7 ms·

Selling shit on the subway is illegal. The reason this man is capable of making a profit is because he has almost no competition. It has nothing to do with entr

• darien 15y ago
  On the contrary, the nyc subways are filled with these dudes "Selling candy for a basketball team" or "Trying to make some money to stay out of trouble." (Actual quotes) The competition may be slim, but there are at least a hundred people selling candy on the subway everyday.
  • gerggerg 15y ago
    And if it were actually legal, there would be more; many more. If it gets past a certain tolerance you can bet Bloomberg will fire up the ticket machine.
• joelrunyon 15y ago
  Why is it okay to break the rules in the tech world but if you do it in the NYC subway, it's cheating. Entrepreneurship is all about breaking the rules, making your own way and making things happen. The guy probably didn't have a lot set up for him in life, so instead of feeling sorry for himself, he put on his shoes, grabbed his box of candy and made it happen. Just because he's exercising his entrepreneurial spirit by doing something that's not as sexy as programming the next facebook/twitter/social "disruption" doesn't mean his attitude shouldn't be applauded. Give the guy some credit.
  • ImprovedSilence 15y ago
    Agreed, it's better than pushin crack.
    • ImprovedSilence 15y ago
      so much downvote hate these days. Quoted from the article itself: "He started selling candy in order to get out of the "hood," he says." Growing in the hood, with that kind of entrepreneurial spirit, I give him mad moral props for resorting to selling candy on the subway instead of drugs on the street. For any of you entrepreneurial types out there, I challenge you to read 50 Cent's book "From Pieces to Weight", and tell me that if you were born in the hood, and had the same aspiring drive, you wouldn't resort to selling drugs.
      • sliverstorm 15y ago
        Actually, a surprising portion of HN seems to approve of drugs. Selling heroin- fighting the good fight. Selling candy on the subway- criminal.
  • comicjk 15y ago
    He isn't breaking convention, he's just breaking the law. That law exists for a good reason - because being stuck in a confined space with a bunch of salesmen is intolerable. Does your tech startup break the law? If so, please call your local precinct and wait for the police to arrive.
    • joelrunyon 15y ago
      How many startups are currently facing legal action? Do you really want to know the answer to this question? Tons of startups are breaking the law either intentionally or purposely trying to disrupt it. I think we've established long ago that something being "legal" or "illegal" doesn't necessarily mean it's "right" or "wrong."
      • rhizome 15y ago
        Tons of startups are breaking the law either intentionally I challenge you to supply three examples.
        • a3camero 15y ago
          I don't know about "breaking the law intentionally" but here are some examples of things startups have done that other people have thought were illegal. In some of the cases people have thought that so strongly that they've filed lawsuits. Groupon selling coupons for alcohol in Massachusetts: http://articles.boston.com/2011-03-18/business/29351154_1_groupon-spokeswoman-groupon-com-daily-deal-website http://articles.boston.com/2011-03-18/business/29351154_1_gr... (here are some other suits: http://www.portfolio.com/business-news/2011/03/29/groupon-faces-multiple-lawsuits-over-daily-deal-offers-advertising/ http://www.portfolio.com/business-news/2011/03/29/groupon-fa...) Facebook not living up to privacy promises: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20111129-710865.html http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20111129-710865.html YouTube/Google not paying royalties/failing to control copyright infringement: http://paidcontent.org/article/419-music-publishers-settle-with-youtube-as-other-defendants-fight-on/ http://paidcontent.org/article/419-music-publishers-settle-w... AirBNB's operations in New York: http://www.betabeat.com/2011/05/31/airbnb-takes-manhattan-with-2k-bookings-a-night-but-many-listings-may-be-illegal/ http://www.betabeat.com/2011/05/31/airbnb-takes-manhattan-wi...
  • jorgecastillo 15y ago
    >Entrepreneurship is all about breaking the rules, making your own way and making things happen. Braking the rules is ok, braking the laws is not. So if I understand, you would consider the people, that are in the drug business, as entrepreneurs? Illegal activities are highly profitable, precisely because most people, will not participate in them, and this distorts the market.
    • burgerbrain 15y ago
      Why exactly is breaking the laws not ok in the general case? And in this particular case, why isn't it ok? He is clearly providing a service that the people are demanding.
      • RockyMcNuts 15y ago
        Have you been on the subway when a peddler, beggar, dance troupe comes through with a loud spiel? It's more like the subway version of spam. Clearly lots of people are demanding spam, right? He's providing a service that a few people* are demanding, and most people find annoying. Plus evading sales tax, creating litter, reducing rent from the legit concessionnaire, etc. If that's OK, why stop there, why shouldn't I set up a candy stand in the movie theater? *the ones who take up one seat for each butt-cheek
        • burgerbrain 15y ago
          Having commuted on the subway at one point in my life, yes. That has happened to me hundreds of times. Usually I ignored them, other times I wanted some candy and purchased it.
