8 ms·

> Investors did. In paper value. Odds are most are still up on their investment. Equity isn't cash.

jsemrau 4y ago
If it weren't for these pesky share buyback programs. 45B at a price of 330 USD only in 2021!
cwalv 4y ago
> Odds are most are still up on their investment. I'm not so sure about that; FB hasn't traded in this range since mid-2015, doesn't pay dividends and hasn't had any splits. Also, USD today is worth ~20% less in real terms today than it was in 2015
greenyoda 4y ago
> most are still up on their investment Meta stock is now at $99, a price last seen in early 2016. Chart: https://finance.yahoo.com/chart/META#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 https://finance.yahoo.com/chart/META#eyJpbnRlcnZhbCI6IndlZWs... So if you would have bought and held the stock any time after that, you'd currently be sitting on a loss.
crazygringo 4y ago
In what universe are stock investments not equivalent to cash, for nearly all investors? You buy, you sell, same as forex or gold or turnips. This is real-life loss of value. Saying it's "paper value" makes as much sense as saying the money in your bank account isn't cash because it's just "numbers of a screen". I'm astonished that somebody could think stock losses are somehow less harmful than losing cash. That's just wrong.
- pyuser583 4y ago
  It’s only harmful if you buy high and sell low.
  - SensoredRooster 4y ago
    I like where your heads at. Simple yet brilliant!
- edanm 4y ago
  What are you talking about? The almost universal advice before buying stocks is that it's only good for the long term, because at any particular moment it might lose its value. It is always stressed that you shouldn't use money to buy stocks if you might need that money in the next ten years. It is also recommended to move money from stocks to a safer instrument as you get closer to needing to use it.
  - izacus 4y ago
    What's a safer instrument in these years though?
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      If “in these years” means possibly needing to sell within 0 to 5 years, then safer would be USD, short term treasures, I bonds, muni bonds, AAA corporate bonds (or correspondence bond ETFs), etc.
  - qwytw 4y ago
lern_too_spel 4y ago
> Odds are most are still up on their investment. Facebook IPO'd in 2012. The stock is down to its price in October 2015. There are a few people who own lots of shares obtained before October 2015, and they are up. There are probably more people who own a few shares obtained after October 2015, and they are down.
kotlin2 4y ago
Equity in Meta is liquid net worth, unless you're a materially important share holder. The stocks you hold right now can be converted into cash easy at any point in time. In what world is that nearly equivalent to cash?
- lotsofpulp 4y ago
  In the world that the cash (USD) from 2 months ago still buys you almost the same today, but equity in Meta buys you 25% less.
  - kotlin2 4y ago
    A world where your cash is held in British pounds? Why do you accept forex fluctuations but not security fluctuations?
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      I do accept the fluctuations, but the risk and magnitude are different.
hestefisk 4y ago
Exactly. These are unrealised losses. The net loss would depend on what price each investor entered their position on.
bagels 4y ago
Transaction costs are low and there is liquidity. It's not cash, but they did lose money whether or not they want to acknowledge it.

If it weren't for these pesky share buyback programs. 45B at a price of 330 USD only in 2021!

> Odds are most are still up on their investment. I'm not so sure about that; FB hasn't traded in this range since mid-2015, doesn't pay dividends and hasn't had any splits. Also, USD today is worth ~20% less in real terms today than it was in 2015

greenyoda 4y ago

> most are still up on their investment Meta stock is now at $99, a price last seen in early 2016. Chart: https://finance.yahoo.com/chart/META#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 https://finance.yahoo.com/chart/META#eyJpbnRlcnZhbCI6IndlZWs... So if you would have bought and held the stock any time after that, you'd currently be sitting on a loss.

crazygringo 4y ago

In what universe are stock investments not equivalent to cash, for nearly all investors? You buy, you sell, same as forex or gold or turnips. This is real-life loss of value. Saying it's "paper value" makes as much sense as saying the money in your bank account isn't cash because it's just "numbers of a screen". I'm astonished that somebody could think stock losses are somehow less harmful than losing cash. That's just wrong.

pyuser583 4y ago
It’s only harmful if you buy high and sell low.
- SensoredRooster 4y ago
  I like where your heads at. Simple yet brilliant!
edanm 4y ago
What are you talking about? The almost universal advice before buying stocks is that it's only good for the long term, because at any particular moment it might lose its value. It is always stressed that you shouldn't use money to buy stocks if you might need that money in the next ten years. It is also recommended to move money from stocks to a safer instrument as you get closer to needing to use it.
- izacus 4y ago
  What's a safer instrument in these years though?
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    If “in these years” means possibly needing to sell within 0 to 5 years, then safer would be USD, short term treasures, I bonds, muni bonds, AAA corporate bonds (or correspondence bond ETFs), etc.
- qwytw 4y ago

lern_too_spel 4y ago

> Odds are most are still up on their investment. Facebook IPO'd in 2012. The stock is down to its price in October 2015. There are a few people who own lots of shares obtained before October 2015, and they are up. There are probably more people who own a few shares obtained after October 2015, and they are down.

kotlin2 4y ago

Equity in Meta is liquid net worth, unless you're a materially important share holder. The stocks you hold right now can be converted into cash easy at any point in time. In what world is that nearly equivalent to cash?

lotsofpulp 4y ago
In the world that the cash (USD) from 2 months ago still buys you almost the same today, but equity in Meta buys you 25% less.
- kotlin2 4y ago
  A world where your cash is held in British pounds? Why do you accept forex fluctuations but not security fluctuations?
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    I do accept the fluctuations, but the risk and magnitude are different.

hestefisk 4y ago

Exactly. These are unrealised losses. The net loss would depend on what price each investor entered their position on.

bagels 4y ago

Transaction costs are low and there is liquidity. It's not cash, but they did lose money whether or not they want to acknowledge it.