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Paul Graham: SOPA Supporting Companies No Longer Allowed At YC Demo Day
- malandrew 15y agoWhich companies on the list send people to Demo Day?
- mahmoudimus 15y agoWow, surprising to see Visa on that list. Here's a direct link to the list on the techcrunch article. http://judiciary.house.gov/issues/Rouge%20Websites/SOPA%20Supporters.pdf http://judiciary.house.gov/issues/Rouge%20Websites/SOPA%20Su...
- nextparadigms 15y agoMastercard should be there, too. They even had a "witness" at the first hearing. Can we get a list for the companies supporting Protect IP, too? We don't want that one to slip past us, either.
- samstave 15y agoMastercard (and Visa) are both on the PDF I linked to above.. http://judiciary.house.gov/issues/Rouge%20Websites/SOPA%20Supporters.pdf http://judiciary.house.gov/issues/Rouge%20Websites/SOPA%20Su... EDIT: Just realized this was the same as the GP link.
- ggchappell 15y agoBut not Discover. Interesting.
- alexg0 15y agoNot American Express either.
- wallflower 15y ago> They even had a "witness" at the first hearing Mastercard's VP Linda Kirkpatrick was the only witness at that hearing who testified with any semblance of being not 100% pro-SOPA at that hearing. > As noted yesterday, Visa is actually officially against these bills, which makes this one at least somewhat interesting, because the story we'd been hearing was that MasterCard was in favor of them. But Kirkpatrick's testimony is actually kind of surprising. While we expected it to be very pro-SOPA... it turns out that she's very concerned about the massive compliance and liability costs of the bill. Kirkpatrick explains how MasterCard works, and goes to great lengths to say it's against the company's policy to use its cards for any transactions that break the law. And it already has an existing anti-piracy policy, which allows law enforcement and rights holders to bring such infringement using its cards to the company's attention. It then explains its investigation and notification policy. This is all very interesting... and basically makes an anti-SOPA point: given that MasterCard already does this, why does it need SOPA? http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20111116/00035716786/look-testimony-given-todays-sopa-lovefest-congressional-hearings-with-surprise-mastercard.shtml http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20111116/00035716786/look-t...
- tzs 15y agoWhy the quotes around the word witness?
- hub_ 15y agoBoth are there, and with their take in the Wikileak blockade it should not surprise anybody to see them supporting SOPA.
- sequoia 15y agoeww... the Graphic Artists' Guild is on the list. That's really disappointing. https://www.graphicartistsguild.org/ https://www.graphicartistsguild.org/
- nosse 15y agoSurprisingly un-artsy page btw..
- burgerbrain 15y ago""If these companies are so clueless about technology that they think SOPA is a good idea, how could they be good investors?"" That is a brilliant point.
- staunch 15y agoUnless they're different people in the organization, which is likely the usual case. Not that I disagree with the sentiment.
- burgerbrain 15y agoIf that is the case, then the organization is ill. Best to stay away from it, in case it happens to be contagious.
- evan_ 15y agoAn organization is ill if it tolerates its employees having differing political and/or ideological beliefs?
- brown9-2 15y agoThat's not what is at play here. "The company" is the one supporting SOPA, and "the company" is sending representatives to YC demo day. It doesn't sound like you would be banned for merely working for the company and being interested in YC - it's keeping that company out of the process.
- rmc 15y agoThese are not organisations that have individual employees who, on their own time, support SOPA. This is organisations that's policy is to support SOPA.
- maaku 15y agoThat's a little naïve.
- nextparadigms 15y agoPG, if you're reading this, I don't know which list you saw, but here's one with SOPA supporters that is probably the most comprehensive: http://www.digitaltrends.com/opinion/the-439-organizations-sopa-opponents-should-worry-about/ http://www.digitaltrends.com/opinion/the-439-organizations-s...
- mrlase 15y agoSome of these companies are just so random... Why, for instance, does Adidas, L'Oreal, American Apparel, Rite Aid, Pfizer, etc. even have a stance on SOPA? I was rather disconcerted to see that Elsevier was on this list :(
- marshray 15y agoBecause they lose money to counterfeit knock offs. There are people who would sell their country's freedom for a handful of cash. I consider them un-American traitors.
