5 ms·

> The loan industry really enables a life of debt. It really does, and I've seen so many people fall into it, especially at the beginning of their career. Fina

by fathyb 4y ago

> The loan industry really enables a life of debt. It really does, and I've seen so many people fall into it, especially at the beginning of their career. Financial responsibility should be something taught early on at schools. With cryptos today, maybe even with the risks behind investing. That said, I'm glad I live in the majority of countries where someone more privileged than me cannot judge my financial decisions to give me access to housing. I consider myself financially responsible, and credit scores aren't a thing here anyway, but I find it very disturbing.

josephcsible 4y ago
What happens in your country if you move into a house and then just stop paying?
- into_infinity 4y ago
  It is pretty unusual in most parts of the world for landlords to get access to one's credit records. Credit reporting is a pretty US-specific phenomenon, even if you're applying for a bank loan or a credit card. You usually present proof of earnings and possibly references from previous landlords. And if you get unlucky - well, same as in the US, in many of the nicest markets, you're facing an uphill battle to evict people.
  - dazc 4y ago
    In the UK you invariably rent through an agent who has access to credit reporting, the cost of which is passed on to both you and the landlord. If you're self employed or a company director then there are a few other things you have to pay for, £45 to look at your balance sheet, for example, which is freely available to anyone else. I know a few landlords and despite the efforts they take to find the perfect tenant, they all have tales to tell of people who passed all the tests with flying colours but soon turned out to be a costly disaster.
  - pcthrowaway 4y ago
    Completely normal in Canada also
  - oezi 4y ago
    I guess it depends per country. In Germany it has become common that the landlord will require a credit score (called Schufa) plus the things you mentioned (3 months of pay slips, references of balances paid from past landlord). Strong data protection rules have made it that there is now a credit score report which is only giving you a pass/fail so that landlords don't know too many details.
    - wink 4y ago
      AFAICT Schufa is not like a US credit score. It's just OK/NOT OK, or a list of "infractions". Which means if you always paid your stuff on time, a virtual +1 is the same as a +1000, and the visible result will just be "OK" and after a while the entries will age out if it was a "NOT OK"
  - EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 4y ago
    US has very strict non-discrimination laws in housing. Requesting credit reports is a way to circumvent those laws.
  - sadpasture 4y ago
    Standard practice in Germany, although the credit system here is a bit better than the US since it works by "demerits" rather than "building credit". Meaning you start out high, and only lose credit if you fail to make payments on a loan. Also I think landlords can only see a high level summary and final score, not the details of your financial situation.
- tpxl 4y ago
  One of three things happens in my country: * A mafioso comes for a chat with the tenant and they move out. This rarely happens. * The case is presented to court and they'll evict the tenant in about 2 months. This usually happens. * The tenant has small children and is poor. The owner is fucked as the court won't do anything - the tenants children have a basic human right to a roof over their head. This also rarely happens, but when it does, the damages are huge. My great aunt lost 1-2 years of rent and about 10k in damages due to neglect this way. Because of this, there are interviews for tenants. Mostly just a chat, but rarely you need to prove you're employed and provide bank statements.
- walkhour 4y ago
  What happens in most cases is that rents go up, because landlords have to factor in this uncertainty. And the debt of the non paying tenants is collectivized.
  - yakak 4y ago
    Rental prices are based on the rental market price and then affect house prices. A landlord deciding they aren't going to make enough for their risk at the market rate and selling doesn't change much as whoever buys either stops renting or is going to rent it out.
FrontierPsych 4y ago
>Financial responsibility should be something taught early on at schools. 100% guarantee that this does not matter one iota. I've tried and tried to help so many people with their financial picture. You would have more luck talking to a brick wall. People don't care. They just simply do not care. This is because most people - maybe 95% - are ruled by their emotions rather than rationality. Or to put it more precisely, people make decisions based on emotions and then use their rational mind after they make their decision to rationalize their purchase. Also, becoming financially responsible is just about the simplest thing to do, at least at the beginning stages. All it requires is addition and subtraction, mostly, which we learn in second grade or whenever it is. Second grade. I remember opening my first savings and checking account when I was 15 years old (when you could do it yourself without parent's permission). The person who helped my took about 10 minutes to help me understand, that's all you need. The internet is inundated with videos and classes on basic financial knowledge. I'm sure that I could go to Udemy and find 500 courses on basic financial training and pay $15 for it....hmmm, let me go check right now...ok, typed "personal finance" in the search and it came back with "6,496 results for “personal finance”" People don't take those classes because they don't want to take them. Probably personal finance is one of the topics that is #1 for total courses available. Honestly, personal finance is so easy. It is just about the easiest thing to do. Sure if you get into complicated stuff, if you have $200 million in the bank/assets/whatever, maybe it is hard. But for the general person, no, it is simple. And the part that someone doesn't get, there are a ton of videos and articles on that, too. I have gotten exceptionally angry at some people because they were so broke and asked me for help. There I was, spending countless hours with them, doing what you said and educating them, and they go out and blow a HUGE chunk of their feeble savings on the stupidest shit. I got angry because I knew these people and got emotionally invested in helping them (I don't regret getting emotionally invested). I don't help people anymore. It's an exercise in frustration and futility. People simply do notwant to be financially responsible...well, maybe in the 20/80 law, 20% are financially responsible. The other 80%...don't waste time on them. Kind of a rant, but it still burns deep in my soul, because the people I tried to help are good people. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. Pearls before swine.
- jjav 4y ago
  > All it requires is addition and subtraction, mostly, which we learn in second grade or whenever it is. To be fair that's not quite true. For example credit cards go out of the way to make their interest and penalties algorithm obscure in order to try to lock people into paying interest forever.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

by fathyb 4y ago

josephcsible 4y ago

What happens in your country if you move into a house and then just stop paying?

