7 ms·

Still glad I took my chances with the vaccine: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/01/11/briefing/omicron-deaths-vaccinated-vs-unvaccinated.amp.ht

Still glad I took my chances with the vaccine: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/01/11/briefing/omicron-deaths-vaccinated-vs-unvaccinated.amp.html https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/01/11/brie...

kitsunesoba 4y ago
Seeing how family who got infected prior to vaccine availability are still suffering brain fog and lack of energy even now, I am too. The long term effects of covid concern me far more than those of the vaccine do.
- twerkmonsta 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - Enginerrrd 4y ago
    I'm glad the emergency use authorization allowed people who are interested to get the vaccine. I don't think mandates were ever appropriate, and I think people should also have had a right to NOT get the vaccine. The emergency use authorization seemed absolutely like the appropriate course of action given the circumstances.
- vikingerik 4y ago
  Remember the right comparison regarding apparent long-Covid: What proportion of people would self-report brain fog and lack of energy anyway, with nothing to do with Covid?
  - AnthonBerg 4y ago
    This sort of claim has been made after a study was released that took the presence of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies as the source of thruth for whether people had gotten COVID-19. This sort of claim can’t be made on that basis because a lot of people do not produce antibodies after infection. Paper: “Predictors of Nonseroconversion after SARS-CoV-2 Infection” – https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/9/21-1042_article https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/9/21-1042_article Abstract: “Not all persons recovering from severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection develop SARS-CoV-2–specific antibodies. We show that nonseroconversion is associated with younger age and higher reverse transcription PCR cycle threshold values and identify SARS-CoV-2 viral loads in the nasopharynx as a major correlate of the systemic antibody response.” Please note that this was already known when the study which is taken to show that people are imagining long COVID was published. It’s not a good study. Quite a bit of research has been done since then which further pins down the fact that long COVID is very real and how to diagnose it with biomarkers, which turn out to correspond very well with people saying that a SARS-CoV-2 infection messed them up. Please also consider how harshly judgemental it appears when someone accuses a large number of people of imagining or making up a severe and disabling condition. You have to be very certain.
  - dekhn 4y ago
    How much of everything can be explained by the brain's bias to ignore the base rate fallacy.
chedca21 4y ago
The danger of contracting covid was inflated relatively by initial standards of care that later proved harmful; https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/why-some-doctors-are-moving-away-ventilators-virus-patients-n1179986 https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/why-some-doctors-... Also using steroids like dexamethasone were a later advent in treating covid that helped a lot. (They should have been standard of care right away like they would have been for any other respiratory illness). These early follies increased the perceived need for a vaccine then and today still; risk : benefit analysis for the vaccines consider worst possible scenarios for covid, which include defunct practices like high PIP ventilator use and forgoing of common first-line treatments
- xracy 4y ago
  Did you look at the article? The time frames for the graphs are not the beginnings of covid (EoY 2021). By that time the initial standards of care had improved to the steroid treatments (I can't say specifically which ones, because I do not know, but I do know they were generally the standard of care at that time). The risk benefit analysis of the vaccine vs the disease is ultimately something that's impossible to do at this point, because it's impossible to be impartial to whatever side you think is riskier. In general, I think a disease is just always going to be riskier than a vaccine. Anything you say about the vaccine could be true of the disease as well until we have complete information about the disease.
Server6 4y ago
I watched one of my best friends choke on his own lungs and die of COVID last year. He'd be alive if he had gotten the vaccine.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- HideousKojima 4y ago
- throwaway5959 4y ago
  I’m sorry to hear that.
  - Server6 4y ago
    Thanks. I wouldn't wish what he went through on my worst enemy. He was in the hospital for three months and spend half of that time on a ventilator. After a month COVID isn't contagious anymore and we were allowed us to visit him in the ICU (really visiting his family). I was at the hospital the night he passed away. I think for a lot of people COVID isn't "real". They don't know anyone who died. Or if they do they were old, and/or it happened in the hospital far away from whatever their personal reality is. Believe me when I tell you the risk associated with the vaccine is nothing compared to what he went through. I fully believe had he been vaccinated he'd still be here today.
- polartx 4y ago
  >He'd be alive if he had gotten the vaccine. Sorry for your loss, but there’s no way you could know that. The very same logic you would require you to espouse the belief that any person who received a vaccine and died, died because the vaccine.
  - Server6 4y ago
    He was in mid 30s, young for COVID - but diabetic. There have been actual studies done for the vaccine to show efficacy in preventing death for someone in his risk group. So not the same logic, but accrual proven causation. There's a very very good chance he would've made it had he been vaccinated.
thedrbrian 4y ago

kitsunesoba 4y ago

Seeing how family who got infected prior to vaccine availability are still suffering brain fog and lack of energy even now, I am too. The long term effects of covid concern me far more than those of the vaccine do.