- mekoka 15y agoBecause they lose money to counterfeit knock offs. Your assumption is that if someone doesn't buy knock offs, they'll buy the real thing. Until that can be proven true, I think a better reformulation which more accurately translates the greed of these corporations is Because they feel they're not making more money due to counterfeit knock offs. The companies themselves aren't actually losing anything.
- marshray 15y agoI agree that is more accurate. I thought about writing that but didn't want to slice the language so thin that it distracted from the main point.
- dextorious 15y ago"""Your assumption is that if someone doesn't buy knock offs, they'll buy the real thing. Until that can be proven true""" I keep hearing that argument in discussions about counterfeiting/piracy. Does it convince anyone? Yes, lots of people would buy the real thing X if there was no way to buy X's knock offs. It only depends on a) how much they want something X-like and b) the relative price. If (1) something X-like is desirable, and (2) the price of X's knock offs is near the price of X (so that people not affording X at all is not an issue), then people WOULD buy the original if they couldn't get a cheaper knockoff. Does even one person's money lost qualify the issue as "proven"? Because I know that I have downloaded albums and books that I would DEFINITELY have bought if I could not get them for free of the intertubes.
- d0vs 15y agoAm I the only one thinking that this is censorship too? edit: censorship
- michaelty 15y agoYes. This is not censoring, this is capitalism in action.
- alanfalcon 15y agoCensorship involves speech or other forms of communication. Withholding an invite or discouraging of certain investors in not censorship.
- theorique 15y agoYC demo day is a private event hosted by a private organization. As such, YC has the right to determine the kind of entities that are allowed to be present at the event. And YC / pg have determined that the kind of companies that would support SOPA are unlikely to make good investors in YC portfolio companies. No censorship, just a business decision.
- thebigshane 15y agoCurious: Aren't ISPs and payment processing companies also private organizations? Are DNS "name servers"? I don't disagree with PG's stance here and I don't think it is censorship, but you must admit that these are "just business decisions" for these parties as well (possibly even Congress)
- marshray 15y agoThe term for large ISPs and DNS systems is "common carriers". They are qualitatively different than a Y Combinator.
- thebigshane 15y agoI think you might be wrong. According to wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_carrier https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_carrier Internet Service Providers have argued against being classified as a "common carrier" and, so far, have managed to do so [...] Because ISPs are no longer prohibited from discriminating among different types of content under common carrier law [...]
- dantheman 15y agoWe need try and start to route around companies that are damaging the internet; and start figuring out who their collaborators are and route around them. This is a great first start, but we need to get companies like google to refuse to allow the MPAA & RIAA to use any of their value add products (gmail/calendar/etc).
- nazgulnarsil 15y agoIs there a peerblock list for SOPA supporting companies?
- vijayr 15y agomay be we should stop watching the movies of the supporting studios (and giving them money directly or indirectly) - much harder to do, but would be quite effective
- alphadogg 15y agoWill this simply ring hollow in Washington? I mean, as big as Paul Graham is here, will this mean anything where it matters? (And, in truth, I hope it can.)
- samstave 15y agoPG, thank you - this is one of the best stances against SOPA yet. Frankly, this is a badass stance. And this line, as also mentioned by others, is fantastic: "If these companies are so clueless about technology that they think SOPA is a good idea, how could they be good investors?"
- gasull 15y agoI was going to say the same thing. Thank you PG for doing your part. Thank you so much.
- kposehn 15y agoSmart move. This is a clear way to send a signal to SOPA supporting companies: supporting this bill may cut you out of some of the best investment opportunities in the world.
- kbutler 15y agoSo, who is the congressional staffer who can't spell rogue? http://judiciary.house.gov/issues/Rouge%20Websites/SOPA%20Supporters.pdf http://judiciary.house.gov/issues/Rouge%20Websites/SOPA%20Su...
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- briankim 15y agoThis is pretty awesome indeed.
- pan69 15y agoI sincerely hope that many Internet companies such as Facebook and Google will follow this initiative by removing all these companies from their databases.
- rbanffy 15y agoIn case someone takes the list down, http://www.dieblinkenlights.com/blog_en/companies-that-support-sopa http://www.dieblinkenlights.com/blog_en/companies-that-suppo... Enjoy.
