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My professional codebase actually really upsets me - sometimes I dread going on holidays purely because I know when I return to it, it’ll take me a week to get

My professional codebase actually really upsets me - sometimes I dread going on holidays purely because I know when I return to it, it’ll take me a week to get over the feeling of just wanting to quit. It’s really nice to see this post put out in words what makes me happy when I program.

hrbf 4y ago
Wouldn’t the solution be to seek more of the rewarding parts of programming and re-evaluating exactly how destructive to your mental health working in that “professional” environment really is?
- F2hP18Foam 4y ago
  I agree with you, but it's easier said than done. Especially if you're already depressed, drudging forward can seem like the path of least resistance, even though it often isn't.
  - hrbf 4y ago
    No doubt. Depression is debilitating in so many subtle as well as visible ways. As parent is currently the most-upvoted comment, I believe it important to ask the obvious questions to maybe start a conversation.
- nicbou 4y ago
  People have bills to pay, and programming is one of the more acceptable ways to do it.
  - hrbf 4y ago
    That’s a superficial argument. Is permanently exposing yourself to a level of emotional stress that results in a semi-permanent depressive state really worth the money? I’d argue that if you have the skills to code, you are well suited for other areas as well, depending on your willingness to adapt. If you’re already depressed it’s harder to see alternatives and easier to feel trapped though.
    - tartoran 4y ago
      > I’d argue that if you have the skills to code, you are well suited for other areas as well, depending on your willingness to adapt. Could you please state what those are?
      - hansel_der 4y ago
        struggling with this question as well. obiously it is highly dependent on the individual, but in the end, it depends on the boss making/getting the connection and not be like "nah, but i relly could need an IT guy"
      - hrbf 4y ago
        If you code at a professional level, you are likely of above average intelligence. You are able to efficiently reason about complex systems to some degree. Those two skills alone qualify you for many jobs, especially when you’re willing to learn. What those are depends entirely on your interests and further skills. Often, looking into a completely different direction is helpful. Ask yourself what you enjoy doing, apart from programming and computers. It could be cooking, gardening, talking to people, writing, teaching, whatever. Something that is not stressful for you to do. Something your friends maybe told you at one time or the other you’re good at without having to put great effort in it. Something that doesn’t drain you if you’re doing it for extended periods of time. Often that’s where you can find what’s truly important to you and your inherent skills are. Go from there. Let yourself be inspired. Those could be technical or entirely apart from what you’re currently doing. When you start looking into unconventional jobs, you’ll be astonished what kind of work exists within reach. It often just looks like it isn’t because you’d have to leave your comfort zone to pursue them. That’s the issue with comfort zones: even if you feel like shit, it’s a familiar feeling. As humans, we tend to go with what we know, even if it leads to constantly feeling terrible. This way, we can at least make sense of what surrounds us. Going into the unknown is scary, sometimes it feels like mortal danger. If you can afford it, take a sabbatical to clear your head. If you have a partner, talk to them about what you’re going through.
        throwaway1649 4y ago
_Algernon_ 4y ago
This is me every time I have to work with react, and that's with toy projects in my web development course. Can't imagine how hellish it is to work with a mature, half a decade old big React code base.
- mumblemumble 4y ago
  From what I've seen, you might not need to worry much about that. React codebases seem get rewritten every 3-4 years.
- idontknowifican 4y ago
  react codebases at size are more or less department wide passive aggressive blog posts (see slack or any comment section on a changeset) masquerading as jira tickets and agile meetings
KronisLV 4y ago
> My professional codebase actually really upsets me - sometimes I dread going on holidays purely because I know when I return to it, it’ll take me a week to get over the feeling of just wanting to quit. This is pretty much the exact set of circumstances that I find myself in, to the point of wanting to write a webapp in a weekend or two, that'd let me keep a log of when and why I wanted to submit my resignation, with descriptions/images and so on. It is also kind of why I have a slightly ranty section on my blog, that attempts to document the interesting ways how the variety of software that I've used can fail (either in the literal sense, or just with how it hinders my attempts to get things done), called "Everything is Broken": https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken I just realize that there are so many "broken" things out there, that I literally don't have enough time to write everything down - e.g. describing how hard exporting data from an Oracle instance and then re-creating a similar setup inside of a local Oracle XE container was, with everything that broke along the way (text encoding, export formats, SQLPlus refusing to read files with empty lines, SQLPlus having a problem with the SQL Developer export format, there not being easy to use CLI exporters for Oracle data, there being problems with the init scripts of the Oracle XE 18 images, there being problems with certain DDL being exported but refusing to be imported, certain features that are not available in XE, tablespaces not being automatically extended by default) all just so I could test applications locally with decent performance. Of course, there are also certain behaviors or mindsets that result in the experience with certain codebases becoming miserable; I'd also like to write more about how to develop software for a more positive outcome, so props to the author for expressing her thoughts along those lines!
renewedrebecca 4y ago
I had this is a huge way with my previous employer. Everything about the code base was terrible, every choice that could be made along the way was the wrong one. Even the (CVS) tagging strategy for releases was just horrible. I really dreaded getting up in the morning because I knew the entire day was going to be a slog through the mud of bad design and worse code. I'm way happier now, working for a company that has thoughtful people doing the bulk of the design work.

hrbf 4y ago

Wouldn’t the solution be to seek more of the rewarding parts of programming and re-evaluating exactly how destructive to your mental health working in that “professional” environment really is?

