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My 2013 MacBook Pro is/was my last Mac. It worked just fine, but I opted out of newer OS X updates because I noticed each successive "upgrade" was making the O

My 2013 MacBook Pro is/was my last Mac. It worked just fine, but I opted out of newer OS X updates because I noticed each successive "upgrade" was making the OS worse, in countless ways, and adding exactly zero improvement I could discern. Change for the sake of change, as far as I'm concerned. I feel the same way about Windows... I ended up just going out and buying a bunch of old ThinkPads and running OpenBSD and Linux on them. I think I got like five computers for less than the price of a single MacBook Air. I'm pretty much done with proprietary operating systems because they clearly no longer provide the best experience, from my perspective. I'm tired of being locked out of software I paid for because I "upgraded" the OS (looking at you, Logic Pro), or vice versa, unable to use new software because I didn't "upgrade" (most new Mac software won't run on my MBP). If I upgrade, I literally throw away a $250 piece of software and have to spend another $250 (or whatever) to use the new version of _that same software_. At least open-source OSes allow me to stay up to date while still having nearly-maximum agency over how the computer works and what software it runs. I'm tired of my computer doing a ton of stuff I didn't tell it to do. The amount of notifications/nags/etc. on a modern Mac/Windows computer is absolutely mind-boggling to me. The always-online aspect, software-update-checks, "telemetry" and "analytics", phoning home every time I launch a program... I'm tired of my computer not being a tool for me to use, but rather just a gateway to a bunch of stores and ways I can spend money, with a bit of "productivity" sprinkled on the side. I could go on and on. Oh, I didn't even touch on the software design/UX aspects. Like Riccardo wrote, it's a worthy of an entire article itself. I could probably spend an entire day documenting/critiquing the degradation of user experience in Mac OS and Windows. Mac OS had a lot further to fall, and indeed has been extra-disappointing because I used to hold it in such high regard :\

