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The first Pi was based off a failed set-top streaming box SoC that Broadcom didn't know what to do with. The original goal (remember that?) was to make it a ch

The first Pi was based off a failed set-top streaming box SoC that Broadcom didn't know what to do with. The original goal (remember that?) was to make it a cheap educational Linux system. And it was a nice idea. The cheap sticker price got it noticed compared to the other more expensive (but better supported) ARM single-board computers. And here we are. I sure as heck don't know what Broadcom's endgame is here either, because like you say they don't even answer your call if you're <100K EAU. So unlike other EVKs that can be used to rip apart and spin into real projects, you're stuck with RPi as a standalone unit. The chip shortage is hurting everyone, but at least with other SoCs you can find them from multiple sources eventually. Or use a broker if you're desparate.

jrockway 4y ago
Yup, Raspberry Pi kind of sucked the oxygen out of the Beaglebone ecosystem. Speedier and cheaper. The Beaglebone has a lot of features that hardcore embedded engineers want (real-time support, eMMC, tons of IO, good platform documentation), but the Raspberry Pi really appealed to the maker crowd. I guess the $25 price difference made a big difference? I never really understood it. I was a big Beaglebone Black supporter, but figured the winds were blowing towards the Raspberry Pi, so just started using that instead. Now I'm here with the need for several mini Linux boxes and instead I have nothing. Beaglebone Black feels outdated. Raspberry Pi is unobtainium. Unfortunate where the random walk leads.
- pclmulqdq 4y ago
  In a world where TI had been able to get a foothold with hobbyists on the beaglebone, the world might be very different. TI doesn't hate small-volume sales like Broadcom. The hobbyist market has weirdly strong network effects: we saw this with Arduino, too, which was a lot more expensive than its competitors! I assume there is a measure of influencer marketing here that old-guard tech companies didn't grasp. 10 years ago, the beagleboard was a game changer, though. They are still making beaglebones and beagleboards, both of which are cool, but they are last-generation computers with lots of useful embedded SoC features, while the Pi is a computer first.
  - jrockway 4y ago
    Yeah, TI always seemed nice to hobbyists. I think the RPi foundation was just better organized. Beaglebone always felt very scrappy. RPi feels like they have full time employees around to do all the running-the-org stuff. Well run org + OK project > OK org + great project, I suppose.
  - joezydeco 4y ago
    From my POV the companies were happy to see people experiment with their designs and SoCs but they just didn't have the resources to put the necessary amount of customer support forward. In my many argumen^H^H^Hdiscussions with RPi users here and elsewhere, the counter-argument for Pi has always been the community support is excellent. And, yes, it is. When you aren't large enough to get a TI or NXP FAE to answer your email then having a robust community is great. But it was built ground-up from all the RPi fans having the object in their hands and little else to do with it. When TI dropped OMAP I left for Freescale, now NXP. I've been developing on i.MX for well over a decade now and have really enjoyed it. Their foothold in automotive has allowed them to keep growing the line and branching it out in different ways, more so than TI or Broadcom will.
    - pclmulqdq 4y ago
      NXP does seem to be the next good vendor of ARM SoCs (i.MX and QorIQ are both pretty impressive lines). The idea of "community support" is kind of interesting - it clearly had an effect here, but I'm not so sure how they got it. I guess the foundation just made it very easy for people to talk to each other about RPi projects, while TI put you on some forum in a dark corner of their website.
      - Rediscover 4y ago
        QorIQ is seriously impressive, except for the enclosures for the official dev kits. Pop the lid and toss it in the bin - it will be much quieter.
      - joezydeco 4y ago
        NXP has been doing solid work with ARM for almost 20 years now. Their LPC line, which they had before the Moto/Freescale acquisition, is a solid workhorse set of SoCs. I've done many projects with the LPC17xx (Cortex-M3) family and they all come out pretty great. And I believe you're right about the community support. The RPi groups have been run by actual owners and enthusiasts, whereas the factory support forums in my experience have been minimally maintained with almost no interaction from anyone at the actual companies.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

jrockway 4y ago

Yup, Raspberry Pi kind of sucked the oxygen out of the Beaglebone ecosystem. Speedier and cheaper. The Beaglebone has a lot of features that hardcore embedded engineers want (real-time support, eMMC, tons of IO, good platform documentation), but the Raspberry Pi really appealed to the maker crowd. I guess the $25 price difference made a big difference? I never really understood it. I was a big Beaglebone Black supporter, but figured the winds were blowing towards the Raspberry Pi, so just started using that instead. Now I'm here with the need for several mini Linux boxes and instead I have nothing. Beaglebone Black feels outdated. Raspberry Pi is unobtainium. Unfortunate where the random walk leads.

pclmulqdq 4y ago
In a world where TI had been able to get a foothold with hobbyists on the beaglebone, the world might be very different. TI doesn't hate small-volume sales like Broadcom. The hobbyist market has weirdly strong network effects: we saw this with Arduino, too, which was a lot more expensive than its competitors! I assume there is a measure of influencer marketing here that old-guard tech companies didn't grasp. 10 years ago, the beagleboard was a game changer, though. They are still making beaglebones and beagleboards, both of which are cool, but they are last-generation computers with lots of useful embedded SoC features, while the Pi is a computer first.
- jrockway 4y ago
  Yeah, TI always seemed nice to hobbyists. I think the RPi foundation was just better organized. Beaglebone always felt very scrappy. RPi feels like they have full time employees around to do all the running-the-org stuff. Well run org + OK project > OK org + great project, I suppose.
- joezydeco 4y ago
  From my POV the companies were happy to see people experiment with their designs and SoCs but they just didn't have the resources to put the necessary amount of customer support forward. In my many argumen^H^H^Hdiscussions with RPi users here and elsewhere, the counter-argument for Pi has always been the community support is excellent. And, yes, it is. When you aren't large enough to get a TI or NXP FAE to answer your email then having a robust community is great. But it was built ground-up from all the RPi fans having the object in their hands and little else to do with it. When TI dropped OMAP I left for Freescale, now NXP. I've been developing on i.MX for well over a decade now and have really enjoyed it. Their foothold in automotive has allowed them to keep growing the line and branching it out in different ways, more so than TI or Broadcom will.
  - pclmulqdq 4y ago
    NXP does seem to be the next good vendor of ARM SoCs (i.MX and QorIQ are both pretty impressive lines). The idea of "community support" is kind of interesting - it clearly had an effect here, but I'm not so sure how they got it. I guess the foundation just made it very easy for people to talk to each other about RPi projects, while TI put you on some forum in a dark corner of their website.
    - Rediscover 4y ago
      QorIQ is seriously impressive, except for the enclosures for the official dev kits. Pop the lid and toss it in the bin - it will be much quieter.
    - joezydeco 4y ago
      NXP has been doing solid work with ARM for almost 20 years now. Their LPC line, which they had before the Moto/Freescale acquisition, is a solid workhorse set of SoCs. I've done many projects with the LPC17xx (Cortex-M3) family and they all come out pretty great. And I believe you're right about the community support. The RPi groups have been run by actual owners and enthusiasts, whereas the factory support forums in my experience have been minimally maintained with almost no interaction from anyone at the actual companies.
deleted 4y ago
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