10 ms·

Putin annexes four regions of Ukraine in major escalation of Russia’s war

IYasha 4y ago
Since when return equals to annexation? )
wrp 4y ago
The article and comments so far miss what I believe is the main point of the annexation. Changing the legal status of that region vis-à-vis the Russian state expands Putin's executive powers in the conduct of the war.
- rasz 4y ago
  Yes. https://www.wipo.int/edocs/lexdocs/laws/en/ru/ru080en.pdf https://www.wipo.int/edocs/lexdocs/laws/en/ru/ru080en.pdf The Criminal Code Of The Russian Federation : Article 353. Planning, Preparing, Unleashing, or Waging on Aggressive War 1. Planning, preparing, or unleashing an aggressive war Shall be punishable by deprivation of liberty for a term of seven to fifteen years. 2. Waging an aggressive war, Shall be punishable by deprivation of liberty for a term of 10 to 20 years.
doubtingtom 4y ago
[flagged]
ugjka 4y ago
Those particular regions were Ukraine's industrial "powerhouse". They are also rich with untapped oil and gas fields. No wonder Zelensky won't give up. Now Putin's game will be to take Odessa to turn Ukraine into a land locked country which basically kills the whole economy
- egfx 4y ago
  They’ll never take Odessa.
  - ugjka 4y ago
    I hope so, but remember that chemical and tactical nuclear weapons still haven't been used...
    - abudabi123 4y ago
      Would the mirror image of U.S.'s Curtis LeMay in Russia choose to bomb to the West or East of the dividing line in the mind of James Baker when Michael Gorbachev's Soviet Union came to an historic end? And? France takes revenge...
    - anonAndOn 4y ago
      The world's largest military is prepared to neutralize all nuclear threats as soon as the first bomb goes off. It's not hyperbole to suggest that much of the western Russian military infrastructure (Army, Navy and AF) would be eliminated within days. Remember, NATO is only giving UA the small weapons and Russia can't even defend against those.
      - blub 4y ago
        Yours reads like a comment that even the NATO propaganda department would be too embarrassed to attach their name to. In a nuclear conflict between the US and Russia, Europe would be wiped out. UK, France, Germany, Italy and other countries hosting nuclear weapons will be certainly annihilated. Poland, the Baltics, Finland, Romania, etc will probably be nuked out of spite and whatever’s left will wither under a radioactive cloud. Even the US “win” means being hit by hundreds of nuclear weapons. Those claiming that nuclear war can be won are just suicidal in a very contorted way.
      - apostacy 4y ago
        > The world's largest military is prepared to neutralize all nuclear threats as soon as the first bomb goes off. So in other words, you are rooting for WWIII to start. Does anyone seriously think that NATO would be able to completely neutralize Russia's nuclear capability before they get a single ICBM launched? Warmongers in the Pentagon have been trying to start a "winnable" nuclear war since the 1960s. Perhaps we can minimize casualties to only a few tens of millions on our side, if we are lucky. London, New York and Paris have multiple ballistic missiles aimed at them from different sites (that we even know about). Are you so confident that every single missile could be intercepted? Is Ukraine worth the risk? Russia has been preparing for this for a very long time. Even if we shoot down every one of their bombers and nuke every one of their silos, they have a fleet of nuclear submarines waiting to destroy our population centers. Only a complete psychopath would continue to escalate things at this point.
- O__________O 4y ago
  Agree, not only that, but Belarus’ leader at one point made a nationally televised presentation, which appeared to show plans to invade Moldova; possible their plans have changed, it was disinformation, etc. Google to find examples of the map and related press coverage: https://www.google.com/search?q=belarus+moldova+map+invasion https://www.google.com/search?q=belarus+moldova+map+invasion
  - ugjka 4y ago
    Transnistria will welcome Russians with open arms and Moldavians have no army basically
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - heneryville 4y ago
      This claim sounds vaguely familiar...
      - ugjka 4y ago
        You just don't know history... Transnistria exists because Moldova didn't have and still have no resources to fight off Russian separatists in their own country.
    - marshray 4y ago
      Lol, Russia has a couple thousand soldiers in Moldova who haven't received a single planeload of resupply in years. If they ever actually tried to threaten they would find Moldovan, Ukranian, and/or NATO forces responding very quickly. We'll get around to kicking them out eventually.
- marshray 4y ago
  "They are also rich with untapped oil and gas fields. No wonder Zelensky won't give up." Alaska is also rich with untapped oil and gas fields. No wonder Biden won't give it up.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - the_only_law 4y ago
    Wait who’s attacking Alaska?
    - marshray 4y ago
      Russian parliament (Duma) members have openly proposed it on official state television.
      - the_only_law 4y ago
        That would be an interesting suicide.
  - avmich 4y ago
    Both true. I guess?..
O__________O 4y ago
