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Almost every adult in the developed world needs a smart phone. They replace these devices about every 2-3 years. Apple makes one of the best in class of these

by duped 4y ago

Almost every adult in the developed world needs a smart phone. They replace these devices about every 2-3 years. Apple makes one of the best in class of these devices, and has successfully designed one such that it's hard to switch to a competitor (rather it's easier to stay in the ecosystem). They've convinced about a billion people on the planet that the iPhone is the best device for them, so if you split that into about 300 million re-ups into the ecosystem each year you're talking about where their revenue is. I say this as a happy iOS user. I replaced my phone of three years about a month ago. Took a day to get it through my carrier and it immediately restored from backup with minimal data loss, despite not having access to the old device. That ease of use and confidence I won't lose data is worth the premium.

smoldesu 4y ago
iPhones make money, but services make more. The App Store alone made over 80 billion dollars in estimated revenue last year, just by existing. That's without accounting for Apple One, Apple Fitness, Apple Arcade, AppleTV Plus, or iCloud. Apple simply makes $80 billion annually for writing a payment processor everyone else has to use. Services are one thing, but playing both the gatekeeper and competitor to a number of corporations is not a sustainable business model. Apple needs to double-down on their hardware dominance and leave the software distribution to software writers. All their other services can stay, Apple users can drown in AppleTV+ shows for all I care. The App Store is a fundamental de-facto monopoly on software distribution and (as we've seen with Spotify) service development. That quite literally cannot be the status quo going forward.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- prepend 4y ago
  > The App Store is a fundamental de-facto monopoly on software distribution and (as we've seen with Spotify) service development. This would be true if Android didn’t exist. But it does, so apple isn’t. What would be funny is if Google stops developing android, since it’s lot lucrative, so they can sue under antitrust to improve their ad business that apple keeps hampering.
  - smoldesu 4y ago
    > This would be true if Android didn’t exist. But it does, so apple isn’t. This would be true if iOS and the App Store weren't separate entities. But they are, so it isn't. If Google stops contributing to the AOSP, they would not be able to sue under antitrust because Android still exists.
    - prepend 4y ago
      I don’t think Android would retain much market power, especially in the US and Europe, if Google stopped backing it.
- kjreact 4y ago
  I think the App Store model is probably still currently the best model for the average user who doesn’t know how to secure a computing device. I know we may be heading towards a future where we’re totally locked down, but what alternative do we have? I’m always hesitant to install software on my desktop because I never know if there’s a trojan hidden in the software. I’m a relatively technical user, but I have no idea how I would determine if the software was safe. So at the moment I’m content to let Apple handle it. Note, this is coming from a pro-Apple user. Conversely, it would be interesting if an independent pro-privacy company (such as DuckDuckGo?) were to make a configurable smartphone for the more technical crowd that was both secure and allowed side-loading. I’d like to see such a product offered as an alternative to the offerings from the big tech companies.
  - smoldesu 4y ago
    > I know we may be heading towards a future where we’re totally locked down, but what alternative do we have? Well, Apple could just... let people install other stores. The App Store will still exist for new users and security-paranoid users, but the right to install/manage software needs to be a universal right when you buy hardware from someone. Arguing the opposite is almost insanity. > I’m a relatively technical user, but I have no idea how I would determine if the software was safe. Do what F-Droid does, compare the downloaded binary against a first-party checksum for the release (usually provided by Github). Then you can tell if the software you're loading has been tampered before it runs, simple as that. This is what the App Store does internally (along with cert-checking) to provide your "premium" security experience. It's largely designed to be distributed. > Conversely, it would be interesting if an independent pro-privacy company (such as DuckDuckGo?) were to make a configurable smartphone for the more technical crowd that was both secure and allowed side-loading. That's not the point either. The iPhone is fully capable of loading alternative App Stores and even alternate OSes. Apple is the only one stopping the user from doing these things. The fact that Apple explicitly does not allow people to distribute software unless they profit off has drawn incredible antitrust scrutiny. All of this can and will be alleviated with Apple giving up their iron grip on the 30% tax. What alternative do we have?
    - 4y ago
- AOsborn 4y ago
  > That quite literally cannot be the status quo going forward. Honestly, I disagree. The Apple customer experience and product ecosystem is just so far ahead of any competitors I don't want to use anything else. As far as the store is concerned specifically, I want to be able to use one store with a clear policy around payments, subscriptions and refunds - not a myriad of half-baked competitors with fragmented offerings.
  - smoldesu 4y ago
    That's great, I support that option for you. Personally, I just want to use the Open Source apps that Apple won't let me install. If I can have that, then there's no reason we can't both live in perfect harmony. That system works perfectly fine on Android and Google even manages to make a handsome bundle off the Play Store to boot.
