact Amazon using their live chat in order to explain what happened? Or to ask them how to do what you want? I've found that the people on Amazon's live chat are extremely helpful and always resolve the issue (as long as what I purchased was on Prime or Kindle).
• acd1357 4y ago
  Buy directly from the publisher’s website. Only O’Reilly doesn’t sell books, they have only an expensive subscription. Manning puts your name and email at the bottom of every page. Apress and Packt for example don’t. There is no DRM. After Thanksgiving there are big discounts. Packt’s sale is still ongoing - $5 an ebook. Apress’s books are only $7 after Thanksgiving, I think both for ebooks and print.
• 0xmarcin 4y ago
  I never bought an ebook from Amazon, but I bought at least a dozen Audible audiobooks. Putting aside DRM, not-really-your-audiobook stuff the experience was very good. And I am living in a second world country (Poland). The entire process is just finding an audiobook, clicking pay (with my debit card) and a few minutes later I have the book downloaded to the app and I can start listening. The only issue that I had with Audible is when I wanted to buy an audiobook in German (for language learning purposes). I bought the book via amazon.de and whoa the book does not show up in my audible because I was logged there using amazon.pl account. After logging to amazon.de account in Audible the book showed up. Now I remember to buy foreign audiobooks always using the same amazon site. The process is as frictionless as downloading warez from a side like library genesis. Most local providers in my country have more or less sh_tty systems, where you pay and a few hours later you get an email (sic!) with an audiobook as an attachment (usually you get both epub and mobi). They use a few watermarks techniques to identify your copy - so I am actually scared to share my ebooks with anyone. This year I simply had enough, since I moved to a bigger place I had more place for paper books so I switched to them again. I underestimated how quickly the volume needed by books will grow but I found it refreshing to ditch kindle for a year and be back to paper. Now about 70% of my original book storage is taken, maybe it's time to share my books with my friends? Now my biggest problem when buying books online: often not even table of contents is available. I can use sites like goodreads to predict if I would like the book, but c'mon table of contents should be considered a must have for online book shops. I also noticed that Amazon book preview is deteriorating, now there is a lot of books when you can't even see a single page, only the cover. This is sad, maybe it's a sign that there is space for Amazon competitor?
• elias94 4y ago
  1. don't use Kindle since it lock you to use a proprietary format made by Amazon. Use a Kobo for example 2. buy ebook in a open format like .epub 3. buy physical copies as an alternative Remember that the important thing is to support book writers and publishers in their job to bring us stories and information. Doesn't matter if you use Amazon or other stores.
  • petodo 4y ago
    Kobo readers are infamous for their swelling batteries destroying displays, KIndle has better built quality. The answer should be Kindle+Calibre combo (Calibre can run even own server) and no need any internet connection in Kindle.
    • Sugimot0 4y ago
      Anecdotally my kobo aura is almost a decade old with 0 issues whatsoever, and it has a removable sd card which made sideloading software and files a breeze. I wish they continued making them that way.
• 55555 4y ago
  Go to libgen.is, search book name, click download link, then click "Open with Books" and you're done. It takes single-digit seconds. It literally takes longer to log in to Amazon, and the last time I did they blocked me as well for suspected fraud despite it being a 10+ year old Prime account. (I still buy them later to support the authors.)
• speeder 4y ago
  A book series I am a fan of, was available only on fictionwise on my country. (It was available on other countries with other stores). Barnes e Noble then bought fictionwise and sent me an email explaining I had a few days to download the books I legally bought because their policy was that downloads after the deadline would be allowed only for people physically inside USA and they would even check VPN and proxy usage. So right now there are 0 legal ways for me to get the books I am a fan of. So piracy it is. I guess the author can't even complain if lost sales since there is literally zero ways for me to pay him.
• deleted 4y ago
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• temp2022account 4y ago
  My moral compass has always been to pirate a product, then pay the studios/studio partners once I have a copy. It ensures I'm happy and the original authors get profit, at the detriment of intermediaries. Sometimes you can't pay the studios directly, so things like a Crunchyroll subscription covers my anime pirating, even though I could never use their product for watching anything. Is it terribly evil? I'm not sure. But I do know it aligns incentives for me to buy stuff and for creators to create stuff.
  • hunter2_ 4y ago
    > subscription covers my anime pirating, even though I could never use their product for watching anything This breaks down if the service allocates payment based on your usage. Presumably zero usage results in your money being split in some manner such as proportionately across all creators based on their own total play counts, whereas having some usage results in at least some of your money being split based on what you play. I have no idea how this actually works. Purely speculating.
