8 ms·

What frequent fliers do for status

38 points by lxm 4y ago

defrost 4y ago
https://archive.ph/47C1z https://archive.ph/47C1z It's commercial pasengers taking extra trips to retain FF perks. > Their goal: Fly and spend enough to maintain or upgrade their elite status with the carrier they fly most, with the promise of upgrades, free checked bags and bonus miles for the following year. The title given currently The Frequent Fliers Who Go To Extremes had me wondering if this was to be tales of daring do from those who clock up a million+ line kms in flight on a routine basis.
- sublinear 4y ago
  This is unrelated, but I just had to look up "daring" vs "derring" and unearthed a factoid others may enjoy. Apparently the technically correct spelling is "derring" because of a 16th century misprint. Perhaps being technically correct is not the "best kind of correct" this time.
  - defrost 4y ago
    No drama, FWiW I'm familiar with the history of the phrase from Middle English, through Chaucer, Spenser, and Walter Scott .. and I'd suggest "misprint in the 16th Century" is a bit simplistic as language in that region in those times had an exuberance of spellynges until Samuel Johnson took a stab at nailing jelly to the wall. I toss a mental coin any time I come to type such a phrase and note that we still translate the progenitor "dorryng do" as 'daring to do' and have derring-do littered throughout every volume of Ripping Yarns so it seems passable to spilt the difference. :-)
pknomad 4y ago
Having reached 1K status with United this year (many trips from SFO to IAD, LAX, EWR, ATL, and now HND at the end of the year), I do question if the status is even worth it. I feel like United (and other airline carriers) already have way more data and know how to optimize the seats so that these extra flights these passengers take gives them a bigger profit at the end. 1K status gets you early boarding and extra free checked luggage for sure but the free upgrades rarely happen, especially for popular lines like SFO to EWR.
- filoleg 4y ago
  it depends. I don't fly enough to look into the details, but a few years ago I ended up reaching the second lowest tier on Delta (gold iirc), and I would get free upgrades about half the time for my flights that year. Routes were from seattle to all over the place (NYC, SF, LA, ATL, etc) and back.
  - sokoloff 4y ago
    2nd lowest is gold; 2nd highest is platinum (behind diamond). I usually get to platinum and, except for the bus routes (to/from ATL), I get first class upgrades on almost 75% of my domestic segments. Add in ATL segments (full of diamond flyers) and it’s probably down to the 50% you mention for gold. It’s very route specific. I have noticed a lot of domestic first-class seats or post-purchase upgrades have become cheaper during COVID to get the airline some revenue from that seat rather than upgrading you or I.
- partdavid 4y ago
  I have gold on United and get CPUs more often than not but these are often short flights, or even regional routes on Skywest, so that's really a crapshoot depending on the route, I think. I'll take the other benefits, too, and they're "worth it" as long as you don't spend a bunch of money to get them. There's a real dollar benefit to free Economy Plus, checked bags and the mileage multiple; but of course how much that's worth to you depends on what's important to you, let alone the intangibles like pre-boarding or better customer service. So far, the status and miles I've earned haven't involved spending any money I wouldn't have otherwise. With the sometimes exception of spending a little more to stick with United. Which is of course the point of a loyalty program. But I've never spent more on that increment than I've recovered in benefit on that flight (like from free Economy Plus). But who knows? Maybe I'll get so addicted I'll be tempted to make a "mileage run".
- dehrmann 4y ago
  > early boarding Yay. Let me pay for the privilege of sitting in a cramped seat in a cramped aluminum can longer than I have to.
fauria 4y ago
https://12ft.io/https://www.wsj.com/articles/airlines-frequent-flier-status-mileage-run-11671562815 https://12ft.io/https://www.wsj.com/articles/airlines-freque... Or https://archive.md/47C1z https://archive.md/47C1z
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
tannedNerd 4y ago
I did this a bunch during the cheap award flights during the pandemic, when they started counting those toward status points. I basically skipped getting a coworking spot for a month and would hop on random flights I could book like SAN-JFK round trip same day on delta for only 16,000 skymiles (would net around 5,000 mqms). I would almost always get bumped to first and Deltas wifi is reliable enough to work from the air. At this point I’ve banked enough MQMs that I just have to hit the spend min on my Amex (easy when you are self employed and can pay taxes on it) to keep platinum for the next 3 years without any flying.
