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There is a pay wall, so I haven't read the article. I just want to put it out there: Did this seem predictable to anyone? I had the sense he was unsatisfied and

There is a pay wall, so I haven't read the article. I just want to put it out there: Did this seem predictable to anyone? I had the sense he was unsatisfied and Meta's public perception, particularly in Carmack's department, seemed to be plummeting. It seemed very likely that this would happen, but maybe I'm projecting too much. I imagined myself being deeply ungratified in his role.

santoshalper 4y ago
It always seemed like a poor fit to me. From the begining, Facebook has always been an unctuous, slimy organization and Carmack seems to be a relatively high-integrity human. I'm honestly surprised it lasted as long as it did.
- Aeolun 4y ago
  I’m fairly certain it started out as him expecting to have some sort of positive influence on the slimy mold that is Facebook, but in the end he found out that his advice was often just thrown to the wind because it didn’t match someone’s political agenda. At some point you have to decide whether it’s worth it to keep fighting.
  - pjmorris 4y ago
    Jerry Weinberg had an expression "Cucumbers get pickled more than brine gets cucumbered" to express the influence environment has on individuals.
- JohnFen 4y ago
  Of the many things that cooled my interest in VR, the presence of Facebook in the space is near the top.
  - sharkweek 4y ago
    Agreed and maybe this is a little naive of me but I don’t currently own or plan on owning an oculus but if it was still an independent product via its original founders, I’m almost certain I’d have one.
bane 4y ago
This blogpost from 2014 has been an almost perfect predictor of the last few years of the Meta disaster. It misses some stuff, but it's not really wrong anywhere beyond some minor details. It calls out Carmack as being the canary that will ultimately predict Oculus/Meta's future. https://assayviaessay.blogspot.com/2014/03/virtual-spaces-real-data.html https://assayviaessay.blogspot.com/2014/03/virtual-spaces-re...
- pxc 4y ago
  That was a good read. But I'm not sure about Carmack being the canary. The idea was then that if he left quickly over ethical matters, it would be a sign of something was really wrong. But Carmack didn't leave quickly. It's been almost 9 years. And none of the reasons he cites have to do with openness, transparency, or abuse of user data.
primitivesuave 4y ago
His note to Meta: https://archive.vn/t6zQp https://archive.vn/t6zQp
- steve_adams_86 4y ago
  Oh wow. What he’s describing really resonates with me. Working in software, I feel it’s almost dichotomous in its nature that people absolutely coast or absolutely give a damn. It can be so difficult to work on a coasting team. And otherwise, it’s torture to your soul not to give a damn around people who do (if you care, I guess). In his role I can see that being a genuine struggle, arguably worse than what I’ve encountered. I’ve rarely had agency to effect change, or even the illusion of it. In his case, it must have felt as though he should be able to get things on course somehow. That would be frustrating.
  - primitivesuave 4y ago
    It resonates the exact same way with me. I hope our industry can start having higher standards, or at least start respecting leadership with high standards. 5% GPU usage is abysmal and it does seem to be reflective of the engineering culture (from knowing other people at Meta).
    - steve_adams_86 4y ago
      I haven’t worked in graphics so I’m not sure what percentage of GPU usage is good. Should it be lower or higher?
sp332 4y ago
He hasn't seemed happy since the beginning. So this was a surprise to me. I thought he would leave after something vested, but that doesn't seem to have determined the timing.

santoshalper 4y ago

It always seemed like a poor fit to me. From the begining, Facebook has always been an unctuous, slimy organization and Carmack seems to be a relatively high-integrity human. I'm honestly surprised it lasted as long as it did.

Aeolun 4y ago
I’m fairly certain it started out as him expecting to have some sort of positive influence on the slimy mold that is Facebook, but in the end he found out that his advice was often just thrown to the wind because it didn’t match someone’s political agenda. At some point you have to decide whether it’s worth it to keep fighting.
- pjmorris 4y ago
  Jerry Weinberg had an expression "Cucumbers get pickled more than brine gets cucumbered" to express the influence environment has on individuals.
JohnFen 4y ago
Of the many things that cooled my interest in VR, the presence of Facebook in the space is near the top.
- sharkweek 4y ago
  Agreed and maybe this is a little naive of me but I don’t currently own or plan on owning an oculus but if it was still an independent product via its original founders, I’m almost certain I’d have one.

bane 4y ago

This blogpost from 2014 has been an almost perfect predictor of the last few years of the Meta disaster. It misses some stuff, but it's not really wrong anywhere beyond some minor details. It calls out Carmack as being the canary that will ultimately predict Oculus/Meta's future. https://assayviaessay.blogspot.com/2014/03/virtual-spaces-real-data.html https://assayviaessay.blogspot.com/2014/03/virtual-spaces-re...

pxc 4y ago
That was a good read. But I'm not sure about Carmack being the canary. The idea was then that if he left quickly over ethical matters, it would be a sign of something was really wrong. But Carmack didn't leave quickly. It's been almost 9 years. And none of the reasons he cites have to do with openness, transparency, or abuse of user data.

primitivesuave 4y ago

His note to Meta: https://archive.vn/t6zQp https://archive.vn/t6zQp

steve_adams_86 4y ago
Oh wow. What he’s describing really resonates with me. Working in software, I feel it’s almost dichotomous in its nature that people absolutely coast or absolutely give a damn. It can be so difficult to work on a coasting team. And otherwise, it’s torture to your soul not to give a damn around people who do (if you care, I guess). In his role I can see that being a genuine struggle, arguably worse than what I’ve encountered. I’ve rarely had agency to effect change, or even the illusion of it. In his case, it must have felt as though he should be able to get things on course somehow. That would be frustrating.
- primitivesuave 4y ago
  It resonates the exact same way with me. I hope our industry can start having higher standards, or at least start respecting leadership with high standards. 5% GPU usage is abysmal and it does seem to be reflective of the engineering culture (from knowing other people at Meta).
  - steve_adams_86 4y ago
    I haven’t worked in graphics so I’m not sure what percentage of GPU usage is good. Should it be lower or higher?

sp332 4y ago

He hasn't seemed happy since the beginning. So this was a surprise to me. I thought he would leave after something vested, but that doesn't seem to have determined the timing.