    - andsoitis 4y ago
      What are some of the open source apps you use on your Android phone?
      - smoldesu 4y ago
        Glad you asked! Florisboard is a nice minimalist alternative to GBoard. Offers decent theming and lots of settings for haptics/layout, makes a very quick/easy replacement on new devices. NewPipe is a minimalist frontend to YouTube that lets you download videos and use PiP/background playing without paying for Premium (or logging into YouTube, for that matter) Bromite offers a de-Googled Chromium experience for mobile users, pretty barebones and basic. Glider is an awesome FOSS Hacker News client that I use for checking headlines on the go. Hugely recommended if you're an Android user! The last big one I use is KeePassDX, which is a password manager integrated with the open KeePass standard. All my passwords get locked up in a nice encrypted, portable file I sync across my devices. Now, I also use the Play Store for stuff like Discord and Spotify, and iOS users probably would still use the App Store if Cydia became officially supported overnight. That being said, having FOSS replacements for shitty defaults saves the modern Google-based Android experience for me. If they removed sideloading, I'd probably jump ship to a more minimalist fork.
- ummonk 4y ago
  As a consumer, I’m happy to pay the ~40% premium necessary to have app service subscriptions that are easy to cancel from a single location…
- jeromegv 4y ago
  Your numbers are wrong. iPhone business is bigger than services by quite a large number https://www.macstories.net/news/apple-reports-expectations-beating-q4-2022-results-of-90-1-billion/ https://www.macstories.net/news/apple-reports-expectations-b... 47% vs 21%
- scarface74 4y ago
  > iPhones make money, but services make more. The results are there big as day. This is obviously isn’t true. > The App Store alone made over 80 billion dollars in estimated revenue last year, just by existing Apple accounts for revenue as all of the money it takes in for the App Store before distributing 70%-85% to app makers. > for all I care. The App Store is a fundamental de-facto monopoly on software distribution Good thing we have a real judge who has said just the opposite in the Epic vs Apple trial. The judge thought it was foolish to claim that someone had a legal “monopoly” on their own platform. That’s just like saying Sony has a monopoly on the PlayStation
- TheOtherHobbes 4y ago
  This is underappreciated. You're not just buying an iPhone, you're buying a system of life accessories. Which has clunky ugly corners, but still sort of works smoothly most of the time. (Mostly.) I'm increasingly convinced Android only exists because it allows Google to pretend it's not just an ad company, and Apple to pretend it's not a monopoly. Apple's stranglehold on the mobile market, with its mix of hardware, software, and content services, is far more extreme than Microsoft's 90s-era stranglehold on the PC desktop.
  - rswail 4y ago
    You're taking the perspective from places where iPhones are in a majority, or a plurality of people's pockets. In Asia, Africa, Middle East, South America etc, Android has a much larger share of the market, even if it is spread across large numbers of models and manufacturers. Apple's "stranglehold" is about as strong as it's "stranglehold" on the desktop/laptop market with Macs.
beanjuiceII 4y ago
When I get my new pixel, I just login and everything is there, I assume apple is same way? this seems common these days
- girvo 4y ago
  It is, but it didn’t used to be. Way back at the dawn of the smartphone era I was working in consumer telco here in Aus, and half of my day was spent making sure people kept their data between phones. Even going from one android phone to another wasn’t a great guarantee, and for iPhones we used to have a computer to take a backup via the 30-pin. These days cloud backups and the like make it pretty simple on both operating systems.
  - prepend 4y ago
    I’ve had an iPhone since the original 4G. It’s always been an easy transfer. I have voice memos that have migrated since that very first one.
    - girvo 4y ago
      For you and I, definitely. For your average consumer back in the late 2000s? Nah they struggled with it and lost data constantly despite the fact that Apple tried to make it easy.
    - fazfq 4y ago
      The other day I thought of that... I was wondering if there would be people walking around with an iPhone 14 with photos taken with the camera of an iPhone 1st gen which they transferred every time they upgraded.
      - girvo 4y ago
        Not the 1st gen, but my 3G, I absolutely do :) its fun scrolling all the way back
      - reaperducer 4y ago
mcphage 4y ago
> They replace these devices about every 2-3 years. Some people do, but definitely not “almost every adult in the developed world”.
- readthenotes1 4y ago
  I mean, right? Who waits 2 years?
- crazygringo 4y ago
  Statistically yes, the average is between 2 and 3 years, you can look up the stats from multiple sources. Obviously parent meant an average, not that almost nobody goes for 1 year and almost nobody goes for 4. And heck even if you mean to keep it for longer, they're small semi-fragile things that are uncommonly easy to lose and break.
  - mcphage 4y ago
    You’re right, and that came as a real surprise to me. My current phone is 5 years, and I’m into tech, so I assumed that the average people was at least as long as what I usually do.
- tyre 4y ago
  I used to and now have a phone that’s 4 years old. I don’t plan on upgrading any time soon. There is nothing compelling about the newer models. “Better camera” pushed a lot of upgrades for a while, but my camera is good enough.
tshaddox 4y ago
> Apple makes one of the best in class of these devices, and has successfully designed one such that it's hard to switch to a competitor (rather it's easier to stay in the ecosystem). I wonder how many years it will take before I can convince some people that I actually just prefer Apple's phones to competing phones and that I'm not actually brainwashed or forced by Apple to never leave. But that's exactly what a brainwashed person would say...