- coderintherye 4y ago
  At a credit card fee of 1.98%, that's a non-trivial amount of money to have to spend on fees depending on how much you pay in taxes (looks like IRS charges based on processor but it is between 1.86-1.98%)
  - khuey 4y ago
    In practice that fee works out to at most a $500 buy-in for Platinum status on Delta. You can also immediately opt for a $200 travel voucher as your Platinum benefit. I could see why some might think it's worth it.
    - sokoloff 4y ago
      Starting in 2023, mere platinum doesn’t get you lounge access on international flights, but the affiliate credit cards do. That’s worth $20+ in real value on each international segment (the sticker price is higher, but there’s at least $20 of convenience and comfort to wait in the club over the boarding area).
      - khuey 4y ago
        Hmm I wonder how that is going to work since lounge access is a SkyTeam Elite Plus benefit.
phpisthebest 4y ago
I cant image flying that much. I am old enough to remember pre-911 flying and how much better it was before the TSA and their "Stand here with no shoes while we treat you like a criminal" procedures. Today if my destination is with in a 10hr drive from me, I am driving. Does not even really cost me that much time as with connections, and security it takes about as long to fly anyway that is assuming it is not delayed or cancelled. Of the 10 flights I have taken in the last 3 years or so, 60% of them had some kind of delay or cancellation during one of the legs. Plus side I have gotten very good at packing density so I can take a weeks worth of provisions in my carry on backpack easily. No checked bags for me....
- wetpaws 4y ago
  TSA precheck makes everythin a breeze on domestic flights. International flights are a whole new beast though.
- Scoundreller 4y ago
  > Stand here with no shoes They now sell you a solution to bypass that step. Surely a little background check proves your shoes are safe.
  - ethanbond 4y ago
    Why wouldn’t it?
  - coin 4y ago
    "Racket" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeering https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeering > offer a service to solve a nonexistent problem, or offer a service that solves a problem that would not exist without the racket Operating a racket is called racketeering.
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      At least that racket pays the government directly. They came up with another racket to skip further in the line lets a private company take a cut for bribing the government to let you skip to the front and buy back some of your time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clear_Secure https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clear_Secure
poidos 4y ago
Seems very wasteful to be taking extra, unnecessary flights for perks, no matter how big. I don’t care about the fliers’ money, that’s theirs to do what they want with. But the environmental costs are non-nil (even accounting for the fact that those flights would be going regardless of if they fly on them) and can’t be worth the perks for these privileged few.
- woleium 4y ago
  I guess if the plane is going anyway..
- xwdv 4y ago
  I don’t understand the environmental shaming. Does the plane work harder for each person that boards? Seems like the plane is going to fly the route anyway. We’re not talking private jets here.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - sokoloff 4y ago
    It does work harder by weight carried. There is some induced drag for every pound of lift and, in unaccelerated flight (most of it), lift and weight are exactly balanced. My piston-engine airplane goes about 3% faster on the same fuel flow (power) at the end of a long flight than the start. That’s the effect of reduced drag from the lower weight.
    - xwdv 4y ago
      Ok, so what’s the environmental impact of the individual?
      - 1659447091 4y ago
        I am not sure there would be much difference in impact since the airline would fill unused weight allowance with other cargo.
Traubenfuchs 4y ago
When I was with Accenture I booked multistop flights to get my star alliance frequent flyer status sooner. This year I just went to random European locations doing wfh vacations (not telling my company because it would have needed approval). I really, really don‘t want to queue for security checks with the dirty masses and their nasty offspring. Good times.
- selimthegrim 4y ago
  I presume when you quit Accenture you were promoted away from belonging to the great unwashed
  - Traubenfuchs 4y ago
    Being precise, anything but having reached a point where you could stop working forever without having to reduce your standard of living means being part of the unwashen masses, so, no. Another indicator of not being part of the unwashen masses is being able to afford business/first class, so you get the priority security check lane a la carte.
