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So I have been rejected and "banned" from a MSG venue. It's not fun, and it has nothing to do with your behavior. It was at the Chicago Theather and it was the

• slingnow 4y ago
  • monksy 4y ago
    I was assertive and not aggressive. I tried to do friendly chit chat with the security guy trying to corner me against the wall so "I wouldn't escape into their venue". (People dealing with the public have very short fuses when it comes to non-polite language on ejecting you/banning you/etc.. I have no plans to giving them the ability to invoke that policy despite their frequent gas lighting "well this is what the artist demands") > unclear This about a venue's (MSG, which also runs the one that the Rockeets played at) overzealous and seedy decisions to deny entry.
• moloch-hai 4y ago
  This sort of thing, everywhere, is exactly what to expect from "deregulation".
  • justanorherhack 4y ago
    Yes and if enough people actually thought about it and cared then they wouldnt participate and the market would change. But instead just like with regulation they don't care. It's just one is forced and one is a choice.
    • SQueeeeeL 4y ago
      An artistic show tend to have weirdly inelastic demand. If someone is a committed fan, they will typically pay any amount of money to "worship their idol" (not in a negative way, ritualized communal, artist performances are some of the earliest human traditions we have). To see a society in which very few limits were placed on who could see a concert, look up Metallica playing when the USSR fell, absolutely massive.
  • notinfuriated 4y ago
    I'm unclear on how this is a regulation or deregulation thing. There could be a regulation that specifically allows for or denies smartphones at such events. It's hypothetical at this point, so why is deregulation to blame in this case now?
    • crmd 4y ago
      It’s only a big deal because regulators allowed companies like MSGE and Live Nation to buy up all the independent venues. No one would care if a single fascist club owner was terrorizing customers because the free market would punish him.
    • cool_dude85 4y ago
      Presumably you could have a law saying what kinds of things are or aren't sufficient grounds to ban people from places.
    • 4y ago
• raldi 4y ago
  What was the phone requirement that you refused? Did they want to confiscate your phone, lock it in a bag you physically couldn’t open, seal it in an envelope you got to keep but could open in an emergency, just demand you keep it in your pocket…?
  • andybak 4y ago
    Yeah. I've never heard of this and "phoneless/phone encasing" isn't returning much. GP - what?
    • sunsunsunsun 4y ago
      Not OP but there are a few performers who like to either confescate phones or place them in locked baggies to stop the people who hold their phone in the air filming a video nobody will ever watch. In theory I like the idea but in practice I agree with OP.
      • monksy 4y ago
        > to stop the people who hold their phone in the air filming a video nobody will ever watch. This is the statement that I want to go up to you in person physically grab you, shake you and tell you I love you for making that statement. It's frustrating to be gaslit by artist claiming that a youtube reproduction of their concert/show is going to cause a justifiable loss of future revenue. Looking back at the Rammstein stiched concerts only makes me want to go more.
    • monksy 4y ago
      Look up "phone free" and you'll find the references. What it is: It's a strong fabric case that locks you out of your phone with a very strong magnet.(defaces the object you have) This prevents you from answering the phone, making calls, using the camera etc. Have a medical/police/medical-staff being called back emergency? Good luck buddy, no one cares about this. The company who is doing this is Yondr. They've been doing this for years. They've been doing this with musicians, comedians, courtrooms, and even at schools. I'm amazed that they have been getting away with this for so long. Yondr has had a lot of astroturfing over the years so it's harder to find the people who have had a bad experience over the years. You'll see non-normally participating people pop up in every comment section that mentions the phone ban: "well i like that everyone isn't on their phone" etc. Also, you'll see near promo news pieces on this. Additionally there has been no public comment with this that I know of, which is super auspicious from the US or Europe. (Just did the research Placebo and Bono have enforced this in Paris.. a bit brave considering the bataclan) EDIT: Dang, yes I said the a word (ends with turfing), this is not a statement thats happening here.
• chroma 4y ago
  I guarantee that you clicked through some terms and conditions while buying that ticket, and it almost certainly said that phones weren't allowed. This is quite common at comedy shows because comedians develop their material over time. They don't want clips of jokes failing to land or being taken out of context, as that could hurt their career. Recording also emboldens hecklers, as one friend can record (or even livestream) while another insults the performer.
  • crazygringo 4y ago
    Back in 2017 it wasn't that common yet. I think Yondr is a great solution for comedians, but can also totally see that it wouldn't have made it into terms and conditions yet. I don't think you can guarantee anything in this case unless you have the actual T&C from that particular show.
