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Musk’s Twitter Antics Are Tarnishing Tesla as Its EV Rivals Are Catching Up

33 points by samizdis 4y ago

sidibe 4y ago
I do believe Elon could be a deciding factor for a liberal deciding on which EV to get. He's suddenly lurching into MyPillow territory where his products might start feeling like a political statement
cityzen 4y ago
Yea I will never give this guy a penny outside of the tax money of mine he grifts from the government.
- Bubble_Pop_22 4y ago
  I will never give a penny to EV manufacturers period. As a consumer I want corporate attention to be focused on me, not people who will be alive 100 years from now. I am also working on avoiding giving Misk and co. any of my tax money by moving to either Sao Paolo, Mexico City or Dubai
clouddrover 4y ago
If Tesla needs Musk then they should get him off Twitter and get his focus back on Tesla. Alternatively, if Tesla is getting along just fine without Musk then what do they need him for and why are they paying him? That's money that could be returned to shareholders or invested in the company.
- sidibe 4y ago
  The tough thing for Tesla shareholders is the share price needs Elon, but the company itself would be better off without Elon if he's going to affect demand. A lot of the share price is for the future magic tech Elon keeps proposing, it is currently valued way more than car companies would ever be
  - fuzzfactor 4y ago
    You are what you own. Owning both Tesla and SpaceX is like owning Ford and Boeing to an extent. Building them up from scratch in one lifetime is remarkable in addition. These are technology companies that require technology progress to begin with, then continuously as you go along. With SpaceX it does take a rocket scientist to do this. Plus they give users something to show for their money. Owning Twitter is like owning the National Enquirer. Not a technology company regardless of any technology that might be involved or developed. This is a gossip rag with reader participation, where the one-to-many and distribution have been scaled by technical progress. Where the ultimate outcome is putting advertising on steriods via gossip. Not a technology company. Just gossip media, and purchased when trending toward lower-class participation. Remember, even Trump could start one of these with no engineering ablity of his own. Of course when it comes to engineering or leadership, he's no Jack Dorsey. As we have seen, his genius remains stable at a much lower point on the scale. With Tesla and SpaceX being so significant, plus things like Boring and Starlink, Musk was always considered all-in on technology. Now not so much, with gossip taking such a significant chunk. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to spread unflattering words. And of course I'm no rocket scientist. Just a regular scientist.
hairofadog 4y ago
The link in the Forbes article to the clip of the “entire segment” of the John Oliver show links to a YouTube imposter account, and turns into what I'm gonna call terrible ambient beach music halfway through. Ironic, given that the Oliver segment is partly about imposter Twitter accounts. Any time you share a video, scrub through to the end! There's a lotta weird stuff out there.
DoingIsLearning 4y ago
The initial roadmap that Tesla set out from the Roadster onwards was to progressively create models in increasing volume and at a decreasingly lower price point. However at this point in time they neither have the volume nor the price point to be a model T for the masses in the EV world. In my humble opinion Musk's vision for 'auto-pilot' was too soon and completely misplaced. This has taken too much focus away from actual EV disruption. What was needed from an environmental standpoint was for Tesla to leverage their battery factories to bring forward a mass market car at a price point that actually competes with ICEs pricing. Irrespective of their build quality issues this would allow them to eat the competition's lunch in the EV world and to accelerate the much needed sunsetting of ICEs.
- cypress66 4y ago
  The rate at which they are increasing sales is pretty incredible[1]. Elon's predictions are very often bullshit. But I wouldn't underestimate Tesla's growth. [1] https://www.statista.com/statistics/502208/tesla-quarterly-vehicle-deliveries/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/502208/tesla-quarterly-v...
- ren_engineer 4y ago
  this article is trying to mostly pin it on Elon's Twitter stuff but even the writer admits in the article that a big factor is that Tesla really doesn't have any low-end models. Of course Tesla is going to lose market share in that case I doubt Tesla is worried about it as long as they keep selling more high end models with massive profit margin compared to their competitors. EV is growing in terms of market share, Tesla will be fine even if they have a smaller slice of a pie that is getting bigger each year
  - slimebot80 4y ago
    Yeah so pre-Twitter, Tesla was facing issues due to their inability to compete on the lower end, and their high-end brand is based on Elon's aura rather than quality. And now with Twitter, Elon's aura is very, very murky, and more people now see his bullishness as deceitful.
freddealmeida 4y ago
I disagree. Tesla has made bets the other EV firms have not yet even understood. Do you really want to pay 3000 USD for a tail light for a GM EV? The full view shows that Tesla is by far way ahead because of the total vertical.
propogandist 4y ago