F2hP18Foam 4y ago
I agree with you, but it's easier said than done. Especially if you're already depressed, drudging forward can seem like the path of least resistance, even though it often isn't.
- hrbf 4y ago
  No doubt. Depression is debilitating in so many subtle as well as visible ways. As parent is currently the most-upvoted comment, I believe it important to ask the obvious questions to maybe start a conversation.
nicbou 4y ago
People have bills to pay, and programming is one of the more acceptable ways to do it.
- hrbf 4y ago
  That’s a superficial argument. Is permanently exposing yourself to a level of emotional stress that results in a semi-permanent depressive state really worth the money? I’d argue that if you have the skills to code, you are well suited for other areas as well, depending on your willingness to adapt. If you’re already depressed it’s harder to see alternatives and easier to feel trapped though.
  - tartoran 4y ago
    > I’d argue that if you have the skills to code, you are well suited for other areas as well, depending on your willingness to adapt. Could you please state what those are?
    - hansel_der 4y ago
      struggling with this question as well. obiously it is highly dependent on the individual, but in the end, it depends on the boss making/getting the connection and not be like "nah, but i relly could need an IT guy"
    - hrbf 4y ago
      If you code at a professional level, you are likely of above average intelligence. You are able to efficiently reason about complex systems to some degree. Those two skills alone qualify you for many jobs, especially when you’re willing to learn. What those are depends entirely on your interests and further skills. Often, looking into a completely different direction is helpful. Ask yourself what you enjoy doing, apart from programming and computers. It could be cooking, gardening, talking to people, writing, teaching, whatever. Something that is not stressful for you to do. Something your friends maybe told you at one time or the other you’re good at without having to put great effort in it. Something that doesn’t drain you if you’re doing it for extended periods of time. Often that’s where you can find what’s truly important to you and your inherent skills are. Go from there. Let yourself be inspired. Those could be technical or entirely apart from what you’re currently doing. When you start looking into unconventional jobs, you’ll be astonished what kind of work exists within reach. It often just looks like it isn’t because you’d have to leave your comfort zone to pursue them. That’s the issue with comfort zones: even if you feel like shit, it’s a familiar feeling. As humans, we tend to go with what we know, even if it leads to constantly feeling terrible. This way, we can at least make sense of what surrounds us. Going into the unknown is scary, sometimes it feels like mortal danger. If you can afford it, take a sabbatical to clear your head. If you have a partner, talk to them about what you’re going through.
      - throwaway1649 4y ago

_Algernon_ 4y ago

This is me every time I have to work with react, and that's with toy projects in my web development course. Can't imagine how hellish it is to work with a mature, half a decade old big React code base.

mumblemumble 4y ago
From what I've seen, you might not need to worry much about that. React codebases seem get rewritten every 3-4 years.
idontknowifican 4y ago
react codebases at size are more or less department wide passive aggressive blog posts (see slack or any comment section on a changeset) masquerading as jira tickets and agile meetings

KronisLV 4y ago

> My professional codebase actually really upsets me - sometimes I dread going on holidays purely because I know when I return to it, it’ll take me a week to get over the feeling of just wanting to quit. This is pretty much the exact set of circumstances that I find myself in, to the point of wanting to write a webapp in a weekend or two, that'd let me keep a log of when and why I wanted to submit my resignation, with descriptions/images and so on. It is also kind of why I have a slightly ranty section on my blog, that attempts to document the interesting ways how the variety of software that I've used can fail (either in the literal sense, or just with how it hinders my attempts to get things done), called "Everything is Broken": https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken I just realize that there are so many "broken" things out there, that I literally don't have enough time to write everything down - e.g. describing how hard exporting data from an Oracle instance and then re-creating a similar setup inside of a local Oracle XE container was, with everything that broke along the way (text encoding, export formats, SQLPlus refusing to read files with empty lines, SQLPlus having a problem with the SQL Developer export format, there not being easy to use CLI exporters for Oracle data, there being problems with the init scripts of the Oracle XE 18 images, there being problems with certain DDL being exported but refusing to be imported, certain features that are not available in XE, tablespaces not being automatically extended by default) all just so I could test applications locally with decent performance. Of course, there are also certain behaviors or mindsets that result in the experience with certain codebases becoming miserable; I'd also like to write more about how to develop software for a more positive outcome, so props to the author for expressing her thoughts along those lines!

renewedrebecca 4y ago

I had this is a huge way with my previous employer. Everything about the code base was terrible, every choice that could be made along the way was the wrong one. Even the (CVS) tagging strategy for releases was just horrible. I really dreaded getting up in the morning because I knew the entire day was going to be a slog through the mud of bad design and worse code. I'm way happier now, working for a company that has thoughtful people doing the bulk of the design work.