8 ms·

TikTok and the First Amendment

26 points by Leary 4y ago

falcolas 4y ago
TL;DR: The US Government can't ban TikTok using censorship of speech, so they can/should do it via economic controls instead. Nothing really new here, economic controls are what the previous administration tried to implement, and are most likely to try and use if the government wants to try another round at blocking it. Can't say I'm in favor of that, but then I like my huehuehuehue birb videos.
- colechristensen 4y ago
  TikTok is mostly harmless when considering everything its peers do (i.e. the same things). The mass surveillance done by more or less all popular social apps on phones (and beyond) is a problem, but that problem is everywhere. It would be good for all of us if tiktok was treated fairly, and by fairly i mean the FUD about surveillance and manipulation should apply everywhere and be regulated everywhere not just the Chinese state sponsored kind. Enact data collection laws, local storage laws, etc. and apply them everywhere. Then better regulate and control the agents of foreign powers that overly influence business done in America.
  - aierou 4y ago
    > the FUD about surveillance and manipulation should apply everywhere We're already here. > and be regulated everywhere This is where we need to be.
  - nickthegreek 4y ago
    Not sure why you are being downvoted. The problem is corps abilities to slurp up all kinda of data and worm their way into knowing everything with cookie trails and insane fingerprinting techniques that you could never explain to a layperson. Everyone is focused on the 'foreign power' part like this hasn't been possible/used since other countries hooked up to the internet.
TSiege 4y ago
[Sort of off topic] While I don't like that Tiktok has close ties to the CCP and I can see the see the potential security threat it poses with manipulated social media trends and spying on it's users. I'm starting to second guess the idea of banning it. At least without a viable replacement. My stance is this, most of the big names coming out for a ban are either conservative leaning institutions or just plain conservative. FBI and Marco Rubio. (I'm old enough to remember a rogue FBI branch pressuring the FBI director to release a scathing report on Hilary Clinton just before the election) I think TikTok is filling a void for Democrat messaging that Republicans/Conservatives have ie: Fox, conservative youtubers, breitbart, etc. The left is doesn't have this and TikTok has been useful for sharing concise information in a repetitive and engaging fashion. I have a hunch it's a large reason why we had such big youth turnout this midterm election cycle. TL;DR: Ban TikTok when there's a good home grown replacement. Or Nationalize it's US/Western wing and spin it off as a separate entity
- blendergeek 4y ago
  Would you support banning it if it primarily was helping your political opponents?
- throwaway0x7E6 4y ago
  >threat it poses with manipulated social media trends ;)
- doublerabbit 4y ago
  MSN Messenger was my true first client. ICQ, YIM, AIM and the likes for those. My prediction of things for next generational of things: Skype turned into Teams MSN Messenger turned to Skype, Discord will turn in to MSN Ventrilo/Mumble morphed in to Discord. TikTok will turn in to Discord ???? turns in to TikTok
- notUrsMine 4y ago
  I like how the story always comes down to private-government collusion in other countries bad. While in the US policy has for decades been intentionally designed to stifle worker gains[0], tacitly a re-education program to rebuild the “essential worker base” of our society, to remember we best keep propping up our civic traditions never mind they’re as sacrosanct in any real terms as religious catechism and routines of worship; not at all. There are other geometric patterns human agency could conceptually “draw upon the globe”. But the agency wealth creation hive mind is familiar with are to be taken as immutable. [0] https://www.nytimes.com/1997/02/27/business/job-insecurity-of-workers-is-a-big-factor-in-fed-policy.html https://www.nytimes.com/1997/02/27/business/job-insecurity-o...
kneebonian 4y ago
So I really hate TikTok I think it is a major security risk; however I've recently become worried about the actual mechanism of enforcement getting rid of TikTok. It seems however we do it, blacklisting IPs associated with TikTok, messing with DNS, or pretty much any other actual enforcement mechanism sets a dangerous precedent. I then wonder what happens if we allow the government to start disallowing certain apps for "National Security" reasons, just like when we decided that the NSA should be able to listen to any electronic communication without a warrant to "stop terrorism". Don't get me wrong I despise TikTok and the CCP and think it is bad for mental health and is a weapon of psychological warfare by the CCP, but I am worried about the precedent set by allowing the federal government to ban or make illegal an app and how that will be abused in the future.
- mrits 4y ago
  If TikTok decides to stay up even when we don't let US companies advertise, you know it was more of a an issue than we originally thought.
