4 ms·

All I can do is express my sympathy to those affected. None of you deserved to be treated like this.

taolegal 4y ago
> None of you deserved to be treated like this. Give me a break. This sector of the economy is literally the upper echelon of humanity. They won the lottery compared to most people and act like this is some affront. What a bunch of baloney.
mint2 4y ago
Prayers is not technically all we can do, we can push for more labor organization which would be able to prevent that type of mistreatment, among other things. We could also boycott Twitter.
- socialismisok 4y ago
  If Twitter had unionized they could have protected themselves from the whims of Musk. It's still likely Musk would have massacred the company, but maybe people wouldn't be getting fired the day before Thanksgiving. How any engineer looks at Twitter and doesn't say, "We should consider a union..." is beyond me.
  - maigret 4y ago
    He would have disregarded the unions as well. In the EU the workers have probably been illegally fired and the lawsuits are coming soon.
    - socialismisok 4y ago
      You are probably right, tbh.
    - javagram 4y ago
      A union could have used a strike or other type of organized labor action to fight back immediately. Not typically pro-union in tech, but Twitter is making the best case for one I’ve seen yet.
      - ModernMech 4y ago
        Honestly I wouldn’t put it past Musk to call the Pinkertons. They’re still around after all.
      - KptMarchewa 4y ago
        In this case, what would strike achieve from people who Musk wants to not work anyway? Twitter literally closed EU facilities. I don't know any union law in any country that prevents company from closing facilities and eliminating all jobs.
        socialismisok 4y ago
        Twitter workers could strike and shut down the site, they could strike and not make changes like the $8 verification badge, they could strike until Musk agreed to reasonable work hours. They could afford to pay a lawyer a whole lot to fight layoffs and firings. Not a perfect set of options, but better options than they have today.
        KptMarchewa 4y ago
        >Twitter workers could strike and shut down the site No, they are all fired. Didn't you hear? Every EU software engineer has been fired.
        disgruntledphd2 4y ago
        Not legally they haven't been. Facebook discovered this recently, when they attempted to lay off people in NL. They discovered that because it's a mass layoff, they need to consult a workers council. But they don't have a workers council, so they need to elect one, which will take three months. Then another three months of consultation. Even in Ireland/UK which have pretty employer friendly labour laws, none of the FB employees have actually been laid off yet, they're still in a consultation period (till December I believe). Unfortunately for US CEO's, the US labour law does not apply globally.
    - danaris 4y ago
      To be clear, in the EU, the workers have been blocked from access, but they have not been fired, because he legally cannot fire them in that manner. Before access was blocked, from what I've heard, many of the EU Twitter employees read the "you're fired" email, said "hah, not from that I'm not" and went right back into work the next day. If Twitter employees were unionized here in the US, it would be a similar story: Musk could say "you're all fired", but unless he went through the processes outlined in the union contract to fire the people, they would not be fired. At most, if he could get the payroll employees to do his bidding, he could stop them from getting paid, but that would absolutely not hold up in court, and he would have to pay them with back pay once the legal system got done with it—and that kind of legal dispute probably wouldn't take 2 years, since it would be an extremely straightforward case of breach of contract.
  - luckylion 4y ago
    > How any engineer looks at Twitter and doesn't say, "We should consider a union..." is beyond me. "You know, those $500k a year are nice and all, but what I really want is $125k, job security and someone who makes sure only union members are allowed to plug in network cables." Engineers are making large amounts of money, that's why they don't care about unions.
q1w2 4y ago
Twitter engineers are extremely well paid in addition to being cashed out of their company stock options at an above market price - and then getting severance.
- ProjectArcturis 4y ago
  Is this true? What happened to unvested RSUs?
  - coredog64 4y ago
    Unvested RSUs were supposed to have turned into cash payments that would "vest" on the same schedule.

> None of you deserved to be treated like this. Give me a break. This sector of the economy is literally the upper echelon of humanity. They won the lottery compared to most people and act like this is some affront. What a bunch of baloney.

mint2 4y ago

Prayers is not technically all we can do, we can push for more labor organization which would be able to prevent that type of mistreatment, among other things. We could also boycott Twitter.

socialismisok 4y ago
If Twitter had unionized they could have protected themselves from the whims of Musk. It's still likely Musk would have massacred the company, but maybe people wouldn't be getting fired the day before Thanksgiving. How any engineer looks at Twitter and doesn't say, "We should consider a union..." is beyond me.
- maigret 4y ago
  He would have disregarded the unions as well. In the EU the workers have probably been illegally fired and the lawsuits are coming soon.
  - socialismisok 4y ago
    You are probably right, tbh.
  - javagram 4y ago
    A union could have used a strike or other type of organized labor action to fight back immediately. Not typically pro-union in tech, but Twitter is making the best case for one I’ve seen yet.
    - ModernMech 4y ago
      Honestly I wouldn’t put it past Musk to call the Pinkertons. They’re still around after all.
    - KptMarchewa 4y ago
      In this case, what would strike achieve from people who Musk wants to not work anyway? Twitter literally closed EU facilities. I don't know any union law in any country that prevents company from closing facilities and eliminating all jobs.
      - socialismisok 4y ago
        Twitter workers could strike and shut down the site, they could strike and not make changes like the $8 verification badge, they could strike until Musk agreed to reasonable work hours. They could afford to pay a lawyer a whole lot to fight layoffs and firings. Not a perfect set of options, but better options than they have today.
        KptMarchewa 4y ago
        >Twitter workers could strike and shut down the site No, they are all fired. Didn't you hear? Every EU software engineer has been fired.
        disgruntledphd2 4y ago
        Not legally they haven't been. Facebook discovered this recently, when they attempted to lay off people in NL. They discovered that because it's a mass layoff, they need to consult a workers council. But they don't have a workers council, so they need to elect one, which will take three months. Then another three months of consultation. Even in Ireland/UK which have pretty employer friendly labour laws, none of the FB employees have actually been laid off yet, they're still in a consultation period (till December I believe). Unfortunately for US CEO's, the US labour law does not apply globally.
  - danaris 4y ago
    To be clear, in the EU, the workers have been blocked from access, but they have not been fired, because he legally cannot fire them in that manner. Before access was blocked, from what I've heard, many of the EU Twitter employees read the "you're fired" email, said "hah, not from that I'm not" and went right back into work the next day. If Twitter employees were unionized here in the US, it would be a similar story: Musk could say "you're all fired", but unless he went through the processes outlined in the union contract to fire the people, they would not be fired. At most, if he could get the payroll employees to do his bidding, he could stop them from getting paid, but that would absolutely not hold up in court, and he would have to pay them with back pay once the legal system got done with it—and that kind of legal dispute probably wouldn't take 2 years, since it would be an extremely straightforward case of breach of contract.
- luckylion 4y ago
  > How any engineer looks at Twitter and doesn't say, "We should consider a union..." is beyond me. "You know, those $500k a year are nice and all, but what I really want is $125k, job security and someone who makes sure only union members are allowed to plug in network cables." Engineers are making large amounts of money, that's why they don't care about unions.

q1w2 4y ago

Twitter engineers are extremely well paid in addition to being cashed out of their company stock options at an above market price - and then getting severance.

ProjectArcturis 4y ago
Is this true? What happened to unvested RSUs?
- coredog64 4y ago
  Unvested RSUs were supposed to have turned into cash payments that would "vest" on the same schedule.