8 ms·

The six light configuration they're recommending is pattern E here: https://i.imgur.com/hpOt1ac.png https://i.imgur.com/hpOt1ac.png

gojomo 4y ago
Thanks! So the top light is on some big new 'eyestalk' above the handlebars? (I'm baffled how the Rice PR team could put this out without any diagram/photo/rendering of the full proposed six-light-configuration, which could give the story 10x more interest & viral-forwarding legs, as well as improve the chances of its eventual life-saving adoption.)
- mattficke 4y ago
  The top light is a helmet-mounted light. They mention this in the full paper but it’s not clear from the abstract.
  - Scoundreller 4y ago
    I have one of these on my bicycle helmet. Works great for getting a driver’s attention at a 4-way stop (the North American approach to right-of-way is deficient when everyone stops at the same time and is going straight). But a problematic tell when I see a head-turner walking on the sidewalk.
  - nonrandomstring 4y ago
    My take is that this is about parallax [1], although I haven't read the paper and so that's an assumption. Creatures with forward facing stereoscopic vision (like us) can judge the speed and distance of an object if we can determine its size and see something of the background. In the dark, some information is missing when we rely on attached lights. Most people know the approximate size of a car, and so with two lights its easier to guess the distance (and crucially speed as the distance between the lights seems to change). I've noticed it's harder to cross a road when bikes are approaching than cars, because if you're looking along the axis of travel then its hard to gauge their speed. Attaching more than one light to a bike allows us to judge the speed better. It seems that it's irrelevant whether the spacing is horizontal or vertical for our visual systems to make this judgement. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax
    - bsimpson 4y ago
      Motorcycles also suffer a depth perception problem in the daytime: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doSDfIo61r0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doSDfIo61r0
    - gojomo 4y ago
      This research, & further your comment, makes me wonder: Customized cars often project vanity mood lighting down towards the pavement. (I believe the legality of such nonstandard lighting varies across jurisdictions.) Perhaps motorcycles could be required to project a large light-splash down, creating a more-visible 'light puddle' below them. It could even be something with very-sharp boundaries, & a standard oval size, so that the shape more strongly communicates distance/angle/speed.
      - nonrandomstring 4y ago
        That's really quite a good idea. I've seem bicycles in London projecting a green bike emblem into the road about 5 meters ahead using a laser. Two somewhat higher intensity spots on the road ahead would work as you indicate, At least in ideal road conditions.
        2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
        I’ve never seen this in Australia. But my main gripe with motor/push bikes is a) People riding without any lights. b) People riding without sufficient lightly. Re. b)If a bike comes up really close to the rear of your vehicle, and the rider has no reflective gear, the light can be obscured by your own vehicle. Re. a) I’m not sure if this is some Aussie thing. Especially with push bikes. The number of people I’ve seen on the road at night with no lighting and zero reflective gear.
        Nursie 4y ago
        So as a relatively recent migrant to Aus, I find that odd because AFAICT the regulations here are more strict than back in the UK. I.E. you must wear a helmet, you must have lights after dark, your bike must have a certain configuration of reflectors (two in the wheel, back/front of each pedals, front and rear) etc. From what I understand the reflector stuff is routinely ignored by 'the community' because it's outdated, rules out use of clipless setups etc. But the lights ... no idea. It's really really bad idea to cycle on the road at night with no lights. I wouldn't want to risk it, and it's scary as a driver when all of a sudden there's this dark figure out of nowhere.
- zucked 4y ago
  Seriously! As a motorcyclist (and cyclist) with a keen interest in not dying, I'm always looking for additional ways to be seen and predictable. This image should have been in the blog article, full stop. How is it _so_ buried?
  - mistrial9 4y ago
    light is great but first on the list is an aftermarket horn .. LOUD
    - bsimpson 4y ago
      I was about to cruise through a yellow light today when a pickup truck in the center of a one way street abruptly decided to make a left turn across my path. (I was in the far left lane.) I slammed on my brakes and laid on my horn. I saw his face in his mirror. As he realized the noise he was hearing was my underpowered Vespa horn protesting the needless near-calamity, a smirk of victory beamed across his face. Guy nearly took me out today, and all I could do was trust my ABS brakes and give him Roadrunner's angriest "meep meep."
      - taylodl 4y ago
        Now you've learned your lesson to not cruise through yellow lights. Also, mind your lane position. I'm always in the left-most position to maximize driver's opportunity to see me.
    - guenthert 4y ago