- mc32 4y ago
  Same. I don’t like the app/service and think it’s detrimental to health. But even potentially worse would be the precedent of banning something like this. I believe the gov should better govern advertising and algorithms than outright banning something completely. Admittedly it’s a thorny issue.
- ouid 4y ago
  I think that exceptions like tik tok can be safely excised by naming the organization in legislation. No generalizations to draw from legislation that picks on tiktok by name
  - kneebonian 4y ago
    But that's no longer rule by law that's rule by mob outrage or by the security apparatus depending on who you believe wants TikTok banned. Is it really appropriate to give the government the power to arbitrarily name certain companies to no longer exist or operate within the US because the government said so? How long before this power is used against Parler or some other company because people don't like it. Or WikiLeaks or other sources of inconvenience and upset to the those running things? Should 4chan be allowed to exist?
algoatecorn 4y ago
It's truly disheartening that TikTok usage is even framed at a NatSec issue when we should be self-limiting in the first place. The amount of individual attention that has been robbed from our population through scroll-feeds is sickening. Monopolizing the attention economy will lead to the monopolization of the decision economy. Those who are neck deep in social media will begin to give away their own free will without realizing it.
- gambiting 4y ago
  It's not about attention - if tiktok was merely wasting everyone's time we wouldn't even be discussing it. It's about the fact that a corporation controlled by a foreign government has an app installed on the phones of most Americans, and that app captures a huge amount of information. That's why it's a national security issue. At least that's the way I understand it.
  - algoatecorn 4y ago
    Oh no, I agree that it's a natsec issue. I'm just saying it's sad that this is the point at which people start to pay attention. People should know better than to interact with it as much as they do anyway. Also, if it wasn't such a glorious attention-robbing mechanism, then the amount of information captured wouldn't be as big of an issue. The attention aspect is what will eventually cause the most harm. Attention feeds databases. The future of AGI is dependent on its utility to make decisions for us. The primary users of AGI as a personal decision maker will be those who are feeding the most information to these systems.
  - halpmeh 4y ago
    The information collected isn’t great, but a large part of the concern is related to attention. Attention allows influence. For instance, the CCO could use TikTok to push conspiracy theories that undermine faith in the electoral system.
  - jamesgreenleaf 4y ago
    Not just any foreign government, but an authoritarian rival Great Power. In addition to data-capture, the app also employs a closed-source algorithm that can promote or bury certain types of content. It's a window into the minds of the citizens of competing, democratic nations, and those nations do not have reciprocal methods of such access.
josefresco 4y ago
Asked my teen what they'd switch to if TikTok disappeared. Instagram Reels? YouTube Shorts? Snapchat Spotlight? Response: "Nothing, I'd probably just watch more Netflix"
- Spivak 4y ago
  Yep, TikTok is TV complete with channel surfing but make it social media. The clones don’t actually get that.
  - josefresco 4y ago
    I've used YouTube shorts and it seems to be pretty much the same. It's basically YT video content, shortened and remixed.
- nicolashahn 4y ago
  Realistically I think most of the TikTok content creators would go over to Reels and the net effect on attention-destroying time-wasting would be small.
  - josefresco 4y ago
    I think YouTube shorts has a decent shot, as they can leverage the mega YouTube pool of creators.
    - skyyler 4y ago
      I don't think shorts is going to take off if they continue with the gimped player.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago
  Your teen also never expected to use TikTok in the first place. The social group "decides" collectively. I'm positive that if TikTok were banned teens would find themselves on another service.
jokoon 4y ago
It's a bit interesting how the first amendment can actually cause security problems in the US. It seems to test the limit of "absolute free speech". I'm not against free speech, but there are people arguing that the first amendment is part of the American culture and identity, but in this particular case, it doesn't seem to work very well. So there is a fine line between "the market of ideas favors virtuous ideas" and "the value of ideas also depends on the ability of state actors to have influence on the market of ideas".
Barrin92 4y ago
I find it hard to reconcile framing TikTok as a national security issue when it's by far the least politicized app in the social media space, probably due to the short form video medium and moderation and the focus on entertainment. Also somewhat funny given that Twitter, the most influential social/poliitcal platform is now owned by a guy who praises China directly and is being favorably quoted on Russian state television, with the Saudis becoming the second largest investor. I'd be slightly more concerned about that one.
