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> But I don't get why people are fundamentally against "prisoners should work to provide for themselves, just like the rest of us." If we treat prison as a ser

> But I don't get why people are fundamentally against "prisoners should work to provide for themselves, just like the rest of us." If we treat prison as a service to society it makes sense that we should pay for the service through taxes. Prison obviously isn't intended to be a service for the convicted individual so it doesn't make any sense to charge them. If this cost is considered too high we should consider reducing the number of people we send to prison. If we can offload the cost to prisoners, those least capable of fighting back (they can't even vote!), then the sky's the limit! > Hell, it would probably be great for rehabilitation. You could teach people how to show up for a job and manage money. Sure, if and only if they're paid the local minimum wage and services in the prison are reasonably priced (no $25 brief phone calls, etc). Otherwise we're not teaching them to manage anything, we're just exploiting them.

AlgorithmicTime 4y ago
dolni 4y ago
To touch on your last point, yes. Prison jobs should be treated basically the same as a real world job, where practicable. You interview for a job, you get paid a fair market rate, you get reasonable paid time off and sick time. On the flip side of that, you also need to pay for your own lodging and food. Also at fair market rate (accounting for prison quality generally being lower means lower rent, I wager). You could offer nicer accommodations that prisoners can upgrade to, for a higher monthly rent. And maybe the food line has different meal options. If you want to splurge one day to celebrate, you could order a steak or lobster, or something.
surement 4y ago
> Prison obviously isn't intended to be a service for the convicted individual so it doesn't make any sense to charge them. People are in prison because of their own antisocial behavior, and you think that others should bear the costs of keeping them there?
- dpkirchner 4y ago
  I do. I am also OK with providing public defenders, prosecutors, judges, rehab counseling, probation, all on the taxpayer's dime. I believe the benefits to society far outweigh the costs.
- mrguyorama 4y ago
  Yes? Locking people away IF ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY is only done for the reason of making the rest of society better. Of course we should be paying for that functionality. We shouldn't be imprisoning people to make them suffer, we should be doing it because it's literally the only possible way to keep them from harming society as a whole. The "punishment" inherent in prison is the loss of your basic human rights, your freedom. Anything above and beyond that should be considered unethical treatment. Prison should be an incredibly boring hotel stay really. And if you say "but then people will want to go to prison" you should think about how horrible of a world you've built where it's better to give up basic rights than participate in society.
- imtringued 4y ago
  People are in prison because that benefits the people outside of prison. By locking up serial killers, the people outside of prison are safe but the people inside prison are not.

AlgorithmicTime 4y ago

dolni 4y ago

To touch on your last point, yes. Prison jobs should be treated basically the same as a real world job, where practicable. You interview for a job, you get paid a fair market rate, you get reasonable paid time off and sick time. On the flip side of that, you also need to pay for your own lodging and food. Also at fair market rate (accounting for prison quality generally being lower means lower rent, I wager). You could offer nicer accommodations that prisoners can upgrade to, for a higher monthly rent. And maybe the food line has different meal options. If you want to splurge one day to celebrate, you could order a steak or lobster, or something.

surement 4y ago

> Prison obviously isn't intended to be a service for the convicted individual so it doesn't make any sense to charge them. People are in prison because of their own antisocial behavior, and you think that others should bear the costs of keeping them there?

dpkirchner 4y ago
I do. I am also OK with providing public defenders, prosecutors, judges, rehab counseling, probation, all on the taxpayer's dime. I believe the benefits to society far outweigh the costs.
mrguyorama 4y ago
Yes? Locking people away IF ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY is only done for the reason of making the rest of society better. Of course we should be paying for that functionality. We shouldn't be imprisoning people to make them suffer, we should be doing it because it's literally the only possible way to keep them from harming society as a whole. The "punishment" inherent in prison is the loss of your basic human rights, your freedom. Anything above and beyond that should be considered unethical treatment. Prison should be an incredibly boring hotel stay really. And if you say "but then people will want to go to prison" you should think about how horrible of a world you've built where it's better to give up basic rights than participate in society.
imtringued 4y ago
People are in prison because that benefits the people outside of prison. By locking up serial killers, the people outside of prison are safe but the people inside prison are not.