- tcmart14 4y ago
  I switched to my first iPhone last year and for me the determining factor was not feeling I had to constantly be on the upgrade path. I've has my iPhone SE (2020) and haven't been happier with a phone. A taken care of iPhone can theoretically last 7-8 years since that is how long an iPhone generally gets OS and security updates. Android is getting better on flagship phones, but still not as good. By some none flagship android and your lucky to get 1 year of OS and security updates. My last android was a pixel and so was the one before that and every time I felt like after year 1 with an android, there is a massive performance drop off. I feel like my iPhone SE (2020) runs just as well today as the day it came out of the box. Apple does do some things really well. Android could, and I really want to see them do it, but as of right now, there are some things Android does not do well. Addition: And I think one thing that really hurt the Android ecosystem is when Android phones went through that phase of every phone flagship phone had some sort of gimmick. Where as Apple really just buttoned down and developed a really solid phone. A lot of android phone makers were just focusing on gimmicks like styluses or niche features to set them apart from other Android instead of just really developing a good solid smart phone.
  - tbrock 4y ago
    On android you’d be lucky to get more than a single OS update that added new features or functionality.
    - ethbr0 4y ago
      Or just buy a Pixel if you care about that. Why people buy Samsung or other manufacturer phones, and then gripe that the company is as stingy with backwards support and updates as they've always been boggles my mind. Why would anyone ever think this time would be different?
stereoradonc 4y ago
Happy Samsung Galaxy owner here. Migration from my last Note to current S21 Ultra was completed in less than half an hour, including "settings", contacts, data etc. I had to log in to Fastmail and Telegram with a seamless sync. Using BitWarden to manage passwords. That is worth the premium too! Dropbox syncs my files (and back ups) seamlessly. No sweat. iCloud is pathetic in terms of features (no delta sync) and generally limited storage space.
- endisneigh 4y ago
  lol. The average iPhone user isn’t wasting their time managing fast mail, telegram and bitwarden. The whole value is that it’s seamless, across devices and Macs
  - faeriechangling 4y ago
    More iPhone users use Windows than use MacOS. That's quite the seam and for this reason I generally recommend Bitwarden or Strongbox on iOS.
    - endisneigh 4y ago
      You can use iCloud passwords with windows.
- timeon 4y ago
  > completed in less than half an hour From one Samsung phone to another and it took almost half an hour? I'm not fun of iCloud but it is basically instant.
rkagerer 4y ago
They replace these devices about every 2-3 years As someone who buys a good smartphone then hangs onto it for 5 years, can someone help me understand the need for this?
- bun_at_work 4y ago
  Sometimes the newer model has a feature you'd like to have. Sometimes you've discovered something you don't like about your current model. Sometimes outside factors influence you (deals from your service provider, for example). Many people (especially here on HN) can afford to get the new device every year, or every 2-3. So they do. I don't really know what to say, though. People gonna people. Humans are often irrational, sub-optimal, and easily influenced. Happens to the best of us.
- porknubbins 4y ago
  How long have you been doing this? There was a point (I would argue at least up to iPhone 6s) when every iphone was a massive upgrade.
- seti0Cha 4y ago
  I like to get new phones every year or two. I enjoy it because I like gadgets, new phones always seem a bit more futuristic and beautiful than my old phone, and I like feeling I have a top of the line phone. On the other hand I drive my cars until they won't pass inspection and the repair cost exceeds the value of the vehicle. I don't care about cars. I know some people replace their cars every 2 or 3 years. People care about different things.
- sumedh 4y ago
  Peer pressure specially if you are young?
- isatty 4y ago
  My phone is my most used (personal) daily device, I use it for maps while driving, to text people, call people, browse Reddit/HN, occasional YouTube etc. I can also easily afford to replace it every year if I want to. I do but usually the upgrades are incremental so I do it every 2 years. I’m gonna pass on this years iPhone because of the lack of a sim tray though.
mtoner23 4y ago
Good point here. Reminds me of how this is also how GM Ford etc made insane amounts of money in the 50s. They sold a car to almost everyone in the united states every 3-5 years. It made them and the city of detriot insanely rich.
bane 4y ago
I don't think they make best in class devices, Apple has become in may respects a fast follower, but they do a great job of locking people into their ecosystem. It just turns out that their ecosystem doesn't suck, but it's still kind of a white collar app prison. If I had to ferment a revolution into a democracy, Android would be much closer to the ideal I would want in that future.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
aliqot 4y ago
I have 0 smart devices. It's nice.
WastingMyTime89 4y ago
> Took a day to get it through my carrier and it immediately restored from backup with minimal data loss, despite not having access to the old device. That ease of use and confidence I won't lose data is worth the premium. I’m a mostly happy iOS user but it’s exactly the same with Android. You connect to your Google Account and everything is back exactly as it was. I think US users don’t realise how close to each other Android and iOS actually are especially if you use a Pixel phone. I switched because of the Apple Watch which had no equivalent.