Related: Russian-occupied territories - https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian-occupied_territories https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian-occupied_territories Annexation of Southern and Eastern Ukraine - https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Southern_and_Eastern_Ukraine https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Southern_and_Easter... Annexation of Crimea by the Russian Federation - https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Crimea_by_the_Russian_Federation https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Crimea_by_the_Russi...
sorokod 4y ago
Kyiv applies for Nato membership https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2022/sep/30/russia-ukraine-war-live-news-biden-and-zelenskiy-reject-expected-annexations-ahead-of-putin-speech https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2022/sep/30/russia-uk... Turbulent times ahead.
- IAmGraydon 4y ago
  This is nothing more than theater. They literally cannot join NATO with an active war going on.
- kobalsky 4y ago
  The consensus was that it wouldn't be accepted, did this change?
  - sorokod 4y ago
    Don't know about consensus but this may amplify tensions within NATO. May even create alternative aliances e.g. Baltic States + Ukraine + Poland
    - gus_massa 4y ago
      Countries with nuclear weapons in Nato: 3 [1] Countries with nuclear weapons in Baltic States + Ukraine + Poland: 0 [1] I still can't believe Germany has no secret nuclear weapon program.
      - highwaylights 4y ago
        Countries with nuclear weapons in Nato: Enough. I'd also go further and say that the world makes fairly extensive efforts to understand who has nuclear weapons and how many, but that doesn't cover all WMD's. I have no idea what kind of strategic theater-level biological weapons exist in the world, but I imagine it's more than zero.
      - jacooper 4y ago
        The German military is a joke, so its no surprise they have no nukes. And since they have an incredible amount of US bases, the US won't let them have any nukes, no matter what.
belter 4y ago
On the same day of the annexation of Sudetenland... - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munich_Agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munich_Agreement
- IAmGraydon 4y ago
  You know…I’m not one to believe in the metaphysical, but the parallels are getting kind of creepy. On the other hand, when you believe something about Russia, always ask yourself if you believe it because they want you to. They are master manipulators. It’s very possible they planned the parallels to WWII to scare the world into thinking this too will erupt into a World War.
  - simonblack 4y ago
    <grin> Every day is an anniversary of some event or another. If you keep thinking about what event happened on this day many years ago and what parallels it portends in today's world, you'd go gaga. 1551 – Sue Takafusa, a retainer of the Ōuchi clan in western Japan, led a coup against the daimyō Ōuchi Yoshitaka, leading to the latter's forced suicide. Yep. Japan's government gonna collapse today.
    - Scea91 4y ago
      Annexation of Sudetenland is not just any event. It's an event to which Russia-Ukraine situation has been compared over and over again.
  - foverzar 4y ago
    > They are master manipulators. Eheheh, eah, sure "master manipulators" without a shred of marketing talent.
- Michelangelo11 4y ago
  WOW.
- IdealeZahlen 4y ago
  What a terrifying déjà vu.
lakomen 4y ago
- lakomen 4y ago
tibbydudeza 4y ago
Well they are getting pummeled in Lyman and the new batch of conscripts (mobiks) are untrained and sent straight to the front - guess they think using WW2 Soviet tactics will work again.
AnimalMuppet 4y ago
Let me make sure I've got this right. Russia is annexing these four regions. (I presume the "regions" have formal boundaries, like a US state or a UK county.) Russia is annexing them because they voted to be annexed. But Russia doesn't currently control all of those regions, so the rest have to be "liberated". But the parts of the regions that Ukraine control didn't vote to join Russia. The BS meter is reading off the charts on this one...
- jakubadamw 4y ago
  They didn't vote to be annexed. Ticking a checkbox on a ballot with armed soldiers behind your back is not voting. Any referendum carried out by an occupying force and followed by an annexation is against international law, specifically Article 47 of the Fourth Geneva Convention, not to mention the UN Charter.
  - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
    Sure. But even if you think that the referendum was fair, unforced, and valid (which I don't), even then Russia is doing something bogus, because the rest of the regions didn't vote to be annexed.
    - type0 4y ago
      But the tragedy of situation is that it's enough for most Russians to believe it's legit,
      - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
        Wow, are you an optimist. The real tragedy is the war(s) this is going to start over the next several hundred years.
  - foverzar 4y ago
    > Ticking a checkbox on a ballot with armed soldiers behind your back is not voting. > Any referendum carried out by an occupying force and followed by an annexation is against international law, specifically Article 47 of the Fourth Geneva Convention, not to mention the UN Charter There is already a legal precedent with Kosovo, which at the very least means that the global community accepts voting "with armed soldiers behind your back".

