5 ms·

My experience from around 2017: Today's employers just don't like good simple resumes for some reason. They expect you to be a graphic designer to even look at

My experience from around 2017: Today's employers just don't like good simple resumes for some reason. They expect you to be a graphic designer to even look at it. I had a clearly formatted, simple resume and had a 0% success rate (besides one offer for 30k which was an insult) after hundreds of applications coming out of college to places far and wide or local, until a recruiter for a consultancy company cold contacted me. People online lombasted my resume for not being fancy enough. I still think it's an example of a perfect resume personally. Doesn't matter anymore thankfully now that I have a great job I want to stay in. Found a picture of it for reference, plus or minus minor tweaks depending on the company: https://external-preview.redd.it/Sfx4gvcEZXKXr8cxBseyyW2ycGPxzAQigSnJGND8NKA.png?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=20aec6c11c2f0814b47a7fe11896ba748de76a81 https://external-preview.redd.it/Sfx4gvcEZXKXr8cxBseyyW2ycGP... Certainly far above average chops for an entry level applicant so I don't know what every employer's problem was. Much harder world for junior developers than anyone would make you think if even I had that much trouble. I was legitimately scared I had no future outside of fast food for a while there.

kubanczyk 4y ago
Thanks for taking trouble to actually link to the resumé in question. I'd only wish critics of it were similarly verbatim.
Bakary 4y ago
You don't need it to be fancy, you just need to be one step above the raw Word appearance you have there. It's the equivalent of having the same pair of pants but it fits you. But as you've said it's moot now that you have a job.
- jimmaswell 4y ago
  The OP resume looks like a raw typewriter document to me. I don't understand what value it brings to go beyond - it's nothing but a tool to convey your skills and experience.
  - Bakary 4y ago
    Dumb things such as having a tiny bit of color or a slightly less basic format can make or break you when the recruiter/hirer is sifting through the pile. Besides, it takes all of ten minutes to do this and be done with it. It's like fashion. Arbitrary but just having the basics understood goes such a long way professionally and socially compared to the effort expended
    - jimmaswell 4y ago
      Maybe this is a good use case for AI. Write your resume then let AI rewrite it to be aesthetically pleasing to resume readers. People like my interior decorating, I can appreciate other things that are aesthetically pleasing, and I've made my share of actual art. I just don't think I have it in me to understand whatever in the world is going through someone's mind when they're displeased with this resume. It's a missing faculty like blindness or tone deafness. When I get a resume or an email I just read it, I don't sit there and hem and haw over how many pixels the bullet point is indented or whatever it is. This is why resumes should be abolished entirely and replaced by a standardized database you put your experience and skillset into. Anything an employer wants to know has to go in a standardized field. No discrimination can possibly occur based on your ability to format a piece of paper according to invisible, unpredictable metrics that you might have no faculty for and have no bearing on your ability to do the job.
      - antonknee 4y ago
        I agree a standardised database would be ideal. I think it’s telling that you have received very valid and constructive criticism on this resume from multiple people, yet you still can’t see why this is a bad resume. You know from data and observation that in the real world this is in fact a bad resume, because it doesn’t get you interviews and offers - which is the point of a resume.
        jimmaswell 4y ago
        It's a case where the world is wrong, I'm right, and we'd all be better off if people thought like me on this issue instead, as far as I'm concerned.
dist1ll 4y ago
There are many problems with your resume, and lack of fancy design is not one of them. - Half of your CV is empty space - Dates are formatted really badly, no one would be able to get a good grasp on your project and work timeline quickly - You have a game project that spans several years, and you sum it up into one sentence. Why are you doing that? It's one of your main selling points, and you don't expand enough on it. - The prioritization is not sound. I'm reading about your proficiency with vim (pretty much irrelevant) before I even know your work history. - You mention Linux administration. That's pretty broad. You should specify more. Did you deal with network config? systemd? FUSE? Overall your resume looks lackluster, unprofessional and bare-minimum. It's been more than 7 years now, and you still see nothing wrong with it? Sorry if that sounds harsh, but I'm doing you a favor by giving you a reality check.
- jimmaswell 4y ago
  If I got this resume from a junior I would hire them assuming the interview went decently. Half is empty - just graduated, can't expect that much stuff to put there. Maybe I should have expanded more on the game but I was getting the impression nobody cared that much about personal projects. The very first two things you do with a resume are match up the list of technical skills with the list of tech in your position requirements, and check the education requirement. That's why those two go at the top. I'd dealt with a lot of config issues running Debian on various hardware in high school as well as installing it, dealing with apt, understanding chron, a lot of basic things. I don't think systemd was much of a thing yet. I still fundamentally disagree that the resume is bad. Again, I'd hire this person, and I'm saying that as someone who's done interviews and hired people now.
  - blandflakes 4y ago
    I'm not sure I'd even interview this person; I'd at least have to find reasons to. It definitely doesn't give me anything to ask about. Quotes like "Save a lot of time by automating an email process" are so vague and ambiguous that the bullet point may as well be omitted. Education on the top is a waste of most anybody's time, let it be on the top only if you have no work experience (and if that's the case, yikes). I don't care about language/skillset checklists, because that's not what I hire for. Especially with no indication of relative strength or accomplishments with them - if I need a specific skill I'll happily scroll to see if it's there or not, but I want to see an actual story about this person's career and interests, not a set of "fill in the blank" stuff that every graduate has: * woo high school and a college degree great, that's not something we're going to talk about * version control, editors, etc are table stakes Why is all of the experience effectively unscanable (by eye)? Prose-first, no easy way to separate by date, by project, or position held? A resume doesn't have to be a thesis in print design, but I think you'd do well to consider the feedback you're receiving in this thread and that you alluded to receiving before - this resume isn't advertising anything to me and it's work for me to construct a coherent story about why this candidate is a strong fit for hiring.
Firmwarrior 4y ago
Ah, I had the same experience as you when I graduated People will offer all sorts of wacky feedback about resumes when prompted, but the real issue is that recruiters just don't look at or care about resumes that much. For my last few jobs I just sent an unformatted text file as my resume, one that would make dist1ll's eyes bleed. The most recent recruiter was actually angry at me for how "unprofessional" he thought my resume was, but the decision was out of his hands. You have to network your way into a job. Put out feelers to friends, family, friends' families, professors, professors' friends, etc. A referral will jet you past the recruiter's filters and get you a real shot at a job.
- jimmaswell 4y ago
  > You have to network your way into a job. Not necessarily, but it does make it easier if you have that opportunity. Places like Tata are good for someone with no connections to get a footing.
  - Firmwarrior 4y ago
    That's a good point, but I think people have a lot more connections than they realize Chances are good you're acquainted with 50+ people, and if each of them is acquainted with 20 unique people, that's 1000 people you can contact through a few weeks of hanging out and chatting Professors often know relevant industry people in town, too Worst case, you can hop on here or blind and ask for referrals. Some random dude cold-mailed me before and asked for a referral to my company. I chatted with him a little to make sure he wasn't completely insane, then passed his resume on to a relevant hiring manager. I forgot all about it until I noticed that a $3000 referral bonus showed up in my paycheck a few months later
mixmastamyk 4y ago
It's not 1980 any longer, and even the resume from that era has a nice table layout for ease of reference. Yours on the other hand looks like a first draft with arguably seome good stuff in it. I don't care for a fancy resume, but it should at least look like you spent more than 15 minutes on it, and with the reader in mind.