- einherjae 4y ago
  Not politics, but idiotic crap like tidepod-challenges and general promotion of unhealthy/stupid crap. That’s how you unravel a generation while making sure your own population gets healthy exercise videos.
- mechanical_bear 4y ago
  The politicization is not the issue, and is a bit of a straw man.
UIUC_06 4y ago
Difference between "banning TikTok for people under 18" and "banning alcohol for people under 18" ? Go.
- einherjae 4y ago
  Wrong comparison, try “violent movies” or “porn” instead of alcohol, then you’re still within first amendment territory. Unless we go from “money is speech” to “alcohol loosens lips, ergo it is speech”…
  - UIUC_06 4y ago
    Both you and falcolas are off base. Porn restriction for minors is not controversial, legally. Your first amendment argument will go nowhere. So then the question is, should something that harms young minds be restricted? You can argue that TikTok doesn't, and that's a fair argument to make. But if your argument is "yes, but it's free speech" then I think you lose.
- algoatecorn 4y ago
  Well banning alcohol is about keeping poison out of the hands of developing minds. Wait, shit! Idk
- falcolas 4y ago
  Alcohol can straight up kill you or impair your judgement when operating anything including your own body. TikTok can distract you or direct opinions. Or to put it another way, it wasn't social media that killed Avicci. It was drinking. Inane, reductive comparison.
- pdq 4y ago
  Both cigarettes and alcohol are now 21 minimum.
  - MichaelCollins 4y ago
    > In the United States, the age to buy tobacco products is 21 in all states as of 2020. Huh, TIL.
gdsdfe 4y ago
maybe a dumb question but why not build an alternative ?! there's a real need for something like tiktok but with much more features like payments, commerce, influencer based ads etc. I really it would work, just make something better!
- Spivak 4y ago
  That called forcing ByteDance to sell TikTok to American owners.
  - gdsdfe 4y ago
    what?! building an alternative is not called buying tiktok
    - Spivak 4y ago
      There’s like 5 clones from major US companies, people haven’t moved yet.
      - gdsdfe 4y ago
        A. I haven't seen any clones - B. I'm not talking about clones, I'm talking about alternatives aka something that takes the good things and adds more good things. You can't compete with clones, it's just silly
yanderekko 4y ago
>The United States could ban app stores from offering TikTok for download or purchase. Huh? How can they do this? Just informal pressure on Apple/Google? The government can't just unilaterally direct these companies to ban any disfavored apps, I assume.. or at least I hope.
- falcolas 4y ago
  The federal government has control over interstate commerce and international commerce. TikTok would be easy to classify as pertaining to these.
  - yanderekko 4y ago
    Why is it easier to use the commerce clause as a catch-all to ban app store distribution but not to just ban TikTok? Are there not similar rights concerns in play?
    - falcolas 4y ago
      The federal government would have to make an economic case for blocking or managing TikTok. I imagine they could make a national security argument, but that would be a lot harder. But I'm not a lawyer or politician, so that's just speculation on my part.
awinter-py 4y ago
Not an expert, but angles the link doesn't explore: 1. tiktok is banned in china. Potential product safety angle of 'don't ship us things that aren't legal where they're made'. (But would presumably need new regs here). 2. trade policy -- western social media is banned in china, let's at least not allow theirs to sell stuff here? Article says 'tiktok has not monetized so no point in banning transactions', I think they're oversimplifying the impact of saying 'no income at all' 3. stronger privacy laws generally -- rules about where data is domiciled (or at least honestly disclosing it), how it is used, real audits, and real penalties for violators. (this should apply to domestic cos too) 4. WTO subsidies / anti-dumping? But this probably applies to many tech companies + could escalate badly. Also not sure if tiktok is gov-subsidized -- I think an SOE has a minority stake 5. 'kicking them from app stores would have no impact bc of existing install base' feels naive
- nicolashahn 4y ago
  Tiktok is not banned in China, it's just rebranded as Douyin.
  - awinter-py 4y ago
    yes I googled this, the results were like 'tiktok isn't banned it's just not available' legit question bc I am not sure: is tiktok content available to douyin users? is the web version available?
  - halpmeh 4y ago
    I believe it’s regulated. Kids can only spend 40 mins / day and can’t use it between 10 pm and 6 am: https://www.cnet.com/culture/tiktoks-china-equivalent-limits-kids-to-40-minutes-a-day/ https://www.cnet.com/culture/tiktoks-china-equivalent-limits...
  - MichaelCollins 4y ago
    Different content, different rules for content, different product.
  - mayama 4y ago