nullc 4y ago
I once worked in job which included constant travel. More than once I saw one of my colleagues take a flight the wrong way around the earth-- e.g. flying London to DC via Japan-- in order to get the miles they needed to maintain their status. Being on an airplane has always made me feel a little ill (from fumes or reduced air pressure?)-- even though at one point I was regularly flying cross country multiple times per week, so I can't imagine voluntarily spending more time in one than strictly necessary. Last night we watched "Up in the Air" (don't believe the claims that it's a comedy-- it's a drama, and a good one) and I found its depiction of a life of constant air travel and people in the milage rat race quite familiar.
- sokoloff 4y ago
  Having done travel US to/from Japan and India, I can’t imagine doing that either. Even in business class lay-flat seats, it’s still a miserable experience and in premium or normal economy, it’s even worse. When I first arrived in Tokyo from Detroit, my thought was “well, I guess I live here now, because I’m sure not taking that return flight…”
  - nullc 4y ago
    We flew first or business on any trip over a certain duration (and more often depending on people's willingness to use their miles)-- but still. Business class on an international meant that there was at least a chance I could sleep some on a redeye and be able to stagger into a meeting some flight fan scheduled right after our arrival; but it doesn't actually make the experience a good one. > When I first arrived in Tokyo from Detroit, my thought was “well, I guess I live here now, because I’m sure not taking that return flight…” Haha. I've been right there. I've only been back to Europe twice after relocating to the west coast (from DC)-- flying from SFO to Edinburgh was a final straw for me. The trip back I tried to work it out so I could stay on the east coast a couple days before finishing my trip but couldn't make the schedule work.
diebeforei485 4y ago
Does "conservation advocacy" mean environment stuff? The carbon emissions of unproductive flying must be immense. Airlines should let people just pay the fare and get the miles without flying. Win for the people (saves their time and money), win for the airline (they save on marginal price of jet fuel and food/drinks), and win for the environment.
- erehweb 4y ago
  Many airlines will let you buy miles, but (at least at American Airlines), these don't count towards status. I wonder why they don't offer that. Maybe to make it seem less explicitly transactional? https://www.aa.com/aadvantage-program/buy-gift-transfer/en_US/home/buy https://www.aa.com/aadvantage-program/buy-gift-transfer/en_U...
- greggarious 4y ago
  I don’t listen to greens ever since I moved back to my hometown to find they hadn’t raised the minimum wage in the decade I’d been gone or really do anything of note but hell so loudly about nuclear energy they split the vote so pro fracking ppl won and [checks notes] decriminalized weed? (No rental protections, no reforms aside from ones like rebates for a hybrid that benefit rich white professor types) We need to reward folks who go child free or car free as much as we reward companies that frack instead of blow coal.
dhosek 4y ago
In 1998, I worked for a while on the flight cancelation software for United Airlines. The number of factors that come into play in determining which flights should get canceled for, e.g., bad weather is fascinating (flights are always canceled in pairs so that planes and crew won’t have to deadhead to be where they need to be). The one that sticks with me the most was that having a high-milage frequent flier on a flight would make that flight less likely to be canceled.
- erk__ 4y ago
  Getting crew around is a interesting problem, it is not long ago that the railways in the Netherlands had to stay still for a day because their crew planning software had broken. And as I understand getting it to match up is a pretty big NP-complete problem so it can take long time to solve it.
  - mvnuweucxqokii 4y ago
    I once sat next to a SkyWest pilot on a flight. I was asking him how they assigned pilots and crews to flights. He told me that they actually had an internal auction system where crew members bid on "trips". A "trip" is a sequence of several flights over the course of a few days to a week that will all be crewed by the same people. Individual employees were allocated "money" to bid with (not real money, of course) according to seniority, so more senior crew would almost always get the most favorable trips, e.g. those composed entirely of non-redeye flights, etc.
- Matumio 4y ago
  > flight cancelation software Just to be clear, this was the software that made the decision about cancellation? (Otherwise, it would be somewhat expected that flights of frequent fliers are less likely cancelled. I suppose they learn to avoid those flights.)
