4 ms·

I forget which Pixel generation. For one generation Google I believe never shipped the ability to unlock your phone with your face. Despite having all the har

by urthor 4y ago

I forget which Pixel generation. For one generation Google I believe never shipped the ability to unlock your phone with your face. Despite having all the hardware on the phone, it just didn't have the feature. This was a serious feature deficit viz a viz the relevant iPhone at the time. The gossip was, the feature was finished, completely. Had to be ripped out after external pen-testing bypassed it with Facebook photos. They have many, big, problems.

mschuster91 4y ago
> This was a serious feature deficit viz a viz the relevant iPhone at the time. IIRC, the iPhone uses not just a photo from the selfie cam, but adds infrared to construct a sort-of-3d-ish depth map of your face as well - that is what defeats a simple attempt at unlocking with photos. Now, the really interesting thing to research is if a silicone molded face mask could be used to fool the iPhone into unlocking. Photos or videos of the subject in multiple angles should be enough to create a decent enough 3D face copy.
- jerpint 4y ago
  A video rotating around a subject + nerfs could maybe get you the 3D face copy pretty easily
- endisneigh 4y ago
  Won’t work - https://9to5mac.com/2019/12/16/3d-mask/amp/ https://9to5mac.com/2019/12/16/3d-mask/amp/ Muscle movement is also now necessary so it’s pretty difficult to circumvent
  - rkagerer 4y ago
    Betcha someone will make a silicone mask that twitches.
  - Dylan16807 4y ago
    That just sounds like you need a proper mask that can be worn. And it doesn't sound like it even needs to fit.
foverzar 4y ago
> Despite having all the hardware on the phone Did Pixel phones really have a frontal lidar?
- makeitdouble 4y ago
  Pixel 4 had dedicated hardware (project Soli)
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - llampx 4y ago
    Incidentally, I said to myself I would buy a Pixel 5 if it had Soli as well because it would show that Google was becoming serious about supporting features for more than 1 generation. Predictably, I never bought a Pixel 5 or 6 or 7.
  - krzyk 4y ago
    Soli != hardware for face unlock. It had 2xIR cameras, flood illuminator and a dot project for that purpose. Soli was a gimmick on top of that, so it would enable that hardware above when you were reaching with your hand for the phone. In my case it was a gimmick because I don't see much difference between face unlock times when I reach for the phone and the most useful feature for me (swiping to change music) was working also when my windshield had wipers working. I dream of a Pixel with normal face unlock (like in Pixel 4, not the crippled on in Pixel 7) but without Soli. I can't believe that they ditched it after just one generation, now I'm stuck. And only reason to upgrade would be a Pixel that has photos >12mpix (not just the sensor).
AuthorizedCust 4y ago
Pixel is on generation 7. Only two supported face unlock: 4 and 7. 6 was rumored to have it, but it was never delivered. 6 and 7 are equivalent hardware-wise for face unlock: neither has the sensors to do it in a highly secure manner. 7’s face unlock therefore doesn’t give you access to the most sensitive stuff, like bank accounts, requiring supplemental, secure authentication, such as fingerprint.
sorenjan 4y ago
Android introduced face unlocking in 2011[0]. It used the regular front camera and hence had no depth information, which makes it vulnerable to photos[1]. It was removed in Android 10, when a new face authentication interface[2] was added. Face unlocking without specialized hardware such as what iPhones have is not secure. [0] https://www.androidauthority.com/face-unlock-android-4-0-ice-cream-sandwich-most-personal-feature-27693/ https://www.androidauthority.com/face-unlock-android-4-0-ice... [1] https://www.androidauthority.com/android-jelly-bean-face-unlock-blink-hacking-105556/ https://www.androidauthority.com/android-jelly-bean-face-unl... [2] https://source.android.com/docs/security/features/biometric/face-authentication https://source.android.com/docs/security/features/biometric/...
izacus 4y ago
I'm not really sure what you're talking about - the only generation that had LIDAR was Pixels 4/4XL and those shipped with face unlock. There WAS a rumor about Pixel 6, but it doesn't have any special face unlocking camera. Pixel 7 does support face unlock without special hardware with caveat that it's less secure.