> The change for the EV brand is more dramatic among Americans surveyed who identify as Democrats, falling 20 points in the past month, Elon is angering liberals and he has clearly crossed a line by exposing liberal bias. If the south african had pushed money to democrats, like SBF, he simply would not be having this problem. SBF stole billions and the FTX brand is stronger than ever, among democrats. That’s the power of campaign contributions.
- taolegal 4y ago
  He's upsetting people who think they're morally superior to everyone else - saints that walk among us. That group really came into being under Obama, Trump solidified it, and then they got absolutely juiced up during the pandemic & BLM stuff. The double standards and hypocrisy are absolutely breathtaking. And since these people have decided they're just the only people operating in objective reality, they almost never examine themselves. And for me, I don't even like Trump or his party. I'm left in the frustrating position where what angers me the most are his opponents who are so off-puttingly full of themselves. I think that's why they're so opposed to Musk, a lifelong liberal & voter for Democrats who realizes how far things have drifted from sanity. He's cleaved from the groupthink. So now, like the immune system, he must be disassociated & eliminated.
- nocoiner 4y ago
  ????? You are painting with an awfully broad brush. I’m a dem, and I abhor what it seems SBF (allegedly) did. I hope every candidate who receive a contribution from him returns it, and if he did what he’s alleged to have done, I hope he spends a very, very long time in prison. His political affiliations or preferences are completely irrelevant to me (though didn’t he say in one of his many, many recent interviews, he also donated a lot of money to republicans?). Of course, the FTX brand was trash in my eyes before the collapse. Maybe your username and mine are equally apt.
wcarron 4y ago
Long before his Twitter fiasco, I decided I would never purchase one of his vehicles. His looooong history, as noted in the article, with the SEC, OSHA, NLRB had permanently put me off Tesla. Much like Apple under Jobs, I dislike cults of personality, and staunchly remained an Android/Linux user. My wife & I are soon-to-be in the market for an EV, but Tesla is absolutely beyond the line in the sand. Never will I give a single cent to that bloviating asswipe. If Porsche unveils the EV Macan in time, we'll go that way. Besides, the Tesla interiors are cheap garbage.
- taolegal 4y ago
  As much as you abhor bloviating, sounds like you're bloviating too.
- scarface74 4y ago
  Yes because Linux doesn’t suffer from cults of personality like RMS… For software developers who haven’t gotten over their addiction to food and shelter and who trade labor for money via software development, the entire premise behind “all software should be free” is quite cultish.
  - wcarron 4y ago
    I don't even know who you're referring to with RMS. Nor do I understand your point here.
    - scarface74 4y ago
      You never heard of Richard Stallman?
      - wcarron 4y ago
        I do, but not on the level that I connected his name to an acronym.
- nocoiner 4y ago
  I think you and I think along roughly similar lines. Several years back, I was in the market for an EV and seriously considering a Tesla. However, during the course of that consideration, he made the “$420 funding secured” tweet (and also I believe started spouting off about “pedo guy”) and I decided I preferred not to do business with companies that casually commit major securities fraud. Wound up buying an Audi e-tron instead. Range didn’t hold up to any of the Teslas at the time, but it was more than workable and the fit/finish and interior were excellent.
deepsquirrelnet 4y ago
Common sense says that if your product is sold on a big enough scale and with adequate consumer decision, it’s not a good business decision for your public figurehead to be overly political and alienate half of your potential customers. On the other hand, maybe he’s feeling that another government windfall is the only path forward and he’s hitching his wagons to a horse…
tibbydudeza 4y ago
I dunno about the folks in charge at Hyundai or Volkswagen who makes our family's two cars and I really don't want to know about them as long as the cars are good. Elon on the other hand is part of the marketing machine of Tesla and he is rather a toxic individual right now to the common folks - as a South African it strikes close to home as he acts and behaves like those clueless white people from the 1980's who voted for the National Party and Apartheid. Steve Jobs was also like that for Apple but his personal life and opinions very much under the radar except for his annual product releases.
cafard 4y ago
There are a bunch of Teslas in my neighborhood, some belonging to people I know well. None of the owners has shown any signs of embarrassment about owning a Tesla.
- slimebot80 4y ago
  Once they have the BlueTooth chip on their brain tissue we can more accurately monitor these things. Until then, you'll need to wait for them to speak out. I also know Tesla drivers, and a solid half of them are speaking out against Elon and how they find it embarrassing.
hanafudafan 4y ago
Anybody else just reveling in the crying and moaning since Musk took away the intelligence community's favorite plaything? We're going to be shocked and amazed at the types of corruption that various Atlantic-circle governments have been engaging in. Tesla's been under fire by the financial rags and their talking heads for years, only the excuses change. Absolutely delicious tears, I never knew they could be so precious.