  - dhosek 4y ago
    It was the software for flight cancellations. The variables that go into the decision making are such that it would be difficult for anyone on the outside to predict what the most likely flight to be canceled would be. Interestingly, there was a case of this with my wife’s trip to Mexico where her flight on Aeromexico departed on Thursday while a united flight at the same time was canceled since they couldn’t guarantee that the return flight would be able to travel in a timely fashion.
gumby 4y ago
Seems like these deadweight flights are self-defeating. The $1,300 for the lightning trip would instead pay for a lot of checked bags and seat upgrades.
- StanislavPetrov 4y ago
  It all depends on how often you fly and where you go. A close friend of mine who flies around the country weekly for business was just a few miles below achieving Diamond status on Delta for the year, and all of the free upgrades to 1st class, other freebies, Crown Room access, ect made it well worth it to take a flight to nowhere in order to maintain this level.
meling 4y ago
I fly premium economy from Europe to the US 3-4 times per year, and this is usually enough to keep my top-tier status. I fly SAS (preferably) and I try to fly on less popular times of the year/days of the week, which increases my chances of getting upgraded. I avoid connections in the US if I can because I rarely get good seats as a non-United ff.
mr_woozy 4y ago
[dead]
2143 4y ago
For me getting to the United States involves going through another big airport (because the airport in my town does not have a direct flight to the US). For my specific situation, Etihad usually ended up having the most favorable travel duration, connection time, arrival and departure time, price etc. With Etihad, it's about 4 hours from my hometown to Abu Dhabi (AUH), and 15 hours from there to LAX. It only took me a couple of to and fro journeys to get the silver card status. And by next year I was a gold card member, with lounge access in Abu Dhabi and Los Angeles. It was hilarious because I was only making a couple of journeys a year. Also, I see comments here about the TSA screening situation. Did you know that there's a US customs & immigration + TSA counter at Abu Dhabi?! If you're traveling to the US from Abu Dhabi, you have to get all the immigration processes (passport/visa verification and other stuff) done from the American consular officers at Abu Dhabi [1]. On your passport, the port of entry will be marked as AUH. And the aircraft will fly as a domestic flight into the domestic terminal of your destination in the US. No immigration procedure in the US because it's already been done before the flight. Multiple advantages to this: 1. If you anyway have a connecting flight to the US at AUH and have a couple of hours of waiting time, you can get the immigration process done whilst waiting for your connection. 2. (Convoluted logic follows) If for whatever reason you're denied entry to the US, in my case atleast, I would only have a 4 hours return time back to my hometown, as opposed to a 24+ hours of return time if I were denied entry once I physically reached the US. That's after traveling 24+ hours to get there in the first place. Cheaper and more convenient for everyone involved. 3. After your 15 hour flight to the US, you can take your luggage and walk out instead of having to go through the US immigration and customs processes when you're tired after the long journey. [1] https://www.abudhabiairport.ae/en/services-and-facilities/us-pre-clearance-facility https://www.abudhabiairport.ae/en/services-and-facilities/us...
- RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u 4y ago
  > Did you know that there's a US customs & immigration + TSA counter at Abu Dhabi?! [...] [a]nd the aircraft will fly as a domestic flight into the domestic terminal of your destination in the US. This is also the case when you fly out of Shannon airport[0]. Incidentally, if you're arriving at LAX, there's another way to "bypass" immigration & customs, but it'll cost you dearly[1]. [0] https://www.shannonairport.ie/passengers/at-the-airport/flying-out/travel-requirements/us-customs-border-pre-clearance/ https://www.shannonairport.ie/passengers/at-the-airport/flyi... [1] https://reserveps.com/ https://reserveps.com/
tiffanyh 4y ago
Misalignment of incentives. People typically achieve travel status on their employers dime. Since the individual personally benefits from gaining status (and reward points), it’s not surprising that people do things not in their employers interest (buying a more expensive ticket, or taking a longer flight) since they benefit.
- greggarious 4y ago
  And congress made sure airline perks aren’t taxable income
amadeuspagel 4y ago
How does this make sense economically? Why do airlines offer these complex, gamable reward programs? Why do they not simply charge for whatever privileges frequent fliers get?