by urthor 4y ago

mschuster91 4y ago

> This was a serious feature deficit viz a viz the relevant iPhone at the time. IIRC, the iPhone uses not just a photo from the selfie cam, but adds infrared to construct a sort-of-3d-ish depth map of your face as well - that is what defeats a simple attempt at unlocking with photos. Now, the really interesting thing to research is if a silicone molded face mask could be used to fool the iPhone into unlocking. Photos or videos of the subject in multiple angles should be enough to create a decent enough 3D face copy.

jerpint 4y ago
A video rotating around a subject + nerfs could maybe get you the 3D face copy pretty easily
endisneigh 4y ago
Won’t work - https://9to5mac.com/2019/12/16/3d-mask/amp/ https://9to5mac.com/2019/12/16/3d-mask/amp/ Muscle movement is also now necessary so it’s pretty difficult to circumvent
- rkagerer 4y ago
  Betcha someone will make a silicone mask that twitches.
- Dylan16807 4y ago
  That just sounds like you need a proper mask that can be worn. And it doesn't sound like it even needs to fit.

foverzar 4y ago

> Despite having all the hardware on the phone Did Pixel phones really have a frontal lidar?

makeitdouble 4y ago
Pixel 4 had dedicated hardware (project Soli)
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- llampx 4y ago
  Incidentally, I said to myself I would buy a Pixel 5 if it had Soli as well because it would show that Google was becoming serious about supporting features for more than 1 generation. Predictably, I never bought a Pixel 5 or 6 or 7.
- krzyk 4y ago
  Soli != hardware for face unlock. It had 2xIR cameras, flood illuminator and a dot project for that purpose. Soli was a gimmick on top of that, so it would enable that hardware above when you were reaching with your hand for the phone. In my case it was a gimmick because I don't see much difference between face unlock times when I reach for the phone and the most useful feature for me (swiping to change music) was working also when my windshield had wipers working. I dream of a Pixel with normal face unlock (like in Pixel 4, not the crippled on in Pixel 7) but without Soli. I can't believe that they ditched it after just one generation, now I'm stuck. And only reason to upgrade would be a Pixel that has photos >12mpix (not just the sensor).

AuthorizedCust 4y ago

Pixel is on generation 7. Only two supported face unlock: 4 and 7. 6 was rumored to have it, but it was never delivered. 6 and 7 are equivalent hardware-wise for face unlock: neither has the sensors to do it in a highly secure manner. 7’s face unlock therefore doesn’t give you access to the most sensitive stuff, like bank accounts, requiring supplemental, secure authentication, such as fingerprint.

sorenjan 4y ago

Android introduced face unlocking in 2011[0]. It used the regular front camera and hence had no depth information, which makes it vulnerable to photos[1]. It was removed in Android 10, when a new face authentication interface[2] was added. Face unlocking without specialized hardware such as what iPhones have is not secure. [0] https://www.androidauthority.com/face-unlock-android-4-0-ice-cream-sandwich-most-personal-feature-27693/ https://www.androidauthority.com/face-unlock-android-4-0-ice... [1] https://www.androidauthority.com/android-jelly-bean-face-unlock-blink-hacking-105556/ https://www.androidauthority.com/android-jelly-bean-face-unl... [2] https://source.android.com/docs/security/features/biometric/face-authentication https://source.android.com/docs/security/features/biometric/...

izacus 4y ago

I'm not really sure what you're talking about - the only generation that had LIDAR was Pixels 4/4XL and those shipped with face unlock. There WAS a rumor about Pixel 6, but it doesn't have any special face unlocking camera. Pixel 7 does support face unlock without special hardware with caveat that it's less secure.