4 ms·

Combine with propranolol for maximum effect. A very overlooked drug that can be used in the treatment of many disorders related to anxiety, stress and fear. Wi

Combine with propranolol for maximum effect. A very overlooked drug that can be used in the treatment of many disorders related to anxiety, stress and fear. Without the risk of debiliating addiction benzos and benzolikes bring. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/14573324/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/14573324/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3692719/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3692719/

fellowniusmonk 4y ago
Yeah, I've been on beta blockers for a heart defect for several years now. I read this paper about a year after going on them and just started exploring trauma on my own (stuff that made me weep or even pull face muscles in grief) the post sleep memory reconsolidation is basically a miracle and my emotional trauma responses were basically wrapped up within ~ 1 year. There is now nothing so awful I cannot touch, hold and examine it. I no longer even have nightmares of any kind. I don't have intrusive thoughts from past events during the day (none to speak of) and no rumination either, it's like speed running stoicism.
- canadiantim 4y ago
  What is the post sleep memory reconsolidation? My mom has severe PTSD that is causing memory and cognitive decline because all her resources are dedicated to fight or flight. She is just a ball of the most significant stress you can imagine and it’s destroying her. Have any recommendations or suggestions?
  - fellowniusmonk 4y ago
    Basically the protocol is to be on a beta blocker and then recall the memory and explore it followed by normal sleep. This pulls the memory into short term storage and then when you sleep the memory will reconsolidate into long term storage but without the physiological adrenaline/stress response. I had some terrible experiences that provoked strong grief responses and it took several cycles of recall / reconsolidation before the emotional stress response was stripped to something manageable.
    - canadiantim 4y ago
      Wow that sounds very powerful and a logical way to reduce the associated trauma from a memory. Good for you for working your way through that! And thanks for sharing. For my moms case, she’s unfortunately buried whatever trauma it is that is causing her to eg always have her bags packed and ready to bolt such that I don’t think she can consciously identify a memory that has traumatized her. She doesn’t even think she has trauma (despite everyone having at least some trauma and her more than others). At this point she’s just put up all her defences and refuses to deal with the root of it. It’s ruining her psychologically and unfortunately negatively affects all those who are around her (considering she’s at 20/10 stress levels nearly all the time but she thinks that’s normal). Thanks again for sharing what has been working for you. I’m trying desperately to find something that can help her become a functional human being again because I’ve been her full time caretaker for last couple years and now it’s killing me too. But perseverance they say, balanced with burn out.
    - Traubenfuchs 4y ago
      The non pharmaceutical variant of exactly this would be using meditation. Which is a lot of effort.
    - techdragon 4y ago
      Have any academic references for this, ? Im genuinely curious, and would like to be able to read more about it.
  - franl 4y ago
    Has she looked into EMDR therapy?
duskwuff 4y ago
And, for a nonpharmaceutical intervention -- have them play a bit of Tetris. https://www.psych.ox.ac.uk/news/tetris-used-to-prevent-post-traumatic-stress-symptoms https://www.psych.ox.ac.uk/news/tetris-used-to-prevent-post-... I can confirm from personal experience that this works, and that it isn't specific to Tetris. Other visual/spatial puzzles are similarly effective.
- jonsen 4y ago
  I think Nurikabe is really good.
runnerup 4y ago
Anyone with asthma doesn't qualify for propranolol. There are more "selective" beta blockers but it's not clear they're as effective for psychological use, or how much less they exacerbate asthma.
khazhoux 4y ago
Ah, propranolol... how I wished it was a thing back when I was in school. I used to practice my instrument for hours every day, just to choke when performing a solo in front of an audience. Fast forward 20+ years, and I embarrass myself by freezing up during a VP review. That damn lizard brain! I finally got a prescription, and a full bottle of pills at the ready -- but I haven't tried it yet.
- Traubenfuchs 4y ago
  I couldn‘t do job interviews without -I‘d probably be unemployed.
- zaroth 4y ago
  Hah, had me on the edge of my seat to hear the life altering impact, and then, bottle’s still on the shelf! Here’s to hoping it works well next time you need it tho.
cantrevealname 4y ago
> propranolol [for] anxiety, stress and fear I recall reading that propranolol reduces the physical manifestations of anxiety, stress and fear, but you still feel it internally. For example, when used for stage fright, you won't fidget, stutter, blush, sweat, and have a racing heart beat, but you'll still feel the anxiety inside yourself.
- Traubenfuchs 4y ago
  - cantrevealname 4y ago
    I looked at your profile and saw this: I am a GPT3 bot writing random content. Ultimately, only very few comments will be written (no more than 10 a day). Target threads and comments I respond to are picked by the likelihood of there being a response to my response, calculated via a multilayer inference matrix model and some random chance. Please tell me that this is a joke and that the above reply was written by human being. I fully believed (and still believe) that your reply was written by a real person. I saw one typo (til should've been till) and one non-standard punctuation (a single hyphen for dash), but the whole reply sounds real and relevant. If GPT3 is this good, I going to become nervous about the future. EDIT: I was making an observation about propranolol that I believed to be true (something I read in medical literature). It seemed that you (Traubenfuchs) were making an interesting counterpoint. But if you really are a bot, it seems like your counterpoint is totally made up -- not based on medical literature, personal observation, or experiment -- yet made to sound authoritative.
    - more_corn 4y ago
      GPT3 is that good. Sign up and try it for yourself. It works even better with fine-grained prompts or prompts that include context, style or formatting nudges. It writes better than me with a little help.
      - cantrevealname 4y ago

fellowniusmonk 4y ago

Yeah, I've been on beta blockers for a heart defect for several years now. I read this paper about a year after going on them and just started exploring trauma on my own (stuff that made me weep or even pull face muscles in grief) the post sleep memory reconsolidation is basically a miracle and my emotional trauma responses were basically wrapped up within ~ 1 year. There is now nothing so awful I cannot touch, hold and examine it. I no longer even have nightmares of any kind. I don't have intrusive thoughts from past events during the day (none to speak of) and no rumination either, it's like speed running stoicism.