38 points by lxm 4y ago

https://archive.ph/47C1z https://archive.ph/47C1z It's commercial pasengers taking extra trips to retain FF perks. > Their goal: Fly and spend enough to maintain or upgrade their elite status with the carrier they fly most, with the promise of upgrades, free checked bags and bonus miles for the following year. The title given currently The Frequent Fliers Who Go To Extremes had me wondering if this was to be tales of daring do from those who clock up a million+ line kms in flight on a routine basis.

sublinear 4y ago
This is unrelated, but I just had to look up "daring" vs "derring" and unearthed a factoid others may enjoy. Apparently the technically correct spelling is "derring" because of a 16th century misprint. Perhaps being technically correct is not the "best kind of correct" this time.
- defrost 4y ago
  No drama, FWiW I'm familiar with the history of the phrase from Middle English, through Chaucer, Spenser, and Walter Scott .. and I'd suggest "misprint in the 16th Century" is a bit simplistic as language in that region in those times had an exuberance of spellynges until Samuel Johnson took a stab at nailing jelly to the wall. I toss a mental coin any time I come to type such a phrase and note that we still translate the progenitor "dorryng do" as 'daring to do' and have derring-do littered throughout every volume of Ripping Yarns so it seems passable to spilt the difference. :-)

pknomad 4y ago

Having reached 1K status with United this year (many trips from SFO to IAD, LAX, EWR, ATL, and now HND at the end of the year), I do question if the status is even worth it. I feel like United (and other airline carriers) already have way more data and know how to optimize the seats so that these extra flights these passengers take gives them a bigger profit at the end. 1K status gets you early boarding and extra free checked luggage for sure but the free upgrades rarely happen, especially for popular lines like SFO to EWR.

filoleg 4y ago
it depends. I don't fly enough to look into the details, but a few years ago I ended up reaching the second lowest tier on Delta (gold iirc), and I would get free upgrades about half the time for my flights that year. Routes were from seattle to all over the place (NYC, SF, LA, ATL, etc) and back.
- sokoloff 4y ago
  2nd lowest is gold; 2nd highest is platinum (behind diamond). I usually get to platinum and, except for the bus routes (to/from ATL), I get first class upgrades on almost 75% of my domestic segments. Add in ATL segments (full of diamond flyers) and it’s probably down to the 50% you mention for gold. It’s very route specific. I have noticed a lot of domestic first-class seats or post-purchase upgrades have become cheaper during COVID to get the airline some revenue from that seat rather than upgrading you or I.
partdavid 4y ago
I have gold on United and get CPUs more often than not but these are often short flights, or even regional routes on Skywest, so that's really a crapshoot depending on the route, I think. I'll take the other benefits, too, and they're "worth it" as long as you don't spend a bunch of money to get them. There's a real dollar benefit to free Economy Plus, checked bags and the mileage multiple; but of course how much that's worth to you depends on what's important to you, let alone the intangibles like pre-boarding or better customer service. So far, the status and miles I've earned haven't involved spending any money I wouldn't have otherwise. With the sometimes exception of spending a little more to stick with United. Which is of course the point of a loyalty program. But I've never spent more on that increment than I've recovered in benefit on that flight (like from free Economy Plus). But who knows? Maybe I'll get so addicted I'll be tempted to make a "mileage run".
dehrmann 4y ago
> early boarding Yay. Let me pay for the privilege of sitting in a cramped seat in a cramped aluminum can longer than I have to.

fauria 4y ago

https://12ft.io/https://www.wsj.com/articles/airlines-frequent-flier-status-mileage-run-11671562815 https://12ft.io/https://www.wsj.com/articles/airlines-freque... Or https://archive.md/47C1z https://archive.md/47C1z

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

tannedNerd 4y ago

I did this a bunch during the cheap award flights during the pandemic, when they started counting those toward status points. I basically skipped getting a coworking spot for a month and would hop on random flights I could book like SAN-JFK round trip same day on delta for only 16,000 skymiles (would net around 5,000 mqms). I would almost always get bumped to first and Deltas wifi is reliable enough to work from the air. At this point I’ve banked enough MQMs that I just have to hit the spend min on my Amex (easy when you are self employed and can pay taxes on it) to keep platinum for the next 3 years without any flying.

