6 ms·

A bit of a tangent, but the opening paragraph suggests that weed is now being cut with fentanyl causing death. Is this actually true? It makes absolutely no s

A bit of a tangent, but the opening paragraph suggests that weed is now being cut with fentanyl causing death. Is this actually true? It makes absolutely no sense at all, unless the goal of whoever is doing it actually is to kill people. Cutting heroin or other opiates with Fentanyl can make sense (from a dealer's point of view), because it is extremely potent but not much more expensive than the desired drug -- so you can mix a tiny amount of fentanyl with loads of fillers and then cut that into the actual drug, and your buyer will probably never know. Until you screw up and put a tiny bit too much fentanyl in and then lots of your customers die. But this model, however fucked up, makes sense. Cutting things like weed with fentanyl truly makes no sense to me at all except as a fucked up way to murder people.

JshWright 4y ago
Haven't read the article (can't be bothered to work around the paywall), but the fentanyl scare is driven in large part by "copaganda". Cops treat fentanyl like some sort of boogeyman (to the point that they have panic attacks when they think they might have had fentanyl somewhere in their presence, get "revived" with narcan, and further perpetuate the myth that fentanyl is some mythical thing that can kill you just by looking at). This isn't to say that fentanyl (and opiates in general) isn't a huge problem in the US (I couldn't possibly count the number of legit narcan wakeups I've done over the years), but fentanyl in particular is really prone to exaggerated claims by law enforcement that don't pass the sniff (or snort?) test.
- boringg 4y ago
  I don't know - fentanyl has done some serious damage to the population. I would probably disagree with what you are saying and how you are dismissive/minimizing its damage.
  - bigyikes 4y ago
    The person you’re replying to is a paramedic who claims to have actively stopped people from overdosing. I think they have a pretty good idea of how damaging it can be.
  - dtjb 4y ago
    They fully acknowledged the danger to the general public. That can be true while also acknowledging the hysteria [1] present in many law enforcement agencies. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/13/magazine/police-fentanyl-exposure-videos.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/13/magazine/police-fentanyl-...
    - boringg 4y ago
      Fair hysteria isn't helpful. That said there's been a lot of fentanyl deaths and it ain't making any communities better off having it. It's cheap, easy to get and the cartels can easily justify losing people to selling large batches. Only way they can stop the cartels continue to get more of a foothold is by decreasing demand of the product. Not saying their approach is a good approach but I understand why they would try it.
  - jccalhoun 4y ago
    There are videos of police officers falling to the ground and claiming it was because they said they TOUCHED something laced with fentanyl. As far as I have read that isn't possible.
    - meandave 4y ago
      Here is a video of me touching fentanyl and not getting high or collapsing https://www.instagram.com/tv/CaDE8XblaKy/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y= https://www.instagram.com/tv/CaDE8XblaKy/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y...
    - boringg 4y ago
      Have a heard time believing this statement.
      - JshWright 4y ago
        Believing which statement?
- pGuitar 4y ago
  Lethal dose of fentanyl VS heroin VS carfentanyl: https://www.scripps.edu/news-and-events/press-room/2021/20210203-janda-carfentanil.html https://www.scripps.edu/news-and-events/press-room/2021/2021... You need a very precise scale to measure those quantities...
- pessimizer 4y ago
  It was wonderful that we had the crying, puking, fainting fentanyl cops during the time that Havana Syndrome was being pushed. When you accused Havana Syndrome sufferers of mass hysteria, Authorities would start explaining to you like you were a child how very important and very professional the sufferers are, and how it's just like not believing women when you don't believe that they were brain damaged by secret, very quiet, commie sound ray guns. You could reply with a video of a fentanyl cop.
chimeracoder 4y ago
Most fentanyl in non-opiates (such as cocaine) is the result of accidental contamination, not intentional cutting. It happens late in the supply chain: a dealer sells two different drugs, uses the same scale for both, and doesn't completely sanitize them in between, so you get a few remaining "crumbs" or residue of fentanyl accidentally mixed in. This is an issue with fentanyl because it's so potent that a small amount which would be a non-issue for opiate users can easily kill a person with no tolerance for the drug. It's also dangerous because, when mixed with stimulants like cocaine, the overdose doesn't necessarily happen immediately - the stimulants will briefly mask the effects of the opiates, raising the heart rate, but then they'll wear off and the opiates will suppress breathing to the point of death. Because the effects aren't always immediate, the drug user (or those around them) don't connect the person's behavior to the drug use, so they don't always recognize it as an opiate overdose requiring immediate emergency attention and Narcan. Source: used to work for a nonprofit that conducted harm reduction education training
- codefreeordie 4y ago
  That's interesting, and it does make sense -- if you're not using opiates, tiny residues of fentanyl can be very dangerous. You would think that dealers would be more careful than that -- killing your customers is bad for business -- but it makes way more sense than intentionally cutting fentanyl into pot.
boomboomsubban 4y ago
A little bit of searching shows no documented evidence of fentanyl mixed with weed. The supposed reason is dealers trying to get their weed users addicted, but that doesn't make a ton of sense as they'd have to either fess up or be the only weed dealer someone knows. Plus, I'm not positive the temperature of burning marijuana would do anything to fentanyl or if the temps would destroy it.
- cronix 4y ago
  You can smoke fentanyl the same way you freebase cocaine, with a lighter and tinfoil or small pipe.
  - boomboomsubban 4y ago
    Which is not how you smoke marijuana. I edited my post to indicate I'm not sure if it's too low a temp to be activated or so high it destroys it.
    - tayo42 4y ago
      maybe marijuana is a catch all for all thc methods. not to much different between a dab rib and a meth pipe when you simplify it. also dmt needs to be vaporized but a common way to take it is to fill a pipe with weed flower and put the dmt on top, then light it. it does work...
    - cronix 4y ago
      > with a lighter and tinfoil or small pipe. >> Which is not how you smoke marijuana. People don't use a pipe to smoke marijuana? Here's a NIH paper on less people injecting fentanyl and other opiods in favor of smoking fentanyl. I think you can conclude that smoking it is an adequate delivery system and doesn't destroy it, just like freebasing cocaine. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34482046/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34482046/
      - boomboomsubban 4y ago
bergenty 4y ago
My conspiracy theory based on absolutely nothing is this is a way for the government to get everyone off all drugs. Create enough doubt in everyone’s mind that they stop doing it. Worked on me, I do coke about once a year but not any more, there’s a pretty high chance of dying.
- pessimizer 4y ago
  The US government murdered, by some estimates, around 10K people by poisoning alcohol during prohibition.
  - gruez 4y ago
    Did they poison alcohol that they knew were destined for human consumption (eg. they found some moonshiner's shack, broke in, poisoned the alcohol, and then left)? Or did they poison industrial alcohols not meant for human consumption? I can see how the former would be murder, but not the latter.
    - kasey_junk 4y ago
      They added poison to industrial alcohols because they knew it was being used by people for consumption.
      - salawat 4y ago
        The industry whitewashing language is "creating abuse-resistant/deterrant formulations". Sounds great on paper, but the mechanism is generally some variant of "if you do abusive behavior with this you'll die or suffer some other health threatening complication. In other words, poisoning.
        codefreeordie 4y ago
        In other news, many opioid pain medicines are only available in formulations mixed with acetaminophen, as a "deterrent" to abuse, because acetaminophen is acutely toxic in moderately large doses.