kubanczyk 4y ago

Thanks for taking trouble to actually link to the resumé in question. I'd only wish critics of it were similarly verbatim.

Bakary 4y ago

You don't need it to be fancy, you just need to be one step above the raw Word appearance you have there. It's the equivalent of having the same pair of pants but it fits you. But as you've said it's moot now that you have a job.

jimmaswell 4y ago
The OP resume looks like a raw typewriter document to me. I don't understand what value it brings to go beyond - it's nothing but a tool to convey your skills and experience.
- Bakary 4y ago
  Dumb things such as having a tiny bit of color or a slightly less basic format can make or break you when the recruiter/hirer is sifting through the pile. Besides, it takes all of ten minutes to do this and be done with it. It's like fashion. Arbitrary but just having the basics understood goes such a long way professionally and socially compared to the effort expended
  - jimmaswell 4y ago
    Maybe this is a good use case for AI. Write your resume then let AI rewrite it to be aesthetically pleasing to resume readers. People like my interior decorating, I can appreciate other things that are aesthetically pleasing, and I've made my share of actual art. I just don't think I have it in me to understand whatever in the world is going through someone's mind when they're displeased with this resume. It's a missing faculty like blindness or tone deafness. When I get a resume or an email I just read it, I don't sit there and hem and haw over how many pixels the bullet point is indented or whatever it is. This is why resumes should be abolished entirely and replaced by a standardized database you put your experience and skillset into. Anything an employer wants to know has to go in a standardized field. No discrimination can possibly occur based on your ability to format a piece of paper according to invisible, unpredictable metrics that you might have no faculty for and have no bearing on your ability to do the job.
    - antonknee 4y ago
      I agree a standardised database would be ideal. I think it’s telling that you have received very valid and constructive criticism on this resume from multiple people, yet you still can’t see why this is a bad resume. You know from data and observation that in the real world this is in fact a bad resume, because it doesn’t get you interviews and offers - which is the point of a resume.
      - jimmaswell 4y ago
        It's a case where the world is wrong, I'm right, and we'd all be better off if people thought like me on this issue instead, as far as I'm concerned.

