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> a "metaverse" that nobody wants This is going to be the next famous “nobody wants Dropbox” comment. I don’t know if Horizon Worlds is going to be successful

> a "metaverse" that nobody wants This is going to be the next famous “nobody wants Dropbox” comment. I don’t know if Horizon Worlds is going to be successful, but Reality Labs is much, much bigger than that. Do you honestly believe no one wants VR and AR? Seriously? Think about gaming alone. Think about sitting on an airplane with three 50” monitors overlaid with your vision, where you can actually code, or do whatever. Travel, education, shopping, entertainment. The possibilities are endless. This stuff is basically already possible today, and maybe a couple years away from a legitimately good experience. Meta is way out in the lead on this. When the media talks about the spending on Metaverse, they’re always imagining Horizon Worlds. I think it’s entirely possible Horizon Worlds becomes successful. I mean, my company does some watercooler meetings in gather.towns, where you have a tiny little 32x32 pixel avatar. It’s entirely possible in a few years we’ll be doing these in Horizon Worlds. But even if we’re not, and that’s entirely bunk, Reality Labs is still the leading VR headset manufacturer, with a ton of software to make it all possible, still has an entire games division in Oculus Studios, and much more. People definitely want this stuff. It’s early days still, and Reality Labs is definitely burning cash rapidly, but they also sold a billion dollars of headsets over the past year.

solardev 4y ago
Do they though...? They've been saying that about VR since the VirtualBoy, and still nobody wants it. It's just some super niche activity that's novel for all of a couple hours and then quickly gets old. yawn I bet we'll still be hearing about proper VR is just around the corner, twenty years from now...
- jlmorton 4y ago
  The growth in VR headsets is quickly becoming a hockey stick. 5 million in 2020, 8 million this year, 11 million projected next year, with an install base of 25 million. To put this in perspective, there were 8 million PS5 sales in 2022, and 6.5 million Xbox X. I realize this is not quite an apt comparison, and I’m lumping all VR headsets from all manufacturers together. But this is rapidly becoming a big deal.
  - solardev 4y ago
    vs more than a billion smartphones sold, 300 million PCs, 30 million monitors...
    - jlmorton 4y ago
      It was only fifteen years ago that the original iPhone launched with 6 million units sold. Look, I’m not necessarily claiming Quest VR headsets will be the next iPhone. But I think it’s pretty likely this will be a big and important product over the next few years.
smackeyacky 4y ago
When (if) they solve the balance/vomit inducing nature of the VR headsets and find a way not to ruin your eyes because they are focused at 2cm for extended periods of time, maybe VR will take off. Until then, VR is a nausea inducing gimmick like 3D TV that adds precisely nothing to any kind of human interaction. Augmented reality... that has some actual uses. VR is not even that good for games, let alone the fantasy of having a meeting enhanced by using it.
- vmladenov 4y ago
  Eyes are not focused at 2cm in VR, that's ridiculous. The focus distance is several meters but it varies between sets. You notice this when objects get close to you and your natural instinct causes you to focus closer, making the entire field of view go out of focus.
- School-Cotton 4y ago
  I upvoted you because I agree overall, but it’s absolutely wrong that VR isn’t good for games. The first time I played a game in VR was a mind-blowing experience.
pixl97 4y ago
>Do you honestly believe no one wants VR and AR? That's not important question, that question is, do enough people want this that it will pay off. I mean I heard that 3D TV was the shit a decade ago, but we don't much of that around.
fdsafdewe 4y ago
>Think about sitting on an airplane with three 50” monitors overlaid with your vision What will anyone do with that, except watch funny cat videos?
- jlmorton 4y ago
  Any number of things. These are just like regular desktop monitors, just virtual. You can have an IDE open on one, a browser on another, email on another. Or whatever you normally use a monitor for. The resolution is not quite there yet, but it’s getting close. Horizon Workroom, along with Horizon Remote Desktop are tools that allow you do real tasks in VR/AR.
  - fdsafdewe 4y ago
    >These are just like regular desktop monitors, Funny cat videos it is.
School-Cotton 4y ago
> Think about gaming alone. Think about sitting on an airplane with three 50” monitors overlaid with your vision, where you can actually code, or do whatever. The common feature of metaverse bulls seems to be asserting without evidence that pixel density will increase massively from its current state, such that emulating several monitors will be viable. I see no reason to believe this is true. It’s not the case that all technology you can imagine will eventually exist. Things always level off eventually, which is why I don’t have a 10 GHz processor today.
- jlmorton 4y ago
  I agree there are limitations, but Meta announced Project Cambria last year, with an expected resolution of 1230 DPI, up from 770 on Quest Pro. If they can achieve that, people are going to start doing real work on the headsets.
  - School-Cotton 4y ago
    What DPI do you estimate would be needed to emulate three 50-inch monitors?
    - jlmorton 4y ago
      To be honest, I’m not an expert, and you’d just be getting a lay opinion. They say human vision can discern about 60 pixels per degree. I believe Quest Pro achieves about 20, and Project Cambria might push 30. Note that the 1200 DPI is per eye.
zeroonetwothree 4y ago
How many people spend so much of their time on airplanes that they need to optimize it? The average flights/year is around 1 per person.
tjpnz 4y ago
>Think about sitting on an airplane with three 50” monitors overlaid with your vision, where you can actually code, or do whatever. Travel, education, shopping, entertainment. The possibilities are endless. I would much rather look out the window, read or sleep.
hardware2win 4y ago
>This is going to be the next famous “nobody wants Dropbox” comment. Did you bet money on that? e.g by purchasing meta stocks