- rjurney 15y agoMaybe all us angry nerds should OCCUPY something. Something big, related to SOPA. It would be cool to see EFF type concerns channeled into that movement.
- Joakal 15y agoOccupy congress, "We demand INTERNET FREEDOM to replace SOPA [and other antiINTERNET FREEDOM bills?]". SOPA could be renamed to SOCPA (Stop Online Child Pornography Act), then you will have a lot of hostile people towards the current and future INTERNET FREEDOM movements.
- paul9290 15y agoIndeed we all should OCCUPY the capitol or the judiciary committee; inside the committee and outside. Though will 1,000s of citizens trying to save the Internet from the media be covered by the media?
- rjurney 15y agoI think occupying Sutro Tower would be pretty cool.
- philwelch 15y agoThe "Occupy" movement is a sinking ship run by anarchists. It's literally an expression of incoherent rage. I think a traditional, well-organized, on-message movement against SOPA would do a lot better than throwing in with OWS.
- AdamFernandez 15y agoGauntlet officially thrown down. I respect PG even more for taking a stand on this. Now we need to figure out the best way to get people opposed to SOPA on a grand scale. No disrespect to the HN community, but I wonder how much of an impact we really have had thus far. Tumblr, Reddit, and Mozilla have done a fairly good job of this, but they are not large enough to do it on their own. Next we need Google and Facebook to get more involved as I think that would make awareness of this issue skyrocket. Any thoughts on pragmatic approaches to getting the public more involved?
- Joakal 15y ago1) Adjust the movement to be about INTERNET FREEDOM, not SOPA. This is because the bill can be delayed/stopped til there's an anti-child porn bill with similar wording. eg "Demand INTERNET FREEDOM bills to replace the ANTI-INTERNET bills [of SOPA, PROTECT-IP, DMCA, etc]" 2) Having INTERNET FREEDOM bills would make it impossible for laws like SOPA to pass. As a bonus, compromises can be made while having some INTERNET FREEDOM. Whereas with SOPA, they're watering down some parts that still lead to ANTI-INTERNET. Which further encourages ANTI-INTERNET supporters to make huge demands. It's a technique: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Door-in-the-face_technique https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Door-in-the-face_technique 3) Find Congress people that love Internet. I hope there's a few! Ask if they can be the mascots, the INTERNET messiah, etc. 4) Copy and paste SOPA to start with. Replace the words to protect INTERNET instead. This is a delicious backfire of using someone's work and their own weapons against them. 5) Add a way for people to be excepted from the movement to the services. Also allow a way for people to understand why the companies are no longer appearing politically neutral (because the anti-INTERNET bills are going to kill them). 6) Add some masking of dropped services with JS hover and non-JS side-by-side of anti-FREEDOM warning 'of increased costs to comply with the legal demands of other companies'. 7) Of course, provide a simple link to the INTERNET FREEDOM movement that has to have two different sections; a) Simple. A video, simple acts to perform to demand and spread the information. This is an attempt to educate people with simplicity. A link is provided to advanced for more complex information. b) Advanced. 'Nerds', that understand the terminology, and what it's about. How to demand and spread information. Also how to explain with simple education if some people don't understand. I tried to suggest some of this to Reddit's ideas for admins but got ghostbanned and censured because apparently it's 'politics' despite Reddit's recent anti-SOPA support.
- rbanffy 15y agoThanks for standing up for us all, pg.
- aestetix_ 15y agopg, thank you so much for doing this. You rock.
- jerfelix 15y agoAmazingly, nine out of the top ten articles on the front page are SOPA related (if you count Louis CK's personal distribution, which seems to me to be an experiment in fighting the xIAA organizations.)
- andrewhillman 15y agoA bomb was just dropped! This is a badass stand that sends a strong and direct message to anyone tied to a SOPA supporter. It will be interesting to see if venture funds start to cut ties w/ SOPA supporters.
- DavidSJ 15y agoI'm virulently anti-SOPA myself, have signed all the petitions, etc. But am I the only one made uncomfortable by a blacklist of people who have expressed certain opinions?