      I can count on the fingers of one hand the times I used the horn on any of my motorcycles in two decades of riding (>100kmi, various situations, not much commute, less in the dark). In dangerous situation where honking might have helped, I typically was busy to either break or steer out of harms way. Aside that horns on m/c tend to be meek. They seem to be installed only because some law requires them.
      - aussiesnack 4y ago
- harmonymeow 4y ago
  getting helmet mounted light charging would be a chore. what if we only keep the other 5 lights? would it be that much less effective?
  - bsimpson 4y ago
    Would it? I already keep my Cardo helmet speakers charged. Cyclists keep their helmet lights charged.
nomel 4y ago
The choice of the small top light seems odd. If the lower view of the bike is obstructed, like in a review/side mirror, you'll see a single small light, and think it's a far away something. I think adding some unique color(s) or flashing patterns would be much more identifiable. We're in the future now. We can craft lights that have colors outside of efficient slices of the blackbody spectrum, and make them do fancy things like "blink".
- minitoar 4y ago
  Most (all?) vehicle codes don’t permit other colors or flashing lights unless it’s an emergency vehicle.
  - pavon 4y ago
    However, the law does often distinguish between modulating/pulsating lights and flashing ones. In the US, federal code 49 CFR Part 571.108 S7.9.4.1 explicitly allows modulating headlights on motorcycles[1]. From time to time I do see motorcycles whose headlights pulse. I hate it - it makes them easier to see but harder to gauge distance, and harder to focus on all the other traffic and pedestrians on and around the road. [1] https://www.gl1800riders.com/attachments/federal-law-motorcycle-headlight-modulators-pdf.308139/ https://www.gl1800riders.com/attachments/federal-law-motorcy...
    - jlgaddis 4y ago
      As a "normal" driver, the pulsating lights absolutely are annoying... and don't even get me started on those loud ass pipes! Now, as a motorcyclist who has been hit head-on more than once by drivers who swore "I didn't even see him!" -- with the last crash leaving me with multiple broken bones and an inability to walk for several months -- you better believe I now have both a pulsating headlamp and a nice set of loud ass pipes (they're even called "Street Cannons")! on my bike. I've also lost a non-zero number of friends due to folks who swore they didn't see them. It's now been eight years since I've gotten hit... so I really am sorry if my headlight or pipes bother you as I pass by but, well, I have loved ones I'd like to see again so I hope you'll forgive me.
toss1 4y ago
Thanks - it was definitely hard to visualize with only the (oddly) un-illustrated article. Without going all the way to version "E", I've noticed that a setup not pictured, with two full-sized headlights side-by-side in the normal just-under-the-handlebars location (round or rectangular didn't matter) instantly made it far easier to identify the motorcycle and judge distances. The single headlight just looks too much like a car with one dead headlight (especially since standard riding technique is to not ride in the center of the lane), and it takes seconds to figure out if I'm looking at a bike or a car possibly halfway into my lane. Two headlights it's instant, and also upgrades it to a 2D object in a black field, making 3D judgements much easier, as the spacing between them widens on approach, etc.. I think the best setup would be a dual-headlight setup in the illustrated "E" setup.
dt3ft 4y ago
The pattern E seems to resemble a human figure.
- snissn 4y ago
  first thing i noticed too! would definitely wake me up a bit driving if i saw that!
Wagthesam 4y ago
I add aux lights similar to the two bottom configuration. This creates a triangle with the headlight and makes me more visible. The two lights to the side is excessive because it can confuse drivers with the turn signal lights. I would not attach any lights to the helmet. Helmets are ideally glancing off impacts and gopro or light add ons can cause catastrophic failure for the helmet if its hit during impact. See Schumacher's ski accident
- minitoar 4y ago
  Agreed about not modifying the helmet but I could imagine a helmet with such a thing built in.
  - _carbyau_ 4y ago
    Where's my inbuilt headcam already? Honestly, first motorcycle helmet with inbuilt front and back cams that is at a vaguely mainstream price (premium allowed for extra features!) has my serious interest.
  - Scoundreller 4y ago
    Built-in seems worse? I'd rather it sit outside on something flimsy and break away at impact.
    - minitoar 4y ago
      Helmets are tested in a variety of impact scenarios without modification. Who knows how some random attachment might negatively affect those outcomes. Presumably you might use some sort of adhesive to attach things — that adhesive can damage and weaken the shell of the helmet.
      - Scoundreller 4y ago
        I just use my brain and assume that the plastic 'candy' shell on the helmet doesn't do anything (other than moisture protection) and as long as the styrofoam innards are in-tact, then nothing materially changes. Otherwise we'd also see warnings against stickers and artwork on the shell of helmets, but we don't. Or at least I didn't, but I don't really read manuals.
Corazoor 4y ago
I think I get why this might be the most effective: When I look at that, my mind completes it to a stick figure, like an optical illusion. At least to me, that one is immediately recognizable as a human.
- euroderf 4y ago
  Absolutely. An abstract-but-recognizable figure.