JshWright 4y ago

Haven't read the article (can't be bothered to work around the paywall), but the fentanyl scare is driven in large part by "copaganda". Cops treat fentanyl like some sort of boogeyman (to the point that they have panic attacks when they think they might have had fentanyl somewhere in their presence, get "revived" with narcan, and further perpetuate the myth that fentanyl is some mythical thing that can kill you just by looking at). This isn't to say that fentanyl (and opiates in general) isn't a huge problem in the US (I couldn't possibly count the number of legit narcan wakeups I've done over the years), but fentanyl in particular is really prone to exaggerated claims by law enforcement that don't pass the sniff (or snort?) test.

boringg 4y ago
I don't know - fentanyl has done some serious damage to the population. I would probably disagree with what you are saying and how you are dismissive/minimizing its damage.
- bigyikes 4y ago
  The person you’re replying to is a paramedic who claims to have actively stopped people from overdosing. I think they have a pretty good idea of how damaging it can be.
- dtjb 4y ago
  They fully acknowledged the danger to the general public. That can be true while also acknowledging the hysteria [1] present in many law enforcement agencies. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/13/magazine/police-fentanyl-exposure-videos.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/13/magazine/police-fentanyl-...
  - boringg 4y ago
    Fair hysteria isn't helpful. That said there's been a lot of fentanyl deaths and it ain't making any communities better off having it. It's cheap, easy to get and the cartels can easily justify losing people to selling large batches. Only way they can stop the cartels continue to get more of a foothold is by decreasing demand of the product. Not saying their approach is a good approach but I understand why they would try it.
- jccalhoun 4y ago
  There are videos of police officers falling to the ground and claiming it was because they said they TOUCHED something laced with fentanyl. As far as I have read that isn't possible.
  - meandave 4y ago
    Here is a video of me touching fentanyl and not getting high or collapsing https://www.instagram.com/tv/CaDE8XblaKy/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y= https://www.instagram.com/tv/CaDE8XblaKy/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y...
  - boringg 4y ago
    Have a heard time believing this statement.
    - JshWright 4y ago
      Believing which statement?
pGuitar 4y ago
Lethal dose of fentanyl VS heroin VS carfentanyl: https://www.scripps.edu/news-and-events/press-room/2021/20210203-janda-carfentanil.html https://www.scripps.edu/news-and-events/press-room/2021/2021... You need a very precise scale to measure those quantities...
pessimizer 4y ago
It was wonderful that we had the crying, puking, fainting fentanyl cops during the time that Havana Syndrome was being pushed. When you accused Havana Syndrome sufferers of mass hysteria, Authorities would start explaining to you like you were a child how very important and very professional the sufferers are, and how it's just like not believing women when you don't believe that they were brain damaged by secret, very quiet, commie sound ray guns. You could reply with a video of a fentanyl cop.

