5 ms·

It is astonishing to me that people are out there buying Intel PC laptops when the M1 MBA can be had for <$1000

by sylens 4y ago

uni_rule 4y ago
I understand the sentiment but a dead ssd won't permanently brick a large portion of x86 laptops.
- II2II 4y ago
  More to the point: I can still access the data from the SSD even if every other component on the laptop was dead. Heck, I could pop the SSD into another laptop and continue working where I left off.
encryptluks2 4y ago
An Intel laptop can be had for like $200
tootie 4y ago
Well, $1000 upfront plus $100 a year for the right to develop apps.
borissk 4y ago
The base MBA comes with only 8GB RAM and 256GB SSD and has very limited upgrade option. Also Apple charges crazy prices for more RAM and storage. For $1000 one can buy a Windows laptop with 32GB RAM and 1TB SDD, that can cheaply be upgraded to 64GB memory and 10+TB SSD (2x SO-DIMM slots + 2x M2 PCIe slots).
- jzb 4y ago
  Um. Cheaply to 10+ TB SSD? Where are you shopping?! I want to go there.
  - borissk 4y ago
    Samsung 870 QVO 8TB is under $700.
- MBCook 4y ago
  I’m not arguing people should switch to an M1 Mac. I’m trying to say I think people should have the option of something like it on Windows, not just the hot/power hungry stuff out there today.
MattGaiser 4y ago
$1000 is still more than I would guess about half of PCs. It would surprise me if my mother, grandparents, sister, etc. have ever sent more than $800 on a computer.
q-big 4y ago
> It is astonishing to me that people are out there buying Intel PC laptops when the M1 MBA can be had for <$1000 Can the M1 MBA run Windows? EDIT: Or can it run GNU/Linux natively (see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33320765 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33320765)?
- 58028641 4y ago
  Apple Silicon Macs can run Windows and Linux in a VM. Asahi Linux (native) is making decent progress.
  - makeitdouble 4y ago
    To caveat, Linux in a VM is decent enough for non GUI programs, Windows might have harder limitations on anything that wants GPU power or direct peripherics access, and Asahi Linux is a research project at this point. We’re far far from the dual booting days, running a mac VM on a Windows machine is probably the holy grail of running every OS on a single machine at this point in time.
jimnotgym 4y ago
It depends what is important to you. Firstly I am mostly plugged in, so battery life is secondary. Secondly I am a heavy Excel user, and it just isn't as good on Apple Thirdly I use PowerBI which isn't available for Apple Lastly I have hybrid Active Directory, and can deploy SSO trivially to my remote Windows users, which I can't on Mac. During Covid I could mail someone a PC and get them signed on to AD resources in minutes. My Windows users are first class citizens, easier to support, and happier with their IT.
- ultrasounder 4y ago
  THIS! Apple:- fair warning an inside Bollywood joke. Apple:- “Mere paas M1/M2/MAX,A16, Hain “ and looks at MSFT and asks “Tere paas kya Hain”? MSFT:- Shoulder shrugs and says “Mere Paas Excel Hain”. Apple has nothing on Excel. And Numbers languishes Excel by a few generations. Esp after the boatload of updates that Excel APIs got last year. I guess it’s all about priorities and what’s important for that business at that time.
  - MBCook 4y ago
    That wasn’t what I was trying to say. I know there is Windows only software. I know there is software that’s better on Windows. I don’t care if people switch to Mac. They should all have the choice of a chip as good (or reasonably close) to the M1. But they don’t. And it doesn’t look like that’s changing. And I find that sad.
    - ultrasounder 4y ago
      Okay! Thanks for the clarification!
- MBCook 4y ago
  I’m not advocating everyone switch to Mac. I’m sorry if I gave that impression. I’m advocating Windows/Linux users should have the choice of a machine roughly as good. Doesn’t have to 1:1, but clearly there is a lot of space for “better” past what everyone is selling today. And I don’t see that improving much after 2 years and I find it kind of sad. Why should you have to switch OSes and everything to have a fast computer with good battery life that’s quiet and cool? You shouldn’t.
eliasmacpherson 4y ago
The M1 is a marvel, however there's a vast range of things it's not going to do anytime soon, e.g. CUDA, eGPU etc - nevermind games. https://store.steampowered.com/macos https://store.steampowered.com/macos Had they not pushed Metal so hard over Vulkan - then things would be different. There's time yet for Apple to change course. (Seems Valve open sourced MoltenVK, so that's one barrier removed at least!)
matsemann 4y ago
I guess that says something about the concessions some of us will do to avoid using MacOS.
makeitdouble 4y ago
This was the general sentiment when Apple was on PowerPC, and we were buying pricier mac laptops just because of the OS. I don’t have actual experience on a windows machine right now, but if the linux subsystem is getting good enough, switching there could be worth the hardware and price penalty.
neogodless 4y ago
Comments like this astonish me, a little. First that Apple is so good at advertising. Well done! Second, that a Macbook Air is the only form factor anyone could conceivably need? Or that macOS covers all use cases? My (largely useless in this context) personal anecdote is that I spent $1029 for a gaming laptop. AMD Ryzen 7 4800H (8-cores, 16 threads), 16GB, 1TB, RTX 2060 6GB. Gets about 4-5 hours of battery doing normal stuff. Plugged in for gaming. (Yes, it runs all of my Steam collection!) It's very fast for everything I use it for. (I mostly work on my desktop, but I've used it for various development, etc. - Visual Studio Community, SQL Server Management Studio, VS Code, WSL/WSL2 and all Linux-based development I've done, photo editing, etc., of course it can run web browsers and be used to check email!) Why wouldn't I buy a laptop that costs this much and can do so many things well? Because it doesn't work away from plugs for a day? But I live and work at home. Near lots of plugs!
- sylens 4y ago
  First, I'm not in Apple's corner by any means. Before I left this comment, I left another one on a different story critical of what they've been doing with macOS. But I've tried a lot of laptops over the pandemic and nothing has come close to the Apple silicon ones in terms of responsiveness, power efficiency, and just plain reliability. And in terms of sheer battery life and weight, the MBA is king of the hill. Sure, I'm not gaming on it - but then again, I can't stand gaming on a laptop to begin with, as the heat and fan noise really bother me. A typical consumer picking out a laptop for college or for use around the house would be better solved with an M1 MBA than almost any Windows laptop unless they have an absolutely mission critical software need. The MBA isn't for everyone - heck, it can only support 1 external monitor - but it 's the right fit for that middle part of the bell curve.
tails4e 4y ago
I have a macbook pro 16 (the last Intel one) and it has a claimed 10 hour battery life. I use it mostly for ms office (excel, PowerPoint, outlook) and have zoom/teams open in the background, as well as citirx for access to some Linux servers. I'm lucky to get an hour and a half. Fans running, etc. Window_server chwes up battery like no one's business. Nice hw is nice, but I'm very dissapointed at my first toe-dip into the mac world
- MBCook 4y ago
  I’ve got a similar machine. The last 15” Intel. Honestly it’s kind of one of the worst. The 2010 was pretty great. If you ignore they keyboard issues (a BIG DEAL) they got better for a few years. In the last few years it became very clear Apple just couldn’t do what they wanted as the Intel chips kept getting hotter and more power hungry. I’m sorry you got that experience. It was and now is so much better. You kind of lucked into a low point.
  - tails4e 4y ago
    That's interesting, thanks. I would have assumed Window_server would be a common issue cpu on all platforms, is that not the case? If so do you know if disabling 3d acceleration could help etc?