dist1ll 4y ago

There are many problems with your resume, and lack of fancy design is not one of them. - Half of your CV is empty space - Dates are formatted really badly, no one would be able to get a good grasp on your project and work timeline quickly - You have a game project that spans several years, and you sum it up into one sentence. Why are you doing that? It's one of your main selling points, and you don't expand enough on it. - The prioritization is not sound. I'm reading about your proficiency with vim (pretty much irrelevant) before I even know your work history. - You mention Linux administration. That's pretty broad. You should specify more. Did you deal with network config? systemd? FUSE? Overall your resume looks lackluster, unprofessional and bare-minimum. It's been more than 7 years now, and you still see nothing wrong with it? Sorry if that sounds harsh, but I'm doing you a favor by giving you a reality check.

jimmaswell 4y ago
If I got this resume from a junior I would hire them assuming the interview went decently. Half is empty - just graduated, can't expect that much stuff to put there. Maybe I should have expanded more on the game but I was getting the impression nobody cared that much about personal projects. The very first two things you do with a resume are match up the list of technical skills with the list of tech in your position requirements, and check the education requirement. That's why those two go at the top. I'd dealt with a lot of config issues running Debian on various hardware in high school as well as installing it, dealing with apt, understanding chron, a lot of basic things. I don't think systemd was much of a thing yet. I still fundamentally disagree that the resume is bad. Again, I'd hire this person, and I'm saying that as someone who's done interviews and hired people now.
- blandflakes 4y ago
  I'm not sure I'd even interview this person; I'd at least have to find reasons to. It definitely doesn't give me anything to ask about. Quotes like "Save a lot of time by automating an email process" are so vague and ambiguous that the bullet point may as well be omitted. Education on the top is a waste of most anybody's time, let it be on the top only if you have no work experience (and if that's the case, yikes). I don't care about language/skillset checklists, because that's not what I hire for. Especially with no indication of relative strength or accomplishments with them - if I need a specific skill I'll happily scroll to see if it's there or not, but I want to see an actual story about this person's career and interests, not a set of "fill in the blank" stuff that every graduate has: * woo high school and a college degree great, that's not something we're going to talk about * version control, editors, etc are table stakes Why is all of the experience effectively unscanable (by eye)? Prose-first, no easy way to separate by date, by project, or position held? A resume doesn't have to be a thesis in print design, but I think you'd do well to consider the feedback you're receiving in this thread and that you alluded to receiving before - this resume isn't advertising anything to me and it's work for me to construct a coherent story about why this candidate is a strong fit for hiring.

Firmwarrior 4y ago

Ah, I had the same experience as you when I graduated People will offer all sorts of wacky feedback about resumes when prompted, but the real issue is that recruiters just don't look at or care about resumes that much. For my last few jobs I just sent an unformatted text file as my resume, one that would make dist1ll's eyes bleed. The most recent recruiter was actually angry at me for how "unprofessional" he thought my resume was, but the decision was out of his hands. You have to network your way into a job. Put out feelers to friends, family, friends' families, professors, professors' friends, etc. A referral will jet you past the recruiter's filters and get you a real shot at a job.

jimmaswell 4y ago
> You have to network your way into a job. Not necessarily, but it does make it easier if you have that opportunity. Places like Tata are good for someone with no connections to get a footing.
- Firmwarrior 4y ago
  That's a good point, but I think people have a lot more connections than they realize Chances are good you're acquainted with 50+ people, and if each of them is acquainted with 20 unique people, that's 1000 people you can contact through a few weeks of hanging out and chatting Professors often know relevant industry people in town, too Worst case, you can hop on here or blind and ask for referrals. Some random dude cold-mailed me before and asked for a referral to my company. I chatted with him a little to make sure he wasn't completely insane, then passed his resume on to a relevant hiring manager. I forgot all about it until I noticed that a $3000 referral bonus showed up in my paycheck a few months later

mixmastamyk 4y ago

It's not 1980 any longer, and even the resume from that era has a nice table layout for ease of reference. Yours on the other hand looks like a first draft with arguably seome good stuff in it. I don't care for a fancy resume, but it should at least look like you spent more than 15 minutes on it, and with the reader in mind.