bdlowery 4y ago
I thought the same until I saw my boss with a basic MacBook setup move around his OS, programs, and IDE faster than me. The only difference was he didn’t spend 20 hours setting it up at every new dev job. Custom OS’s are a complete waste of time, and you’re just fighting an uphill battle. I’d take my 20+ hour battery life MacBook Pro over anything else all day everyday.
- newaccount74 4y ago
  I assume your boss didn't have to install Xcode? Installing Xcode updates is something that I spend way too much time on....
  - amatecha 4y ago
    I have a couple friends who live pretty off-grid and the colossal 10gb+ XCode updates was one reason they abandoned Apple ecosystem. It's just not sustainable when your entire month's data allotment isn't enough to download the update for a single piece of software you require to do your work.
    - stepbeek 4y ago
      I live semi-rurally with really crappy ADSL available. Starlink was a god-send. The number of projects that require extremely good connectivity is really surprising. In particular, I was surprised by how much docker pull struggles on a poor connection.
  - wmurmann 4y ago
    They take forever but it’s only once in a while. If you’re just trying to support newer iOS versions you can just yank them from here instead of updating. https://github.com/iGhibli/iOS-DeviceSupport https://github.com/iGhibli/iOS-DeviceSupport
  - saagarjha 4y ago
    They don’t actually take that long now. They’re a big download but beyond that it’s only few minutes to extract them.
    - vetinari 4y ago
      I have exactly opposite problem - it downloads quickly, but installing takes eternity (via app store). Bonus points when I leave the computer to let it install; then it thinks it is idle, puts itself into sleep and the install fails. Rinse, repeat.
ihateolives 4y ago
> The amount of notifications/nags/etc. on a modern Mac/Windows computer is absolutely mind-boggling Really? Only notifications I get on my Mac right now are from few programs that I have allowed, mainly for messages and e-mail. That's it. On Windows there are more, but MacOS leaves me alone pretty much most of the time. Perhaps it was different in 2013, but it's not definitely "mind-boggling amount of notifications".
- goosedragons 4y ago
  If you don't use Safari the OS will nag you to use Safari until you launch it whenever you open a non-Safari browser. You can temporarily ignore it for a bit but it will come back. And this resets every time Safari is updated. They will also stick a notification badge on system preferences if you're not using iCloud.
  - ben_w 4y ago
    I've never had that problem on any machine or OS version. I do have a pointless notification telling me there's a new version of macOS I could update to, and the reason it's pointless is that my mac is too old for the specific new version of macOS that the notification is trying to convince me to install. But that thing you're getting with the web browser, I've never had that problem.
    - goosedragons 4y ago
      It's pretty old and still exists. Since you're on an old macOS it's never going to reset and bug you to try the new Safari because it's never updated. https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/how-to-osx-try-safari-promotion.html https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/how-to-osx-try-safari-promotion....
      - ben_w 4y ago
        My personal mac is old, but the OS is newer than that link. My current work mac (and all previous work macs back to when my current personal mac was new) have never had the bug you're talking about — install chrome, make default, never get nagged.
coldtea 4y ago
>'m tired of being locked out of software I paid for because I "upgraded" the OS (looking at you, Logic Pro), or vice versa, unable to use new software because I didn't "upgrade" (most new Mac software won't run on my MBP). If I upgrade, I literally throw away a $250 piece of software and have to spend another $250 (or whatever) to use the new version of _that same software_. At least open-source OSes allow me to stay up to date while still having nearly-maximum agency over how the computer works and what software it runs. Yes, as long as it's available, which it mostly isn't. What would be your Logic replacement options in Linux? Reaper is OK for tracking and effects, but doesn't even come close to the built-in stuff Logic has, and BitWig looks like it will probably soon go the subscription way.
- amatecha 4y ago
  Ardour is probably the most popular DAW in Linux. It's probably what I would use if I wanted to produce some music in Linux. Yeah, I have a pretty big collection of old Macs because, well, if I didn't, I'd be throwing away a good couple $thousand worth of software (because it won't run on newer machines)... pretty disappointing. Luckily, other than Logic Pro 9, I bought most of that stuff while it was still "pay for it once and use it forever, even without the internet", unlike today where everything is based on online-activated DRM that guarantees one day your software will stop working.
nerdyadventurer 4y ago
Is there any good solution for iOS, Mac development on Linux ? since I also prefer linux. Using cloud macs can become slow due to latency and price can add up over time.
ryandrake 4y ago
This is a great comment, and touches on a lot of things I find myself ranting[1] about. I've just resigned myself to the fact that every time you update a piece of software, it gets worse rather than better, because the developers are not focused on the user's needs. They're learning a new tech stack for their resume and mastering a new algorithm. The designers are not focused on the user's needs. They're building a slick portfolio. The business guys are not focused on the user's needs. They're monetizing. This is pretty much true for almost all software I've used in the past 10 or so years. The root problem is that computers and software have shifted from being tools to empower the user to being tools to empower the developer's company. I listened to software requirements discussions back in the 90s, and the questions were all "What does the user need to do?" and "What task is the user trying to accomplish?" and "What features will the user pay for?" Now, you talk to a software product manager, and it's "How do we get the user to do X?" and "We need to channel the user into Y." and "We need to understand how the user uses Z so we can monetize it." Totally reversed mindset. The company already knows what profitable actions are available to the user, so all the research and development is spent on is coercing and funneling the user into those actions. Nobody really cares what the user wants to do. 1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30852227 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30852227

bdlowery 4y ago

I thought the same until I saw my boss with a basic MacBook setup move around his OS, programs, and IDE faster than me. The only difference was he didn’t spend 20 hours setting it up at every new dev job. Custom OS’s are a complete waste of time, and you’re just fighting an uphill battle. I’d take my 20+ hour battery life MacBook Pro over anything else all day everyday.

newaccount74 4y ago
I assume your boss didn't have to install Xcode? Installing Xcode updates is something that I spend way too much time on....
- amatecha 4y ago
  I have a couple friends who live pretty off-grid and the colossal 10gb+ XCode updates was one reason they abandoned Apple ecosystem. It's just not sustainable when your entire month's data allotment isn't enough to download the update for a single piece of software you require to do your work.
  - stepbeek 4y ago
    I live semi-rurally with really crappy ADSL available. Starlink was a god-send. The number of projects that require extremely good connectivity is really surprising. In particular, I was surprised by how much docker pull struggles on a poor connection.
- wmurmann 4y ago
  They take forever but it’s only once in a while. If you’re just trying to support newer iOS versions you can just yank them from here instead of updating. https://github.com/iGhibli/iOS-DeviceSupport https://github.com/iGhibli/iOS-DeviceSupport
- saagarjha 4y ago
  They don’t actually take that long now. They’re a big download but beyond that it’s only few minutes to extract them.
  - vetinari 4y ago
    I have exactly opposite problem - it downloads quickly, but installing takes eternity (via app store). Bonus points when I leave the computer to let it install; then it thinks it is idle, puts itself into sleep and the install fails. Rinse, repeat.