33 points by samizdis 4y ago

I do believe Elon could be a deciding factor for a liberal deciding on which EV to get. He's suddenly lurching into MyPillow territory where his products might start feeling like a political statement

cityzen 4y ago

Yea I will never give this guy a penny outside of the tax money of mine he grifts from the government.

Bubble_Pop_22 4y ago
I will never give a penny to EV manufacturers period. As a consumer I want corporate attention to be focused on me, not people who will be alive 100 years from now. I am also working on avoiding giving Misk and co. any of my tax money by moving to either Sao Paolo, Mexico City or Dubai

clouddrover 4y ago

If Tesla needs Musk then they should get him off Twitter and get his focus back on Tesla. Alternatively, if Tesla is getting along just fine without Musk then what do they need him for and why are they paying him? That's money that could be returned to shareholders or invested in the company.

sidibe 4y ago
The tough thing for Tesla shareholders is the share price needs Elon, but the company itself would be better off without Elon if he's going to affect demand. A lot of the share price is for the future magic tech Elon keeps proposing, it is currently valued way more than car companies would ever be
- fuzzfactor 4y ago
  You are what you own. Owning both Tesla and SpaceX is like owning Ford and Boeing to an extent. Building them up from scratch in one lifetime is remarkable in addition. These are technology companies that require technology progress to begin with, then continuously as you go along. With SpaceX it does take a rocket scientist to do this. Plus they give users something to show for their money. Owning Twitter is like owning the National Enquirer. Not a technology company regardless of any technology that might be involved or developed. This is a gossip rag with reader participation, where the one-to-many and distribution have been scaled by technical progress. Where the ultimate outcome is putting advertising on steriods via gossip. Not a technology company. Just gossip media, and purchased when trending toward lower-class participation. Remember, even Trump could start one of these with no engineering ablity of his own. Of course when it comes to engineering or leadership, he's no Jack Dorsey. As we have seen, his genius remains stable at a much lower point on the scale. With Tesla and SpaceX being so significant, plus things like Boring and Starlink, Musk was always considered all-in on technology. Now not so much, with gossip taking such a significant chunk. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to spread unflattering words. And of course I'm no rocket scientist. Just a regular scientist.

hairofadog 4y ago

The link in the Forbes article to the clip of the “entire segment” of the John Oliver show links to a YouTube imposter account, and turns into what I'm gonna call terrible ambient beach music halfway through. Ironic, given that the Oliver segment is partly about imposter Twitter accounts. Any time you share a video, scrub through to the end! There's a lotta weird stuff out there.

DoingIsLearning 4y ago

The initial roadmap that Tesla set out from the Roadster onwards was to progressively create models in increasing volume and at a decreasingly lower price point. However at this point in time they neither have the volume nor the price point to be a model T for the masses in the EV world. In my humble opinion Musk's vision for 'auto-pilot' was too soon and completely misplaced. This has taken too much focus away from actual EV disruption. What was needed from an environmental standpoint was for Tesla to leverage their battery factories to bring forward a mass market car at a price point that actually competes with ICEs pricing. Irrespective of their build quality issues this would allow them to eat the competition's lunch in the EV world and to accelerate the much needed sunsetting of ICEs.

cypress66 4y ago
The rate at which they are increasing sales is pretty incredible[1]. Elon's predictions are very often bullshit. But I wouldn't underestimate Tesla's growth. [1] https://www.statista.com/statistics/502208/tesla-quarterly-vehicle-deliveries/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/502208/tesla-quarterly-v...
ren_engineer 4y ago
this article is trying to mostly pin it on Elon's Twitter stuff but even the writer admits in the article that a big factor is that Tesla really doesn't have any low-end models. Of course Tesla is going to lose market share in that case I doubt Tesla is worried about it as long as they keep selling more high end models with massive profit margin compared to their competitors. EV is growing in terms of market share, Tesla will be fine even if they have a smaller slice of a pie that is getting bigger each year
- slimebot80 4y ago
  Yeah so pre-Twitter, Tesla was facing issues due to their inability to compete on the lower end, and their high-end brand is based on Elon's aura rather than quality. And now with Twitter, Elon's aura is very, very murky, and more people now see his bullishness as deceitful.

freddealmeida 4y ago

I disagree. Tesla has made bets the other EV firms have not yet even understood. Do you really want to pay 3000 USD for a tail light for a GM EV? The full view shows that Tesla is by far way ahead because of the total vertical.

