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Why is it FUD? Who is more likely to get fired if you are choosing between two similar competent people and you have been told you need to pick one: The one yo
by ejb999 4y ago
Why is it FUD?
Who is more likely to get fired if you are choosing between two similar competent people and you have been told you need to pick one: The one you sit next to and have lunch with a few days a week and possibly lives in your general neighborhood? or the person which you have never met in person and lives 2000 miles away?
- zaphod12 4y agoFear, Uncertainty and Doubt. When you say statements like the one noted above which aren't true, but I mean..."hey, it sounds like it could be true and do you want to take that risk?"
- ejb999 4y agoJust because you don't want to believe it, doesn't make it not true - its human nature to be more protective of the people you know better/personally than those you have never met.
- Retric 4y agoFrom what’s I have seen remote workers tend to survive layoffs more than office workers. I don’t know if this is a common trend, but remote workers are generally cheaper including overhead which is a major point when it comes to cost cutting initiatives.
- ejb999 4y agothen they are not 'similar' people are they? if the cost structure is completely different - that is a completely different calculation.
- Retric 4y agoSimilar or higher pay being offset by vastly cheaper office space is not about the person.
- kube-system 4y agoSelection bias. Remote workers also tend to skew more senior/experienced. The new guy who isn't providing much value is always the first to get cut, and he's also the same guy who is less likely to be trusted to WFH.
- Retric 4y agoPossibly, though selection bias the other way means people who are more likely to survive a layoff are also more likely to become senior.
- CydeWeys 4y agoA lot of remote workers on here seem to expect to be paid the same salary regardless of where they're working though. So they would indeed be more likely to get laid off, as they cost the same amount but haven't developed those in-person relationships with the decision-maker.
- yrgulation 4y agoExcuse me? I expect to be paid more because unlike on site workers i deliver more work and of higher quality. Also i play less sleazy politics and do less decision maker boot leaking.
- nsxwolf 4y agoWhy would anything besides performance and value factor into this decision? "Mary just gets more done for the money than Bob does... but I haven't seen her in awhile... Gone."
- danjoredd 4y agoThat assumes rationality, unfortunately. It would be nice if performance was the only factor in a managers decision, but we all know that managers have a tendency to prefer the employees that they see often. That being said if you were hired as a remote employee, I wouldn't worry.
- CydeWeys 4y agoIt's 100% rational from the manager's individual POV to choose to lay off someone you don't know so well vs someone you see every day in person and consider a friend.
- robertlagrant 4y agoPerformance is pretty hard to measure without resorting to gameable KPIs.
- f1shy 4y agoThere is always a "perceived performance". Once a year (typically) managers evaluate the associates; same evaluation is performed when one has to go. If seen somebody everyday plays a role, yes, maybe. But for example, 5 years ago, I worked in a team, when I was only couple of days in the office. Others every day. I saw my team manager the days I was in the office... and also at weekends, because we were friends... so... it all depends.
- robertlagrant 4y agoYep. It can help if you ask their coworkers across the business for multiple types of feedback, but it's never going to be anything close to perfect. How do you define "performance" of someone who spent time helping 5 other teams deliver with their expertise, but then didn't quite do the thing they were given to do? It's not an absolute thing, and so we shouldn't be bemoaning that it's not used enough as a measurement.
- lnsru 4y agoMy upper management wants me badly in the office. It’s 12 seat open office. These people have their own comfy offices, but work all days every week from home. What a paradox.
- musha68k 4y agohttps://youtu.be/zLQ2d89vCiw https://youtu.be/zLQ2d89vCiw
- yamtaddle 4y agoFlexibility about where and, to some degree, when/how-much, one works, plus how surveilled one is while working, is a status-related perk (and connected more broadly to social class). No surprise execs who are used to maximal freedom on those see expanding those perks to the peons as a threat to their own status. "But what if they fuck off to play golf at 2:30 PM or sneakily take a vacation to the beach without using vacation time while in fact only working part of the time for that week?" says the exec, before fucking off to play golf at 2:30 PM and then help the spouse and kids pack for for tomorrow's vacation-disguised-as-a-business-trip.
- redanddead 4y agoThat's the truth right there. My girlfriend's uncle told me over Christmas dinner, his job is to go golfing with US bank CEOs. That's how they do business! We're being scammed, and them too.
- yamtaddle 4y agoThere's even one[1] of these in the show Silicon Valley. The seasoned, solid-track-record, expert exec they bring in the show to be the "grown up" in charge as the startup begins to take off, who's out of the office messing with his horse-breeding hobby half the time. Like everything else in that show, it's not even really satire. [1] I haven't finished the show, so maybe "at least one"
- throwaway5959 4y ago
- marcosdumay 4y agoHum... You are just assuming similar competent people get on this situation a with relevant odds. What is a very odd assumption, because if a company is firing based on competence, similar competent people will get on the same bracket and both fired or kept. And no large company knows enough to fire based on personal competence anyway. So yeah, it's FUD.
- micromacrofoot 4y agoIt's a lot more complicated than that. How much more does that in-person employee cost, for example. Even with the current uncertainty there are employees choosing to change jobs rather than go to an office. Even if you freeze hiring, you need to make sure you're retaining the employees you have.
- Silverback_VII 4y ago>choosing between two similar competent ... People don't even have to similar in competence... the farther away from the headquarters you are the less influence and importance you have. common sense
- f1shy 4y agoYou are assuming a good relation... what if the guy who comes to be office happens to be dirty, or loud, or smelly, or whatever discomfort he may impose to the decision maker? What if the decision maker is a lazy manager (have never seen one!) that feels observed but this guy coming everyday to the office? Moreover, what if the manager himself, prefers to not come to the office...