It is astonishing to me that people are out there buying Intel PC laptops when the M1 MBA can be had for <$1000

by sylens 4y ago

It is astonishing to me that people are out there buying Intel PC laptops when the M1 MBA can be had for <$1000

uni_rule 4y ago

I understand the sentiment but a dead ssd won't permanently brick a large portion of x86 laptops.

II2II 4y ago
More to the point: I can still access the data from the SSD even if every other component on the laptop was dead. Heck, I could pop the SSD into another laptop and continue working where I left off.

encryptluks2 4y ago

An Intel laptop can be had for like $200

tootie 4y ago

Well, $1000 upfront plus $100 a year for the right to develop apps.

borissk 4y ago

The base MBA comes with only 8GB RAM and 256GB SSD and has very limited upgrade option. Also Apple charges crazy prices for more RAM and storage. For $1000 one can buy a Windows laptop with 32GB RAM and 1TB SDD, that can cheaply be upgraded to 64GB memory and 10+TB SSD (2x SO-DIMM slots + 2x M2 PCIe slots).

jzb 4y ago
Um. Cheaply to 10+ TB SSD? Where are you shopping?! I want to go there.
- borissk 4y ago
  Samsung 870 QVO 8TB is under $700.
MBCook 4y ago
I’m not arguing people should switch to an M1 Mac. I’m trying to say I think people should have the option of something like it on Windows, not just the hot/power hungry stuff out there today.

MattGaiser 4y ago

$1000 is still more than I would guess about half of PCs. It would surprise me if my mother, grandparents, sister, etc. have ever sent more than $800 on a computer.

q-big 4y ago

> It is astonishing to me that people are out there buying Intel PC laptops when the M1 MBA can be had for <$1000 Can the M1 MBA run Windows? EDIT: Or can it run GNU/Linux natively (see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33320765 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33320765)?

