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From what I've read Lufthansa never banned AirTags, regardless of what a misinformed customer service person on Twitter may have thought. They clarified their

From what I've read Lufthansa never banned AirTags, regardless of what a misinformed customer service person on Twitter may have thought. They clarified their guidelines to say that active transmitters were not allowed in the hold because they couldn't be put on to flight mode (pretty much correct according to ICAO guidelines), and then after all this blew up later clarified their position by confirming that AirTags do not count (also correct).

duxup 4y ago
>From what I've read Lufthansa never banned AirTags "Hi David, Lufthansa is banning activated AirTags from luggage as they are classified as dangerous and need to be turned off./Mony" https://twitter.com/lufthansa/status/1578879849577385984 https://twitter.com/lufthansa/status/1578879849577385984 I think that's pretty explicit. Official policy somewhere else in the company might be different but it's hard to imagine how folks are supposed to know what is up when they say it clearly like that.
- danpalmer 4y ago
  > regardless of what a misinformed customer service person on Twitter may have thought I'd suggest that their published guidelines are probably more reliable than the interpretation of those being communicated for convenience by customer service reps. That's not to say this didn't have an impact, it clearly did, and customers should be able to trust this, but most of the reporting on this has treated it like an active decision to ban a particular device by a large company, rather than a misinterpretation by one individual in response to a question about a specific device.
  - prange 4y ago
    What makes you think a customer service rep is operating the official Twitter account for a $40+BN company?
    - danpalmer 4y ago
      The fact that Twitter is a customer service channel, the tweet was sent with "Qualtrics Social Connect" which describes itself as a customer service tool, the fact that there was a personal sign-off on the tweet which big companies don't tend to do when they're making policy announcements, but that they do tend to do when a customer service rep is replying to a customer question. Plenty of large companies do this sort of support via their official account rather than through a dedicated support account, it generally provides a better customer experience because no one wants to look up an account like "LufthansaSupportEMEA". I'm not sure what makes you think this is not a customer service interaction?
      - duxup 4y ago
        Not to disagree with your characterization of the tweet or response to the user, but what's the end point then? "Don't believe our official twitter account if you think customer service is involved?" I have trouble faulting anyone for believing what was a very clear statement on their official twitter account.
        danpalmer 4y ago
        There's a difference between the Lufthansa account tweeting out a statement, and a Lufthansa rep, named in the tweet, replying to one user. The reply means that it's hidden from anyone who isn't either following both users (unlikely) or actively seeking it out. I see this interaction as closer to a customer service phone call where a rep got something wrong, and the only fallout should be that I as one single customer am now misinformed. The amount of checks and balances to ensure that messaging is correct doesn't need too high as it's low risk if one customer is misinformed. Whereas if Lufthansa makes a full statement they should expect all customers to be misinformed, or expect the press to pick it up. This brings me back to my original point. I don't think the press reported on this well, because this was clearly not an official statement prepared for the press or the audience of all customers, with the level of thinking about it that should go into that sort of thing. It was clearly (to me) an isolated thing. The correct course of action for a journalist would be to confirm with Lufthansa, which appears not to have happened.
  - duxup 4y ago
    I think the "misinterpretation" is completely understandable considering their official outright said they banned them... This wasn't even an interpretation, they say outright they're banning them.
- tlogan 4y ago
  If they just replied back and said “oh no - mistake: AirTags are allowed” then there will be no story. But they did not. So I called them and their customer support was not able to tell me. So I started believing that they really will not allow AirTags
  - duxup 4y ago
    The progression was really strange. There were some folks in the media who reached out to PR people at the airline, some got "don't know" others were told "that's not our policy" ... but nobody updated the official twitter account for a while. I agree 100%, just a mistaken tweet could have been solved with a timely new tweet.
croes 4y ago
But why do AirTags not count?
- danpalmer 4y ago
  The guidelines are targeted at phones and other long range transmission equipment. AirTags use Bluetooth and have a relatively limited range, a very low transmission power, and don't really do much at all until they get pinged by another device. It's also been fairly well understood for a while now that Bluetooth is not a concern on flights, and it uses an ISM radio frequency which is specifically set aside so as to not interfere with things like planes and other critical communications infrastructure.
  - anaganisk 4y ago
    Even cellular dont, its more to protect towers in path being DDOsd by 100s of people at a time.
    - Dylan16807 4y ago
      I've never seen a real citation for this, do you have one?
      - anaganisk 4y ago
        Its an FCC regulation, why would I need to cite it :p But anyway https://www.businessinsider.com/phone-airplane-mode-flight-explained-2017-7 https://www.businessinsider.com/phone-airplane-mode-flight-e...
        Dylan16807 4y ago
        "protect against radio interference" is extremely vague, I want something better and also evidence someone has made an assessment/update to cell service at least as modern as 3G. "picking up service from multiple cell towers" seems like a guess if it's solely based on the above words, and also that's pretty different from planefuls of people arriving and overwhelming a tower.