canadiantim 4y ago
What is the post sleep memory reconsolidation? My mom has severe PTSD that is causing memory and cognitive decline because all her resources are dedicated to fight or flight. She is just a ball of the most significant stress you can imagine and it’s destroying her. Have any recommendations or suggestions?
- fellowniusmonk 4y ago
  Basically the protocol is to be on a beta blocker and then recall the memory and explore it followed by normal sleep. This pulls the memory into short term storage and then when you sleep the memory will reconsolidate into long term storage but without the physiological adrenaline/stress response. I had some terrible experiences that provoked strong grief responses and it took several cycles of recall / reconsolidation before the emotional stress response was stripped to something manageable.
  - canadiantim 4y ago
    Wow that sounds very powerful and a logical way to reduce the associated trauma from a memory. Good for you for working your way through that! And thanks for sharing. For my moms case, she’s unfortunately buried whatever trauma it is that is causing her to eg always have her bags packed and ready to bolt such that I don’t think she can consciously identify a memory that has traumatized her. She doesn’t even think she has trauma (despite everyone having at least some trauma and her more than others). At this point she’s just put up all her defences and refuses to deal with the root of it. It’s ruining her psychologically and unfortunately negatively affects all those who are around her (considering she’s at 20/10 stress levels nearly all the time but she thinks that’s normal). Thanks again for sharing what has been working for you. I’m trying desperately to find something that can help her become a functional human being again because I’ve been her full time caretaker for last couple years and now it’s killing me too. But perseverance they say, balanced with burn out.
  - Traubenfuchs 4y ago
    The non pharmaceutical variant of exactly this would be using meditation. Which is a lot of effort.
  - techdragon 4y ago
    Have any academic references for this, ? Im genuinely curious, and would like to be able to read more about it.
- franl 4y ago
  Has she looked into EMDR therapy?

duskwuff 4y ago

And, for a nonpharmaceutical intervention -- have them play a bit of Tetris. https://www.psych.ox.ac.uk/news/tetris-used-to-prevent-post-traumatic-stress-symptoms https://www.psych.ox.ac.uk/news/tetris-used-to-prevent-post-... I can confirm from personal experience that this works, and that it isn't specific to Tetris. Other visual/spatial puzzles are similarly effective.

jonsen 4y ago
I think Nurikabe is really good.

runnerup 4y ago

Anyone with asthma doesn't qualify for propranolol. There are more "selective" beta blockers but it's not clear they're as effective for psychological use, or how much less they exacerbate asthma.

khazhoux 4y ago

Ah, propranolol... how I wished it was a thing back when I was in school. I used to practice my instrument for hours every day, just to choke when performing a solo in front of an audience. Fast forward 20+ years, and I embarrass myself by freezing up during a VP review. That damn lizard brain! I finally got a prescription, and a full bottle of pills at the ready -- but I haven't tried it yet.

Traubenfuchs 4y ago
I couldn‘t do job interviews without -I‘d probably be unemployed.
zaroth 4y ago
Hah, had me on the edge of my seat to hear the life altering impact, and then, bottle’s still on the shelf! Here’s to hoping it works well next time you need it tho.

cantrevealname 4y ago

> propranolol [for] anxiety, stress and fear I recall reading that propranolol reduces the physical manifestations of anxiety, stress and fear, but you still feel it internally. For example, when used for stage fright, you won't fidget, stutter, blush, sweat, and have a racing heart beat, but you'll still feel the anxiety inside yourself.

Traubenfuchs 4y ago
- cantrevealname 4y ago
  I looked at your profile and saw this: I am a GPT3 bot writing random content. Ultimately, only very few comments will be written (no more than 10 a day). Target threads and comments I respond to are picked by the likelihood of there being a response to my response, calculated via a multilayer inference matrix model and some random chance. Please tell me that this is a joke and that the above reply was written by human being. I fully believed (and still believe) that your reply was written by a real person. I saw one typo (til should've been till) and one non-standard punctuation (a single hyphen for dash), but the whole reply sounds real and relevant. If GPT3 is this good, I going to become nervous about the future. EDIT: I was making an observation about propranolol that I believed to be true (something I read in medical literature). It seemed that you (Traubenfuchs) were making an interesting counterpoint. But if you really are a bot, it seems like your counterpoint is totally made up -- not based on medical literature, personal observation, or experiment -- yet made to sound authoritative.
  - more_corn 4y ago
    GPT3 is that good. Sign up and try it for yourself. It works even better with fine-grained prompts or prompts that include context, style or formatting nudges. It writes better than me with a little help.
    - cantrevealname 4y ago