Since when return equals to annexation? )

wrp 4y ago

The article and comments so far miss what I believe is the main point of the annexation. Changing the legal status of that region vis-à-vis the Russian state expands Putin's executive powers in the conduct of the war.

rasz 4y ago
Yes. https://www.wipo.int/edocs/lexdocs/laws/en/ru/ru080en.pdf https://www.wipo.int/edocs/lexdocs/laws/en/ru/ru080en.pdf The Criminal Code Of The Russian Federation : Article 353. Planning, Preparing, Unleashing, or Waging on Aggressive War 1. Planning, preparing, or unleashing an aggressive war Shall be punishable by deprivation of liberty for a term of seven to fifteen years. 2. Waging an aggressive war, Shall be punishable by deprivation of liberty for a term of 10 to 20 years.

doubtingtom 4y ago

[flagged]

ugjka 4y ago

Those particular regions were Ukraine's industrial "powerhouse". They are also rich with untapped oil and gas fields. No wonder Zelensky won't give up. Now Putin's game will be to take Odessa to turn Ukraine into a land locked country which basically kills the whole economy

egfx 4y ago
They’ll never take Odessa.
- ugjka 4y ago
  I hope so, but remember that chemical and tactical nuclear weapons still haven't been used...
  - abudabi123 4y ago
    Would the mirror image of U.S.'s Curtis LeMay in Russia choose to bomb to the West or East of the dividing line in the mind of James Baker when Michael Gorbachev's Soviet Union came to an historic end? And? France takes revenge...
  - anonAndOn 4y ago
    The world's largest military is prepared to neutralize all nuclear threats as soon as the first bomb goes off. It's not hyperbole to suggest that much of the western Russian military infrastructure (Army, Navy and AF) would be eliminated within days. Remember, NATO is only giving UA the small weapons and Russia can't even defend against those.
    - blub 4y ago
      Yours reads like a comment that even the NATO propaganda department would be too embarrassed to attach their name to. In a nuclear conflict between the US and Russia, Europe would be wiped out. UK, France, Germany, Italy and other countries hosting nuclear weapons will be certainly annihilated. Poland, the Baltics, Finland, Romania, etc will probably be nuked out of spite and whatever’s left will wither under a radioactive cloud. Even the US “win” means being hit by hundreds of nuclear weapons. Those claiming that nuclear war can be won are just suicidal in a very contorted way.
    - apostacy 4y ago
      > The world's largest military is prepared to neutralize all nuclear threats as soon as the first bomb goes off. So in other words, you are rooting for WWIII to start. Does anyone seriously think that NATO would be able to completely neutralize Russia's nuclear capability before they get a single ICBM launched? Warmongers in the Pentagon have been trying to start a "winnable" nuclear war since the 1960s. Perhaps we can minimize casualties to only a few tens of millions on our side, if we are lucky. London, New York and Paris have multiple ballistic missiles aimed at them from different sites (that we even know about). Are you so confident that every single missile could be intercepted? Is Ukraine worth the risk? Russia has been preparing for this for a very long time. Even if we shoot down every one of their bombers and nuke every one of their silos, they have a fleet of nuclear submarines waiting to destroy our population centers. Only a complete psychopath would continue to escalate things at this point.
O__________O 4y ago
Agree, not only that, but Belarus’ leader at one point made a nationally televised presentation, which appeared to show plans to invade Moldova; possible their plans have changed, it was disinformation, etc. Google to find examples of the map and related press coverage: https://www.google.com/search?q=belarus+moldova+map+invasion https://www.google.com/search?q=belarus+moldova+map+invasion
- ugjka 4y ago
  Transnistria will welcome Russians with open arms and Moldavians have no army basically
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - heneryville 4y ago
    This claim sounds vaguely familiar...
    - ugjka 4y ago
      You just don't know history... Transnistria exists because Moldova didn't have and still have no resources to fight off Russian separatists in their own country.
  - marshray 4y ago
    Lol, Russia has a couple thousand soldiers in Moldova who haven't received a single planeload of resupply in years. If they ever actually tried to threaten they would find Moldovan, Ukranian, and/or NATO forces responding very quickly. We'll get around to kicking them out eventually.
marshray 4y ago
"They are also rich with untapped oil and gas fields. No wonder Zelensky won't give up." Alaska is also rich with untapped oil and gas fields. No wonder Biden won't give it up.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- the_only_law 4y ago
  Wait who’s attacking Alaska?
  - marshray 4y ago
    Russian parliament (Duma) members have openly proposed it on official state television.
    - the_only_law 4y ago
      That would be an interesting suicide.
- avmich 4y ago
  Both true. I guess?..