    • monksy 4y ago
      I disagree with your statement about the comedians, unless you're talking about a full length recording that is being sold on. But for those people, you go after them in the courts for piracy after the fact. Most of the bits captured are/will be out of context and useless. My personal desire to "record" is short "i'm here" clips or pictures. (Music productions, clips, photo for the show) TM claimed "there was nothing extra" on the ticket. (I contacted them but did not try to pull a refund as that I know that TM is going to pull the "well this is the venues' issue")
      • crazygringo 4y ago
        > Most of the bits captured are/will be out of context and useless. Actual history shows the opposite. The entire reason for Yondr is precisely because people were posting bits that comedians were trying out, and then people were jumping on "so-and-so told an offensive joke!" on Twitter and it becomes a whole thing. Comedians are terrified of getting "cancelled" because they tried wording their joke a different way to see what the audience reaction would be. If people were just recording "I'm here" clips then Yondr would never have existed.
• rmorey 4y ago
  I’ve gone to several comedy shows (5 or so?) that use the Yondr bags, and honestly I think they’re a pretty good solution. I think it’s fair for artists and comedians to want to prevent filming, and the phone jail thing is quite clever, actually. The bags are not indestructible, it seems like a sharp pair of scissors or a knife would get you in. And I think the magnet lock is actually bypassable otherwise. It’s just inconvenient enough that everyone pretty much just complies, while retaining physical possession of their phone. I kinda like the experience as an audience member, I think the phone thing does keep the audience more engaged with the show. I’m open to arguments against, but as it stands I find the phone jail charming
  • monksy 4y ago
    I fully respect your preference there. I'm also glad we can have a civil agreement/disagreement about this. > it seems like a sharp pair of scissors or a knife would get you in You have neither of those during the time of an emergency. They've already taken those things away at the door with the metal detector. They do "have an area where you can unlock it" however it's a restricted area.. and not much of a use during an emergency. > It’s just inconvenient enough that everyone pretty much just complies I feel like that's why it's gotten so far as it has.
• namuol 4y ago
  Yeesh. This whole thing sounds like some gross commercialization of a problem blown out of proportion, that doesn’t really work, hurts honest customers, and only gets enforced due to some sunk cost fallacy going on in the minds of the venues/entertainers that were duped into using this “product” by the IP attorneys that are throwing bad ideas out there to justify the size of their salaries. I have no doubt the same sort of thing is going on with the linked article, only it’s a different branch of the legal team involved this time.
• the__alchemist 4y ago
  Credit card chargeback.
  • monksy 4y ago
    That would have invalidated my other tickets held by Ticketmaster. I think I held a Metallica ticket at the time. (Metallica let me into solder field with a Lecia Lumix LX10)
    • BeFlatXIII 4y ago
      Then charge those back as well and bad mouth all those bands.
    • josephcsible 4y ago
      Plus you'd probably never be able to go to any show that Ticketmaster sells tickets to for the rest of your life.
    • SoftTalker 4y ago
      Funny about Metallica. They went from being one of the lead crusaders that brought Napster down, to now releasing their new music with no restrictions, and allowing filming at their concerts, because they have realized that on balance they are gaining more from the publicity than they lose on music sales.
• andsoitis 4y ago
  > ushers who can't get people to stop filming. Not only is it a numbers game (too many people to police), it is also very annoying for other patrons when people are constantly told to stop. So banning the phones is a great solution that solves a number of problems. > Think they're going to know how to call the cops/handle an emergergcy? lol. Of course they do. I really don’t think you rationale for refusing to hand over your phone holds up.
  • elmomle 4y ago
    While I am fine with bans on phones for performances, I too would absolutely bristle and feel strongly inclined to complain if that was not made clear at the time I bought a ticket.
  • ezfe 4y ago
    If they actually kicked people out, not just say "please put your phone away" people would learn it's not okay. The only reason people do it is because they don't think they'll get in trouble.
• vorpalhex 4y ago
  The yondr device looks like it could be defeated with a magnet or a sharp knife.
  • josephcsible 4y ago
    Places that use Yondr also make you go through airport-like security and won't allow either of those things in.
    • vorpalhex 4y ago
      A magnet can be attached to your keys so it looks like a prox pass. No security guard is going to argue about the contents of your keyring. I've had success with keeping (small) pocket knives on me. Those metal detectors are almost always badly tuned since false alarms are disruptive. I used to consider getting some kind of fancy thermoplastic pocket knife but frankly any cheap small knife works.
• BeFlatXIII 4y ago
  > Ultimately I lost that 80$ Why didn't you chargeback for services not received?