into_infinity 4y ago
It is pretty unusual in most parts of the world for landlords to get access to one's credit records. Credit reporting is a pretty US-specific phenomenon, even if you're applying for a bank loan or a credit card. You usually present proof of earnings and possibly references from previous landlords. And if you get unlucky - well, same as in the US, in many of the nicest markets, you're facing an uphill battle to evict people.
- dazc 4y ago
  In the UK you invariably rent through an agent who has access to credit reporting, the cost of which is passed on to both you and the landlord. If you're self employed or a company director then there are a few other things you have to pay for, £45 to look at your balance sheet, for example, which is freely available to anyone else. I know a few landlords and despite the efforts they take to find the perfect tenant, they all have tales to tell of people who passed all the tests with flying colours but soon turned out to be a costly disaster.
- pcthrowaway 4y ago
  Completely normal in Canada also
- oezi 4y ago
  I guess it depends per country. In Germany it has become common that the landlord will require a credit score (called Schufa) plus the things you mentioned (3 months of pay slips, references of balances paid from past landlord). Strong data protection rules have made it that there is now a credit score report which is only giving you a pass/fail so that landlords don't know too many details.
  - wink 4y ago
    AFAICT Schufa is not like a US credit score. It's just OK/NOT OK, or a list of "infractions". Which means if you always paid your stuff on time, a virtual +1 is the same as a +1000, and the visible result will just be "OK" and after a while the entries will age out if it was a "NOT OK"
- EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 4y ago
  US has very strict non-discrimination laws in housing. Requesting credit reports is a way to circumvent those laws.
- sadpasture 4y ago
  Standard practice in Germany, although the credit system here is a bit better than the US since it works by "demerits" rather than "building credit". Meaning you start out high, and only lose credit if you fail to make payments on a loan. Also I think landlords can only see a high level summary and final score, not the details of your financial situation.
tpxl 4y ago
One of three things happens in my country: * A mafioso comes for a chat with the tenant and they move out. This rarely happens. * The case is presented to court and they'll evict the tenant in about 2 months. This usually happens. * The tenant has small children and is poor. The owner is fucked as the court won't do anything - the tenants children have a basic human right to a roof over their head. This also rarely happens, but when it does, the damages are huge. My great aunt lost 1-2 years of rent and about 10k in damages due to neglect this way. Because of this, there are interviews for tenants. Mostly just a chat, but rarely you need to prove you're employed and provide bank statements.
walkhour 4y ago
What happens in most cases is that rents go up, because landlords have to factor in this uncertainty. And the debt of the non paying tenants is collectivized.
- yakak 4y ago
  Rental prices are based on the rental market price and then affect house prices. A landlord deciding they aren't going to make enough for their risk at the market rate and selling doesn't change much as whoever buys either stops renting or is going to rent it out.

FrontierPsych 4y ago

>Financial responsibility should be something taught early on at schools. 100% guarantee that this does not matter one iota. I've tried and tried to help so many people with their financial picture. You would have more luck talking to a brick wall. People don't care. They just simply do not care. This is because most people - maybe 95% - are ruled by their emotions rather than rationality. Or to put it more precisely, people make decisions based on emotions and then use their rational mind after they make their decision to rationalize their purchase. Also, becoming financially responsible is just about the simplest thing to do, at least at the beginning stages. All it requires is addition and subtraction, mostly, which we learn in second grade or whenever it is. Second grade. I remember opening my first savings and checking account when I was 15 years old (when you could do it yourself without parent's permission). The person who helped my took about 10 minutes to help me understand, that's all you need. The internet is inundated with videos and classes on basic financial knowledge. I'm sure that I could go to Udemy and find 500 courses on basic financial training and pay $15 for it....hmmm, let me go check right now...ok, typed "personal finance" in the search and it came back with "6,496 results for “personal finance”" People don't take those classes because they don't want to take them. Probably personal finance is one of the topics that is #1 for total courses available. Honestly, personal finance is so easy. It is just about the easiest thing to do. Sure if you get into complicated stuff, if you have $200 million in the bank/assets/whatever, maybe it is hard. But for the general person, no, it is simple. And the part that someone doesn't get, there are a ton of videos and articles on that, too. I have gotten exceptionally angry at some people because they were so broke and asked me for help. There I was, spending countless hours with them, doing what you said and educating them, and they go out and blow a HUGE chunk of their feeble savings on the stupidest shit. I got angry because I knew these people and got emotionally invested in helping them (I don't regret getting emotionally invested). I don't help people anymore. It's an exercise in frustration and futility. People simply do notwant to be financially responsible...well, maybe in the 20/80 law, 20% are financially responsible. The other 80%...don't waste time on them. Kind of a rant, but it still burns deep in my soul, because the people I tried to help are good people. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. Pearls before swine.

jjav 4y ago
> All it requires is addition and subtraction, mostly, which we learn in second grade or whenever it is. To be fair that's not quite true. For example credit cards go out of the way to make their interest and penalties algorithm obscure in order to try to lock people into paying interest forever.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]