• yosito 4y ago
  Got tired of giving Amazon and other big advertising companies my reading list to profile me with. Bought an Android-based eReader. Found it incredibly difficult to find most books off of Amazon. Even harder to find books without DRM. Also never found a satisfactory way to sync book progress between devices (phone and eReader). Eventually gave up and bought a Rakuten Kobo. Comes with DRM and probably sells my data to third parties. Has poor support for books in languages I read. But has a book store with a halfway decent selection of mainstream books and at least I'm not giving my data directly to Amazon. Honestly wondering when Apple is going to come out with a sexy eInk device.
• charles_f 4y ago
  > it's possible to remove this DRM protection, but it's also not something completely legal Something is legal or it's not. Is it illegal though? You clearly press on a "buy" button to purchase the book. Unless they have somewhere a clause that says you're not buying the book but license to rent it? In any case it's not immoral, and I doubt it's illegal unless you share it. Nb: don't agree with the precept, for the general use case it's much easier to buy a book. It takes a couple clicks on Amazon, and removing the DRM if you wanted to (say, if you wanted to switch to a Kobo later on) is straight forward. Finding a pirated version of a book that's not a series-A on the other hand is pretty hard.
  • themadturk 4y ago
    Removing copy protection or DRM is illegal in the USA and, upon conviction, is punishable by substantial fines and jail time. I believe that copy protection and DRM is indeed immoral, but nonetheless it is legal.
• temp2022account 4y ago
  Related thought: I've hoped that digital rights licensing would someday be improved similar to today's stock markets. The government authorizes a broker to setup a market and sell signed licenses (JSON snippets signed by the broker's key, who cares how it's implemented) for eg "1 person viewership of MOVIE_NAME", "1 room viewership of MOVIE_NAME". Sellers place limit orders, buyers do the same and/or buy/sell at the current market price. There, you've solved the financing problem in a way that's compatible with every distribution mechanism, including existing piracy platforms. Yes there's an honor system problem, but that's exactly the level of enforcement companies have now.
• faet 4y ago
  Why did you not use the "Buy For Others" option? It is directly under the "Buy now with 1-Click" option. It lets you enter any number of emails and they will send the books directly to them. Or they'll just give you redemption codes you can send out yourself. https://imgur.com/BJ4ZUCA https://imgur.com/BJ4ZUCA
• crayonviking 4y ago
  So I've had a kindle since 1st generation. Love it. BUT I never ever have my kindle on wireless. Always buy books from amazon w desktop computer, download manually, then remove DRM, then manually transfer them via usb. Never had a problem.
  • 411111111111111 4y ago
    The act of removing the DRM is illegal in a lot of places, and most definitely against the TOS of the store you bought your book on. the OPs point was that you could've just downloaded it as well. Both is illegal and downloading from one of the zlibrary mirrors is just easier and quicker at the end of the day.
• dawnerd 4y ago
  Also easier just getting an ebook from an online library legally. For example: https://www.overdrive.com/apps/libby https://www.overdrive.com/apps/libby
  • hasbot 4y ago
    At least for the libraries I'm a member of, assuming the library even has it, the wait list for nearly all books is weeks or months. And then just hope that when it becomes available, one has the time to read it.
    • dawnerd 4y ago
      Should have added that it does depend. My library has everything I want available. Only remember having to wait a week for one book.
• myself248 4y ago
  Music was this way for a while. Then the industry did what we'd been pleading them to do since the late 90s: Embrace digital distribution. Pandora appeared, then Spotify, and it became easier to go legit than to maintain a big library of pirated content. $15/mo was absolutely worth not having to worry about my ISP forwarding a DMCA notice someday, or to hassle with making sure my ID3 tags were right, or synchronizing the collection across my desktop and laptop and mobile. One Spotify worked everywhere, and I completely gave up piracy. Then some chinks appeared in the armor. Spotify turns out to suck, tracks would just randomly vanish (gray-out) from my playlists because some artist pulled a distribution deal. The support forums are an absolute wasteland of "implied #WONTFIX by profound neglect". They got into podcasting and made some questionable choices with regard to misinformation, and even more artists left. So now I'm on Deezer and it also sucks but in different and less-egregious ways. I'm back to maintaining a local stash of mp3's for certain stuff that I just can't find on streaming. (I'm paying for them now, because it turns out Bandcamp scratches that itch in the majority of cases, but the hassle factor is still there.) TV and movies were this way for a while. Then Netflix stepped up and basically made everything awesome. One payment, a world of content. Why pirate anymore? Then a dozen-plus other streaming services proliferated and fragmented the landscape, and it turns out Netflix hates Linux viewers, and so on. (I completely gave up caring about TV and movies some time ago, so this is all based on hearsay. It was easier to _remove myself from an entire art form_ than deal with the industry that controls it. Admit that wash-basin.) Are ebooks on a similar trajectory?
