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Does China still want Taiwan if it's no longer technologically relevant? My understanding is that China is making similar strides in its own chip industry to th

Does China still want Taiwan if it's no longer technologically relevant? My understanding is that China is making similar strides in its own chip industry to the point where TSMC won't be as nearly as useful to them in 10 years as it is now.

nonethewiser 4y ago
Yes.
whalesalad 4y ago
Taiwan does far more than just TSMC. That is just one single company, albeit a very essential one. For instance, I don't like to buy hand tools (impact sockets, torque wrenches, etc) made in China, but Taiwanese tools are a higher quality and I have no hesitation purchasing them.
- pifm_guy 4y ago
  I suspect that the hand tools made in China aren't low quality because China doesn't have the tech to make them better, but instead because making cheap low quality tools is more profitable. In fact, when taking apart China-made, China-designed products, I am frequently very impressed at cost-cutting measures that are taken with minimal impact on the functionality of the product.
- deltaseventhree 4y ago
  Essential for you. But overall tsmc eclipses everything else Taiwan makes. If Taiwan stopped making those tools you would be impacted. The world overall... not so much.
  - mr_toad 4y ago
    > Essential for you. But overall tsmc eclipses everything else Taiwan makes. TSMC’s revenue is less than a tenth of Taiwan’s total export revenue. They might be the most profitable of Taiwan’s companies, but Taiwan has a huge economy. And it terms of impact on the world economy, Hon Hai precision, better known in the west as Foxconn, would like to say hi.
    - deltaseventhree 4y ago
- fomine3 4y ago
  Many computer/electrics manufacturers and OEMs, like ASUS, Acer, Foxconn, Wistron, Pegatron, MediaTek, Synology, etc are HQ'd in Taiwan. Though PRC company may be able to supersede them, unlike TSMC.
paperskull 4y ago
Taiwan also serves the role as an unsinkable battleship right next door to Chinas mainland. Its military value extends far beyond its chip production capabilities in order for the US to check Chinas influence in SEA region.
- wahern 4y ago
  The U.S. military doesn't stage any assets in Taiwan, not since shortly after rapprochement with China and establishment of the current strategic ambiguity. The U.S. military is very careful about both what and who it officially permits to land on Taiwan. Occasionally (on the order of years) there are borderline cases, such as a research vessel with U.S. Navy ties docking in Taiwan, and it becomes a huge thing in the Chinese media. AFAIU, high-level officers are rarely if ever given permission to enter Taiwan; direct military liaisons in Taiwan are limited to lower level staff officers. When this protocol is broken it's a tit-for-tat situation designed to send a message, and doesn't change anything of substance in how the relationship operates. Anyhow, the U.S. has no need nor desire to establish a presence on Taiwan. Okinawa and Korea are more than close enough for its purposes, peaceful or otherwise. And if the U.S. were to try to establish a presence, you can be sure China's invasion fleet would reach Taiwan before any significant U.S. materiel could make it ashore.
speed_spread 4y ago
Taiwan is the only place China can have a deep water port required by a fleet of nuclear submarines. Mainland coast waters are too shallow.
monocasa 4y ago
China wants Taiwan orthgonally to any economic value it would provide. Reunification is pretty core to their mythos at this point. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if making Taiwan globally less economically relevant is core to their strategy for reunification. While the US is dependent on Taiwan for chips, Taiwan has a very important defense partner that China can't really compete with. But China has a way better chance of securing Taiwan if the rest of the global community only cares for ideological reasons.

nonethewiser 4y ago

Yes.

whalesalad 4y ago

Taiwan does far more than just TSMC. That is just one single company, albeit a very essential one. For instance, I don't like to buy hand tools (impact sockets, torque wrenches, etc) made in China, but Taiwanese tools are a higher quality and I have no hesitation purchasing them.

pifm_guy 4y ago
I suspect that the hand tools made in China aren't low quality because China doesn't have the tech to make them better, but instead because making cheap low quality tools is more profitable. In fact, when taking apart China-made, China-designed products, I am frequently very impressed at cost-cutting measures that are taken with minimal impact on the functionality of the product.
deltaseventhree 4y ago
Essential for you. But overall tsmc eclipses everything else Taiwan makes. If Taiwan stopped making those tools you would be impacted. The world overall... not so much.
- mr_toad 4y ago
  > Essential for you. But overall tsmc eclipses everything else Taiwan makes. TSMC’s revenue is less than a tenth of Taiwan’s total export revenue. They might be the most profitable of Taiwan’s companies, but Taiwan has a huge economy. And it terms of impact on the world economy, Hon Hai precision, better known in the west as Foxconn, would like to say hi.
  - deltaseventhree 4y ago
fomine3 4y ago
Many computer/electrics manufacturers and OEMs, like ASUS, Acer, Foxconn, Wistron, Pegatron, MediaTek, Synology, etc are HQ'd in Taiwan. Though PRC company may be able to supersede them, unlike TSMC.

paperskull 4y ago

Taiwan also serves the role as an unsinkable battleship right next door to Chinas mainland. Its military value extends far beyond its chip production capabilities in order for the US to check Chinas influence in SEA region.

wahern 4y ago
The U.S. military doesn't stage any assets in Taiwan, not since shortly after rapprochement with China and establishment of the current strategic ambiguity. The U.S. military is very careful about both what and who it officially permits to land on Taiwan. Occasionally (on the order of years) there are borderline cases, such as a research vessel with U.S. Navy ties docking in Taiwan, and it becomes a huge thing in the Chinese media. AFAIU, high-level officers are rarely if ever given permission to enter Taiwan; direct military liaisons in Taiwan are limited to lower level staff officers. When this protocol is broken it's a tit-for-tat situation designed to send a message, and doesn't change anything of substance in how the relationship operates. Anyhow, the U.S. has no need nor desire to establish a presence on Taiwan. Okinawa and Korea are more than close enough for its purposes, peaceful or otherwise. And if the U.S. were to try to establish a presence, you can be sure China's invasion fleet would reach Taiwan before any significant U.S. materiel could make it ashore.

speed_spread 4y ago

Taiwan is the only place China can have a deep water port required by a fleet of nuclear submarines. Mainland coast waters are too shallow.

monocasa 4y ago

China wants Taiwan orthgonally to any economic value it would provide. Reunification is pretty core to their mythos at this point. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if making Taiwan globally less economically relevant is core to their strategy for reunification. While the US is dependent on Taiwan for chips, Taiwan has a very important defense partner that China can't really compete with. But China has a way better chance of securing Taiwan if the rest of the global community only cares for ideological reasons.