58028641 4y ago
Apple Silicon Macs can run Windows and Linux in a VM. Asahi Linux (native) is making decent progress.
- makeitdouble 4y ago
  To caveat, Linux in a VM is decent enough for non GUI programs, Windows might have harder limitations on anything that wants GPU power or direct peripherics access, and Asahi Linux is a research project at this point. We’re far far from the dual booting days, running a mac VM on a Windows machine is probably the holy grail of running every OS on a single machine at this point in time.

jimnotgym 4y ago

It depends what is important to you. Firstly I am mostly plugged in, so battery life is secondary. Secondly I am a heavy Excel user, and it just isn't as good on Apple Thirdly I use PowerBI which isn't available for Apple Lastly I have hybrid Active Directory, and can deploy SSO trivially to my remote Windows users, which I can't on Mac. During Covid I could mail someone a PC and get them signed on to AD resources in minutes. My Windows users are first class citizens, easier to support, and happier with their IT.

ultrasounder 4y ago
THIS! Apple:- fair warning an inside Bollywood joke. Apple:- “Mere paas M1/M2/MAX,A16, Hain “ and looks at MSFT and asks “Tere paas kya Hain”? MSFT:- Shoulder shrugs and says “Mere Paas Excel Hain”. Apple has nothing on Excel. And Numbers languishes Excel by a few generations. Esp after the boatload of updates that Excel APIs got last year. I guess it’s all about priorities and what’s important for that business at that time.
- MBCook 4y ago
  That wasn’t what I was trying to say. I know there is Windows only software. I know there is software that’s better on Windows. I don’t care if people switch to Mac. They should all have the choice of a chip as good (or reasonably close) to the M1. But they don’t. And it doesn’t look like that’s changing. And I find that sad.
  - ultrasounder 4y ago
    Okay! Thanks for the clarification!
MBCook 4y ago
I’m not advocating everyone switch to Mac. I’m sorry if I gave that impression. I’m advocating Windows/Linux users should have the choice of a machine roughly as good. Doesn’t have to 1:1, but clearly there is a lot of space for “better” past what everyone is selling today. And I don’t see that improving much after 2 years and I find it kind of sad. Why should you have to switch OSes and everything to have a fast computer with good battery life that’s quiet and cool? You shouldn’t.

eliasmacpherson 4y ago

The M1 is a marvel, however there's a vast range of things it's not going to do anytime soon, e.g. CUDA, eGPU etc - nevermind games. https://store.steampowered.com/macos https://store.steampowered.com/macos Had they not pushed Metal so hard over Vulkan - then things would be different. There's time yet for Apple to change course. (Seems Valve open sourced MoltenVK, so that's one barrier removed at least!)

matsemann 4y ago

I guess that says something about the concessions some of us will do to avoid using MacOS.

makeitdouble 4y ago

This was the general sentiment when Apple was on PowerPC, and we were buying pricier mac laptops just because of the OS. I don’t have actual experience on a windows machine right now, but if the linux subsystem is getting good enough, switching there could be worth the hardware and price penalty.

neogodless 4y ago

Comments like this astonish me, a little. First that Apple is so good at advertising. Well done! Second, that a Macbook Air is the only form factor anyone could conceivably need? Or that macOS covers all use cases? My (largely useless in this context) personal anecdote is that I spent $1029 for a gaming laptop. AMD Ryzen 7 4800H (8-cores, 16 threads), 16GB, 1TB, RTX 2060 6GB. Gets about 4-5 hours of battery doing normal stuff. Plugged in for gaming. (Yes, it runs all of my Steam collection!) It's very fast for everything I use it for. (I mostly work on my desktop, but I've used it for various development, etc. - Visual Studio Community, SQL Server Management Studio, VS Code, WSL/WSL2 and all Linux-based development I've done, photo editing, etc., of course it can run web browsers and be used to check email!) Why wouldn't I buy a laptop that costs this much and can do so many things well? Because it doesn't work away from plugs for a day? But I live and work at home. Near lots of plugs!

sylens 4y ago
First, I'm not in Apple's corner by any means. Before I left this comment, I left another one on a different story critical of what they've been doing with macOS. But I've tried a lot of laptops over the pandemic and nothing has come close to the Apple silicon ones in terms of responsiveness, power efficiency, and just plain reliability. And in terms of sheer battery life and weight, the MBA is king of the hill. Sure, I'm not gaming on it - but then again, I can't stand gaming on a laptop to begin with, as the heat and fan noise really bother me. A typical consumer picking out a laptop for college or for use around the house would be better solved with an M1 MBA than almost any Windows laptop unless they have an absolutely mission critical software need. The MBA isn't for everyone - heck, it can only support 1 external monitor - but it 's the right fit for that middle part of the bell curve.

tails4e 4y ago

I have a macbook pro 16 (the last Intel one) and it has a claimed 10 hour battery life. I use it mostly for ms office (excel, PowerPoint, outlook) and have zoom/teams open in the background, as well as citirx for access to some Linux servers. I'm lucky to get an hour and a half. Fans running, etc. Window_server chwes up battery like no one's business. Nice hw is nice, but I'm very dissapointed at my first toe-dip into the mac world

MBCook 4y ago
I’ve got a similar machine. The last 15” Intel. Honestly it’s kind of one of the worst. The 2010 was pretty great. If you ignore they keyboard issues (a BIG DEAL) they got better for a few years. In the last few years it became very clear Apple just couldn’t do what they wanted as the Intel chips kept getting hotter and more power hungry. I’m sorry you got that experience. It was and now is so much better. You kind of lucked into a low point.
- tails4e 4y ago
  That's interesting, thanks. I would have assumed Window_server would be a common issue cpu on all platforms, is that not the case? If so do you know if disabling 3d acceleration could help etc?