• ftvkyo 4y ago
  I had a similar problem with Amazon 2 years ago. Back then I recently updated my email, but still used my old card (that I paid with before) to buy some books for my Kindle. After I bought them, I got a message saying that suspicious activity has been detected on my account and that they will block it. They requested me to send them documents proving that I own the card within the next 24 hours, threatening with the account being deleted. If I recall correctly, they also specifically requested to not include more information into the documents than needed. I was able to generate a bank statement through my bank app. Not much I could do in terms of configuring what was shown there. The bank agreed to help to make a custom document if such need occurs. However, the thing is... after I sent the email to Amazon with the document, they kept replying that there is something wrong with the documents, but not saying what they didn't like. All replies were the same with little difference in them, and my subsequent attempts were not very successful. And they kept sending threatening emails with "we'll delete everything if you don't reply within 24 hours". In the end I gave up and started sending them the same bunch of documents over and over again, and finally when they stopped sending their threatening emails, some time passed and they unblocked the account, "reverting the malicious email change and purchases". What I hate the most in this story is that I have never been able to speak to a single person in Amazon. In fact, I was blocked from accessing their "famous" human support entirely -- the moment I tried to log in with my account, it would display the request for documents. Subsequently I still needed an account there, but I decided to delete the old one and create a new one with the email I needed instead, because I didn't want the story repeating. Thinking about this makes me really nervous for all the things that are tied to my google account and I am considering leaving it, but also thinking how much of an overwhelming hassle it will be.
• sircastor 4y ago
  I have no qualms about removing the DRM on ePubs that I’ve purchased. The file becomes portable so I can use it on different devices, and future proof of I ever lose access to the account, device, or if Adobe’s auth servers ever shut down. I’m happy that the author and publisher gets paid, and I get the book I want. To me, toss is preferable to piracy, though I understand why people would just want to skip the extra effort.
• gcanyon 4y ago
  All the comments here on buying vs. leasing are giving me an odd thought experiment: Suppose you "buy" a paperback book. We all know that purchase doesn't give you the right to replicate the text of the book -- probably not even as a backup copy. So if you have a house fire and the book burns, you no longer have the book you bought, and no recourse. But paperbacks don't have to burn to be useless. Hundred year old books are generally very fragile. So granted, Stephen King doesn't have the ability to remotely wipe your paperback of The Stand, but it's not eternal. It's a distinction without (much of) a difference, since the paperback will outlive you and probably your grandchildren, but it's not eternal, and so technically you don't own it, the same way you don't own digital copies. The time frame over which you don't own it is just longer.
  • ruph123 4y ago
    You don't own the text, but you do own the manifestation of the text as a physical book. Sure the text doesn't magical stay with you after a fire burns down your house (like all other items in your house) and it isn't eternal (like all other things aren't) but as long as you don't damage the item you own, it has value: the text. Weired argument to say that you don't own a thing because it can be damaged or fall apart. You own it even if it is damaged by the way. The paper shreds after the fire are still yours.
    • gcanyon 4y ago
      I should have been more clear in the final paragraph. I didn't mean you don't own the physical copy of the book. I meant you don't own the text itself. Rephrasing: It's a distinction without (much of) a difference, since the paperback will outlive you and probably your grandchildren, but [the paperback is] not eternal, and so technically you don't own [the text of the book], the same way you don't own [the text of the book when you only have] digital copies. The time frame over which you don't own [the text of the book] is just longer.
  • porcoda 4y ago
    Ownership isn’t a matter of physical existence or duration of some physical property.
• widowlark 4y ago
  On a related note, I started purchasing CD's again - not because I play them on a CD player (though I did also get one of those for my living room audio setup) - but because they are easy to rip at full quality and upload to plex. Now I have a huge collection of HD music that I own completely, with physical backup, for pennies on the dollar
• steelframe 4y ago
  I've been checking ebooks out of the library and stripping the DRM from them. That gives me the best experience with minimal hassle, and I can use Calibre to customize the format to what works best for my e-ink devices. Sometimes I have to wait a few weeks in a queue because the library has a license for a limited number of copies to be "loaned" out at once, but I have a backlog longer than I have time to read what I already have. I figure the publishers get paid the same whether I read the book during the time I have it checked out, whether I scan my ebook reader page-by-page, whether I do absolutely nothing with the digital file and let the loan period expire (probably happens all the time with other patrons), or whether I strip the DRM and keep the epub file around until I get around to reading it later. The act of checking out the ebook from the library signals demand and leads to my tax dollars and local library donations (yes, I do in fact donate to my local library) being allocated toward the publishers of those books. I've heard there are pirate web sites that host pre-stripped epub files, but I don't want my IP address logged or tracked with pirate sites, I don't want the hassle of a VPN just for the occasional ebook, and I want my taxes and donations to veer toward the publishers of the books that I prefer to read.
