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Capitalism is at fault here. Unless there are right regulations in a capitalistic system, capitalism will create abuse and problems. We are in 2022 and it's r

by jokoon 4y ago

Capitalism is at fault here. Unless there are right regulations in a capitalistic system, capitalism will create abuse and problems. We are in 2022 and it's really annoying how we cannot discuss deep changes in how capitalism functions unless an army of trolls brings up the gulag point: "the soviet union failed, thus there is no viable alternative to capitalism". It's already almost difficult to discuss it criticize growth, so socialism is really beyond taboo.

rolobio 4y ago
Many of the things done at FTX are already a crime. The laws simply aren't being enforced for the mega rich.
kspacewalk2 4y ago
Capitalism is not any more at fault here than GPUs or math. Yes, the right regulations are indeed vital for a capitalistic system. Saying "capitalism will create abuse and problems without regulations" is like saying "cars will cause death and destruction without a steering wheel". That's why we don't build them without steering wheels, and a car without a steering wheel is not really a car. A financial market is a market, the very word "market" necessarily implies regulation, like all markets had since the dawn of time (it's why you brought your stuff there, and why the customers came). If a new technology creates a new niche in the financial market, and regulation has not caught up yet, nothing is wrong with the concept of capitalism, the problem is that regulation has not caught up yet. And now it largely has, and these companies are blowing up, and the system works. Not sure what is supposed to make us "discuss deep changes in how capitalism functions" if how modern capitalism functions is fixing the problem.
nyolfen 4y ago
> It's already almost difficult to discuss it criticize growth turning the social meta from positive sum to zero or negative sum is the most disastrous idea conceivable. everything you cherish, including your physical safety, is built on an assumption of shared future rewards. people will seek advantage no matter what; they must have a socially productive avenue or it will be taken from others. if you are so sure an alternative is possible, i encourage you to demonstrate it -- live your life with others in a way that defies market forces. the proof is in the pudding; for now, there is only one game in town.
- barbazoo 4y ago
  > i encourage you to demonstrate it -- live your life with others in a way that defies market forces. the proof is in the pudding; for now, there is only one game in town. are you implying that you positively know that there is not a single group of people on the planet living an alternative that's better than what the majority is doing?
  - nyolfen 4y ago
    no, i am saying that it does not matter what i believe, because if there is a superior system it will require no belief at all. this conversation reminds me of this essay http://hyperstition.abstractdynamics.org/archives/008891.html http://hyperstition.abstractdynamics.org/archives/008891.htm...

by jokoon 4y ago

rolobio 4y ago

Many of the things done at FTX are already a crime. The laws simply aren't being enforced for the mega rich.

kspacewalk2 4y ago

Capitalism is not any more at fault here than GPUs or math. Yes, the right regulations are indeed vital for a capitalistic system. Saying "capitalism will create abuse and problems without regulations" is like saying "cars will cause death and destruction without a steering wheel". That's why we don't build them without steering wheels, and a car without a steering wheel is not really a car. A financial market is a market, the very word "market" necessarily implies regulation, like all markets had since the dawn of time (it's why you brought your stuff there, and why the customers came). If a new technology creates a new niche in the financial market, and regulation has not caught up yet, nothing is wrong with the concept of capitalism, the problem is that regulation has not caught up yet. And now it largely has, and these companies are blowing up, and the system works. Not sure what is supposed to make us "discuss deep changes in how capitalism functions" if how modern capitalism functions is fixing the problem.

nyolfen 4y ago

> It's already almost difficult to discuss it criticize growth turning the social meta from positive sum to zero or negative sum is the most disastrous idea conceivable. everything you cherish, including your physical safety, is built on an assumption of shared future rewards. people will seek advantage no matter what; they must have a socially productive avenue or it will be taken from others. if you are so sure an alternative is possible, i encourage you to demonstrate it -- live your life with others in a way that defies market forces. the proof is in the pudding; for now, there is only one game in town.

barbazoo 4y ago
> i encourage you to demonstrate it -- live your life with others in a way that defies market forces. the proof is in the pudding; for now, there is only one game in town. are you implying that you positively know that there is not a single group of people on the planet living an alternative that's better than what the majority is doing?
- nyolfen 4y ago
  no, i am saying that it does not matter what i believe, because if there is a superior system it will require no belief at all. this conversation reminds me of this essay http://hyperstition.abstractdynamics.org/archives/008891.html http://hyperstition.abstractdynamics.org/archives/008891.htm...