- smokinn 15y agoProbably not but I personally have no problem with this. pg runs an investment firm that invests to a large extent in internet-based companies. To "blacklist" the companies that want to hurt his investment opportunities and returns (really, just no longer help profit from his work) seems like a no-brainer. It gets you positive press from the group you want to attract and hopefully denies some revenue from the ones that would use that revenue against you in the future.
- pork 15y agoIf you think about it, hunters are rarely invited to wildlife fundraisers, fur clothing manufacturers to PETA meetings, and creationists to NAS meetings -- all because of opinions expressed by each party. Dissent is part of a modern life, and not inviting people to private events is a perfectly legitimate way of voicing that dissent.
- DavidSJ 15y agoThe examples you gave are all of events which are defined by some belief or cause, whose opponents would simply be out of place if present. That's very different from what's going on here, where the bearers of a particular opinion are being excluded from a business relationship as a punishment for expressing an opinion which is only circuitously related to that business relationship.
- pork 15y agoI don't see how SOPA is "circuitously" related, since YC deals with Internet companies and SOPA is damaging to fundamental bits of Internet infrastructure. IMO, it's no different from the PETA/fur manufacturer analogy in that the viewpoints are almost diametrically opposed.
- Joakal 15y agoPG, a request; demand INTERNET FREEDOM bills support from SOPA turncoats? Otherwise, we'll go through this shit again [0][1][2][3] until compromises are made. Which I'm sure is from quite an effective tactic [4]. At the moment, it seems to be a lot of 'pacifist' movements to STOP SOPA when they can go to war against the anti-INTERNET FREEDOM supporters by demanding INTERNET FREEDOM bills. After all, if they change the bill to be about stopping rogue sites selling child pornography with same wording except replacing piracy words; are you going to publicly say STOP CHILD PORN act supporting companies are no longer allowed at YC Demo Day? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_S.978 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_S.978 [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combating_Online_Infringement_and_Counterfeits_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combating_Online_Infringement_... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Counterfeiting_Trade_Agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Counterfeiting_Trade_Agre... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Millennium_Copyright_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Millennium_Copyright_A... [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Door-in-the-face_technique https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Door-in-the-face_technique
- inaworldofideas 15y agoPaul Graham. Hero.
- ypcx 15y agoNot sure why you are getting downvoted. Let's call things and people the right names. "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
- Patrick_Bateman 15y agoBoom, headshot. Mmmmmaybe these companies are all so clueless that they think it's a good idea. Far more likely, they know what they're doing is bad, but choose to do it anyway because there's no downside for them. It's like people who are deliberate assholes in public because they (correctly) gamble that no one will risk punching them in the face. Well I for one fully support punching SOPA supporters in the face. This is as good a start as any.
- marcanthonyrosa 15y agoI'm sure you've seen the list of supporters (http://1.usa.gov/t7Wpo8 http://1.usa.gov/t7Wpo8). Even the list itself is a half-assed job by pro-SOPAs to illustrate Congressional support for the bill. Unless, of course, the fragrance company Coty Inc has been seeing a lot of their fragrances being pirated online.
- chernevik 15y agoThe House Judiciary supporters list is chock-full of lawyers -- one-seventh of the list has the string 'LLP' -- and therein lies a major target of opportunity for the technology industry. I doubt anyone will change their counsel over this, but they can make them explain their position. Let every tech industry CEO, CFO and board member call their most senior contact at a supporting firm. Ask them to explain their position, ask them to explain how this _won't_ break DNS, how the precedents set here won't spread to other policy questions or countries. Don't get into balancing one industry or another -- just make them demonstrate a reasonable layperson understanding of how the internet works. The last thing a partner wants is to sound less than informed on the core technologies in their industry of expertise. If nothing else they'll have to go to school on the question. No doubt many such partners will say they get it but the firm is larger than they are. And that's the point of a law firm, isn't it, you hire one because it provides quick access to expertise on a wide variety of subjects. But if that larger firm doesn't understand the tech business, just how prepared are they to handle technology problems in various corners of the law? Ask the M&A guy, the financing guy, the tax guy, to explain how SOPA won't break DNS. I don't know where tech billings compare with movie and recording industry. But they aren't small: M&A, financings, patent, etc etc ad nauseum. Beyond that, the network and technology are the core of how business and industry are changing. Maybe these firms stand to gain from SOPA over the next five years. But can they, can the individual partners, afford to misunderstand the technologies that will be driving more and more clients over time? Get on the phone, not to argue, but to make them understand that they are showing an ignorance that could leave them behind.