coderintherye 4y ago
At a credit card fee of 1.98%, that's a non-trivial amount of money to have to spend on fees depending on how much you pay in taxes (looks like IRS charges based on processor but it is between 1.86-1.98%)
- khuey 4y ago
  In practice that fee works out to at most a $500 buy-in for Platinum status on Delta. You can also immediately opt for a $200 travel voucher as your Platinum benefit. I could see why some might think it's worth it.
  - sokoloff 4y ago
    Starting in 2023, mere platinum doesn’t get you lounge access on international flights, but the affiliate credit cards do. That’s worth $20+ in real value on each international segment (the sticker price is higher, but there’s at least $20 of convenience and comfort to wait in the club over the boarding area).
    - khuey 4y ago
      Hmm I wonder how that is going to work since lounge access is a SkyTeam Elite Plus benefit.

phpisthebest 4y ago

I cant image flying that much. I am old enough to remember pre-911 flying and how much better it was before the TSA and their "Stand here with no shoes while we treat you like a criminal" procedures. Today if my destination is with in a 10hr drive from me, I am driving. Does not even really cost me that much time as with connections, and security it takes about as long to fly anyway that is assuming it is not delayed or cancelled. Of the 10 flights I have taken in the last 3 years or so, 60% of them had some kind of delay or cancellation during one of the legs. Plus side I have gotten very good at packing density so I can take a weeks worth of provisions in my carry on backpack easily. No checked bags for me....

wetpaws 4y ago
TSA precheck makes everythin a breeze on domestic flights. International flights are a whole new beast though.
Scoundreller 4y ago
> Stand here with no shoes They now sell you a solution to bypass that step. Surely a little background check proves your shoes are safe.
- ethanbond 4y ago
  Why wouldn’t it?
- coin 4y ago
  "Racket" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeering https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeering > offer a service to solve a nonexistent problem, or offer a service that solves a problem that would not exist without the racket Operating a racket is called racketeering.
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    At least that racket pays the government directly. They came up with another racket to skip further in the line lets a private company take a cut for bribing the government to let you skip to the front and buy back some of your time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clear_Secure https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clear_Secure

poidos 4y ago

Seems very wasteful to be taking extra, unnecessary flights for perks, no matter how big. I don’t care about the fliers’ money, that’s theirs to do what they want with. But the environmental costs are non-nil (even accounting for the fact that those flights would be going regardless of if they fly on them) and can’t be worth the perks for these privileged few.

woleium 4y ago
I guess if the plane is going anyway..
xwdv 4y ago
I don’t understand the environmental shaming. Does the plane work harder for each person that boards? Seems like the plane is going to fly the route anyway. We’re not talking private jets here.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- sokoloff 4y ago
  It does work harder by weight carried. There is some induced drag for every pound of lift and, in unaccelerated flight (most of it), lift and weight are exactly balanced. My piston-engine airplane goes about 3% faster on the same fuel flow (power) at the end of a long flight than the start. That’s the effect of reduced drag from the lower weight.
  - xwdv 4y ago
    Ok, so what’s the environmental impact of the individual?
    - 1659447091 4y ago
      I am not sure there would be much difference in impact since the airline would fill unused weight allowance with other cargo.

Traubenfuchs 4y ago

When I was with Accenture I booked multistop flights to get my star alliance frequent flyer status sooner. This year I just went to random European locations doing wfh vacations (not telling my company because it would have needed approval). I really, really don‘t want to queue for security checks with the dirty masses and their nasty offspring. Good times.

selimthegrim 4y ago
I presume when you quit Accenture you were promoted away from belonging to the great unwashed
- Traubenfuchs 4y ago
  Being precise, anything but having reached a point where you could stop working forever without having to reduce your standard of living means being part of the unwashen masses, so, no. Another indicator of not being part of the unwashen masses is being able to afford business/first class, so you get the priority security check lane a la carte.