gojomo 4y ago

Thanks! So the top light is on some big new 'eyestalk' above the handlebars? (I'm baffled how the Rice PR team could put this out without any diagram/photo/rendering of the full proposed six-light-configuration, which could give the story 10x more interest & viral-forwarding legs, as well as improve the chances of its eventual life-saving adoption.)

mattficke 4y ago
The top light is a helmet-mounted light. They mention this in the full paper but it’s not clear from the abstract.
- Scoundreller 4y ago
  I have one of these on my bicycle helmet. Works great for getting a driver’s attention at a 4-way stop (the North American approach to right-of-way is deficient when everyone stops at the same time and is going straight). But a problematic tell when I see a head-turner walking on the sidewalk.
- nonrandomstring 4y ago
  My take is that this is about parallax [1], although I haven't read the paper and so that's an assumption. Creatures with forward facing stereoscopic vision (like us) can judge the speed and distance of an object if we can determine its size and see something of the background. In the dark, some information is missing when we rely on attached lights. Most people know the approximate size of a car, and so with two lights its easier to guess the distance (and crucially speed as the distance between the lights seems to change). I've noticed it's harder to cross a road when bikes are approaching than cars, because if you're looking along the axis of travel then its hard to gauge their speed. Attaching more than one light to a bike allows us to judge the speed better. It seems that it's irrelevant whether the spacing is horizontal or vertical for our visual systems to make this judgement. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax
  - bsimpson 4y ago
    Motorcycles also suffer a depth perception problem in the daytime: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doSDfIo61r0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doSDfIo61r0
  - gojomo 4y ago
    This research, & further your comment, makes me wonder: Customized cars often project vanity mood lighting down towards the pavement. (I believe the legality of such nonstandard lighting varies across jurisdictions.) Perhaps motorcycles could be required to project a large light-splash down, creating a more-visible 'light puddle' below them. It could even be something with very-sharp boundaries, & a standard oval size, so that the shape more strongly communicates distance/angle/speed.
    - nonrandomstring 4y ago
      That's really quite a good idea. I've seem bicycles in London projecting a green bike emblem into the road about 5 meters ahead using a laser. Two somewhat higher intensity spots on the road ahead would work as you indicate, At least in ideal road conditions.
      - 2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
        I’ve never seen this in Australia. But my main gripe with motor/push bikes is a) People riding without any lights. b) People riding without sufficient lightly. Re. b)If a bike comes up really close to the rear of your vehicle, and the rider has no reflective gear, the light can be obscured by your own vehicle. Re. a) I’m not sure if this is some Aussie thing. Especially with push bikes. The number of people I’ve seen on the road at night with no lighting and zero reflective gear.
        Nursie 4y ago
        So as a relatively recent migrant to Aus, I find that odd because AFAICT the regulations here are more strict than back in the UK. I.E. you must wear a helmet, you must have lights after dark, your bike must have a certain configuration of reflectors (two in the wheel, back/front of each pedals, front and rear) etc. From what I understand the reflector stuff is routinely ignored by 'the community' because it's outdated, rules out use of clipless setups etc. But the lights ... no idea. It's really really bad idea to cycle on the road at night with no lights. I wouldn't want to risk it, and it's scary as a driver when all of a sudden there's this dark figure out of nowhere.
zucked 4y ago
Seriously! As a motorcyclist (and cyclist) with a keen interest in not dying, I'm always looking for additional ways to be seen and predictable. This image should have been in the blog article, full stop. How is it _so_ buried?
- mistrial9 4y ago
  light is great but first on the list is an aftermarket horn .. LOUD
  - bsimpson 4y ago
    I was about to cruise through a yellow light today when a pickup truck in the center of a one way street abruptly decided to make a left turn across my path. (I was in the far left lane.) I slammed on my brakes and laid on my horn. I saw his face in his mirror. As he realized the noise he was hearing was my underpowered Vespa horn protesting the needless near-calamity, a smirk of victory beamed across his face. Guy nearly took me out today, and all I could do was trust my ABS brakes and give him Roadrunner's angriest "meep meep."
    - taylodl 4y ago
      Now you've learned your lesson to not cruise through yellow lights. Also, mind your lane position. I'm always in the left-most position to maximize driver's opportunity to see me.
  - guenthert 4y ago
    I can count on the fingers of one hand the times I used the horn on any of my motorcycles in two decades of riding (>100kmi, various situations, not much commute, less in the dark). In dangerous situation where honking might have helped, I typically was busy to either break or steer out of harms way. Aside that horns on m/c tend to be meek. They seem to be installed only because some law requires them.
    - aussiesnack 4y ago
harmonymeow 4y ago
getting helmet mounted light charging would be a chore. what if we only keep the other 5 lights? would it be that much less effective?
- bsimpson 4y ago
  Would it? I already keep my Cardo helmet speakers charged. Cyclists keep their helmet lights charged.

