6 ms·

A decent portion of the article was devoted to the physical disc option and how it's increasingly uncommon for that to even be offered as a choice.

by dave78 4y ago

rthomas6 4y ago
Like I said, if the company isn't selling the movie/show anymore, well, what choice do you have?
- pmontra 4y ago
  Some people buy (rent?) videos and books, then download a DRM free copy from bittorrent.
  - listenallyall 4y ago
    Buying a legit copy doesn't make it legal to download a pirated/illegal copy, any more than buying a band's CD makes it legal to sneak into their concert without a ticket.
    - fragmede 4y ago
      I don't think that analogy holds. If I buy the CD and rip it myself end up with MP3s. If I buy the CD and download a torrent of it, I end up with MP3s. If I buy a ticket and bring my tape recorder into their concert, I can listen to my recording of that concert forever.
      - listenallyall 4y ago
        Lol. By default, you can't record a concert either, although some bands do encourage the practice. There's a reason they are called "bootlegs".
        phpisthebest 4y ago
        >>By default, you can't record a concert either, Under what law? The venue may redistrict it, that is not a law though at most they could do to you for violation is kick you out There is no law I am aware of that prevents such a recording, only redistribution of the recording made would be a violation of the law
    - achr2 4y ago
      That’s a false equivalency, the first takes nothing extra from the purveyor, the second takes significant revenue directly from the artist.
      - listenallyall 4y ago
        So you are claiming that downloading illegal torrents is in fact legal?
        TylerE 4y ago
        Yes. Uploading them on the other hand…
        pbhjpbhj 4y ago
        It sounds like they're saying that if you pay, then it's just as moral to acquire your copy from a torrent as from a product. Would you disagree? The creators get the same (small) cut, the buyer gets the same product, so what's wrong with it?
        mathieuh 4y ago
        Something being illegal doesn’t say anything about its morality. Many things that we now think are normal were illegal not too long ago, and in many cases things are made illegal to protect the established powers. Personally I only follow laws I agree with.
        listenallyall 4y ago
        So did the Pirate Roberts Silk Road guy. Terrific life decision. edit: Brittney Griner too.
        _v7gu 4y ago
        So did Martin Luther King Jr and the founding fathers. There is no moral duty to obey arbitrary bullshit. Good on you!
    - woodruffw 4y ago
      This isn't actually settled in US law, as far as I can tell: if you actually do own a legal copy and you download another copy, it's unclear that you've actually done anything illegal. IIRC this is the argument that Apple uses to de-duplicate copies of users' music libraries, sometimes to deleterious effect[1]. [1]: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/252932712 https://discussions.apple.com/thread/252932712
      - nanidin 4y ago
        Yes, and as I understood it the illegal part of torrenting was the upload, not the download.
        deaddodo 4y ago
        Technically, the “illegal” part is copying, distributing and deriving from; per Title 17 of Federal law (in the US, of course). That being said, just like possessing a pound of marijuana can be considered an amount with intent to distribute, the same can be said for having a NAS server with 20TB of copyrighted media. In addition, there are state criminal/civil laws to take into account as well.
        phpisthebest 4y ago
        >>>just like possessing a pound of marijuana can be considered an amount with intent to distribute, the same can be said for having a NAS server with 20TB of copyrighted media. Not even close to being the same thing under the law, not even in the realm of the same thing. Show me one case, even one where a person was sued or even implied that the amount of digital content stored on a storage server was considered "intent to distribute" for the purposed of copyright violation >>In addition, there are state criminal/civil laws to take into account as well. Name them, copyright is 100% US federal law. So what other laws are in play here
      - listenallyall 4y ago
        Do you have the authorization if the legal copyright holder? If so, great! But if you are downloading torrents from Pirate Bay, I'm going to assume you don't have such authorization.
    - phpisthebest 4y ago
      Downloading, or possessing copyrighted work that you have not paid for is not actually illegal. It is not drugs, and it is not theft One of the reasons indivual consumers were targeted for torrents was the fact they were UPLOADING while at the same time downloading Copyright law is about DISTRIBUTION of a protected work, if I have a copy of a movie, and never distribute it even if the person I obtained it from was not authorized to give me a copy of that money I did no violate copyright law, the person that gave it to me did. I have yet to see anyone cite the section of copyright law, or any other law that covers the act of DOWNLOADING, only the act of UPLOADING, Sharing, or other wise distributing the work is what violate copyright
      - listenallyall 4y ago
        It is certainly not as clear-cut as you are making it out. It's not theft to "possess" Call of Duty if you never paid for it? Or, say I purchased a record of Rolling Stones "Sticky Fingers" back in 1977 or whenever. It is a copyrighted work that I paid for, as you stated. Now, can I go into Sam Goody in 1983 and just walk out with a cassette of the same album? In 1994 can I snag a CD off the shelf at Tower Records? Today, can I demand Amazon or Google or Apple provide me with a MP3 copy? Let's say I bought every single Rolling Stones album, in every format, etc. I own every song they have ever released. Tomorrow they come out with a new box set -- every song in the collection is one that I already own... so now I can possess the box set for free without buying it?
        UncleEntity 4y ago
        What you can do is copy those onto different media to make a mixed tape to give to your high school girlfriend. Or back them up on your computer. Or load them onto your phone. You’re conflating the physical media with the umm, non-physical media.
        skelpmargyar 4y ago
        No, you don't possess the box set for free. You already have all the songs in the box set that you paid for, and therefore you already paid for the contents of the box set. You own the box set contents in entirety, just not that specific box set you would walk out with from the store. If you're confusing the medium with the actual work, consider the following. You own an original painting. Is it illegal to take a picture of that painting and not redistribute it? A picture is not an exact replica of the painting, but someone might say it is a close enough copy. What if you copied the painting by hand on a new canvas to be indistinguishable by human eye from the original. How about if you move the painting from one painting frame to another. Is the painting from considered part of the art? Are any of these illegal if you don't redistribute it? Stealing is illegal. If you take a box set, you're stealing the DVDs not just the contents of the DVDs. If you remux a movie, you didn't pay for that exact version that you now possess. Is that illegal if you don't redistribute it? If you buy a fork, 3D scan it and then 3D print it and eat dinner with it, is it illegal? It all comes down to laws of one's country. But your analogy doesn't work because you're talking about physically stealing media and we're talking about digital piracy. Some countries it's actually not illegal to download, only upload. It gets even more complicated in the US when it comes to federal and state laws, copyright law, fair use, personal property, etc. I agree that it is not as clear cut legal as he's making it, but it's not as clear cut illegal as I feel you are making it.
- manicennui 4y ago
  Not watching it?