by duped 4y ago

smoldesu 4y ago

iPhones make money, but services make more. The App Store alone made over 80 billion dollars in estimated revenue last year, just by existing. That's without accounting for Apple One, Apple Fitness, Apple Arcade, AppleTV Plus, or iCloud. Apple simply makes $80 billion annually for writing a payment processor everyone else has to use. Services are one thing, but playing both the gatekeeper and competitor to a number of corporations is not a sustainable business model. Apple needs to double-down on their hardware dominance and leave the software distribution to software writers. All their other services can stay, Apple users can drown in AppleTV+ shows for all I care. The App Store is a fundamental de-facto monopoly on software distribution and (as we've seen with Spotify) service development. That quite literally cannot be the status quo going forward.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
prepend 4y ago
> The App Store is a fundamental de-facto monopoly on software distribution and (as we've seen with Spotify) service development. This would be true if Android didn’t exist. But it does, so apple isn’t. What would be funny is if Google stops developing android, since it’s lot lucrative, so they can sue under antitrust to improve their ad business that apple keeps hampering.
- smoldesu 4y ago
  > This would be true if Android didn’t exist. But it does, so apple isn’t. This would be true if iOS and the App Store weren't separate entities. But they are, so it isn't. If Google stops contributing to the AOSP, they would not be able to sue under antitrust because Android still exists.
  - prepend 4y ago
    I don’t think Android would retain much market power, especially in the US and Europe, if Google stopped backing it.
kjreact 4y ago
I think the App Store model is probably still currently the best model for the average user who doesn’t know how to secure a computing device. I know we may be heading towards a future where we’re totally locked down, but what alternative do we have? I’m always hesitant to install software on my desktop because I never know if there’s a trojan hidden in the software. I’m a relatively technical user, but I have no idea how I would determine if the software was safe. So at the moment I’m content to let Apple handle it. Note, this is coming from a pro-Apple user. Conversely, it would be interesting if an independent pro-privacy company (such as DuckDuckGo?) were to make a configurable smartphone for the more technical crowd that was both secure and allowed side-loading. I’d like to see such a product offered as an alternative to the offerings from the big tech companies.
- smoldesu 4y ago
  > I know we may be heading towards a future where we’re totally locked down, but what alternative do we have? Well, Apple could just... let people install other stores. The App Store will still exist for new users and security-paranoid users, but the right to install/manage software needs to be a universal right when you buy hardware from someone. Arguing the opposite is almost insanity. > I’m a relatively technical user, but I have no idea how I would determine if the software was safe. Do what F-Droid does, compare the downloaded binary against a first-party checksum for the release (usually provided by Github). Then you can tell if the software you're loading has been tampered before it runs, simple as that. This is what the App Store does internally (along with cert-checking) to provide your "premium" security experience. It's largely designed to be distributed. > Conversely, it would be interesting if an independent pro-privacy company (such as DuckDuckGo?) were to make a configurable smartphone for the more technical crowd that was both secure and allowed side-loading. That's not the point either. The iPhone is fully capable of loading alternative App Stores and even alternate OSes. Apple is the only one stopping the user from doing these things. The fact that Apple explicitly does not allow people to distribute software unless they profit off has drawn incredible antitrust scrutiny. All of this can and will be alleviated with Apple giving up their iron grip on the 30% tax. What alternative do we have?