twerkmonsta 4y ago
[flagged]
- Enginerrrd 4y ago
  I'm glad the emergency use authorization allowed people who are interested to get the vaccine. I don't think mandates were ever appropriate, and I think people should also have had a right to NOT get the vaccine. The emergency use authorization seemed absolutely like the appropriate course of action given the circumstances.
vikingerik 4y ago
Remember the right comparison regarding apparent long-Covid: What proportion of people would self-report brain fog and lack of energy anyway, with nothing to do with Covid?
- AnthonBerg 4y ago
  This sort of claim has been made after a study was released that took the presence of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies as the source of thruth for whether people had gotten COVID-19. This sort of claim can’t be made on that basis because a lot of people do not produce antibodies after infection. Paper: “Predictors of Nonseroconversion after SARS-CoV-2 Infection” – https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/9/21-1042_article https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/9/21-1042_article Abstract: “Not all persons recovering from severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection develop SARS-CoV-2–specific antibodies. We show that nonseroconversion is associated with younger age and higher reverse transcription PCR cycle threshold values and identify SARS-CoV-2 viral loads in the nasopharynx as a major correlate of the systemic antibody response.” Please note that this was already known when the study which is taken to show that people are imagining long COVID was published. It’s not a good study. Quite a bit of research has been done since then which further pins down the fact that long COVID is very real and how to diagnose it with biomarkers, which turn out to correspond very well with people saying that a SARS-CoV-2 infection messed them up. Please also consider how harshly judgemental it appears when someone accuses a large number of people of imagining or making up a severe and disabling condition. You have to be very certain.
- dekhn 4y ago
  How much of everything can be explained by the brain's bias to ignore the base rate fallacy.

chedca21 4y ago

The danger of contracting covid was inflated relatively by initial standards of care that later proved harmful; https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/why-some-doctors-are-moving-away-ventilators-virus-patients-n1179986 https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/why-some-doctors-... Also using steroids like dexamethasone were a later advent in treating covid that helped a lot. (They should have been standard of care right away like they would have been for any other respiratory illness). These early follies increased the perceived need for a vaccine then and today still; risk : benefit analysis for the vaccines consider worst possible scenarios for covid, which include defunct practices like high PIP ventilator use and forgoing of common first-line treatments

xracy 4y ago
Did you look at the article? The time frames for the graphs are not the beginnings of covid (EoY 2021). By that time the initial standards of care had improved to the steroid treatments (I can't say specifically which ones, because I do not know, but I do know they were generally the standard of care at that time). The risk benefit analysis of the vaccine vs the disease is ultimately something that's impossible to do at this point, because it's impossible to be impartial to whatever side you think is riskier. In general, I think a disease is just always going to be riskier than a vaccine. Anything you say about the vaccine could be true of the disease as well until we have complete information about the disease.

Server6 4y ago

I watched one of my best friends choke on his own lungs and die of COVID last year. He'd be alive if he had gotten the vaccine.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
HideousKojima 4y ago
throwaway5959 4y ago
I’m sorry to hear that.
- Server6 4y ago
  Thanks. I wouldn't wish what he went through on my worst enemy. He was in the hospital for three months and spend half of that time on a ventilator. After a month COVID isn't contagious anymore and we were allowed us to visit him in the ICU (really visiting his family). I was at the hospital the night he passed away. I think for a lot of people COVID isn't "real". They don't know anyone who died. Or if they do they were old, and/or it happened in the hospital far away from whatever their personal reality is. Believe me when I tell you the risk associated with the vaccine is nothing compared to what he went through. I fully believe had he been vaccinated he'd still be here today.
polartx 4y ago
>He'd be alive if he had gotten the vaccine. Sorry for your loss, but there’s no way you could know that. The very same logic you would require you to espouse the belief that any person who received a vaccine and died, died because the vaccine.
- Server6 4y ago
  He was in mid 30s, young for COVID - but diabetic. There have been actual studies done for the vaccine to show efficacy in preventing death for someone in his risk group. So not the same logic, but accrual proven causation. There's a very very good chance he would've made it had he been vaccinated.

thedrbrian 4y ago