26 points by Leary 4y ago

TL;DR: The US Government can't ban TikTok using censorship of speech, so they can/should do it via economic controls instead. Nothing really new here, economic controls are what the previous administration tried to implement, and are most likely to try and use if the government wants to try another round at blocking it. Can't say I'm in favor of that, but then I like my huehuehuehue birb videos.

colechristensen 4y ago
TikTok is mostly harmless when considering everything its peers do (i.e. the same things). The mass surveillance done by more or less all popular social apps on phones (and beyond) is a problem, but that problem is everywhere. It would be good for all of us if tiktok was treated fairly, and by fairly i mean the FUD about surveillance and manipulation should apply everywhere and be regulated everywhere not just the Chinese state sponsored kind. Enact data collection laws, local storage laws, etc. and apply them everywhere. Then better regulate and control the agents of foreign powers that overly influence business done in America.
- aierou 4y ago
  > the FUD about surveillance and manipulation should apply everywhere We're already here. > and be regulated everywhere This is where we need to be.
- nickthegreek 4y ago
  Not sure why you are being downvoted. The problem is corps abilities to slurp up all kinda of data and worm their way into knowing everything with cookie trails and insane fingerprinting techniques that you could never explain to a layperson. Everyone is focused on the 'foreign power' part like this hasn't been possible/used since other countries hooked up to the internet.

TSiege 4y ago

[Sort of off topic] While I don't like that Tiktok has close ties to the CCP and I can see the see the potential security threat it poses with manipulated social media trends and spying on it's users. I'm starting to second guess the idea of banning it. At least without a viable replacement. My stance is this, most of the big names coming out for a ban are either conservative leaning institutions or just plain conservative. FBI and Marco Rubio. (I'm old enough to remember a rogue FBI branch pressuring the FBI director to release a scathing report on Hilary Clinton just before the election) I think TikTok is filling a void for Democrat messaging that Republicans/Conservatives have ie: Fox, conservative youtubers, breitbart, etc. The left is doesn't have this and TikTok has been useful for sharing concise information in a repetitive and engaging fashion. I have a hunch it's a large reason why we had such big youth turnout this midterm election cycle. TL;DR: Ban TikTok when there's a good home grown replacement. Or Nationalize it's US/Western wing and spin it off as a separate entity

blendergeek 4y ago
Would you support banning it if it primarily was helping your political opponents?
throwaway0x7E6 4y ago
>threat it poses with manipulated social media trends ;)
doublerabbit 4y ago
MSN Messenger was my true first client. ICQ, YIM, AIM and the likes for those. My prediction of things for next generational of things: Skype turned into Teams MSN Messenger turned to Skype, Discord will turn in to MSN Ventrilo/Mumble morphed in to Discord. TikTok will turn in to Discord ???? turns in to TikTok
notUrsMine 4y ago
I like how the story always comes down to private-government collusion in other countries bad. While in the US policy has for decades been intentionally designed to stifle worker gains[0], tacitly a re-education program to rebuild the “essential worker base” of our society, to remember we best keep propping up our civic traditions never mind they’re as sacrosanct in any real terms as religious catechism and routines of worship; not at all. There are other geometric patterns human agency could conceptually “draw upon the globe”. But the agency wealth creation hive mind is familiar with are to be taken as immutable. [0] https://www.nytimes.com/1997/02/27/business/job-insecurity-of-workers-is-a-big-factor-in-fed-policy.html https://www.nytimes.com/1997/02/27/business/job-insecurity-o...

kneebonian 4y ago

So I really hate TikTok I think it is a major security risk; however I've recently become worried about the actual mechanism of enforcement getting rid of TikTok. It seems however we do it, blacklisting IPs associated with TikTok, messing with DNS, or pretty much any other actual enforcement mechanism sets a dangerous precedent. I then wonder what happens if we allow the government to start disallowing certain apps for "National Security" reasons, just like when we decided that the NSA should be able to listen to any electronic communication without a warrant to "stop terrorism". Don't get me wrong I despise TikTok and the CCP and think it is bad for mental health and is a weapon of psychological warfare by the CCP, but I am worried about the precedent set by allowing the federal government to ban or make illegal an app and how that will be abused in the future.