nomel 4y ago

The choice of the small top light seems odd. If the lower view of the bike is obstructed, like in a review/side mirror, you'll see a single small light, and think it's a far away something. I think adding some unique color(s) or flashing patterns would be much more identifiable. We're in the future now. We can craft lights that have colors outside of efficient slices of the blackbody spectrum, and make them do fancy things like "blink".

minitoar 4y ago
Most (all?) vehicle codes don’t permit other colors or flashing lights unless it’s an emergency vehicle.
- pavon 4y ago
  However, the law does often distinguish between modulating/pulsating lights and flashing ones. In the US, federal code 49 CFR Part 571.108 S7.9.4.1 explicitly allows modulating headlights on motorcycles[1]. From time to time I do see motorcycles whose headlights pulse. I hate it - it makes them easier to see but harder to gauge distance, and harder to focus on all the other traffic and pedestrians on and around the road. [1] https://www.gl1800riders.com/attachments/federal-law-motorcycle-headlight-modulators-pdf.308139/ https://www.gl1800riders.com/attachments/federal-law-motorcy...
  - jlgaddis 4y ago
    As a "normal" driver, the pulsating lights absolutely are annoying... and don't even get me started on those loud ass pipes! Now, as a motorcyclist who has been hit head-on more than once by drivers who swore "I didn't even see him!" -- with the last crash leaving me with multiple broken bones and an inability to walk for several months -- you better believe I now have both a pulsating headlamp and a nice set of loud ass pipes (they're even called "Street Cannons")! on my bike. I've also lost a non-zero number of friends due to folks who swore they didn't see them. It's now been eight years since I've gotten hit... so I really am sorry if my headlight or pipes bother you as I pass by but, well, I have loved ones I'd like to see again so I hope you'll forgive me.

toss1 4y ago

Thanks - it was definitely hard to visualize with only the (oddly) un-illustrated article. Without going all the way to version "E", I've noticed that a setup not pictured, with two full-sized headlights side-by-side in the normal just-under-the-handlebars location (round or rectangular didn't matter) instantly made it far easier to identify the motorcycle and judge distances. The single headlight just looks too much like a car with one dead headlight (especially since standard riding technique is to not ride in the center of the lane), and it takes seconds to figure out if I'm looking at a bike or a car possibly halfway into my lane. Two headlights it's instant, and also upgrades it to a 2D object in a black field, making 3D judgements much easier, as the spacing between them widens on approach, etc.. I think the best setup would be a dual-headlight setup in the illustrated "E" setup.

dt3ft 4y ago

The pattern E seems to resemble a human figure.

snissn 4y ago
first thing i noticed too! would definitely wake me up a bit driving if i saw that!

Wagthesam 4y ago

I add aux lights similar to the two bottom configuration. This creates a triangle with the headlight and makes me more visible. The two lights to the side is excessive because it can confuse drivers with the turn signal lights. I would not attach any lights to the helmet. Helmets are ideally glancing off impacts and gopro or light add ons can cause catastrophic failure for the helmet if its hit during impact. See Schumacher's ski accident

minitoar 4y ago
Agreed about not modifying the helmet but I could imagine a helmet with such a thing built in.
- _carbyau_ 4y ago
  Where's my inbuilt headcam already? Honestly, first motorcycle helmet with inbuilt front and back cams that is at a vaguely mainstream price (premium allowed for extra features!) has my serious interest.
- Scoundreller 4y ago
  Built-in seems worse? I'd rather it sit outside on something flimsy and break away at impact.
  - minitoar 4y ago
    Helmets are tested in a variety of impact scenarios without modification. Who knows how some random attachment might negatively affect those outcomes. Presumably you might use some sort of adhesive to attach things — that adhesive can damage and weaken the shell of the helmet.
    - Scoundreller 4y ago
      I just use my brain and assume that the plastic 'candy' shell on the helmet doesn't do anything (other than moisture protection) and as long as the styrofoam innards are in-tact, then nothing materially changes. Otherwise we'd also see warnings against stickers and artwork on the shell of helmets, but we don't. Or at least I didn't, but I don't really read manuals.

Corazoor 4y ago

I think I get why this might be the most effective: When I look at that, my mind completes it to a stick figure, like an optical illusion. At least to me, that one is immediately recognizable as a human.

euroderf 4y ago
Absolutely. An abstract-but-recognizable figure.