A decent portion of the article was devoted to the physical disc option and how it's increasingly uncommon for that to even be offered as a choice.

by dave78 4y ago

A decent portion of the article was devoted to the physical disc option and how it's increasingly uncommon for that to even be offered as a choice.

rthomas6 4y ago

Like I said, if the company isn't selling the movie/show anymore, well, what choice do you have?

pmontra 4y ago
Some people buy (rent?) videos and books, then download a DRM free copy from bittorrent.
- listenallyall 4y ago
  Buying a legit copy doesn't make it legal to download a pirated/illegal copy, any more than buying a band's CD makes it legal to sneak into their concert without a ticket.
  - fragmede 4y ago
    I don't think that analogy holds. If I buy the CD and rip it myself end up with MP3s. If I buy the CD and download a torrent of it, I end up with MP3s. If I buy a ticket and bring my tape recorder into their concert, I can listen to my recording of that concert forever.
    - listenallyall 4y ago
      Lol. By default, you can't record a concert either, although some bands do encourage the practice. There's a reason they are called "bootlegs".
      - phpisthebest 4y ago
        >>By default, you can't record a concert either, Under what law? The venue may redistrict it, that is not a law though at most they could do to you for violation is kick you out There is no law I am aware of that prevents such a recording, only redistribution of the recording made would be a violation of the law
  - achr2 4y ago
    That’s a false equivalency, the first takes nothing extra from the purveyor, the second takes significant revenue directly from the artist.
    - listenallyall 4y ago
      So you are claiming that downloading illegal torrents is in fact legal?
      - TylerE 4y ago
        Yes. Uploading them on the other hand…
      - pbhjpbhj 4y ago
        It sounds like they're saying that if you pay, then it's just as moral to acquire your copy from a torrent as from a product. Would you disagree? The creators get the same (small) cut, the buyer gets the same product, so what's wrong with it?
      - mathieuh 4y ago
        Something being illegal doesn’t say anything about its morality. Many things that we now think are normal were illegal not too long ago, and in many cases things are made illegal to protect the established powers. Personally I only follow laws I agree with.
        listenallyall 4y ago
        So did the Pirate Roberts Silk Road guy. Terrific life decision. edit: Brittney Griner too.
        _v7gu 4y ago
        So did Martin Luther King Jr and the founding fathers. There is no moral duty to obey arbitrary bullshit. Good on you!
  - woodruffw 4y ago
    This isn't actually settled in US law, as far as I can tell: if you actually do own a legal copy and you download another copy, it's unclear that you've actually done anything illegal. IIRC this is the argument that Apple uses to de-duplicate copies of users' music libraries, sometimes to deleterious effect[1]. [1]: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/252932712 https://discussions.apple.com/thread/252932712
    - nanidin 4y ago
      Yes, and as I understood it the illegal part of torrenting was the upload, not the download.
      - deaddodo 4y ago
        Technically, the “illegal” part is copying, distributing and deriving from; per Title 17 of Federal law (in the US, of course). That being said, just like possessing a pound of marijuana can be considered an amount with intent to distribute, the same can be said for having a NAS server with 20TB of copyrighted media. In addition, there are state criminal/civil laws to take into account as well.
        phpisthebest 4y ago
        >>>just like possessing a pound of marijuana can be considered an amount with intent to distribute, the same can be said for having a NAS server with 20TB of copyrighted media. Not even close to being the same thing under the law, not even in the realm of the same thing. Show me one case, even one where a person was sued or even implied that the amount of digital content stored on a storage server was considered "intent to distribute" for the purposed of copyright violation >>In addition, there are state criminal/civil laws to take into account as well. Name them, copyright is 100% US federal law. So what other laws are in play here