mrits 4y ago
If TikTok decides to stay up even when we don't let US companies advertise, you know it was more of a an issue than we originally thought.
mc32 4y ago
Same. I don’t like the app/service and think it’s detrimental to health. But even potentially worse would be the precedent of banning something like this. I believe the gov should better govern advertising and algorithms than outright banning something completely. Admittedly it’s a thorny issue.
ouid 4y ago
I think that exceptions like tik tok can be safely excised by naming the organization in legislation. No generalizations to draw from legislation that picks on tiktok by name
- kneebonian 4y ago
  But that's no longer rule by law that's rule by mob outrage or by the security apparatus depending on who you believe wants TikTok banned. Is it really appropriate to give the government the power to arbitrarily name certain companies to no longer exist or operate within the US because the government said so? How long before this power is used against Parler or some other company because people don't like it. Or WikiLeaks or other sources of inconvenience and upset to the those running things? Should 4chan be allowed to exist?

algoatecorn 4y ago

It's truly disheartening that TikTok usage is even framed at a NatSec issue when we should be self-limiting in the first place. The amount of individual attention that has been robbed from our population through scroll-feeds is sickening. Monopolizing the attention economy will lead to the monopolization of the decision economy. Those who are neck deep in social media will begin to give away their own free will without realizing it.

gambiting 4y ago
It's not about attention - if tiktok was merely wasting everyone's time we wouldn't even be discussing it. It's about the fact that a corporation controlled by a foreign government has an app installed on the phones of most Americans, and that app captures a huge amount of information. That's why it's a national security issue. At least that's the way I understand it.
- algoatecorn 4y ago
  Oh no, I agree that it's a natsec issue. I'm just saying it's sad that this is the point at which people start to pay attention. People should know better than to interact with it as much as they do anyway. Also, if it wasn't such a glorious attention-robbing mechanism, then the amount of information captured wouldn't be as big of an issue. The attention aspect is what will eventually cause the most harm. Attention feeds databases. The future of AGI is dependent on its utility to make decisions for us. The primary users of AGI as a personal decision maker will be those who are feeding the most information to these systems.
- halpmeh 4y ago
  The information collected isn’t great, but a large part of the concern is related to attention. Attention allows influence. For instance, the CCO could use TikTok to push conspiracy theories that undermine faith in the electoral system.
- jamesgreenleaf 4y ago
  Not just any foreign government, but an authoritarian rival Great Power. In addition to data-capture, the app also employs a closed-source algorithm that can promote or bury certain types of content. It's a window into the minds of the citizens of competing, democratic nations, and those nations do not have reciprocal methods of such access.

josefresco 4y ago

Asked my teen what they'd switch to if TikTok disappeared. Instagram Reels? YouTube Shorts? Snapchat Spotlight? Response: "Nothing, I'd probably just watch more Netflix"

Spivak 4y ago
Yep, TikTok is TV complete with channel surfing but make it social media. The clones don’t actually get that.
- josefresco 4y ago
  I've used YouTube shorts and it seems to be pretty much the same. It's basically YT video content, shortened and remixed.
nicolashahn 4y ago
Realistically I think most of the TikTok content creators would go over to Reels and the net effect on attention-destroying time-wasting would be small.
- josefresco 4y ago
  I think YouTube shorts has a decent shot, as they can leverage the mega YouTube pool of creators.
  - skyyler 4y ago
    I don't think shorts is going to take off if they continue with the gimped player.
2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago
Your teen also never expected to use TikTok in the first place. The social group "decides" collectively. I'm positive that if TikTok were banned teens would find themselves on another service.

jokoon 4y ago

It's a bit interesting how the first amendment can actually cause security problems in the US. It seems to test the limit of "absolute free speech". I'm not against free speech, but there are people arguing that the first amendment is part of the American culture and identity, but in this particular case, it doesn't seem to work very well. So there is a fine line between "the market of ideas favors virtuous ideas" and "the value of ideas also depends on the ability of state actors to have influence on the market of ideas".

Barrin92 4y ago

I find it hard to reconcile framing TikTok as a national security issue when it's by far the least politicized app in the social media space, probably due to the short form video medium and moderation and the focus on entertainment. Also somewhat funny given that Twitter, the most influential social/poliitcal platform is now owned by a guy who praises China directly and is being favorably quoted on Russian state television, with the Saudis becoming the second largest investor. I'd be slightly more concerned about that one.

einherjae 4y ago
Not politics, but idiotic crap like tidepod-challenges and general promotion of unhealthy/stupid crap. That’s how you unravel a generation while making sure your own population gets healthy exercise videos.
mechanical_bear 4y ago
The politicization is not the issue, and is a bit of a straw man.