duxup 4y ago

>From what I've read Lufthansa never banned AirTags "Hi David, Lufthansa is banning activated AirTags from luggage as they are classified as dangerous and need to be turned off./Mony" https://twitter.com/lufthansa/status/1578879849577385984 https://twitter.com/lufthansa/status/1578879849577385984 I think that's pretty explicit. Official policy somewhere else in the company might be different but it's hard to imagine how folks are supposed to know what is up when they say it clearly like that.

danpalmer 4y ago
> regardless of what a misinformed customer service person on Twitter may have thought I'd suggest that their published guidelines are probably more reliable than the interpretation of those being communicated for convenience by customer service reps. That's not to say this didn't have an impact, it clearly did, and customers should be able to trust this, but most of the reporting on this has treated it like an active decision to ban a particular device by a large company, rather than a misinterpretation by one individual in response to a question about a specific device.
- prange 4y ago
  What makes you think a customer service rep is operating the official Twitter account for a $40+BN company?
  - danpalmer 4y ago
    The fact that Twitter is a customer service channel, the tweet was sent with "Qualtrics Social Connect" which describes itself as a customer service tool, the fact that there was a personal sign-off on the tweet which big companies don't tend to do when they're making policy announcements, but that they do tend to do when a customer service rep is replying to a customer question. Plenty of large companies do this sort of support via their official account rather than through a dedicated support account, it generally provides a better customer experience because no one wants to look up an account like "LufthansaSupportEMEA". I'm not sure what makes you think this is not a customer service interaction?
    - duxup 4y ago
      Not to disagree with your characterization of the tweet or response to the user, but what's the end point then? "Don't believe our official twitter account if you think customer service is involved?" I have trouble faulting anyone for believing what was a very clear statement on their official twitter account.
      - danpalmer 4y ago
        There's a difference between the Lufthansa account tweeting out a statement, and a Lufthansa rep, named in the tweet, replying to one user. The reply means that it's hidden from anyone who isn't either following both users (unlikely) or actively seeking it out. I see this interaction as closer to a customer service phone call where a rep got something wrong, and the only fallout should be that I as one single customer am now misinformed. The amount of checks and balances to ensure that messaging is correct doesn't need too high as it's low risk if one customer is misinformed. Whereas if Lufthansa makes a full statement they should expect all customers to be misinformed, or expect the press to pick it up. This brings me back to my original point. I don't think the press reported on this well, because this was clearly not an official statement prepared for the press or the audience of all customers, with the level of thinking about it that should go into that sort of thing. It was clearly (to me) an isolated thing. The correct course of action for a journalist would be to confirm with Lufthansa, which appears not to have happened.
- duxup 4y ago
  I think the "misinterpretation" is completely understandable considering their official outright said they banned them... This wasn't even an interpretation, they say outright they're banning them.
tlogan 4y ago
If they just replied back and said “oh no - mistake: AirTags are allowed” then there will be no story. But they did not. So I called them and their customer support was not able to tell me. So I started believing that they really will not allow AirTags
- duxup 4y ago
  The progression was really strange. There were some folks in the media who reached out to PR people at the airline, some got "don't know" others were told "that's not our policy" ... but nobody updated the official twitter account for a while. I agree 100%, just a mistaken tweet could have been solved with a timely new tweet.

croes 4y ago

But why do AirTags not count?

danpalmer 4y ago
The guidelines are targeted at phones and other long range transmission equipment. AirTags use Bluetooth and have a relatively limited range, a very low transmission power, and don't really do much at all until they get pinged by another device. It's also been fairly well understood for a while now that Bluetooth is not a concern on flights, and it uses an ISM radio frequency which is specifically set aside so as to not interfere with things like planes and other critical communications infrastructure.
- anaganisk 4y ago
  Even cellular dont, its more to protect towers in path being DDOsd by 100s of people at a time.
  - Dylan16807 4y ago
    I've never seen a real citation for this, do you have one?
    - anaganisk 4y ago
      Its an FCC regulation, why would I need to cite it :p But anyway https://www.businessinsider.com/phone-airplane-mode-flight-explained-2017-7 https://www.businessinsider.com/phone-airplane-mode-flight-e...
      - Dylan16807 4y ago
        "protect against radio interference" is extremely vague, I want something better and also evidence someone has made an assessment/update to cell service at least as modern as 3G. "picking up service from multiple cell towers" seems like a guess if it's solely based on the above words, and also that's pretty different from planefuls of people arriving and overwhelming a tower.