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All crypto currencies are a ponzi scheme. Change my mind.
by albertopv 4y ago
All crypto currencies are a ponzi scheme. Change my mind.
- px43 4y agoPonzi schemes by definition use opaque ledgers. Ponzi schemes are custodial. Ponzi schemes guarantee returns. There exist Ponzi schemes which have disguised themselves as cryptocurrencies, but the idea that all cryptocurrencies are Ponzi schemes demonstrates a complete ignorance of what a Ponzi scheme is.
- polygamous_bat 4y ago> Ponzi schemes by definition use opaque ledgers. Why? To me a ponzi scheme is where the earlier "investors" get paid out with the money of later "investors". That's it. By that definition it's quite the "decentralized", somewhat stochastic ponzi.
- px43 4y agoPonzi victims are told on paper that their "investments" are increasing in value, and that they can withdraw at any time, when in reality, the assets don't actually exist. Also a key aspect is that their balance only ever goes up.
- cdiddy2 4y agoyour definition includes stocks. I suppose you might be right that stocks are a ponzi
- tehjoker 4y agothey weren't back when the reason people bought them were dividends, now the only real exit is if the company goes bankrupt or is purchased. The intervening time is hard to describe as anything other than pure speculation and piling dupes on top of each other
- someguydave 4y agoYour definition covers every investable asset.
- everfree 4y agoIn a ponzi scheme, there is a fictitious business model that's purported to be turning a profit, and its lack of profit is hidden by secretly using new inflows to pay off old investors. In crypto, none of that is hidden. It's widely known that dollars cashed out by earlier investors come from the coffers of later investors. Since e.g. Bitcoin doesn't deceive people about being a profitable company, it's by definition not a ponzi scheme. It's important to use this terminology correctly.
- lamontcg 4y ago"It can't be a Ponzi because they're honest about it being a scam right up front"
- everfree 4y agoThat's how the definition works, yes. By the way, who is the "they" that your sentence refers to?
- JamesianP 4y agowell you have to draw a line somewhere. Call it something else if you want to criticize it. Like a bunch of fools racing towards a cliff. But if they're honest about something being a scam how can it be a scam? Seems like a paradox.
- lamontcg 4y agoLiterally only a paradox in places like Hacker News by people who are motivated to question calling crypto a Ponzi. I've got bad news. It is still a Ponzi if people are "honest" about it being a Ponzi, it is still a Ponzi if it started out as an investment idea and it went Ponzi as losses added up. Arguing that clear Ponzis aren't really Ponzis due to some kind of semantic rules is a gigantic display of "copium". The only real difference is the distributed and decentralized nature of the scams. And the CEO of JPMorgan has described crypto coins exactly as a "distributed Ponzi scheme" before Congress. If you wind up paying out redemptions with new deposits as fast as you can, right before you fail hard, then it was a Ponzi all along. That's it. That's the definition.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- anomaly_ 4y agoDo you know what a Ponzi scheme is?
- imtringued 4y agoTake a look at RAI.