  - 4y ago
AOsborn 4y ago
> That quite literally cannot be the status quo going forward. Honestly, I disagree. The Apple customer experience and product ecosystem is just so far ahead of any competitors I don't want to use anything else. As far as the store is concerned specifically, I want to be able to use one store with a clear policy around payments, subscriptions and refunds - not a myriad of half-baked competitors with fragmented offerings.
- smoldesu 4y ago
  That's great, I support that option for you. Personally, I just want to use the Open Source apps that Apple won't let me install. If I can have that, then there's no reason we can't both live in perfect harmony. That system works perfectly fine on Android and Google even manages to make a handsome bundle off the Play Store to boot.
  - andsoitis 4y ago
    What are some of the open source apps you use on your Android phone?
    - smoldesu 4y ago
      Glad you asked! Florisboard is a nice minimalist alternative to GBoard. Offers decent theming and lots of settings for haptics/layout, makes a very quick/easy replacement on new devices. NewPipe is a minimalist frontend to YouTube that lets you download videos and use PiP/background playing without paying for Premium (or logging into YouTube, for that matter) Bromite offers a de-Googled Chromium experience for mobile users, pretty barebones and basic. Glider is an awesome FOSS Hacker News client that I use for checking headlines on the go. Hugely recommended if you're an Android user! The last big one I use is KeePassDX, which is a password manager integrated with the open KeePass standard. All my passwords get locked up in a nice encrypted, portable file I sync across my devices. Now, I also use the Play Store for stuff like Discord and Spotify, and iOS users probably would still use the App Store if Cydia became officially supported overnight. That being said, having FOSS replacements for shitty defaults saves the modern Google-based Android experience for me. If they removed sideloading, I'd probably jump ship to a more minimalist fork.
ummonk 4y ago
As a consumer, I’m happy to pay the ~40% premium necessary to have app service subscriptions that are easy to cancel from a single location…
jeromegv 4y ago
Your numbers are wrong. iPhone business is bigger than services by quite a large number https://www.macstories.net/news/apple-reports-expectations-beating-q4-2022-results-of-90-1-billion/ https://www.macstories.net/news/apple-reports-expectations-b... 47% vs 21%
scarface74 4y ago
> iPhones make money, but services make more. The results are there big as day. This is obviously isn’t true. > The App Store alone made over 80 billion dollars in estimated revenue last year, just by existing Apple accounts for revenue as all of the money it takes in for the App Store before distributing 70%-85% to app makers. > for all I care. The App Store is a fundamental de-facto monopoly on software distribution Good thing we have a real judge who has said just the opposite in the Epic vs Apple trial. The judge thought it was foolish to claim that someone had a legal “monopoly” on their own platform. That’s just like saying Sony has a monopoly on the PlayStation
TheOtherHobbes 4y ago
This is underappreciated. You're not just buying an iPhone, you're buying a system of life accessories. Which has clunky ugly corners, but still sort of works smoothly most of the time. (Mostly.) I'm increasingly convinced Android only exists because it allows Google to pretend it's not just an ad company, and Apple to pretend it's not a monopoly. Apple's stranglehold on the mobile market, with its mix of hardware, software, and content services, is far more extreme than Microsoft's 90s-era stranglehold on the PC desktop.
- rswail 4y ago
  You're taking the perspective from places where iPhones are in a majority, or a plurality of people's pockets. In Asia, Africa, Middle East, South America etc, Android has a much larger share of the market, even if it is spread across large numbers of models and manufacturers. Apple's "stranglehold" is about as strong as it's "stranglehold" on the desktop/laptop market with Macs.