    - listenallyall 4y ago
      Do you have the authorization if the legal copyright holder? If so, great! But if you are downloading torrents from Pirate Bay, I'm going to assume you don't have such authorization.
  - phpisthebest 4y ago
    Downloading, or possessing copyrighted work that you have not paid for is not actually illegal. It is not drugs, and it is not theft One of the reasons indivual consumers were targeted for torrents was the fact they were UPLOADING while at the same time downloading Copyright law is about DISTRIBUTION of a protected work, if I have a copy of a movie, and never distribute it even if the person I obtained it from was not authorized to give me a copy of that money I did no violate copyright law, the person that gave it to me did. I have yet to see anyone cite the section of copyright law, or any other law that covers the act of DOWNLOADING, only the act of UPLOADING, Sharing, or other wise distributing the work is what violate copyright
    - listenallyall 4y ago
      It is certainly not as clear-cut as you are making it out. It's not theft to "possess" Call of Duty if you never paid for it? Or, say I purchased a record of Rolling Stones "Sticky Fingers" back in 1977 or whenever. It is a copyrighted work that I paid for, as you stated. Now, can I go into Sam Goody in 1983 and just walk out with a cassette of the same album? In 1994 can I snag a CD off the shelf at Tower Records? Today, can I demand Amazon or Google or Apple provide me with a MP3 copy? Let's say I bought every single Rolling Stones album, in every format, etc. I own every song they have ever released. Tomorrow they come out with a new box set -- every song in the collection is one that I already own... so now I can possess the box set for free without buying it?
      - UncleEntity 4y ago
        What you can do is copy those onto different media to make a mixed tape to give to your high school girlfriend. Or back them up on your computer. Or load them onto your phone. You’re conflating the physical media with the umm, non-physical media.
      - skelpmargyar 4y ago
        No, you don't possess the box set for free. You already have all the songs in the box set that you paid for, and therefore you already paid for the contents of the box set. You own the box set contents in entirety, just not that specific box set you would walk out with from the store. If you're confusing the medium with the actual work, consider the following. You own an original painting. Is it illegal to take a picture of that painting and not redistribute it? A picture is not an exact replica of the painting, but someone might say it is a close enough copy. What if you copied the painting by hand on a new canvas to be indistinguishable by human eye from the original. How about if you move the painting from one painting frame to another. Is the painting from considered part of the art? Are any of these illegal if you don't redistribute it? Stealing is illegal. If you take a box set, you're stealing the DVDs not just the contents of the DVDs. If you remux a movie, you didn't pay for that exact version that you now possess. Is that illegal if you don't redistribute it? If you buy a fork, 3D scan it and then 3D print it and eat dinner with it, is it illegal? It all comes down to laws of one's country. But your analogy doesn't work because you're talking about physically stealing media and we're talking about digital piracy. Some countries it's actually not illegal to download, only upload. It gets even more complicated in the US when it comes to federal and state laws, copyright law, fair use, personal property, etc. I agree that it is not as clear cut legal as he's making it, but it's not as clear cut illegal as I feel you are making it.
manicennui 4y ago
Not watching it?