• tmtvl 4y ago
  Could you use those learning budget funds to donate to said authors? Saying "I'll never buy e-books again" doesn't really help solve the situation you started out with (wanting to proffer thanks).
• robotburrito 4y ago
  Even getting e-books from the library is about 10x harder than just pirating it. It's almost like they go out of their way to make it difficult so that you end up just buying it instead.
• prirun 4y ago
  I recently bought a Kindle to read Legend of Drizzt. The Kindle came with Kindle Unlimited at no cost, however, Kindle "Unlimited" is indeed very limited, as Amazon only includes certain titles with KU. I bought a few of the books for $8/book, but since they can't be resold or donated, it seemed kinda dumb. So I found out that I can rent Kindle books with my local library card. In Indiana, a bunch of public libraries are in a digital consortium that shares access to books. So for the Drizzt series, there are usually 4-5 copies of each book that can be rented for 3 weeks. It's been pretty great so far, and much better than shelling out ~$300 to read the whole series of 38 books. I will not read this again, won't use them as reference material, so "buying"/licensing them for $8 each really didn't make sense. In fact, I deleted the few I did buy after I read them.
• joegahona 4y ago
  Different problem, but I was looking for a book a few days ago that was an absurd $33 for the Kindle version on Amazon. (Paperback was a buck or two more.) I found a PDF of the book on Google after combing through about 10 links.
• slim 4y ago
  You should have bought a paper copy, put archive.org as the delivery address and thus you would have donated them. Then you should proceed to pirate them with no moral issue and minimal legal issue
• dreamcompiler 4y ago
  I've also noticed e-books from Amazon are very nearly the same price as paper books now. Sometimes they're even more expensive. Since most people understand that bits should be cheaper than atoms, this is not going to be sustainable.
• therealdrag0 4y ago
  Don’t sleep in Manning. DRM-free and simple process. Even the email receipt has a direct link to download ebook in all formats.
• nanomonkey 4y ago
  This reminds me of a paper I came across recently that suggests that copyright isn't Halaal [0]. They had a broad term of Poly-Existentials to cover all things that are easily replicated, and therefore not property. [0]http://www.by-star.net/content/generated/doc.free/mohsen/PLPC/120033/current/accessPage http://www.by-star.net/content/generated/doc.free/mohsen/PLP...
• deleted 4y ago
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• plaguepilled 4y ago
  OP is completely right that this is bad design because the fundamental issue is NOT that multiple giftcards are being made - the issue is you cannot have a Kindle shopping cart. No matter how you spin it, that's Amazon being difficult in the hopes that a few lazy shoppers will "just" buy things as they see it and not track their spending. Likewise, .epub is a garbage format. DRM does not belong on books.
• josephcsible 4y ago
  > for each of the purchase I created a new virtual card and bought them. After a few minutes my Amazon account is blocked for suspicious activity, and ALL my kindle library is wiped Accept for the sake of argument that this is a real signal of fraud. If I visit a store five times in a day and present a different physical credit card every time, they can refuse to take it this time or call the police, but they can't just force their way into my house and take back everything I had bought the previous times.
• deleted 4y ago
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• sombragris 4y ago
  There are other forms of stupidity in the book business, too. I live in a South American country. One day I needed a two volume book, and specifically, I needed vol. 2 more than vol. 1. Now, the publisher released a Kindle version for volume 1, but not for volume 2. You could get only a paper copy of vol. 2. I spoke with someone from the publisher and inquired about this circumstance. The person told me that they "forgot" to release vol. 2 in Kindle format and that they would release it "soon". Well, that was about 4 years ago, if not more. Just think about it. You can have the Vol. 1 ebook, but no Vol. 2 for ya.
• HeavyStorm 4y ago
  A lot of people in this post thread defending some that's illegal and immoral just because they realize that doing what is right is expensive and inconvenient. That's a human being for you.
• michaelcampbell 4y ago
  > since I have a kindle and didn't want to buy physical books. ... and ALL my kindle library is wiped After too many of these types of stories, yeah, I feel the OP. But then, I like physical books.
• stefek99 4y ago
  Once upon a time - corporate environment - budget for learning - I've sent the title of the book and the link - intention to supporting the author. The PDF was available on the 1st page of Google. At the end we did not complete the purchase - person responsible for shopping sent me pirated copy. (I hear what you say)
• Alifatisk 4y ago
  Webtorrent have made it very easy to stream pirated movies aswell