beanjuiceII 4y ago

When I get my new pixel, I just login and everything is there, I assume apple is same way? this seems common these days

girvo 4y ago
It is, but it didn’t used to be. Way back at the dawn of the smartphone era I was working in consumer telco here in Aus, and half of my day was spent making sure people kept their data between phones. Even going from one android phone to another wasn’t a great guarantee, and for iPhones we used to have a computer to take a backup via the 30-pin. These days cloud backups and the like make it pretty simple on both operating systems.
- prepend 4y ago
  I’ve had an iPhone since the original 4G. It’s always been an easy transfer. I have voice memos that have migrated since that very first one.
  - girvo 4y ago
    For you and I, definitely. For your average consumer back in the late 2000s? Nah they struggled with it and lost data constantly despite the fact that Apple tried to make it easy.
  - fazfq 4y ago
    The other day I thought of that... I was wondering if there would be people walking around with an iPhone 14 with photos taken with the camera of an iPhone 1st gen which they transferred every time they upgraded.
    - girvo 4y ago
      Not the 1st gen, but my 3G, I absolutely do :) its fun scrolling all the way back
    - reaperducer 4y ago

mcphage 4y ago

> They replace these devices about every 2-3 years. Some people do, but definitely not “almost every adult in the developed world”.

readthenotes1 4y ago
I mean, right? Who waits 2 years?
crazygringo 4y ago
Statistically yes, the average is between 2 and 3 years, you can look up the stats from multiple sources. Obviously parent meant an average, not that almost nobody goes for 1 year and almost nobody goes for 4. And heck even if you mean to keep it for longer, they're small semi-fragile things that are uncommonly easy to lose and break.
- mcphage 4y ago
  You’re right, and that came as a real surprise to me. My current phone is 5 years, and I’m into tech, so I assumed that the average people was at least as long as what I usually do.
tyre 4y ago
I used to and now have a phone that’s 4 years old. I don’t plan on upgrading any time soon. There is nothing compelling about the newer models. “Better camera” pushed a lot of upgrades for a while, but my camera is good enough.

tshaddox 4y ago

> Apple makes one of the best in class of these devices, and has successfully designed one such that it's hard to switch to a competitor (rather it's easier to stay in the ecosystem). I wonder how many years it will take before I can convince some people that I actually just prefer Apple's phones to competing phones and that I'm not actually brainwashed or forced by Apple to never leave. But that's exactly what a brainwashed person would say...

tcmart14 4y ago
I switched to my first iPhone last year and for me the determining factor was not feeling I had to constantly be on the upgrade path. I've has my iPhone SE (2020) and haven't been happier with a phone. A taken care of iPhone can theoretically last 7-8 years since that is how long an iPhone generally gets OS and security updates. Android is getting better on flagship phones, but still not as good. By some none flagship android and your lucky to get 1 year of OS and security updates. My last android was a pixel and so was the one before that and every time I felt like after year 1 with an android, there is a massive performance drop off. I feel like my iPhone SE (2020) runs just as well today as the day it came out of the box. Apple does do some things really well. Android could, and I really want to see them do it, but as of right now, there are some things Android does not do well. Addition: And I think one thing that really hurt the Android ecosystem is when Android phones went through that phase of every phone flagship phone had some sort of gimmick. Where as Apple really just buttoned down and developed a really solid phone. A lot of android phone makers were just focusing on gimmicks like styluses or niche features to set them apart from other Android instead of just really developing a good solid smart phone.
- tbrock 4y ago
  On android you’d be lucky to get more than a single OS update that added new features or functionality.
  - ethbr0 4y ago
    Or just buy a Pixel if you care about that. Why people buy Samsung or other manufacturer phones, and then gripe that the company is as stingy with backwards support and updates as they've always been boggles my mind. Why would anyone ever think this time would be different?