- pan69 15y agoAll though I sympathize with your argument, it seems to be based on "reasoning". Reasoning is the one thing this government/industry ins't interested in.
- bigohms 15y agoFirms do not usually take stances on legislative matters their own. SOPA's passage significantly benefits firms' activity levels and in turn the revenue produced in the furtherance of protecting their clients' rights. While outward facing corporate positions may take a neutral or negative stance on SOPA, many overt and implicit stances are taken by their respective counsel. SOPA claims made via premptive cease and desist letters or active litigation may or may not claim SOPA in their position statements to prevent drawing clear relationships between their clients and SOPA. Most agreements come with gag clauses to further protect and guarantee the cat doesn't get out of the bag. Unfortunately, firms are notoriously good for keeping secrets, so I am not expecting Wikipedia like bombshells connecting brand X to SOPA support.
- moses1400 15y agoanyone have a list of the companies that were part of SOPA that attended either of the last two demo days?
- cechmaster 15y agoJust gained a ton of respect for you YC
- johnrob 15y agoAs much as I support the anti SOPA cause, is this more of a hunger strike than a consequential action? The startups presenting at demo day need those dollars a whole lot more than the corporate venture arms need the investments. Money is money, no matter how stupid it may be.
- gasull 15y agoSOPA is going to hurt our industry so much. It's going to be destructive for Silicon Valley. Taking a stand is necessary. YC startups are going to have much a harder time is SOPA passes. Even from just an economic point of view, it's better to take some loses now than taking higher loses in the future.
- johnrob 15y agoA sacrifice is worth it assuming it provides some benefit to the cause. I'm not sure if this action is going to have any effect (hopefully I'm wrong though).
- robomc 15y ago> and many startups, such as Reddit Can you call a 6 year old site, sold to a major media conglomerate, with some of the highest traffic on the net a startup?
- robryan 15y agoThis seems common for anything that is rooted in new media and doesn't look like the traditional newspapers and magazine websites. You still hear the word startup used with Facebook and twitter occasionally even though they at clearly not.
- austenallred 15y agoIt's not only about Congressmen and Congresswomen being in the back pockets of big corporations. If you watch the hearings you realize that 90% of them don't understand enough technology to know what DNS is. They are persuaded by the people that are bought, and it goes from there.
- _THE_PLAGUE 15y agoThis controversy to me seems eerily similar to the so-called "SCO Wars" when the SCO Group defended her intellectual property rights against looters like IBM and Novell. This act will help to prevent tragedies such as what happened to SCO from occuring in the future, by making it more difficult to pirate other people's code. I do not see why some people think that is a bad thing. Darl McBride was right. He might have lost the suit, but I think history will vindicate him, and SOPA is part of that vindication.
- Steko 15y ago200+: content creation, distribution, etc. Approximately 1/4 seems to be small photography studios. 100+ commonly pirated physical products - pharma, shoes, fashion, guitars, spirits, golf clubs, etc. 50+ general manufac/retail industry concerns. 15+ law enforcement/local government trade orgs 15+ law offices There's a number of testing and credentialing organizations, I'd guess they might be part of content but I'm really not sure.
- Bud 15y agoPaul Graham: Thank you for this incredibly forceful and ballsy move. I almost applauded out loud after reading this.
- geebee 15y agoI just saw that the USTA (United States Tennis Association) supports SOPA. What a disappointment. This is the organization that manages the US Open and other pro tennis tournaments, but it's also the group that manages amateur leagues and tournaments. I've been thinking about just playing ultimatetennis instead, maybe this is the time.
- webinsiders 15y agoGODADDY is acting like we're bluffing and basically challenging us to try and make a dent in their business. Read this! Update (6:18 PM): GoDaddy seems unimpressed by the boycott so far. They made the following statement to Ars Technica: "Go Daddy has received some emails that appear to stem from the boycott prompt, but we have not seen any impact to our business. We understand there are many differing opinions on the SOPA regulations."
