6 ms·

The point of free speech is to push the line. Imagine if people stuck with the speech standards of the 1950s. There would be plenty of people here who would be

The point of free speech is to push the line. Imagine if people stuck with the speech standards of the 1950s. There would be plenty of people here who would be disenfranchised.

joshstrange 4y ago
With the government? Yes. Within a community? It's more complicated than that. Is someone coming into a community posting the n-word or just being incredibly abrasive/offensive "pushing the line" or just being a troll? Online communities get to set their own rules and if you want to buck that trend then try to get support to change those rules or create your own community where you can make the rules.
- 1123581321 4y ago
  it looks like support to change the rules has been obtained.
- Dracophoenix 4y ago
  Initially, I was confused by what you meant by the word "community". Now that I see that you mean online community in the sense of an online forum, then yes, pushing the line may necessitate someone's removal. After all an online community is in almost every case hosted on private property. However, there is a problem that mostly is evaded or goes unexamined with many of these arguments: Does a community (in the general sense of the word) have the right to actively police/censor the content of an individual or group of people on the Internet in their own community (such as in the case of Kiwifarms)?
  - Volundr 4y ago
    > Does a community (in the general sense of the word) have the right to actively police/censor the content of an individual or group of people on the Internet in their own community (such as in the case of Kiwifarms)? Does Facebook or any other community have a right to take KiwiFarms off the net? Obviously not. Is Facebook, Cloudflare or any other company allowed to decide that they want nothing to do with content like KiwiFarms and refuse to do business with them? Absolutely.
fatbird 4y ago
The point of free speech is to be free. Pushing the line constantly is a tactic that some argue (or rationalize) is a way to maximize that freedom, but it's not the purpose, any more than the purpose of a right to bear arms is to get as many questionable shootings as possible.
- Dracophoenix 4y ago
  Now that I think of it, you're right. I shouldn't have used the word "purpose". A proper reformulation of what I meant would be that free speech will, as a property of its existence, push the line against someone's expectations somewhere at some point in time and that denying free speech many decades ago would have inhibited several rights and expressions of rights we take for granted today.

The point of free speech is to push the line. Imagine if people stuck with the speech standards of the 1950s. There would be plenty of people here who would be disenfranchised.

joshstrange 4y ago

With the government? Yes. Within a community? It's more complicated than that. Is someone coming into a community posting the n-word or just being incredibly abrasive/offensive "pushing the line" or just being a troll? Online communities get to set their own rules and if you want to buck that trend then try to get support to change those rules or create your own community where you can make the rules.

1123581321 4y ago
it looks like support to change the rules has been obtained.
Dracophoenix 4y ago
Initially, I was confused by what you meant by the word "community". Now that I see that you mean online community in the sense of an online forum, then yes, pushing the line may necessitate someone's removal. After all an online community is in almost every case hosted on private property. However, there is a problem that mostly is evaded or goes unexamined with many of these arguments: Does a community (in the general sense of the word) have the right to actively police/censor the content of an individual or group of people on the Internet in their own community (such as in the case of Kiwifarms)?
- Volundr 4y ago
  > Does a community (in the general sense of the word) have the right to actively police/censor the content of an individual or group of people on the Internet in their own community (such as in the case of Kiwifarms)? Does Facebook or any other community have a right to take KiwiFarms off the net? Obviously not. Is Facebook, Cloudflare or any other company allowed to decide that they want nothing to do with content like KiwiFarms and refuse to do business with them? Absolutely.

fatbird 4y ago

The point of free speech is to be free. Pushing the line constantly is a tactic that some argue (or rationalize) is a way to maximize that freedom, but it's not the purpose, any more than the purpose of a right to bear arms is to get as many questionable shootings as possible.

Dracophoenix 4y ago
Now that I think of it, you're right. I shouldn't have used the word "purpose". A proper reformulation of what I meant would be that free speech will, as a property of its existence, push the line against someone's expectations somewhere at some point in time and that denying free speech many decades ago would have inhibited several rights and expressions of rights we take for granted today.