stereoradonc 4y ago

Happy Samsung Galaxy owner here. Migration from my last Note to current S21 Ultra was completed in less than half an hour, including "settings", contacts, data etc. I had to log in to Fastmail and Telegram with a seamless sync. Using BitWarden to manage passwords. That is worth the premium too! Dropbox syncs my files (and back ups) seamlessly. No sweat. iCloud is pathetic in terms of features (no delta sync) and generally limited storage space.

endisneigh 4y ago
lol. The average iPhone user isn’t wasting their time managing fast mail, telegram and bitwarden. The whole value is that it’s seamless, across devices and Macs
- faeriechangling 4y ago
  More iPhone users use Windows than use MacOS. That's quite the seam and for this reason I generally recommend Bitwarden or Strongbox on iOS.
  - endisneigh 4y ago
    You can use iCloud passwords with windows.
timeon 4y ago
> completed in less than half an hour From one Samsung phone to another and it took almost half an hour? I'm not fun of iCloud but it is basically instant.

rkagerer 4y ago

They replace these devices about every 2-3 years As someone who buys a good smartphone then hangs onto it for 5 years, can someone help me understand the need for this?

bun_at_work 4y ago
Sometimes the newer model has a feature you'd like to have. Sometimes you've discovered something you don't like about your current model. Sometimes outside factors influence you (deals from your service provider, for example). Many people (especially here on HN) can afford to get the new device every year, or every 2-3. So they do. I don't really know what to say, though. People gonna people. Humans are often irrational, sub-optimal, and easily influenced. Happens to the best of us.
porknubbins 4y ago
How long have you been doing this? There was a point (I would argue at least up to iPhone 6s) when every iphone was a massive upgrade.
seti0Cha 4y ago
I like to get new phones every year or two. I enjoy it because I like gadgets, new phones always seem a bit more futuristic and beautiful than my old phone, and I like feeling I have a top of the line phone. On the other hand I drive my cars until they won't pass inspection and the repair cost exceeds the value of the vehicle. I don't care about cars. I know some people replace their cars every 2 or 3 years. People care about different things.
sumedh 4y ago
Peer pressure specially if you are young?
isatty 4y ago
My phone is my most used (personal) daily device, I use it for maps while driving, to text people, call people, browse Reddit/HN, occasional YouTube etc. I can also easily afford to replace it every year if I want to. I do but usually the upgrades are incremental so I do it every 2 years. I’m gonna pass on this years iPhone because of the lack of a sim tray though.

mtoner23 4y ago

Good point here. Reminds me of how this is also how GM Ford etc made insane amounts of money in the 50s. They sold a car to almost everyone in the united states every 3-5 years. It made them and the city of detriot insanely rich.

bane 4y ago

I don't think they make best in class devices, Apple has become in may respects a fast follower, but they do a great job of locking people into their ecosystem. It just turns out that their ecosystem doesn't suck, but it's still kind of a white collar app prison. If I had to ferment a revolution into a democracy, Android would be much closer to the ideal I would want in that future.

deleted 4y ago

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aliqot 4y ago

I have 0 smart devices. It's nice.

WastingMyTime89 4y ago

> Took a day to get it through my carrier and it immediately restored from backup with minimal data loss, despite not having access to the old device. That ease of use and confidence I won't lose data is worth the premium. I’m a mostly happy iOS user but it’s exactly the same with Android. You connect to your Google Account and everything is back exactly as it was. I think US users don’t realise how close to each other Android and iOS actually are especially if you use a Pixel phone. I switched because of the Apple Watch which had no equivalent.