O__________O 4y ago

Related: Russian-occupied territories - https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian-occupied_territories https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian-occupied_territories Annexation of Southern and Eastern Ukraine - https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Southern_and_Eastern_Ukraine https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Southern_and_Easter... Annexation of Crimea by the Russian Federation - https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Crimea_by_the_Russian_Federation https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Crimea_by_the_Russi...

sorokod 4y ago

Kyiv applies for Nato membership https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2022/sep/30/russia-ukraine-war-live-news-biden-and-zelenskiy-reject-expected-annexations-ahead-of-putin-speech https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2022/sep/30/russia-uk... Turbulent times ahead.

IAmGraydon 4y ago
This is nothing more than theater. They literally cannot join NATO with an active war going on.
kobalsky 4y ago
The consensus was that it wouldn't be accepted, did this change?
- sorokod 4y ago
  Don't know about consensus but this may amplify tensions within NATO. May even create alternative aliances e.g. Baltic States + Ukraine + Poland
  - gus_massa 4y ago
    Countries with nuclear weapons in Nato: 3 [1] Countries with nuclear weapons in Baltic States + Ukraine + Poland: 0 [1] I still can't believe Germany has no secret nuclear weapon program.
    - highwaylights 4y ago
      Countries with nuclear weapons in Nato: Enough. I'd also go further and say that the world makes fairly extensive efforts to understand who has nuclear weapons and how many, but that doesn't cover all WMD's. I have no idea what kind of strategic theater-level biological weapons exist in the world, but I imagine it's more than zero.
    - jacooper 4y ago
      The German military is a joke, so its no surprise they have no nukes. And since they have an incredible amount of US bases, the US won't let them have any nukes, no matter what.

belter 4y ago

On the same day of the annexation of Sudetenland... - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munich_Agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munich_Agreement

IAmGraydon 4y ago
You know…I’m not one to believe in the metaphysical, but the parallels are getting kind of creepy. On the other hand, when you believe something about Russia, always ask yourself if you believe it because they want you to. They are master manipulators. It’s very possible they planned the parallels to WWII to scare the world into thinking this too will erupt into a World War.
- simonblack 4y ago
  <grin> Every day is an anniversary of some event or another. If you keep thinking about what event happened on this day many years ago and what parallels it portends in today's world, you'd go gaga. 1551 – Sue Takafusa, a retainer of the Ōuchi clan in western Japan, led a coup against the daimyō Ōuchi Yoshitaka, leading to the latter's forced suicide. Yep. Japan's government gonna collapse today.
  - Scea91 4y ago
    Annexation of Sudetenland is not just any event. It's an event to which Russia-Ukraine situation has been compared over and over again.
- foverzar 4y ago
  > They are master manipulators. Eheheh, eah, sure "master manipulators" without a shred of marketing talent.
Michelangelo11 4y ago
WOW.
IdealeZahlen 4y ago
What a terrifying déjà vu.

lakomen 4y ago

lakomen 4y ago

tibbydudeza 4y ago

Well they are getting pummeled in Lyman and the new batch of conscripts (mobiks) are untrained and sent straight to the front - guess they think using WW2 Soviet tactics will work again.

AnimalMuppet 4y ago

Let me make sure I've got this right. Russia is annexing these four regions. (I presume the "regions" have formal boundaries, like a US state or a UK county.) Russia is annexing them because they voted to be annexed. But Russia doesn't currently control all of those regions, so the rest have to be "liberated". But the parts of the regions that Ukraine control didn't vote to join Russia. The BS meter is reading off the charts on this one...

jakubadamw 4y ago
They didn't vote to be annexed. Ticking a checkbox on a ballot with armed soldiers behind your back is not voting. Any referendum carried out by an occupying force and followed by an annexation is against international law, specifically Article 47 of the Fourth Geneva Convention, not to mention the UN Charter.
- AnimalMuppet 4y ago
  Sure. But even if you think that the referendum was fair, unforced, and valid (which I don't), even then Russia is doing something bogus, because the rest of the regions didn't vote to be annexed.
  - type0 4y ago
    But the tragedy of situation is that it's enough for most Russians to believe it's legit,
    - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
      Wow, are you an optimist. The real tragedy is the war(s) this is going to start over the next several hundred years.
- foverzar 4y ago
  > Ticking a checkbox on a ballot with armed soldiers behind your back is not voting. > Any referendum carried out by an occupying force and followed by an annexation is against international law, specifically Article 47 of the Fourth Geneva Convention, not to mention the UN Charter There is already a legal precedent with Kosovo, which at the very least means that the global community accepts voting "with armed soldiers behind your back".