4 ms·

Older laptops tend to have all sorts of hacks, master passwords and whatnot, because they realized these scenarios happen and with physical access and enough ti

Older laptops tend to have all sorts of hacks, master passwords and whatnot, because they realized these scenarios happen and with physical access and enough time it's generally game over any way. I wish this were possible with current-day phones. I've had multiple instances of a friend or relative either buying or getting handed an older iphone, and if the previous owner did the responsible thing of resetting the phone beforehand, it will refuse to get past initial setup without a stable wifi connection and the previous owner's icloud credentials. Tracing down the previous owner and getting them to change their password or disable the "find my" feature for this one time operation is harder than you'd think, especially if it was passed down multiple hands or the account is from a different person (and the original owner was never aware). In some of these instances we've had no choice but to throw the brick away.

btdmaster 4y ago
It's not a complete brick; if you give up iCloud and all associated Apple services, you can get a root shell (assuming checkra1n is unpatched on your device & iOS version) and delete the locks and end up with a phone that works fine if you can get an alternative app store on it (which you can if you're able to get a root shell in the first place)[0][1] [0] https://github.com/FlymeDllVa/iCloud-bypass-via-USB https://github.com/FlymeDllVa/iCloud-bypass-via-USB [1] https://github.com/Toni-d-e-v/Aurora-Icloud-bypass https://github.com/Toni-d-e-v/Aurora-Icloud-bypass
- SpikeDad 4y ago
  Would this work when the USB accessory lock is enabled?
  - btdmaster 4y ago
    It looks like checkra1n is more limited in that case[0][1] so I'm not sure if there are any workarounds that can get you the whole way. I would ask in their bugtracker: https://github.com/checkra1n/BugTracker https://github.com/checkra1n/BugTracker [0] https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2020/05/iphone-usb-restricted-mode-workaround/ https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2020/05/iphone-usb-restricted-mod... [1] https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2020/07/checkra1n-usb-restrictions-and-breaking-into-locked-iphones/ https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2020/07/checkra1n-usb-restriction...
BoorishBears 4y ago
That's a feature, not a bug https://techcrunch.com/2015/02/11/apples-activation-lock-leads-to-big-drops-in-smartphone-theft-worldwide/ https://techcrunch.com/2015/02/11/apples-activation-lock-lea... The tradeoff is very reasonable: People need to actively engage in the process of relinquishing control over a device that's essentially become an extension of the mind
- NoraCodes 4y ago
  Even if it's wiped?
  - Jolter 4y ago
    The idea is that ownership needs to be transferred in a structured and conscious way. A factory reset is not an ownership transfer and Apple are not keeping those operations separate. These are expensive devices and theft happens.
    - C4K3 4y ago
      A reasonable solution would be to have a "Do you want to disassociate this phone from your iCloud account?" prompt as part of the factory reset.
      - dawnerd 4y ago
        I thought this was the case already?
        literalAardvark 4y ago
        On the Samsung J5 2017 you need to delete the Google accounts before resetting.I haven't tested FRP on anything newer.
        SpikeDad 4y ago
        It is. iOS prompts to remove the Find My setting (iCloud Lock) when you use the Erase everything prompt. Requires entering your Apple ID password.
danielheath 4y ago
It does make iPhones a far less attractive target for theft, though. Much harder to resell a locked device.
- fortran77 4y ago
  Not really. It can be sold for parts. If someone can grab one, he will.
  - Scoundreller 4y ago
    Lowers the value proposition though
  - selectodude 4y ago
    Hence the serializing of individual parts on the iPhones nowadays. If you take your iPhone to a store that sources stolen parts, the phone will flag it. It obviously doesn't stop the supply chain of stolen parts but it makes it so legitimate consumers will ask questions and legitimate stores will be less likely to buy stolen phones for parts.
    - gunapologist99 4y ago
      It's interesting that the ostensible reason for serializing the parts is of great benefit to Apple by basically killing off second-hand parts and third-party repair shops, much like its ostensible privacy-related reasons for locking down ads in the App Store have massively enhanced its own Ads business while crushing its competitors. In this case, Apple has forcibly become the gatekeeper for all parts, both used and new, and has plausible reasons for why this is good for the customer. It's really quite brilliant.
      - selectodude 4y ago
        It's about weighing the needs of people who break their screens vs the needs of people who don't want to be violently deprived of their property. Frankly, I'm fine spending an extra $50 if I break something vs depriving the market of stolen iPhones. Like everything, there are costs and benefits.
zozbot234 4y ago
The responsible thing is for the owner to log out of iCloud before selling the device or giving it away. Google Android works the same way AIUI: if your device is logged into Google and you reset from recovery or bootloader, you'll need to input these credentials due to FRP.
- mid-kid 4y ago
  Extremely few people are even aware this is a thing, let alone know how to reset a phone in a way that won't essentially brick the device. I'm not too familiar with how google does it, but considering the average android device is easier to unlock while retaining full functionality, and I've managed to help someone bypass it by setting up a captive portal, I've had less issues with it than with iphones.