nullc 4y ago

I once worked in job which included constant travel. More than once I saw one of my colleagues take a flight the wrong way around the earth-- e.g. flying London to DC via Japan-- in order to get the miles they needed to maintain their status. Being on an airplane has always made me feel a little ill (from fumes or reduced air pressure?)-- even though at one point I was regularly flying cross country multiple times per week, so I can't imagine voluntarily spending more time in one than strictly necessary. Last night we watched "Up in the Air" (don't believe the claims that it's a comedy-- it's a drama, and a good one) and I found its depiction of a life of constant air travel and people in the milage rat race quite familiar.

sokoloff 4y ago
Having done travel US to/from Japan and India, I can’t imagine doing that either. Even in business class lay-flat seats, it’s still a miserable experience and in premium or normal economy, it’s even worse. When I first arrived in Tokyo from Detroit, my thought was “well, I guess I live here now, because I’m sure not taking that return flight…”
- nullc 4y ago
  We flew first or business on any trip over a certain duration (and more often depending on people's willingness to use their miles)-- but still. Business class on an international meant that there was at least a chance I could sleep some on a redeye and be able to stagger into a meeting some flight fan scheduled right after our arrival; but it doesn't actually make the experience a good one. > When I first arrived in Tokyo from Detroit, my thought was “well, I guess I live here now, because I’m sure not taking that return flight…” Haha. I've been right there. I've only been back to Europe twice after relocating to the west coast (from DC)-- flying from SFO to Edinburgh was a final straw for me. The trip back I tried to work it out so I could stay on the east coast a couple days before finishing my trip but couldn't make the schedule work.

diebeforei485 4y ago

Does "conservation advocacy" mean environment stuff? The carbon emissions of unproductive flying must be immense. Airlines should let people just pay the fare and get the miles without flying. Win for the people (saves their time and money), win for the airline (they save on marginal price of jet fuel and food/drinks), and win for the environment.

erehweb 4y ago
Many airlines will let you buy miles, but (at least at American Airlines), these don't count towards status. I wonder why they don't offer that. Maybe to make it seem less explicitly transactional? https://www.aa.com/aadvantage-program/buy-gift-transfer/en_US/home/buy https://www.aa.com/aadvantage-program/buy-gift-transfer/en_U...
greggarious 4y ago
I don’t listen to greens ever since I moved back to my hometown to find they hadn’t raised the minimum wage in the decade I’d been gone or really do anything of note but hell so loudly about nuclear energy they split the vote so pro fracking ppl won and [checks notes] decriminalized weed? (No rental protections, no reforms aside from ones like rebates for a hybrid that benefit rich white professor types) We need to reward folks who go child free or car free as much as we reward companies that frack instead of blow coal.

dhosek 4y ago

In 1998, I worked for a while on the flight cancelation software for United Airlines. The number of factors that come into play in determining which flights should get canceled for, e.g., bad weather is fascinating (flights are always canceled in pairs so that planes and crew won’t have to deadhead to be where they need to be). The one that sticks with me the most was that having a high-milage frequent flier on a flight would make that flight less likely to be canceled.

erk__ 4y ago
Getting crew around is a interesting problem, it is not long ago that the railways in the Netherlands had to stay still for a day because their crew planning software had broken. And as I understand getting it to match up is a pretty big NP-complete problem so it can take long time to solve it.
- mvnuweucxqokii 4y ago
  I once sat next to a SkyWest pilot on a flight. I was asking him how they assigned pilots and crews to flights. He told me that they actually had an internal auction system where crew members bid on "trips". A "trip" is a sequence of several flights over the course of a few days to a week that will all be crewed by the same people. Individual employees were allocated "money" to bid with (not real money, of course) according to seniority, so more senior crew would almost always get the most favorable trips, e.g. those composed entirely of non-redeye flights, etc.
Matumio 4y ago
> flight cancelation software Just to be clear, this was the software that made the decision about cancellation? (Otherwise, it would be somewhat expected that flights of frequent fliers are less likely cancelled. I suppose they learn to avoid those flights.)
- dhosek 4y ago
  It was the software for flight cancellations. The variables that go into the decision making are such that it would be difficult for anyone on the outside to predict what the most likely flight to be canceled would be. Interestingly, there was a case of this with my wife’s trip to Mexico where her flight on Aeromexico departed on Thursday while a united flight at the same time was canceled since they couldn’t guarantee that the return flight would be able to travel in a timely fashion.

gumby 4y ago

Seems like these deadweight flights are self-defeating. The $1,300 for the lightning trip would instead pay for a lot of checked bags and seat upgrades.

