4 ms·

Not this publication, but most discussions I've seen of this use essentially the same points: https://www.cjr.org/analysis/capital-b-black-styleguide.php http

by abeyer 4y ago

Not this publication, but most discussions I've seen of this use essentially the same points: https://www.cjr.org/analysis/capital-b-black-styleguide.php https://www.cjr.org/analysis/capital-b-black-styleguide.php

bequanna 4y ago
> White carries a different set of meanings; capitalizing the word in this context risks following the lead of white supremacists. Just… wow. This is some next level nonsense.
- int_19h 4y ago
  At the end of the article there's a little note: "This piece has been updated for clarity. An earlier version included an explanation that was off-base". I got curious and looked up the initial version on the Internet Archive, and it was that paragraph that changed in the most drastic way. The original said: "AT THE COLUMBIA JOURNALISM REVIEW, we capitalize Black, and not white, when referring to racial groups. Black is an ethnic designation; white merely describes the skin color of people who can, usually without much difficulty, trace their ethnic origins back to a handful of European countries." As you've noticed, this became: "AT THE COLUMBIA JOURNALISM REVIEW, we capitalize Black, and not white, when referring to groups in racial, ethnic, or cultural terms. For many people, Black reflects a shared sense of identity and community. White carries a different set of meanings; capitalizing the word in this context risks following the lead of white supremacists."
zugi 4y ago
Correct me if I'm wrong but this seems to have just started a few years ago? Suddenly news publications all started capitalizing "Black". Maybe it was to provide parity with ethnic groups named after locations with proper nouns, like Asians, Hispanics, Indians, Pacific Islanders, etc.? Of course a decade or two ago there was a push towards "African American", which has two capital letters, but that didn't quite catch on. If White people want to be capitalized, maybe we can call them "Euros"?
- Izkata 4y ago
  Recent yep, but your guess is wrong. A cousin comment linked to a Chicago Style Guide post from around the 2020 riots where they mention it's a recent change other publications have made and they're following suit. The change is to refer to "the Black identity" instead of race. Whatever that means.
- MichaelCollins 4y ago
  > If White people want to be capitalized, maybe we can call them "Euros"? I think this would be controversial. While a lot of White Americans are proud of their ethnic background (I'm a quarter Irish!, I'm an Italian American), many are not. Maybe because they have mixed backgrounds, don't know where their ancestors came from, or because their ancestors fought or fled wars with those European ancestors. For instance my great-grandfather left Europe in disgust after WWI, and after coming to America told his family that they were going to be simply Americans. According to wikipedia, 6.6% of Americans self-identify their ancestral origin as simply "American". Most of these are visibly white. Many of them are descended from British people, and quite possibly don't want to self-describe as British-American because America was founded by a war to terminate that connection. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_ancestry https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_ancestry
  - zugi 4y ago
    Interesting. I don't have studies but anecdotally many people seem to tie their hyphenated-Americanism to their last name. Of course that just follows one lineage. You could be 60% British, but have an Italian last name, and describe your ancestry as Italian-American.
blackhaz 4y ago
Mother of god...

by abeyer 4y ago

bequanna 4y ago

> White carries a different set of meanings; capitalizing the word in this context risks following the lead of white supremacists. Just… wow. This is some next level nonsense.

int_19h 4y ago
At the end of the article there's a little note: "This piece has been updated for clarity. An earlier version included an explanation that was off-base". I got curious and looked up the initial version on the Internet Archive, and it was that paragraph that changed in the most drastic way. The original said: "AT THE COLUMBIA JOURNALISM REVIEW, we capitalize Black, and not white, when referring to racial groups. Black is an ethnic designation; white merely describes the skin color of people who can, usually without much difficulty, trace their ethnic origins back to a handful of European countries." As you've noticed, this became: "AT THE COLUMBIA JOURNALISM REVIEW, we capitalize Black, and not white, when referring to groups in racial, ethnic, or cultural terms. For many people, Black reflects a shared sense of identity and community. White carries a different set of meanings; capitalizing the word in this context risks following the lead of white supremacists."

zugi 4y ago

Correct me if I'm wrong but this seems to have just started a few years ago? Suddenly news publications all started capitalizing "Black". Maybe it was to provide parity with ethnic groups named after locations with proper nouns, like Asians, Hispanics, Indians, Pacific Islanders, etc.? Of course a decade or two ago there was a push towards "African American", which has two capital letters, but that didn't quite catch on. If White people want to be capitalized, maybe we can call them "Euros"?

Izkata 4y ago
Recent yep, but your guess is wrong. A cousin comment linked to a Chicago Style Guide post from around the 2020 riots where they mention it's a recent change other publications have made and they're following suit. The change is to refer to "the Black identity" instead of race. Whatever that means.
MichaelCollins 4y ago
> If White people want to be capitalized, maybe we can call them "Euros"? I think this would be controversial. While a lot of White Americans are proud of their ethnic background (I'm a quarter Irish!, I'm an Italian American), many are not. Maybe because they have mixed backgrounds, don't know where their ancestors came from, or because their ancestors fought or fled wars with those European ancestors. For instance my great-grandfather left Europe in disgust after WWI, and after coming to America told his family that they were going to be simply Americans. According to wikipedia, 6.6% of Americans self-identify their ancestral origin as simply "American". Most of these are visibly white. Many of them are descended from British people, and quite possibly don't want to self-describe as British-American because America was founded by a war to terminate that connection. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_ancestry https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_ancestry
- zugi 4y ago
  Interesting. I don't have studies but anecdotally many people seem to tie their hyphenated-Americanism to their last name. Of course that just follows one lineage. You could be 60% British, but have an Italian last name, and describe your ancestry as Italian-American.

blackhaz 4y ago

Mother of god...