solardev 4y ago

Do they though...? They've been saying that about VR since the VirtualBoy, and still nobody wants it. It's just some super niche activity that's novel for all of a couple hours and then quickly gets old. yawn I bet we'll still be hearing about proper VR is just around the corner, twenty years from now...

jlmorton 4y ago
The growth in VR headsets is quickly becoming a hockey stick. 5 million in 2020, 8 million this year, 11 million projected next year, with an install base of 25 million. To put this in perspective, there were 8 million PS5 sales in 2022, and 6.5 million Xbox X. I realize this is not quite an apt comparison, and I’m lumping all VR headsets from all manufacturers together. But this is rapidly becoming a big deal.
- solardev 4y ago
  vs more than a billion smartphones sold, 300 million PCs, 30 million monitors...
  - jlmorton 4y ago
    It was only fifteen years ago that the original iPhone launched with 6 million units sold. Look, I’m not necessarily claiming Quest VR headsets will be the next iPhone. But I think it’s pretty likely this will be a big and important product over the next few years.

smackeyacky 4y ago

When (if) they solve the balance/vomit inducing nature of the VR headsets and find a way not to ruin your eyes because they are focused at 2cm for extended periods of time, maybe VR will take off. Until then, VR is a nausea inducing gimmick like 3D TV that adds precisely nothing to any kind of human interaction. Augmented reality... that has some actual uses. VR is not even that good for games, let alone the fantasy of having a meeting enhanced by using it.

vmladenov 4y ago
Eyes are not focused at 2cm in VR, that's ridiculous. The focus distance is several meters but it varies between sets. You notice this when objects get close to you and your natural instinct causes you to focus closer, making the entire field of view go out of focus.
School-Cotton 4y ago
I upvoted you because I agree overall, but it’s absolutely wrong that VR isn’t good for games. The first time I played a game in VR was a mind-blowing experience.

pixl97 4y ago

>Do you honestly believe no one wants VR and AR? That's not important question, that question is, do enough people want this that it will pay off. I mean I heard that 3D TV was the shit a decade ago, but we don't much of that around.

fdsafdewe 4y ago

>Think about sitting on an airplane with three 50” monitors overlaid with your vision What will anyone do with that, except watch funny cat videos?

jlmorton 4y ago
Any number of things. These are just like regular desktop monitors, just virtual. You can have an IDE open on one, a browser on another, email on another. Or whatever you normally use a monitor for. The resolution is not quite there yet, but it’s getting close. Horizon Workroom, along with Horizon Remote Desktop are tools that allow you do real tasks in VR/AR.
- fdsafdewe 4y ago
  >These are just like regular desktop monitors, Funny cat videos it is.

School-Cotton 4y ago

> Think about gaming alone. Think about sitting on an airplane with three 50” monitors overlaid with your vision, where you can actually code, or do whatever. The common feature of metaverse bulls seems to be asserting without evidence that pixel density will increase massively from its current state, such that emulating several monitors will be viable. I see no reason to believe this is true. It’s not the case that all technology you can imagine will eventually exist. Things always level off eventually, which is why I don’t have a 10 GHz processor today.

jlmorton 4y ago
I agree there are limitations, but Meta announced Project Cambria last year, with an expected resolution of 1230 DPI, up from 770 on Quest Pro. If they can achieve that, people are going to start doing real work on the headsets.
- School-Cotton 4y ago
  What DPI do you estimate would be needed to emulate three 50-inch monitors?
  - jlmorton 4y ago
    To be honest, I’m not an expert, and you’d just be getting a lay opinion. They say human vision can discern about 60 pixels per degree. I believe Quest Pro achieves about 20, and Project Cambria might push 30. Note that the 1200 DPI is per eye.

zeroonetwothree 4y ago

How many people spend so much of their time on airplanes that they need to optimize it? The average flights/year is around 1 per person.

tjpnz 4y ago

>Think about sitting on an airplane with three 50” monitors overlaid with your vision, where you can actually code, or do whatever. Travel, education, shopping, entertainment. The possibilities are endless. I would much rather look out the window, read or sleep.

hardware2win 4y ago

>This is going to be the next famous “nobody wants Dropbox” comment. Did you bet money on that? e.g by purchasing meta stocks