StanislavPetrov 4y ago
It all depends on how often you fly and where you go. A close friend of mine who flies around the country weekly for business was just a few miles below achieving Diamond status on Delta for the year, and all of the free upgrades to 1st class, other freebies, Crown Room access, ect made it well worth it to take a flight to nowhere in order to maintain this level.

meling 4y ago

I fly premium economy from Europe to the US 3-4 times per year, and this is usually enough to keep my top-tier status. I fly SAS (preferably) and I try to fly on less popular times of the year/days of the week, which increases my chances of getting upgraded. I avoid connections in the US if I can because I rarely get good seats as a non-United ff.

mr_woozy 4y ago

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2143 4y ago

For me getting to the United States involves going through another big airport (because the airport in my town does not have a direct flight to the US). For my specific situation, Etihad usually ended up having the most favorable travel duration, connection time, arrival and departure time, price etc. With Etihad, it's about 4 hours from my hometown to Abu Dhabi (AUH), and 15 hours from there to LAX. It only took me a couple of to and fro journeys to get the silver card status. And by next year I was a gold card member, with lounge access in Abu Dhabi and Los Angeles. It was hilarious because I was only making a couple of journeys a year. Also, I see comments here about the TSA screening situation. Did you know that there's a US customs & immigration + TSA counter at Abu Dhabi?! If you're traveling to the US from Abu Dhabi, you have to get all the immigration processes (passport/visa verification and other stuff) done from the American consular officers at Abu Dhabi [1]. On your passport, the port of entry will be marked as AUH. And the aircraft will fly as a domestic flight into the domestic terminal of your destination in the US. No immigration procedure in the US because it's already been done before the flight. Multiple advantages to this: 1. If you anyway have a connecting flight to the US at AUH and have a couple of hours of waiting time, you can get the immigration process done whilst waiting for your connection. 2. (Convoluted logic follows) If for whatever reason you're denied entry to the US, in my case atleast, I would only have a 4 hours return time back to my hometown, as opposed to a 24+ hours of return time if I were denied entry once I physically reached the US. That's after traveling 24+ hours to get there in the first place. Cheaper and more convenient for everyone involved. 3. After your 15 hour flight to the US, you can take your luggage and walk out instead of having to go through the US immigration and customs processes when you're tired after the long journey. [1] https://www.abudhabiairport.ae/en/services-and-facilities/us-pre-clearance-facility https://www.abudhabiairport.ae/en/services-and-facilities/us...

RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u 4y ago
> Did you know that there's a US customs & immigration + TSA counter at Abu Dhabi?! [...] [a]nd the aircraft will fly as a domestic flight into the domestic terminal of your destination in the US. This is also the case when you fly out of Shannon airport[0]. Incidentally, if you're arriving at LAX, there's another way to "bypass" immigration & customs, but it'll cost you dearly[1]. [0] https://www.shannonairport.ie/passengers/at-the-airport/flying-out/travel-requirements/us-customs-border-pre-clearance/ https://www.shannonairport.ie/passengers/at-the-airport/flyi... [1] https://reserveps.com/ https://reserveps.com/

tiffanyh 4y ago

Misalignment of incentives. People typically achieve travel status on their employers dime. Since the individual personally benefits from gaining status (and reward points), it’s not surprising that people do things not in their employers interest (buying a more expensive ticket, or taking a longer flight) since they benefit.

greggarious 4y ago
And congress made sure airline perks aren’t taxable income

amadeuspagel 4y ago

How does this make sense economically? Why do airlines offer these complex, gamable reward programs? Why do they not simply charge for whatever privileges frequent fliers get?