          • RockyMcNuts 15y ago
            well, as Emerson said, good men must not obey laws too well (probably talking about slavery). In this case, I think there are valid reasons for the law. Just because something is a fact of life doesn't mean it's desirable.
        • 15y ago
  • gerggerg 15y ago
    I don't think it's bad to break the rules in either case. He's just not an entrepreneur, and this article proposes nothing truly interesting. He's selling shit on the subway. He didn't come up with a new and interesting way to sell shit. He's just selling shit. Panhandling. The only reason he can make a profit is because it's illegal and people are nice. He's taking advantage of both. Is it better than selling crack? Without the slightest doubt. But thats a terrible metric with which to judge your surroundings.
    • burgerbrain 15y ago
      Are restaurant owners not entrepreneurs? If not, that is an overly restrictive definition. "He didn't come up with a new and interesting way to sell shit." He identified an untapped location/population, and acted on it. How is that not finding a new way to "sell shit"?
      • gerggerg 15y ago
        Untapped? Selling candy to nice people in an uncomfortable situation is an untapped market?
        • burgerbrain 15y ago
          People are buying aren't they? And I reject the suggestion that he is somehow pressuring people into buying, if you've ever been on a subway that is rather implausible.
          • jrockway 15y ago
            Some people are deathly afraid of people talking to them in public, especially if they are from a different social class. I've had people try to sell me candy on the L before. I said, "no thanks" and that was that. I imagine this is the end result of 99.99999% of interactions between people on public transportation. (Someone stole my shoes once after he asked to read my newspaper and I gave it to him. That's the 0.000001% case :)
          • 15y ago
• arnoldwh 15y ago
  Don't knock the hustle. I remember hearing about how GrubWithUs started by inserting flyers inside the free morning daily newsletters in subways (illegally) - people applauded at how "scrappy" this great startup was. Setting up lemonade stands is also illegal unless you have a permit, but nobody complains. I guess sometimes the law just isn't in your favor, and you have to actually think for yourself whether something is right or wrong.
  • gerggerg 15y ago
    I can't seem to find any information on the GrubWithUs flyers. Could you post a link? Lemonade stands don't stand to gain immense competition because of relaxing regulation.
    • arnoldwh 15y ago
      No link. They talked about it at the NYC YC event. They also talked about bootstrapping by working out of a Starbucks and getting free refills for the entire day. Pretty cool stuff. Let me ask you a quick question - what do you think about food trucks? In NYC, most of them park illegally and pay the fine as a cost of doing business. I'm sure this guy has gotten fined before, but maybe it's just a cost of doing business as well.
      • gerggerg 15y ago
        With no link we can't really enter it into the discussion. Food trucks are licensed and subject to food quality regulations.
        • massarog 15y ago
          You don't need a link. I was at the YC NYC event too and the Grubwithus guys did indeed do this.
        • rokhayakebe 15y ago
          Are you saying that if it wasn't recorded then we cannot discuss it? Obviously there are many people who have been to the event, and s/he would be a fool to make such a statement if it weren't true, specially on HN.
• Deepta 15y ago
  I'm agree with you 100% but I would like him to sell candy rather than selling drug on the street.
• jeffem 15y ago
  You're scratching the surface of a much deeper issue. Yes, a lot of people would be annoyed if they were bombarded with train salesmen. On the other hand, the fact that this man and others like him are able to bring in this kind of money shows that there's demand for their products. So if the laws were actually being effectively enforced, the market would go underserved. It seems that we're only having this discussion becuase the transit system is government-owned. Private trains, airlines, etc. have all tried to serve this market in an unobtrusive way.
  • Dylan16807 15y ago
    People buying from an insistent salesmen they can't walk away from is not necessarily a sign of demand. I'm sure there is some demand, but I strongly doubt it accounts for 100% of his business.
• jaydz 15y ago
  Also, he's not paying any taxes and is likely stealing revenue from the legal tax paying subway newsstands. The MTA needs to step up and end this.
• jcc80 15y ago
  "The reason this man is capable of making a profit is because he has almost no competition. It has nothing to do with entrepreneurship, being a good salesman, having a good idea, or really anything positive other than the giving spirit of some New Yorkers." So he's found a niche market and exploiting it. Good for him. And it's not a good idea because it was just so obvious right? Or, because some guy in a suit says it's wrong? If someone cracks down on him fine. Till then he isn't hurting anyone. You should be rooting for this guy instead of against him. That even if he gets shut down at least he had the guts to put himself out there like that and hope he finds something else if this drys up.
• igravious 15y ago
  Napster