chimeracoder 4y ago

Most fentanyl in non-opiates (such as cocaine) is the result of accidental contamination, not intentional cutting. It happens late in the supply chain: a dealer sells two different drugs, uses the same scale for both, and doesn't completely sanitize them in between, so you get a few remaining "crumbs" or residue of fentanyl accidentally mixed in. This is an issue with fentanyl because it's so potent that a small amount which would be a non-issue for opiate users can easily kill a person with no tolerance for the drug. It's also dangerous because, when mixed with stimulants like cocaine, the overdose doesn't necessarily happen immediately - the stimulants will briefly mask the effects of the opiates, raising the heart rate, but then they'll wear off and the opiates will suppress breathing to the point of death. Because the effects aren't always immediate, the drug user (or those around them) don't connect the person's behavior to the drug use, so they don't always recognize it as an opiate overdose requiring immediate emergency attention and Narcan. Source: used to work for a nonprofit that conducted harm reduction education training

codefreeordie 4y ago
That's interesting, and it does make sense -- if you're not using opiates, tiny residues of fentanyl can be very dangerous. You would think that dealers would be more careful than that -- killing your customers is bad for business -- but it makes way more sense than intentionally cutting fentanyl into pot.

boomboomsubban 4y ago

A little bit of searching shows no documented evidence of fentanyl mixed with weed. The supposed reason is dealers trying to get their weed users addicted, but that doesn't make a ton of sense as they'd have to either fess up or be the only weed dealer someone knows. Plus, I'm not positive the temperature of burning marijuana would do anything to fentanyl or if the temps would destroy it.

cronix 4y ago
You can smoke fentanyl the same way you freebase cocaine, with a lighter and tinfoil or small pipe.
- boomboomsubban 4y ago
  Which is not how you smoke marijuana. I edited my post to indicate I'm not sure if it's too low a temp to be activated or so high it destroys it.
  - tayo42 4y ago
    maybe marijuana is a catch all for all thc methods. not to much different between a dab rib and a meth pipe when you simplify it. also dmt needs to be vaporized but a common way to take it is to fill a pipe with weed flower and put the dmt on top, then light it. it does work...
  - cronix 4y ago
    > with a lighter and tinfoil or small pipe. >> Which is not how you smoke marijuana. People don't use a pipe to smoke marijuana? Here's a NIH paper on less people injecting fentanyl and other opiods in favor of smoking fentanyl. I think you can conclude that smoking it is an adequate delivery system and doesn't destroy it, just like freebasing cocaine. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34482046/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34482046/
    - boomboomsubban 4y ago

bergenty 4y ago

My conspiracy theory based on absolutely nothing is this is a way for the government to get everyone off all drugs. Create enough doubt in everyone’s mind that they stop doing it. Worked on me, I do coke about once a year but not any more, there’s a pretty high chance of dying.

pessimizer 4y ago
The US government murdered, by some estimates, around 10K people by poisoning alcohol during prohibition.
- gruez 4y ago
  Did they poison alcohol that they knew were destined for human consumption (eg. they found some moonshiner's shack, broke in, poisoned the alcohol, and then left)? Or did they poison industrial alcohols not meant for human consumption? I can see how the former would be murder, but not the latter.
  - kasey_junk 4y ago
    They added poison to industrial alcohols because they knew it was being used by people for consumption.
    - salawat 4y ago
      The industry whitewashing language is "creating abuse-resistant/deterrant formulations". Sounds great on paper, but the mechanism is generally some variant of "if you do abusive behavior with this you'll die or suffer some other health threatening complication. In other words, poisoning.
      - codefreeordie 4y ago
        In other news, many opioid pain medicines are only available in formulations mixed with acetaminophen, as a "deterrent" to abuse, because acetaminophen is acutely toxic in moderately large doses.