ihateolives 4y ago

> The amount of notifications/nags/etc. on a modern Mac/Windows computer is absolutely mind-boggling Really? Only notifications I get on my Mac right now are from few programs that I have allowed, mainly for messages and e-mail. That's it. On Windows there are more, but MacOS leaves me alone pretty much most of the time. Perhaps it was different in 2013, but it's not definitely "mind-boggling amount of notifications".

goosedragons 4y ago
If you don't use Safari the OS will nag you to use Safari until you launch it whenever you open a non-Safari browser. You can temporarily ignore it for a bit but it will come back. And this resets every time Safari is updated. They will also stick a notification badge on system preferences if you're not using iCloud.
- ben_w 4y ago
  I've never had that problem on any machine or OS version. I do have a pointless notification telling me there's a new version of macOS I could update to, and the reason it's pointless is that my mac is too old for the specific new version of macOS that the notification is trying to convince me to install. But that thing you're getting with the web browser, I've never had that problem.
  - goosedragons 4y ago
    It's pretty old and still exists. Since you're on an old macOS it's never going to reset and bug you to try the new Safari because it's never updated. https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/how-to-osx-try-safari-promotion.html https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/how-to-osx-try-safari-promotion....
    - ben_w 4y ago
      My personal mac is old, but the OS is newer than that link. My current work mac (and all previous work macs back to when my current personal mac was new) have never had the bug you're talking about — install chrome, make default, never get nagged.

coldtea 4y ago

>'m tired of being locked out of software I paid for because I "upgraded" the OS (looking at you, Logic Pro), or vice versa, unable to use new software because I didn't "upgrade" (most new Mac software won't run on my MBP). If I upgrade, I literally throw away a $250 piece of software and have to spend another $250 (or whatever) to use the new version of _that same software_. At least open-source OSes allow me to stay up to date while still having nearly-maximum agency over how the computer works and what software it runs. Yes, as long as it's available, which it mostly isn't. What would be your Logic replacement options in Linux? Reaper is OK for tracking and effects, but doesn't even come close to the built-in stuff Logic has, and BitWig looks like it will probably soon go the subscription way.

amatecha 4y ago
Ardour is probably the most popular DAW in Linux. It's probably what I would use if I wanted to produce some music in Linux. Yeah, I have a pretty big collection of old Macs because, well, if I didn't, I'd be throwing away a good couple $thousand worth of software (because it won't run on newer machines)... pretty disappointing. Luckily, other than Logic Pro 9, I bought most of that stuff while it was still "pay for it once and use it forever, even without the internet", unlike today where everything is based on online-activated DRM that guarantees one day your software will stop working.

nerdyadventurer 4y ago

Is there any good solution for iOS, Mac development on Linux ? since I also prefer linux. Using cloud macs can become slow due to latency and price can add up over time.

ryandrake 4y ago

This is a great comment, and touches on a lot of things I find myself ranting[1] about. I've just resigned myself to the fact that every time you update a piece of software, it gets worse rather than better, because the developers are not focused on the user's needs. They're learning a new tech stack for their resume and mastering a new algorithm. The designers are not focused on the user's needs. They're building a slick portfolio. The business guys are not focused on the user's needs. They're monetizing. This is pretty much true for almost all software I've used in the past 10 or so years. The root problem is that computers and software have shifted from being tools to empower the user to being tools to empower the developer's company. I listened to software requirements discussions back in the 90s, and the questions were all "What does the user need to do?" and "What task is the user trying to accomplish?" and "What features will the user pay for?" Now, you talk to a software product manager, and it's "How do we get the user to do X?" and "We need to channel the user into Y." and "We need to understand how the user uses Z so we can monetize it." Totally reversed mindset. The company already knows what profitable actions are available to the user, so all the research and development is spent on is coercing and funneling the user into those actions. Nobody really cares what the user wants to do. 1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30852227 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30852227