btdmaster 4y ago

It's not a complete brick; if you give up iCloud and all associated Apple services, you can get a root shell (assuming checkra1n is unpatched on your device & iOS version) and delete the locks and end up with a phone that works fine if you can get an alternative app store on it (which you can if you're able to get a root shell in the first place)[0][1] [0] https://github.com/FlymeDllVa/iCloud-bypass-via-USB https://github.com/FlymeDllVa/iCloud-bypass-via-USB [1] https://github.com/Toni-d-e-v/Aurora-Icloud-bypass https://github.com/Toni-d-e-v/Aurora-Icloud-bypass

SpikeDad 4y ago
Would this work when the USB accessory lock is enabled?
- btdmaster 4y ago
  It looks like checkra1n is more limited in that case[0][1] so I'm not sure if there are any workarounds that can get you the whole way. I would ask in their bugtracker: https://github.com/checkra1n/BugTracker https://github.com/checkra1n/BugTracker [0] https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2020/05/iphone-usb-restricted-mode-workaround/ https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2020/05/iphone-usb-restricted-mod... [1] https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2020/07/checkra1n-usb-restrictions-and-breaking-into-locked-iphones/ https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2020/07/checkra1n-usb-restriction...

BoorishBears 4y ago

That's a feature, not a bug https://techcrunch.com/2015/02/11/apples-activation-lock-leads-to-big-drops-in-smartphone-theft-worldwide/ https://techcrunch.com/2015/02/11/apples-activation-lock-lea... The tradeoff is very reasonable: People need to actively engage in the process of relinquishing control over a device that's essentially become an extension of the mind

NoraCodes 4y ago
Even if it's wiped?
- Jolter 4y ago
  The idea is that ownership needs to be transferred in a structured and conscious way. A factory reset is not an ownership transfer and Apple are not keeping those operations separate. These are expensive devices and theft happens.
  - C4K3 4y ago
    A reasonable solution would be to have a "Do you want to disassociate this phone from your iCloud account?" prompt as part of the factory reset.
    - dawnerd 4y ago
      I thought this was the case already?
      - literalAardvark 4y ago
        On the Samsung J5 2017 you need to delete the Google accounts before resetting.I haven't tested FRP on anything newer.
      - SpikeDad 4y ago
        It is. iOS prompts to remove the Find My setting (iCloud Lock) when you use the Erase everything prompt. Requires entering your Apple ID password.

danielheath 4y ago

It does make iPhones a far less attractive target for theft, though. Much harder to resell a locked device.

fortran77 4y ago
Not really. It can be sold for parts. If someone can grab one, he will.
- Scoundreller 4y ago
  Lowers the value proposition though
- selectodude 4y ago
  Hence the serializing of individual parts on the iPhones nowadays. If you take your iPhone to a store that sources stolen parts, the phone will flag it. It obviously doesn't stop the supply chain of stolen parts but it makes it so legitimate consumers will ask questions and legitimate stores will be less likely to buy stolen phones for parts.
  - gunapologist99 4y ago
    It's interesting that the ostensible reason for serializing the parts is of great benefit to Apple by basically killing off second-hand parts and third-party repair shops, much like its ostensible privacy-related reasons for locking down ads in the App Store have massively enhanced its own Ads business while crushing its competitors. In this case, Apple has forcibly become the gatekeeper for all parts, both used and new, and has plausible reasons for why this is good for the customer. It's really quite brilliant.
    - selectodude 4y ago
      It's about weighing the needs of people who break their screens vs the needs of people who don't want to be violently deprived of their property. Frankly, I'm fine spending an extra $50 if I break something vs depriving the market of stolen iPhones. Like everything, there are costs and benefits.

zozbot234 4y ago

The responsible thing is for the owner to log out of iCloud before selling the device or giving it away. Google Android works the same way AIUI: if your device is logged into Google and you reset from recovery or bootloader, you'll need to input these credentials due to FRP.

mid-kid 4y ago
Extremely few people are even aware this is a thing, let alone know how to reset a phone in a way that won't essentially brick the device. I'm not too familiar with how google does it, but considering the average android device is easier to unlock while retaining full functionality, and I've managed to help someone bypass it by setting up a captive portal, I've had less issues with it than with iphones.