- dickbasedregex 15y agoMy company has about 35 domains and SSL certs through GoDaddy. I've always loathed them but I can't justify the cost of transferring over. Is anyone offering a discounted option to jump ship?
- dickbasedregex 15y agoJust found discount list on Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/nmnie/godaddy_supports_sopa_im_transferring_51_domains/ http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/nmnie/godaddy_supp...
- mostlyListening 15y agoSo if SOPA fails to pass and stops being an issue, will that boycott end or will it continue? Going by PG's reasoning (If these companies are so clueless about technology that they think SOPA is a good idea, how could they be good investors?") then it should continue until there are major changes the leaderships of those companies. Right?
- TheCowboy 15y agoThat's a good question, and tough one to figure out. This applies to anyone who wants to deprive these companies of their support. From my perspective, these attempts will not stop, and will take on new forms of bills. We have had to deal with bad bills since during the Clinton administration/Republican-controlled congress. Some people call for 'Internet freedom' laws, but what is stopping the next congressional class from weakening or negating these laws without amending the Constitution? My own view is that it will take a long time for these attempts to cease. Worst case, efforts will peter out until the generation who did not grow up with the Internet are no longer with us.
- mverwijs 15y agoPG: How did you arrive at this action when concerning Monsanto I understood your comments as something along the lines of "that's just the way of things work in the world of corporations"?
- dontbelame 15y agoExcellent! Props to PG for standing up against SOPA. Media company wants to take the free internet away from us. We cannot afford to have SOPA passed!!
- bambax 15y agoPG is quoted in the article as saying ”I don’t know exactly which companies had people on the list. But I know which will now: none of them.” That's fine and admirable, but on the practical side, if he doesn't know who's who, how is he going to enforce this rule?
- Flenser 15y agoFrom the article: Graham told me in a followup email that he was indeed serious and had just given the list of SOPA supporters to the people in charge of the Demo Day invites It's not PG who needs to know, it's the people he's put in charge of Demo Day.
- bambax 15y agoYes, I read that too, and that's my point: he doesn't make the invitations himself; just because you trust an organisation to do something doesn't mean you can dispense yourself from verifying they did what they were asked to do. The "people in charge of the Demo Day invites" probably have enormous incentives to invite influential and powerful employees from SOPA-supporting companies, and would certainly face backslash they'd rather do without. So what I think is happening is that PG just added "manage invitations to Demo Day" to his todo list... (all the most admirable BTW)
- Flenser 15y agoThe people in charge of the Demo Day invites work for PG. They're just running an event, they don't care if any specific organisations attend it apart from the criteria given to them by PG.
- bambax 15y agoOh well, if they're simply Y Combinator employees it's as you say; I read that as if it meant they were a contractor ("the people in charge" vs. "us/we").
- jwblackwell 15y agoThis is great news, but I still feel that more leading industry figures need to step forward the same way PG has and make clear their stance on SOPA. Hopefully PGs move will encourage others to follow suit.
- bokchoi 15y agoGoDaddy no longer supports SOPA: http://www.godaddy.com/newscenter/release-view.aspx?news_item_id=378&isc=smtwsup http://www.godaddy.com/newscenter/release-view.aspx?news_ite...
- satyajit 15y agoFound this link from a comment thread on TechCrunch: commenter (Nick Such) said, jhalf of the YC companies may be affected: http://jpf.github.com/domain-profiler/ycombinator.html http://jpf.github.com/domain-profiler/ycombinator.html. But this graph is (I think) earlier on Dec 22nd. Will be interesting to see how the graph looks like after that day's mayhem!
- joezhou 15y agoballs, PG has them.
- readme 15y agoLooks like the link to the Sopa Supporters.pdf file was taken down, so here's a backup, courtesy of google docs: https://docs.google.com/open?id=1-fTQaHJmvOAe78mGBBRSeFdRLoR9mgJYaIIPd3Cowy_P0ReiJF-lt9rv7FG7 https://docs.google.com/open?id=1-fTQaHJmvOAe78mGBBRSeFdRLoR...