UIUC_06 4y ago

Difference between "banning TikTok for people under 18" and "banning alcohol for people under 18" ? Go.

einherjae 4y ago
Wrong comparison, try “violent movies” or “porn” instead of alcohol, then you’re still within first amendment territory. Unless we go from “money is speech” to “alcohol loosens lips, ergo it is speech”…
- UIUC_06 4y ago
  Both you and falcolas are off base. Porn restriction for minors is not controversial, legally. Your first amendment argument will go nowhere. So then the question is, should something that harms young minds be restricted? You can argue that TikTok doesn't, and that's a fair argument to make. But if your argument is "yes, but it's free speech" then I think you lose.
algoatecorn 4y ago
Well banning alcohol is about keeping poison out of the hands of developing minds. Wait, shit! Idk
falcolas 4y ago
Alcohol can straight up kill you or impair your judgement when operating anything including your own body. TikTok can distract you or direct opinions. Or to put it another way, it wasn't social media that killed Avicci. It was drinking. Inane, reductive comparison.
pdq 4y ago
Both cigarettes and alcohol are now 21 minimum.
- MichaelCollins 4y ago
  > In the United States, the age to buy tobacco products is 21 in all states as of 2020. Huh, TIL.

gdsdfe 4y ago

maybe a dumb question but why not build an alternative ?! there's a real need for something like tiktok but with much more features like payments, commerce, influencer based ads etc. I really it would work, just make something better!

Spivak 4y ago
That called forcing ByteDance to sell TikTok to American owners.
- gdsdfe 4y ago
  what?! building an alternative is not called buying tiktok
  - Spivak 4y ago
    There’s like 5 clones from major US companies, people haven’t moved yet.
    - gdsdfe 4y ago
      A. I haven't seen any clones - B. I'm not talking about clones, I'm talking about alternatives aka something that takes the good things and adds more good things. You can't compete with clones, it's just silly

yanderekko 4y ago

>The United States could ban app stores from offering TikTok for download or purchase. Huh? How can they do this? Just informal pressure on Apple/Google? The government can't just unilaterally direct these companies to ban any disfavored apps, I assume.. or at least I hope.

falcolas 4y ago
The federal government has control over interstate commerce and international commerce. TikTok would be easy to classify as pertaining to these.
- yanderekko 4y ago
  Why is it easier to use the commerce clause as a catch-all to ban app store distribution but not to just ban TikTok? Are there not similar rights concerns in play?
  - falcolas 4y ago
    The federal government would have to make an economic case for blocking or managing TikTok. I imagine they could make a national security argument, but that would be a lot harder. But I'm not a lawyer or politician, so that's just speculation on my part.

awinter-py 4y ago

Not an expert, but angles the link doesn't explore: 1. tiktok is banned in china. Potential product safety angle of 'don't ship us things that aren't legal where they're made'. (But would presumably need new regs here). 2. trade policy -- western social media is banned in china, let's at least not allow theirs to sell stuff here? Article says 'tiktok has not monetized so no point in banning transactions', I think they're oversimplifying the impact of saying 'no income at all' 3. stronger privacy laws generally -- rules about where data is domiciled (or at least honestly disclosing it), how it is used, real audits, and real penalties for violators. (this should apply to domestic cos too) 4. WTO subsidies / anti-dumping? But this probably applies to many tech companies + could escalate badly. Also not sure if tiktok is gov-subsidized -- I think an SOE has a minority stake 5. 'kicking them from app stores would have no impact bc of existing install base' feels naive

nicolashahn 4y ago
Tiktok is not banned in China, it's just rebranded as Douyin.
- awinter-py 4y ago
  yes I googled this, the results were like 'tiktok isn't banned it's just not available' legit question bc I am not sure: is tiktok content available to douyin users? is the web version available?
- halpmeh 4y ago
  I believe it’s regulated. Kids can only spend 40 mins / day and can’t use it between 10 pm and 6 am: https://www.cnet.com/culture/tiktoks-china-equivalent-limits-kids-to-40-minutes-a-day/ https://www.cnet.com/culture/tiktoks-china-equivalent-limits...
- MichaelCollins 4y ago
  Different content, different rules for content, different product.
- mayama 4y ago