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Uhmm, you may want to update your knowledge on the history of the 1945-2022 period tldr: USA is the current world empire; EU are their vassals Homework: (1) f

Uhmm, you may want to update your knowledge on the history of the 1945-2022 period tldr: USA is the current world empire; EU are their vassals Homework: (1) find how many European military bases there are on US soil; (2) find how many US military bases there are on European soil;

epolanski 4y ago
We are nobody's vassals and the EU has no realistic military opponents on its borders. You're ridiculous and watch Fox news too much.
- sfusato 4y ago
  > We are nobody's vassals History contradicts you. I'm an European myself if that wasn't clear enough, so this wasn't an American telling you, an European, you are our vassals. > EU has no realistic military opponents on its borders Fully agree on this. > You're ridiculous and watch Fox news too much. I might be ridiculous to your eyes, but I certainly don't watch FoxNews.
QuarterReptile 4y ago
> (1) find how many European military bases there are on US soil To do what? Counter the Canadian threat to US American territorial integrity? Prevent war between California and ethnic Nevadans? Monitor unmanaged flows of migrants from unstable regions? Hmm, well maybe that one. But really, one of the great blessings of the US is a lack of any home-front excitement, which makes this comparison pretty silly. Not that that disagrees with the hypotheses that the US is a world empire and the EU's present existence is predicated on US military size and operations.
- 8note 4y ago
  To ensure the American government passes EU friendly laws
- sfusato 4y ago
  Right, so what for are the US military bases on European soil then? (Please spare me the part about protecting Europe from outside threats story). Would they leave if we asked nicely enough? Like Pretty please? Would it really take just that?
  - RandomLensman 4y ago
    They probably would, and a lot of US forces left after the end of the old cold war. Right now, not sure a majority/the median voter in Europe actually wants the US to leave, though.
    - sfusato 4y ago
      I want to believe you they would, but I wasn't born yesterday. I'm within less than 2-hours drive from two such US military bases that have nuclear weapons deployed there. US military bases are considered US soil de-facto, they don't need to ask permission to do anything. They can launch an attack on anyone without consulting first with the host country. Yet, on paper, we're sovereign. They've been plenty of protests in Europe over this matter this year, but they won't show them on CNN, that's for sure.
  - QuarterReptile 4y ago
    In some cases, raising the rent will do it [0]. This one looks like political brinksmanship gone wrong for all sides, and the article suggests that it's being undone right now. Random citizen asking obviously does nothing, but foreign base COs are always desperately trying to keep their forces on best behavior to minimize frustration. That's not easy when you import a bunch of guys in the age range that most often causes trouble, give them significant spending money, and remove them from past anchoring influences. It's worse when the receiving society is more orderly; I have Japan in mind. Fighting against those problems is that all political leadership generally benefits from the arrangements. The foreign host nation gets economic activity and some amount of bargaining power, and the US gets a location that obviously is helpful for some strategic objective. >Right, so what for are the US military bases on European soil then? (Please spare me the part about protecting Europe from outside threats story). An anomalous, peaceful Europe is the water that you're swimming in, and I'm trying to point out that it's wet. I recognize the limited prospects of the endeavor. Though, if it's the outside part you're rejecting, I'll acknowledge my imprecise wording. Russia is the outside threat, being outside the Western European culture that is defended, but threats come from within Europe too. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Naval_Base_Subic_Bay https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Naval_Base_Subic_Bay
- pasquinelli 4y ago
  > Not that that disagrees with the hypotheses that the US is a world empire and the EU's present existence is predicated on US military size and operations. oh, so why are you replying?
crote 4y ago
The USA is rapidly losing that status, though. Its European bases were a holdover from the Second World War, extended by the Cold War - their presence should not be seen as any indication of its current political status. In the last 20 years the USA has involved its allies into multiple pointless unwinnable wars. Human rights in the USA have been significantly eroded, and many values essential to modern society are currently being undermined. Additionally, Trump's presidency has done significant damage to a large number of diplomatic relations and resulted not only in widespread doubt about its democratic process, but a genuine coup attempt. Meanwhile, during the same 20 years the European Union and China have risen in power significantly - and both are making significant effort to curtail the power the USA has over them. Those military bases exist because the USA is still somewhat of an ally and the EU has real threats right on its border - as long as the USA is not actively hostile towards the EU, having direct access to the firepower of a gun-drunk nation is quite convenient.