propogandist 4y ago

> The change for the EV brand is more dramatic among Americans surveyed who identify as Democrats, falling 20 points in the past month, Elon is angering liberals and he has clearly crossed a line by exposing liberal bias. If the south african had pushed money to democrats, like SBF, he simply would not be having this problem. SBF stole billions and the FTX brand is stronger than ever, among democrats. That’s the power of campaign contributions.

taolegal 4y ago
He's upsetting people who think they're morally superior to everyone else - saints that walk among us. That group really came into being under Obama, Trump solidified it, and then they got absolutely juiced up during the pandemic & BLM stuff. The double standards and hypocrisy are absolutely breathtaking. And since these people have decided they're just the only people operating in objective reality, they almost never examine themselves. And for me, I don't even like Trump or his party. I'm left in the frustrating position where what angers me the most are his opponents who are so off-puttingly full of themselves. I think that's why they're so opposed to Musk, a lifelong liberal & voter for Democrats who realizes how far things have drifted from sanity. He's cleaved from the groupthink. So now, like the immune system, he must be disassociated & eliminated.
nocoiner 4y ago
????? You are painting with an awfully broad brush. I’m a dem, and I abhor what it seems SBF (allegedly) did. I hope every candidate who receive a contribution from him returns it, and if he did what he’s alleged to have done, I hope he spends a very, very long time in prison. His political affiliations or preferences are completely irrelevant to me (though didn’t he say in one of his many, many recent interviews, he also donated a lot of money to republicans?). Of course, the FTX brand was trash in my eyes before the collapse. Maybe your username and mine are equally apt.

wcarron 4y ago

Long before his Twitter fiasco, I decided I would never purchase one of his vehicles. His looooong history, as noted in the article, with the SEC, OSHA, NLRB had permanently put me off Tesla. Much like Apple under Jobs, I dislike cults of personality, and staunchly remained an Android/Linux user. My wife & I are soon-to-be in the market for an EV, but Tesla is absolutely beyond the line in the sand. Never will I give a single cent to that bloviating asswipe. If Porsche unveils the EV Macan in time, we'll go that way. Besides, the Tesla interiors are cheap garbage.

taolegal 4y ago
As much as you abhor bloviating, sounds like you're bloviating too.
scarface74 4y ago
Yes because Linux doesn’t suffer from cults of personality like RMS… For software developers who haven’t gotten over their addiction to food and shelter and who trade labor for money via software development, the entire premise behind “all software should be free” is quite cultish.
- wcarron 4y ago
  I don't even know who you're referring to with RMS. Nor do I understand your point here.
  - scarface74 4y ago
    You never heard of Richard Stallman?
    - wcarron 4y ago
      I do, but not on the level that I connected his name to an acronym.
nocoiner 4y ago
I think you and I think along roughly similar lines. Several years back, I was in the market for an EV and seriously considering a Tesla. However, during the course of that consideration, he made the “$420 funding secured” tweet (and also I believe started spouting off about “pedo guy”) and I decided I preferred not to do business with companies that casually commit major securities fraud. Wound up buying an Audi e-tron instead. Range didn’t hold up to any of the Teslas at the time, but it was more than workable and the fit/finish and interior were excellent.

deepsquirrelnet 4y ago

Common sense says that if your product is sold on a big enough scale and with adequate consumer decision, it’s not a good business decision for your public figurehead to be overly political and alienate half of your potential customers. On the other hand, maybe he’s feeling that another government windfall is the only path forward and he’s hitching his wagons to a horse…

tibbydudeza 4y ago

I dunno about the folks in charge at Hyundai or Volkswagen who makes our family's two cars and I really don't want to know about them as long as the cars are good. Elon on the other hand is part of the marketing machine of Tesla and he is rather a toxic individual right now to the common folks - as a South African it strikes close to home as he acts and behaves like those clueless white people from the 1980's who voted for the National Party and Apartheid. Steve Jobs was also like that for Apple but his personal life and opinions very much under the radar except for his annual product releases.

cafard 4y ago

There are a bunch of Teslas in my neighborhood, some belonging to people I know well. None of the owners has shown any signs of embarrassment about owning a Tesla.

slimebot80 4y ago
Once they have the BlueTooth chip on their brain tissue we can more accurately monitor these things. Until then, you'll need to wait for them to speak out. I also know Tesla drivers, and a solid half of them are speaking out against Elon and how they find it embarrassing.

hanafudafan 4y ago

Anybody else just reveling in the crying and moaning since Musk took away the intelligence community's favorite plaything? We're going to be shocked and amazed at the types of corruption that various Atlantic-circle governments have been engaging in. Tesla's been under fire by the financial rags and their talking heads for years, only the excuses change. Absolutely delicious tears, I never knew they could be so precious.