epolanski 4y ago

We are nobody's vassals and the EU has no realistic military opponents on its borders. You're ridiculous and watch Fox news too much.

sfusato 4y ago
> We are nobody's vassals History contradicts you. I'm an European myself if that wasn't clear enough, so this wasn't an American telling you, an European, you are our vassals. > EU has no realistic military opponents on its borders Fully agree on this. > You're ridiculous and watch Fox news too much. I might be ridiculous to your eyes, but I certainly don't watch FoxNews.

QuarterReptile 4y ago

> (1) find how many European military bases there are on US soil To do what? Counter the Canadian threat to US American territorial integrity? Prevent war between California and ethnic Nevadans? Monitor unmanaged flows of migrants from unstable regions? Hmm, well maybe that one. But really, one of the great blessings of the US is a lack of any home-front excitement, which makes this comparison pretty silly. Not that that disagrees with the hypotheses that the US is a world empire and the EU's present existence is predicated on US military size and operations.

8note 4y ago
To ensure the American government passes EU friendly laws
sfusato 4y ago
Right, so what for are the US military bases on European soil then? (Please spare me the part about protecting Europe from outside threats story). Would they leave if we asked nicely enough? Like Pretty please? Would it really take just that?
- RandomLensman 4y ago
  They probably would, and a lot of US forces left after the end of the old cold war. Right now, not sure a majority/the median voter in Europe actually wants the US to leave, though.
  - sfusato 4y ago
    I want to believe you they would, but I wasn't born yesterday. I'm within less than 2-hours drive from two such US military bases that have nuclear weapons deployed there. US military bases are considered US soil de-facto, they don't need to ask permission to do anything. They can launch an attack on anyone without consulting first with the host country. Yet, on paper, we're sovereign. They've been plenty of protests in Europe over this matter this year, but they won't show them on CNN, that's for sure.
- QuarterReptile 4y ago
  In some cases, raising the rent will do it [0]. This one looks like political brinksmanship gone wrong for all sides, and the article suggests that it's being undone right now. Random citizen asking obviously does nothing, but foreign base COs are always desperately trying to keep their forces on best behavior to minimize frustration. That's not easy when you import a bunch of guys in the age range that most often causes trouble, give them significant spending money, and remove them from past anchoring influences. It's worse when the receiving society is more orderly; I have Japan in mind. Fighting against those problems is that all political leadership generally benefits from the arrangements. The foreign host nation gets economic activity and some amount of bargaining power, and the US gets a location that obviously is helpful for some strategic objective. >Right, so what for are the US military bases on European soil then? (Please spare me the part about protecting Europe from outside threats story). An anomalous, peaceful Europe is the water that you're swimming in, and I'm trying to point out that it's wet. I recognize the limited prospects of the endeavor. Though, if it's the outside part you're rejecting, I'll acknowledge my imprecise wording. Russia is the outside threat, being outside the Western European culture that is defended, but threats come from within Europe too. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Naval_Base_Subic_Bay https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Naval_Base_Subic_Bay
pasquinelli 4y ago
> Not that that disagrees with the hypotheses that the US is a world empire and the EU's present existence is predicated on US military size and operations. oh, so why are you replying?

crote 4y ago

The USA is rapidly losing that status, though. Its European bases were a holdover from the Second World War, extended by the Cold War - their presence should not be seen as any indication of its current political status. In the last 20 years the USA has involved its allies into multiple pointless unwinnable wars. Human rights in the USA have been significantly eroded, and many values essential to modern society are currently being undermined. Additionally, Trump's presidency has done significant damage to a large number of diplomatic relations and resulted not only in widespread doubt about its democratic process, but a genuine coup attempt. Meanwhile, during the same 20 years the European Union and China have risen in power significantly - and both are making significant effort to curtail the power the USA has over them. Those military bases exist because the USA is still somewhat of an ally and the EU has real threats right on its border - as long as the USA is not actively hostile towards the EU, having direct access to the firepower of a gun-drunk nation is quite convenient.